Forge of Destiny(Xianxia Quest)

We've got the daughter of a Duchess and some other important types here, but she shouldn't skew anything- it's not like there's any particular shortage of uniquely important people around to have kids. There are rulers, generals, inquisitors, sect leaders, high advisors, and generally all kinds of people achieving prominence because they have high Talent scores and then having their kids inherit those and sending them to school.

The weird year should be when there aren't a handful of particularly notable initiates.
To go beyond there- we know that cultivators live a long time, and that a lot of them probably have a "potential heir" every fifteen or so years, so they can focus on them well and decide whether or not they are truly suitable as heirs. This should mean that while not every high-end cultivators is going to do this, most socially prominent are going to have a child in one of the great sects every twenty years or so.

If we assume there is a thousand or so such prominent socially established cultivator, "heir wise" we can expect 50 or so such kids in the empire every year. Now, we know of at least 7 provinces. Let's say that there is ten of them, and that each has around 3 great sects. This does mean that, on average, we should be able to see around 2 'heir' of a very significant cultivator.

While obviously those won't be like Cai Renxiang, the heir to a White, there is something to be said for being part of a family that has 10 000 years of history and had a sublime ancestor at one point or another- or even a non-sublime one.

My thoughts here are a bit different than @DarkLight140's though, as I am unsure if Han Jian is not supposed to be representative of such less driven heirs. The problem is he really doesn't seem driven enough. Meizhen/Sun Liling/Cai Rexiang/Kang Zihao do look "right" for kids who have been well invested in by their family and who take cultivation seriously.
 
Your assumption isn't accurate, because it completely discounts the possibility of lesser Sects, which are almost always a thing--as well as stuff like the previously mentioned "Let's just throw a bunch of people into training camps and rapidly push them up to early red/gold and then use them as our foot soldiers". The amount of people who actually get considered as members in a Great Sect are the ones who are at least at the 'Average' level. Note how "Average" talent however was considered a malus of the High Noble background. Which is to say, that even then, someone who's merely 'Average' isn't going to get very far.

So let's take Han Jian--I don't seriously believe he has major aspirations towards getting to the Inner Sect, simply because it's too unreasonable for someone of simply average talent. If this was a more normal year, where three absolute fucking monsters weren't at the top, and several other potentially scary other competitors waiting in the wings, he might be an okay shot--but it's far more likely that the overall goal of his family was for him to get some real world seasoning and contacts so that when he returns home, he can be useful to his family--which is rich enough that they can basically carry him up to Green/Bronze, where he'll likely serve as a decent captain or city governor somewhere. Barring a the acquisition of some kind of Talent Cheat, he's just not destined to go that far--even absolutely superlative effort would likely only push him up to Cyan/Iron before his 'Average' Talent makes breakthrough rolls just too difficult.

Meanwhile, you've got Bai Meizhen, Sun Liling, and Cai Renxiang, who are all Late Yellow/Silver bordering on Green/Iron themselves. I wouldn't put them as lower than Talent 6--and it means that what amounts to being the same amount of resources poured into their early Cultivation compared to the other noble students (Again, the bottleneck is what you can actually absorb, and the weekly maximum of a Red/Gold doesn't even qualify as a rounding error to even a mid ranking noble house, and Yellow/Silver isn't much more. Hence, I suspect the difference in resources isn't very great between them). Huang Da--I suspect--is in the same boat as Han Jian in the sense that his Talent is 'Merely' Average. In the space of about two months or so, we went from nothing to being capable of fighting him as a peer--if not beating him solo, and he completed his breakthrough at around the same time.

The next level up is what I suspect the likes of Kang Zihao and Li Suyin are at--Talent 5 or so. And in this case, we see the difference between a high noble, and the middle class--which is to say, the former is roughly in the middle of Yellow or so (Strong enough to be a workout, but the real monsters still have a cultivation edge--if Zihao actually felt he was Meizhen's equal, he wouldn't have risked the embarrassment of trying to attack while she was weakened.) Li Suyin meanwhile has been pretty consistently doing well whenever she has the motivation to do so--her biggest problem was her lack of motivation, combined with the fact that her inheritance is apparently stupidly complicated and requires a lot of groundwork to start learning. But as we've seen, whenever she sets her mind to it, she tends to make progress quite quickly. Hence how she went from nothing to Early Gold with about a week of training (Even if Early Gold is pretty easy).

Finally, there's where we sit--and likely the other Real Fucking Monsters--at Talent Six. And at this point, the difference between "Has resources and a slight head start" stops being a rounding error and becomes the difference between "One starts as a mere mortal, the other is in the middle of Yellow" When your Talent is good, it means every scrap of investment poured into you counts for that much more. I suspect that the other real fucking monsters have only been training for a few months themselves, if only because it's probably a bad idea to start Cultivating before puberty starts. The problem is that they had extensive resources and training to begin with, and excellent Arts to build their foundation with.

Then you've got Ji Rong at Talent 7. Who is absolutely fucking destroying everybody to the point that even though he's losing a month of training, he's still a favorite to win the tournament of entry. Like, keep in mind, we had one Art mastered at the end there, he had three. Admittedly, I think the definition of "Mastered" means that it's an Art that you've trained to the limit of what your Cultivation allows before a breakthrough, but it does mean that now that resources are more equalized, that every point he gets is just worth that much more compared to even the other monsters--and your starting advantages become less and less decisive as the ranks rise up. After all, even if you get more successes, your dice pools are still limited, and the amount of successes needed to cross boundaries gets higher and higher.

Like, seriously, the fact that this year has at least 5 people with Talent 6+ is an aberration no matter how you slice it. Han Jian is the average of what you can expect from the nobility (Who you would expect to dominate a normal year). And he's not even a serious competitor in this batch. That--I think, is his actual narrative role here, to show what a 'Normal' example of the high nobility would look like so that you can compare and contrast him to the real fucking monsters that are swarming the Outer Sect in this year.
 
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Your assumption isn't accurate, because it completely discounts the possibility of lesser Sects, which are almost always a thing--as well as stuff like the previously mentioned "Let's just throw a bunch of people into training camps and rapidly push them up to early red/gold and then use them as our foot soldiers". The amount of people who actually get considered as members in a Great Sect are the ones who are at least at the 'Average' level. Note how "Average" talent however was considered a malus of the High Noble background. Which is to say, that even then, someone who's merely 'Average' isn't going to get very far.
I was a bit confused at first, but @DarkLight140's post is taking about a drawing pool. Basically, the 35000 people are those the sect is drawing from, more or less. Obviously most of those aren't even cultivators, and then a fucking lots are just army grunts. However it gives an idea of how many people are there to filter through.
Finally, there's where we sit--and likely the other Real Fucking Monsters--at Talent Six. And at this point, the difference between "Has resources and a slight head start" stops being a rounding error and becomes the difference between "One starts as a mere mortal, the other is in the middle of Yellow" When your Talent is good, it means every scrap of investment poured into you counts for that much more. I suspect that the other real fucking monsters have only been training for a few months themselves, if only because it's probably a bad idea to start Cultivating before puberty starts. The problem is that they had extensive resources and training to begin with, and excellent Arts to build their foundation with.

Then you've got Ji Rong at Talent 7. Who is absolutely fucking destroying everybody to the point that even though he's losing a month of training, he's still a favorite to win the tournament of entry. Like, keep in mind, we had one Art mastered at the end there, he had three. Admittedly, I think the definition of "Mastered" means that it's an Art that you've trained to the limit of what your Cultivation allows before a breakthrough, but it does mean that now that resources are more equalized, that every point he gets is just worth that much more compared to even the other monsters--and your starting advantages become less and less decisive as the ranks rise up. After all, even if you get more successes, your dice pools are still limited, and the amount of successes needed to cross boundaries gets higher and higher.

Like, seriously, the fact that this year has at least 5 people with Talent 6+ is an aberration no matter how you slice it. Han Jian is the average of what you can expect from the nobility (Who you would expect to dominate a normal year). And he's not even a serious competitor in this batch. That--I think, is his actual narrative role here, to show what a 'Normal' example of the high nobility would look like so that you can compare and contrast him to the real fucking monsters that are swarming the Outer Sect in this year.
A couple details: We know Meizhen, at least, was awakened at 8 years old. Ling Qi, at the end before the truce, had 2 arts mastered and a third almost mastered.

I do think you are somehow correct in saying Han Jian is a more typical example of someone from a powerful noble family... but someone who wasn't driven to succeed before coming to the sect. So in that sense he was "less than average" for someone in his position. I'm suspecting that we usually see, in normal years, 5/6 people at early yellow at the beginning of the year. This time we saw 4/5 at mid yellow. However, this doesn't change that mid-yellow beginning is where I expect the people in Meizhen's position to come in, and I'm expecting at least 1/2 such person to come each years.
 
I don't quite think theres that many talent 6's. Maybe downgrading each of those guesses by a number would make more sense to me.
 
I would note that it is not like every major cultivator has a child every year, or that talents are found every year.

It is more likely that this year is weird for Argent Peak Sect because this particular generation has some major noble houses' scions, from different areas of the Empire, as well as a pair of major talents from the commoner stock.

Outliers are typically available on each generation, but in this particular one, there's a significant number of outliers... For Argent Peak.
 
I honestly don't think our success is the big stressor on that relationship.
Sure, it makes them a bit unhappy. But there are far more serious issues with said relationship
For Han Jian and Gu Xiulan? What else would it be?

OH MY GOD.

I just realized.

There's no freaking reason for Bai Meizhen to be carrying around a super special medicinal tea that can only be used for red realm cultivators, she started at late Yellow. Either she was instructed to gift it to worthy allies or she's been buying super expensive medicinal tea for us and 'pretending' it was just something that happened to be at the bottom of her bag that she couldn't use anymore.

OMG that's actually... really considerate of her??? Did she notice how little we wanted to be in her debt??? I think she might be packing more social dots then she's letting on. Maybe this is what a Composure-type social fu looks like.
Possibly a part of it but we know she also enjoys drinking it herself, even without the benefits.
"Right… why don't I get you some tea, you look like you need it," she did too, Meizhen's eyelids were drooping, and the pale girl looked almost ready to fall asleep at the table, and Ling QI still wanted to talk to her.

She blinked, looking surprised. "Would you? That would be most helpful," she said her cool voice touched with gratitude. "Thank you Ling Qi."

She simply nodded, pushing the scraps of her meal aside to head to the kitchen. She would make enough for both of them. Even if it didn't benefit her anymore, she still enjoyed the taste of the tea now. Somewhere along the way the flavor had seemed to change. It had a certain spice to it that just perked her right back up, even when she was tired. Several minutes later, she returned with a pair of steaming cups in hand and set one in front of Meizhen, who offered her a tiny smile before taking a sip.

She didn't quite sigh in relief, but Ling Qi nonetheless saw the way her stiff, tired posture eased slightly.
Still really generous and helpful of her though
 
[X] Volunteer to return. She had only come here to help Meizhen after all

We went for her, and we already got a sweet technique out of this. No need to jeopardize everything.
 
So has anyone noticed we've technically gathered the Sailor Senshi/Guardians in our female friends? Just look at Gu Xiulan, doesn't she just scream 90s anime version of Mars with her attitude? Suyin is a pretty damn good fit for Mercury, Meizhen kinda fits Moon what with being the leader/the STRONGEST along with that White/Silver hair and having her own sassy talking animal companion that may or may not wind up getting a human transformation/lifelike "illusion" ala Xin. We just need a Venus and we're set :p

As for Ling Qi? Given she's getting to be pretty buff, is shooting up really tall and is already pretty tomboyish she makes a pretty good Sailor Jupiter. Dissonance and Starlight Elegy can fill in for the Flower Hurricane so all we need is a Heaven art that lets us shoot lightning bolts. Don't tell me you don't think this would be awesome?
 
I'm not sure Ling Qi is capable of detecting Meizhen bullshitting her reliably, especially with her overall ignorance .
True, and it could also just be the company or the thoughtful gesture but I figured with Ling Qi's opinion of the drink changing from it tasting horrible to having a pleasant sort of spice that perks her up once she hit yellow, I figured it might just end up as their version of coffee. Not like Meizhen seems to spend much on any other consumables nor does she seem to be have much of a limit in cash flow.
 
True, and it could also just be the company or the thoughtful gesture but I figured with Ling Qi's opinion of the drink changing from it tasting horrible to having a pleasant sort of spice that perks her up once she hit yellow, I figured it might just end up as their version of coffee. Not like Meizhen seems to spend much on any other consumables nor does she seem to be have much of a limit in cash flow.
Not enough to afford a maid though.
 
Yeeaaahhh, no. This:

pretty much sums it up.
He is drained and bound, which removes auto successes.
... Did you not read the whole thing about how binding an unwilling spirit costs you way more qi?
Initially. then your relationship rapidly improves because it is a level 1 spirit and as such a non sapient animal (with magic) and thus easily manipulated such as by giving it food.
Also, it is impossible to have willing level 1 spirits because they are animals not people yet.
For willing binding you need actual sapient spirits. the earliest examples we know of is tier 2 (yellow soul)
For Han Jian and Gu Xiulan? What else would it be?
Gu Xiulan is in love with Han Jian and gets catty whenever we get closer to him.
Putting distance with him for Gu's sake is hurting the relationship a lot more than some jealously that flared for a moment and that he worked through the same week it came up
 
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I would have to agree that 'normal nobility' is nothing like the trio of Bai Meizhen, Sun Liling, and Cai Renxiang. When you're saying they're basically expies of Weiss Schnee, Ranko Saotome, and Satsuki Kiryuin, they're not normal.
 
He is drained and bound, which removes auto successes.
You've got absolutely no proof of that, cite now.

I would have to agree that 'normal nobility' is nothing like the trio of Bai Meizhen, Sun Liling, and Cai Renxiang. When you're saying they're basically expies of Weiss Schnee, Ranko Saotome, and Satsuki Kiryuin, they're not normal.
There was nothing said about her being a Weiss expy AFAIK?
 
Amusingly until it became pretty much obvious Cai Renxiang was a Satsuki expy I thought she was a Weiss expy, so my view on her character basically did a 180.
I would have to agree that 'normal nobility' is nothing like the trio of Bai Meizhen, Sun Liling, and Cai Renxiang. When you're saying they're basically expies of Weiss Schnee, Ranko Saotome, and Satsuki Kiryuin, they're not normal.
Them not being normal after a while makes sense, but 'where they began' seems like where fairly talented people from either high nobility or heirs of powerful cultivators would begin when in a sect.

The main limiter, I think, is those parents who purposefully make sure their children are not yet yellow so they can benefit from a sect's cultivation art mastery.
 
After sleeping, I vaguely feel like it might've been a better choice to wait for Bai Meizhen to say her bit - I picture her having an idea, only for Ling Qi to say "I'll go back" and being teleported away from an exasperated (and now alone) snake-girl.
 
Gu Xiulan is in love with Han Jian and gets catty whenever we get closer to him.
Putting distance with him for Gu's sake is hurting the relationship a lot more than some jealously that flared for a moment and that he worked through the same week it came up
All we really know is that Xiulan is extremely possessive of Han Jian and cares more about him than her fiance, not that she's necessarily in love with him. Us then putting distance between ourselves and our first social link did hurt our relationship with him, but what caused our current tension with Xiulan if not our success? We also know that Jian has reacted badly to it, are you just saying our success isn't the main factor?
 
In regards to the early starting for nobles, generally fourteen is the age that one can begin cultivating at full speed, you suffer speed and efficiency penalties cultivating earlier, meaning that most normal nobles will just get their kids awakened around 11-12 and then have them concentrate on arts, qi and mundane skills until its Sect time. getting higher tiers of red is uncommon, and yellows are rare at that age.

Bai Meizhen's starting age is a major outlier though, and was a bit early even for her clan.
 
You've got absolutely no proof of that, cite now.
did you literally not read the last post?
Yet your Qi feels far too weak. You are the source of energy for the mountains formations, are you not?"

The massive tortoise exhaled, and Ling Qi's hair billowed backward, her eyes watering as she was engulfed in a cloud of steam. "If I could kill you, you would be dead child," the thing replied flatly. "The child of deep waters understands."

"Tch, too long. This damned binding…"

Ling Qi could see gleaming shackles of red hot steel, rooted into the stone below by metal spikes covered from end to end in fiercely glowing formation characters.
Drained and bound (literally, with shackles that limit mobility)
 
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did you literally not read the last post?







Drained and bound (literally, with shackles that limit mobility)

What he's saying is that you have no evidence for the fact that him being drained and bound removes the auto successes. I don't believe Yrsillar ever said anything to that effect.
 
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