If your POV here is the consensus, that is fine; I am not strongly opinionated on the subject. That is why I'm posing the question in the first place.
Thought to be fair, consensus seems to be at least somewhat mixed. See here.
Forge of Destiny(Xianxia Quest)
- Thread starter yrsillar
- Start date
- Original Fantasy
Thought to be fair, consensus seems to be at least somewhat mixed. See here.
I can see 3 actions being an ok thing to do at the least. But dripping it out in 1s or 2s over several weeks or months? No not something we should do.
I would say two actions next week and then we'll have to see for the week after. That lets us start on EPC and take one of favor/mission to get EPC sux rolling forward, which seems important, with one spare to argue over.
- Location
- United Kingdom
SCS and TRF are good enough that being able to cultivate them is a pretty big draw, and when/if we get the Dragon cultivation site having Bronze means being able to add those successes.
That and I'm curious how Ling Qi/cultivators in general change physically during breakthrough to Bronze. We know the early realms are more focused on cleansing mortal impurities over achieving an idealised form, which is supported by Meizhen referring to Mid Yellow as Mid Sin Shedding (Shedding Sin = removing impurity), though this reason is more personal curiosity than for any mechanical benefit.
BungieONI
Seven gremlins in a trench coat
- Location
- Lickwidget
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Hmmm? We will only get 5 attempts to breakthrough if we fail one action and get that reroll, in PS's plan if that's what you mean? In which case I agree. In the other case where you are saying "It has five attempts to breakthrough, regardless of reroll" I disagree.
Considering that I want to do six breakthrough actions(Or at least x5 with reroll if six is not possible), and that in all plans Green and Bronze are intimately related as far as I can tell it does increase the chance of double breakthrough given that some of the "work" is done beforehand. @Erebeal what does your math say one way or another?
Arkeus
Crazy cat guy
- Location
- France
Basically, EPC is higher priority than bronze to me, and some specific actions are, too.
Favors can be used as well as a EPC action next week for 70~ EPC successes, and Dragon must be done to repay Meizhen for this week. The last 2? actions should be about Bronze.
The reroll is not needed for the 5th action. PS plan is 5 with reroll unless we are already green.
What I was saying is that the only scenario where we don't do 5 attempt to breakthrough is one where we are already at green, and that PS's plan has more place for breakthrough compared to Alectai next week.
Last edited:
Black Noise
Curious
- Location
- About 1AU from Sol
It might uncap the physical attributes if just getting to Green doesn't.
Also:
[X] Plan Breakthrough: Start!
btw @Thor's Twin, I think you're missing the forest for the trees here;
- PS's plan is functionally identical to 5-action cultivation in the event where we fail to hit Green
- if we do hit green, the 5th action becomes spiritual cultivation towards Appraisal Bronze
- just about the only more efficient action than the above is EPC training, since it means we get EPC5 one week earlier. As-is, getting Appraisal Green seems likely and PS's way will save an action becasue
- Should we breakthrough using any plan, we will likely want a base spiritual cultivation action every week since Appraisal is where we can start doing heavy duty cultivation with 2 GSS (for focus weeks if nothing else)
And yes I'm in the salt camp over Cai ruining our realistic shot at double-breakthrough (at least, efficiently).
Hm, speaking of; @PrimalShadow, would you be amenable to turning the [] cultivate spiritual/phys (with conditions) into cultivating EPC if we hit Green and don't need a phys recover roll? We probably want EPC5 more than Appraisal.
- Location
- United States of America
I honestly don't know whether you are trolling me, or whether there is a genuine miscommunication here. So let's get some clarity in this mess.
The argument that I see you making is that because the action "Cultivate spiritual" would have the potential to allow an action of "Attempt Breakthrough" to roll the d100 needed to determine whether a breakthrough is successful or not it should be considered a breakthrough action. The actual definition you postulated was "actions needed for breakthrough" as the proper definition of what a breakthrough action should be considered as.
I don't agree with that definition, as that opens up even actions that are used to get us to peak where we then can start breaking through into the next realm. Every spiritual cultivation, every physical cultivation, every time we cultivate using the black pool or the special pills that give more successes to spiritual and physical cultivation. For a definition that is exceedingly broad for our purposes, and is in my opinion much too vague for what we actually want to use a breakthrough action before. The value of using the definition is destroyed because every action has the potential to be a breakthrough action. It does very little to weed down what is and what is not a breakthrough action.
A much stricter definition and much more valuable one, in my opinion, is "An action that has the logical possibility of achieving a part or the whole of a breakthrough." This definition means, is it possible for the action, in and of itself, able to achieve a part or the whole of a breakthrough. In that single action is it possible for part of the breakthrough to be completed? If the answer is yes, then it is logically possible to have occurred and is thus a breakthrough action. If the answer is no, then it is logically impossible and is thus not a breakthrough action. The effect of this definition is whether an action rolls the d100 needed to determine whether we breakthrough or not.
You can argue that your definition is the one that should be used, but that doesn't seem to be what you have been arguing. It seems that you have been arguing that PS's plan has 5 breakthrough actions even under my definition, which is not the case. Cultivate spiritual does not roll the d100 needed to determine if a breakthrough occurs.
I don't think anyone is proposing that we drag it out for months. Weeks, maybe. Even 1 action a week would only take a month and a bit - and I don't think anyone was proposing we go that low and stay there.
Frankly, that is my own intuition as well. Basically go for something like 2-3 actions, depending on whether we have to cultivate back up. If we are at peak Physical, we go Breakthrough x2 + Physical; if we are not, we go Physical + Breakthrough. This has the benefit of not needing conditionals either.
I'd rather not. I don't like making the plans include conditionals more than I have to, and I feel like Spiritual/Physical is simpler than Spiritual/Physical/EPC. If it was a big deal in terms of efficiency I would change it, but it doesn't seem to be that important, so I prefer to leave it as is.
@yrsillar We can use omake points for skill tests, to ensure they go well. Can we do something like that to break through?
Imprving our Cultivation Art is as important as getting to Bronze IMO. so after breaking through to Green I'd like us to keep an action for EPC cultivation.
Imprving our Cultivation Art is as important as getting to Bronze IMO. so after breaking through to Green I'd like us to keep an action for EPC cultivation.
Well do a plan with 3xbronze, 1xEPC and 1xdragon or favor depending on what we want to do the most.
You're acting like everything would have been totally the same as now, just with us ready to break through despite the massive change in circumstances and priorities being ready to break through would have made.
33. I didn't say I didn't think she was traumatised, I said how much she was traumatised. I might have thought she'd be fine after breakthrough. The Cai minor was certainly spearheaded by 40 people, but that was a campaign to start a series of those actions leading up to breakthorugh. If we had been ready to breakthrough then and there the calculus of how much the Cai minor was worth could have changed dramatically.
Also you're mixing arguments. Zequing wasn't around week 33 or week 35. And we're just going to have to disagree on the importance of answering when the grade 4 yandere spirit who has done a lot for you and dissapeared from her usual schedule calls for you. Is it possible she's just going to apologise? Maybe, but given that we apologised for a much more insulting thing on the normal two week schedule I don't see any reason that she wouldn't just do the same if that was all it was.
35 While contingencies were important and had been put off we could easily have attempted breakthrough to in our house (fairly safe with Meizhen) and then bought them the next (this) week. Claiming that we didn't buy them that week meant we wouldn't have got them, when we could easily have sacrificed another minor, like Su Ling because they were more important is just bad faith debating. As is ignoring the fact that if we were stronger we might not have needed them.
36. First, no people were not sure she was going to kill him. See all the people who were arguing that we needed to trust Meizhen's judgement and she would know how far was too far without Ling Qi stepping in. Secondly, even if we say that we knew that, there is a massive difference between knowing someone is huning one of your enemies and that they are assaulting their main base this week. It could easily have turned out a that Renshu's lackeys didn't know enough to point her too his remaining secret hideaways.
- Location
- Fabulously Rainbow Ireland
...............because she's not stupid? We agreed to answer yes or no after breaking through. Trying to weasel out like that with a bullshit answer is a slap in the face to her.
EDIT: Another reason why you're "answer" to Cai would be terrible
If you're going to use the excuse that "we don't know enough" well the obvious retort would be to find out first, instead of wasting Cai's time by breaking through to Green without actually investigating her enough to know if you'll comit or not. It'll make us look stupid for not thinking of that.
Last edited:
[X] Plan: Last stop before Breakthrough Week 2.0
@yrsillar please use my omake points to top off athletics. If there's one left over please put it into ossuary scout.
- Location
- Cyberspace
[X] Plan: Last stop before Breakthrough Week 2.0
Preferred one for now.
Preferred one for now.
- Location
- Pindorama
[X] Plan Breakthrough: Start!
ITT: Our friends have a chance to spontaneously combust every week we don't see them.
Seriously, what is the big deal? Are we wiling to spend time essentially faffing about just avoid sacrificing minors? Everything of value is locked behind the breakthrough at this stage; waiting more is pointless. Seeing less people we'd like is not the end of the world. It's not even very inconvenient, to be honest.
ITT: Our friends have a chance to spontaneously combust every week we don't see them.
Seriously, what is the big deal? Are we wiling to spend time essentially faffing about just avoid sacrificing minors? Everything of value is locked behind the breakthrough at this stage; waiting more is pointless. Seeing less people we'd like is not the end of the world. It's not even very inconvenient, to be honest.
NaanContributor
Provider of delicious flatbread, and nothing else.
- Location
- Hawaii
Jesus keeping up with this thread is an ordeal.
Hrrrnn...the arguments about the advantages of getting through to Green have gotten me to begrudgingly switch, despite my dislike of ignoring our Little Brother and putting off the Cai personal again, in favor of two actions that don't matter timing wise (Pale Manual and Music Box). But I guess we just have to live with the attachment restrictions. I really hope that CRX is willing to give us some breathing room without bringing up her offer, hopefully until we get into Bronze?
[x] Plan Breakthrough: Start!
I would like to address some things said about the Cai offer and CRX herself. First, "one more Cai Minor isn't going to change my opinion for/against her offer". Getting to know Cai isn't for the players' benefit, because many have already made their decision, it's for Ling Qi IC, so she's more certain/less uncomfortable with the idea.
Second, "She's so flat and boring compared to Satsuki." The reason I'm treating this Cai Minor with more importance than the previous ones is because the description has finally changed. Whereas before Ling Qi was merely observing CRX in a professional capacity, now they've finally spent enough time together to be comfortable getting to know each other more personally. Yrsillar has had a pretty consistent track record of gradually revealing the more interesting facets and depths of the NPCs as Ling Qi invests time and effort into her relationships with them, where otherwise she'd remain ignorant. Much like how after our second Minor with Gan Guangli in 30+ weeks, we got our first hint of his character beyond "Cai's Loud Right Fist" when he told us about his father, only for Qi to never follow up on his storyline.
The reason we haven't seen anything truly revealing about CRX's character (outside her Interlude) is because we haven't had the chance to truly get to know her like that. Until now. It's almost as if earning the friendship and seeing behind the mask of a damaged and rightfully paranoid girl with a Sword of Damocles hanging over her if she ever shows a hint of weakness, takes a proportionate amount of time and effort.
Hrrrnn...the arguments about the advantages of getting through to Green have gotten me to begrudgingly switch, despite my dislike of ignoring our Little Brother and putting off the Cai personal again, in favor of two actions that don't matter timing wise (Pale Manual and Music Box). But I guess we just have to live with the attachment restrictions. I really hope that CRX is willing to give us some breathing room without bringing up her offer, hopefully until we get into Bronze?
[x] Plan Breakthrough: Start!
I would like to address some things said about the Cai offer and CRX herself. First, "one more Cai Minor isn't going to change my opinion for/against her offer". Getting to know Cai isn't for the players' benefit, because many have already made their decision, it's for Ling Qi IC, so she's more certain/less uncomfortable with the idea.
Second, "She's so flat and boring compared to Satsuki." The reason I'm treating this Cai Minor with more importance than the previous ones is because the description has finally changed. Whereas before Ling Qi was merely observing CRX in a professional capacity, now they've finally spent enough time together to be comfortable getting to know each other more personally. Yrsillar has had a pretty consistent track record of gradually revealing the more interesting facets and depths of the NPCs as Ling Qi invests time and effort into her relationships with them, where otherwise she'd remain ignorant. Much like how after our second Minor with Gan Guangli in 30+ weeks, we got our first hint of his character beyond "Cai's Loud Right Fist" when he told us about his father, only for Qi to never follow up on his storyline.
The reason we haven't seen anything truly revealing about CRX's character (outside her Interlude) is because we haven't had the chance to truly get to know her like that. Until now. It's almost as if earning the friendship and seeing behind the mask of a damaged and rightfully paranoid girl with a Sword of Damocles hanging over her if she ever shows a hint of weakness, takes a proportionate amount of time and effort.
- Location
- Fabulously Rainbow Ireland
ITT: We'll spontaneously combust if we don't break through this week.
We are not "essentially faffing about just avoid sacrificing minors" we're breaking through next week. Certain people are just acting like it's the end of the world if we don't do it now for maximum efficiency when we finally have a chance to relax without a sword of damocles over our heads for the first time in a while.
Last edited: