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Advice and Trust [NGE]

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Susano said:
That's very true. And yes, very annoying.

The order of relationships I look pairings through is S/R, S/K... A/S. And there really is nearly nothing on S/K that isn't AU, and by AU I don't mean divergence but indeed completely different setting and yes usually no angels/EVA/etc. What's even the point then? I don't read those stories. It really seems cliched... like the S/K writers are all tumblr yaoi fangirls with their love of AU one-shots. Blergh. Yeah, I wished there more "real" S/K out there.
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Part of the problem with any non-AU S/K stories is that there is as-of-yet no way to make it anything but a tragedy. Even in YA(N)AF Shinji was pissed at Kaworu when all was said and done. Even ignoring his then-solid relationship with Asuka I don't see any way for that relationship to be salvaged.

On top of that, I completely agree with the assessment that the only reason we got genuine romantic undertones from either of them is because of the unique situation the two of them were in when they finally met. Shinji is two steps from being as empty and catatonic as Asuka (indeed, Kaworu's death and what he does to Asuka pushes him over the edge), and Kaworu likely has no idea what the feelings he's invoking in Shinji and that Shinji is invoking in him even are (unless it was stated elsewhere, the only canonical age we have for Kaworu is 9 days), so it's actually somewhat similar to what he's currently going through with Rei except completely devoid of comedy.

A better-adjusted Shinji (like the one we have right now) may quickly bond with Kaworu (like the easygoing friendship we have right now), but there's no romance potential, as completely toxic as it would be.

One last point: In EoE, it took the visage of Kaworu to erode Shinji's ego to the point he entered Instrumentality. GNR didn't pick Asuka or Misato. Shinji face goes from terrified to relieved and borderline adoring. The canonicity of their "relationship" in that Kaworu was closest person to Shinji at that point cannot be argued.

TL;DR Shinji may have a closet key somewhere, but he at least presents as straight if he's anywhere but "suicidal and willing to accept any and all affection".
 
Schpoonman said:
One last point: In EoE, it took the visage of Kaworu to erode Shinji's ego to the point he entered Instrumentality. GNR didn't pick Asuka or Misato. Shinji face goes from terrified to relieved and borderline adoring. The canonicity of their "relationship" in that Kaworu was closest person to Shinji at that point cannot be argued.
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Certainly it can:

Shinji demonstrated over and over that he thought himself worthless, and when forced to choose, as with Bardiel, that he'd rather die than kill someone. Then he was forced to kill Kaworu, someone he flatly says was a better person than him, and deserved to live more than he did. This broke him. So GNR suddenly showing him Kaworu, 'alive and well' suddenly lifts a HUGE burden from Shinji: The person he was forced to kill is 'alive' and right in front of him. That doesn't need to be romantic/sexual relationship-based there. It's the simple, incredible relief that he's not a murderer anymore. His sin is... forgiven.
 
Schpoonman said:
(unless it was stated elsewhere, the only canonical age we have for Kaworu is 9 days)
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That's the manga, which is a different canon. In the series the officially stated birthday is Second Impact, and while this may be an in-universe lie, I do think that is an important clue at what happened at 2I. I do think in the series, the Contact Experiment with Adam that caused Adam also gave birth to Kaworu. As such, he would even be a little older than Shinji. Of course, even so he is still an angel, an Adamite - an alien, basically, so yes, he probably does tick a bit differently.

The thing is, I just don't buy the "Shinji is desperate" line of reasoning as a complete explanation. Yes, Shinji obviously was desperate. But that only means that he latched onto Kaworu in the record time we see. Because, yes, after everything that happened here finally is a person that shows him unconditional love and affection from the beginning. But I still don't think that would even work, or at least surely not as smoothly as it did, if at least Shinji, well, weren't inclined that way. Of course, if Shinji hadn't been in such a desperate situation, the development would have gone differently, but that's like saying "if things were different, things would be different". Either way, I do think Shinji genuinely had romantic feelings.

So I don't see why there could not be a romantic bond between the two even with a less desperate Shinji (assuming that less desperate Shinji is not already in a relationship). Sure, the development of that bond would be completely different, but I don't see why it would be impossible for it to develop at all sans the despair.

One last point: In EoE, it took the visage of Kaworu to erode Shinji's ego to the point he entered Instrumentality. GNR didn't pick Asuka or Misato. Shinji face goes from terrified to relieved and borderline adoring. The canonicity of their "relationship" in that Kaworu was closest person to Shinji at that point cannot be argued.
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Ah, Instrumentality/Third Impact, where every relationship can find arguments: GNR deliberately takes on the form of GNK in order to calm Shinji, Shinji is calmest in Rei's lap, and he loses all hope when he sees Asuka dead.

TL;DR Shinji may have a closet key somewhere, but he at least presents as straight if he's anywhere but "suicidal and willing to accept any and all affection".
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"Presents as straight" seems a bit... I don't know... cynical? There are various possible reasons for why it was Kaworu acting his personal closet key (heh). The easiest it simply because so far no boy had evoked those feelings in him. I mean, just because he may be bisexual doesn't mean he has to be into every boy. Hell, maybe he is a hetero-leaning bisexual; there is a continuum, after all. It could be that it requires desperation for Shinji to "not present as straight" - or it could be it simply requires Kaworu ;)
 
Strypgia said:
....or I could write a KSK side bit, since everyone seems to want a more fluffy update than the plot allows right now...
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The Englanderish said:
I vote we get this over with - onwards with the Shinji/Gendo standoff!
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Lord Sovereign said:
I concur!
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Ranma-sensei said:
Arr!
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Bugger that, the last week or three have been utterly shit already, we (well, I at least) need some fluff right now.
 
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