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Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest

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Redshirt Army said:
Once we get the explosive Dhar dispelling technique down, and in general fill out our skillset, we should take a vacation down to Skavenblight.
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Do this, repeat for the other major Skaven cities, and it may well break them as a major faction. And if we did it on behalf of the dwarfs (say, High-King Belegar), it may be considered settling the Grudges associated with the Time of Trouble, since it means erasing their major cities.

That said, this is an endgame move. It'll make us the personal, number one enemy of Skavenkind, and they have really good assassins, and we won't get all of those. Don't do this until we've reached levels of unkillable on par with Nagash.
 
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BurnNote said:
Do this, repeat for the other major Skaven cities, and it may well break them as a major species. And if we did it on behalf of the dwarfs (say, High-King Belegar), it may be considered settling the Grudges associated with the Time of Trouble, since it means erasing their major cities.

That said, this is an endgame move. It'll make us the personal, number one enemy of Skavenkind, and they have really good assassins, and we won't get all of those. Don't do this until we've reached levels of unkillable on par with Nagash.
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I'd say we will also need political near-immunity. Say, what do you think about the post of Supreme Patriarch, for starters? Or a Living Saint of Ranald is preferable?
 
You know, we warned that wrangling Magisters was like herding cats...

This is par for the course. You have to handle the well developed egos of non-neurotypical senior nobles that are used to doing what they want, when they want. I think that the payoff should be worth it . Although Mathilde is probably notably more competent and better equipped than the average Magister, when it comes down to the utility of her spells, they're roughly on a peer, and look at how good they are at what she tries to do.

BurnNote said:
Do this, repeat for the other major Skaven cities, and it may well break them as a major species. And if we did it on behalf of the dwarfs (say, High-King Belegar), it may be considered settling the Grudges associated with the Time of Trouble, since it means erasing their major cities.

That said, this is an endgame move. It'll make us the personal, number one enemy of Skavenkind, and they have really good assassins, and we won't get all of those. Don't do this until we've reached levels of unkillable on par with Nagash.
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Skaven have fought vampires who've read the Liber Mortis and the Nine Books of Nagash before, and they're vindictive enough and hard to kill enough that if this worked, I think it would have happened by now. There presumably must be some limitation we've not seen yet.

Even Nagash when he was heading through his physical god stage could 'merely' disable all the warptech beneath Cripple Peak.
 
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Nix's Warden said:
I actually didn't know that. My bad.
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Mathilde could conceivably know that skaven interact with musk, but not that specific fact about Clan Eshin assassins. There are levels of skaven lore, here. It would be a fun and flavorful way to stuff the thread for voting with OOC knowledge, at least.
 
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Enthusiast#117 said:
[X] Plan Not Really Preliminary Anymore

The only thing I disagree with here is that if we're going to be using the knowledge gained from the Liber Mortis to help with burials, we should be using the Coin's Deciever face to make being discovered impossible.
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spiritualatheist said:
We're already super good at lying, though, and Gunnar has no reason to suspect us. I think it'll be fine.
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We've also purchased Morrite books and have our experiences in Sylvania.
 
Guile said:
Mathilde could conceivably know that skaven interact with musk, but not that specific fact about Clan Eshin assassins. There are levels of skaven lore, here. It would be a fun and flavorful way to stuff the voters OOC knowledge voting, at least.
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However, using skaven dung to mask one's smell is a tried, true and widespread ranger tactic which by all right should be in our extensive dwarven skavenlore collection.
 
Guile said:
Mathilde could conceivably know that skaven interact with musk, but not that specific fact about Clan Eshin assassins. There are levels of skaven lore, here. It would be a fun and flavorful way to stuff the voters OOC knowledge voting, at least.
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Not all skaven assassins belong to Clan Eshin though. Clan Mors has its own (less good) assassins. Other clans will as well. Sometimes outsourcing doesn't make sense.
 
[X] Plan Magical Mathilde
Clearly the best plan. It investigates webs! We learn a spell!

[X] Plan Citadel Focus
Clearly better than the other leading plan.
 
Kornet said:
I'd say we will also need political near-immunity. Say, what do you think about the post of Supreme Patriarch, for starters? Or a Living Saint of Ranald is preferable?
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If we settle the Grudges from the Time of Troubles, we will have political immunity, because we will be the single most celebrated human ever, and there wouldn't be many dwarfs more highly considered either. The Grudges from that time are ancient and run deep. The only reason we wouldn't be the most well regarded being short of the ancestor gods themself is that the method isn't proper dwarfy, and they didn't get to do it themselves.

Point is, unless the Empire had proof of a massive betrayal of the dwarfs on our part, they couldn't do shit without invoking a complete shitstorm.
 
Obviously this is all fanciful long term planning based on a number of things we currently barely understand working out just right, but it'd be amusing for theurgy from the God of Cats to be used to wipe out the worshippers of the God of Rats.
 
Well, there are likely many reasons for the Vampires and Necromancers not messing around with detonating warpstone, not least that that sounds like some sort of abominable 100% conversion nuclear reaction, but probably also because such a thing would also cause them to explode; Vampires are basically made of Dhar, and human necromancers need dhar and warpstone in order to get anything done, and on top of that all their magic and magical items and the undead armies that make them so fearsome themselves require or are made out of the stuff. It'd be atomically detonating their nose to spite whatever municipality they happened to reside in.

And all that without considering the possibility of Necromancer vs Necromancer tactics requiring something like Dhar-hardening techniques, of course, which would be essential for putting down upstarts or martyrs.
EVA-Saiyajin said:
Question: can the 2 +20s of the Gambler go to two different actions, because I'm seeing plans that seem to do that?
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Not if I recall correctly; it's basically just the shrine blessing, but twice as strong, not two of them.
 
BurnNote said:
If we settle the Grudges from the Time of Troubles, we will have political immunity, because we will be the single most celebrated human ever, and there wouldn't be many dwarfs more highly considered either. The Grudges from that time are ancient and run deep. The only reason we wouldn't be the most well regarded being short of the ancestor gods themself is that the method isn't proper dwarfy, and they didn't get to do it themselves.

Point is, unless the Empire had proof of a massive betrayal of the dwarfs on our part, they couldn't do shit without invoking a complete shitstorm.
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That depends. This kind of shit can't be pulled without exposing ourselves as a Liber Mortis Affectionado, and then a very, very fucking good case can be made that we are an oathbreaker. And a ncecromancer, but that's secondary to dwarfs - whatever we were before, once we are an oathbreaker, we are dirt. In fact, they'd probably declare a grudge on us and od their damnest to fulfill it, because we were once so trusted and celebrated.

So, Everyone in the Empire needs to be cool with us reading the big black book.

Well, unless we are willing to shave a part of our scalp, paint the rest red, and declare ourselves a slayer. That, that the dwarfs will grudgingly accept.

In fact, Skavenhunt is even more fun if we declare ourselves a slayer beforehand publically ousting ourselves as an accidental posessor of knowledge Man Was Not Meant To Know.
 
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Kornet said:
That depends. This kind of shit can't be pulled without exposing ourselves as a Liber Mortis Affectionado, and then a very, very fucking good case can be made that we are an oathbreaker. And a ncecromancer, but that's secondary to dwarfs - whatever we were before, once we are an oathbreaker, we are dirt. In fact, they'd probably declare a grudge on us and od their damnest to fulfill it, because we were once so trusted and celebrated.
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How are we an Oathbreaker? I don't remember anything of the sort. I don't think the Articles qualify, so long as we don't use Dhar ourselves. Same for necromancer, that means raising corpses, not knowing how to raise corpses. I can't think of any oath it would violate.
 
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BurnNote said:
Do this, repeat for the other major Skaven cities, and it may well break them as a major species. And if we did it on behalf of the dwarfs (say, High-King Belegar), it may be considered settling the Grudges associated with the Time of Trouble, since it means erasing their major cities.

That said, this is an endgame move. It'll make us the personal, number one enemy of Skavenkind, and they have really good assassins, and we won't get all of those. Don't do this until we've reached levels of unkillable on par with Nagash.
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Hey, could we maybe not talk about genocide, again?
 
BurnNote said:
How are we an Oathbreaker? I don't remember anything of the sort. I don't think the Articles qualify, so long as we don't use Dhar ourselves. Same for necromancer, that means raising corpses, not knowing how to raise corpses.
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That's the trouble with the Arcticles - they most certainly count as an oath, and they are worded vaguely enough that you can make a case that reading LM doesn't break them - but you must squint kinda hard.
 
Kornet said:
That depends. This kind of shit can't be pulled without exposing ourselves as a Liber Mortis Affectionado, and then a very, very fucking good case can be made that we are an oathbreaker. And a ncecromancer, but that's secondary to dwarfs - whatever we were before, once we are an oathbreaker, we are dirt. In fact, they'd probably declare a grudge on us and od their damnest to fulfill it, because we were once so trusted and celebrated.

So, Everyone in the Empire needs to be cool with us reading the big black book.

Well, unless we are willing to shave a part of our scalp, paint the rest red, and declare ourselves a slayer. That, that the dwarfs will grudgingly accept.

In fact, Skavenhunt is even more fun if we declare ourselves a slayer beforehand publically ousting ourselves as an accidental posessor of knowledge Man Was Not Meant To Know.
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There is that technicality, we did not study necromancy just read the book. Mathilde was clear that this would not protect her from the College because they are terrified of the Liber Mortis, but dwarfs are a lot more stringent about what an oath actually is.
 
DragonParadox said:
There is that technicality, we did not study necromancy just read the book. Mathilde was clear that this would not protect her from the College because they are terrified of the Liber Mortis, but dwarfs are a lot more stringent about what an oath actually is.
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You may be right. Regardless, I guess that kind of power also grant a kind of political immunity - the Empire will be very, very happy that we are not the enemy and try it's damnedest not to make any threatening moves.

Unless, of course, the Grand Theogonist decides to be a stupid ass. But what are the chances?
 
Kornet said:
That's the trouble with the Arcticles - they most certainly count as an oath, and they are worded vaguely enough that you can make a case that reading LM doesn't break them - but you must squint kinda hard.
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DragonParadox said:
There is that technicality, we did not study necromancy just read the book. Mathilde was clear that this would not protect her from the College because they are terrified of the Liber Mortis, but dwarfs are a lot more stringent about what an oath actually is.
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You also have the precendent of the Grand Theogenist reading it, and that was ok. Now, he's not sworn those oaths, but it's a clear precedent of using the book.
 
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