Dmol8
The Undead Unhinged Lunatic of the Web
- Location
- Belgrade,Serbia
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
Alright, then what is canon?
Attempting to Fulfill the Plan: GDI Edition
Alright, then what is canon?
- Location
- Outside the Box
- Pronouns
- She/Her
If I look up "Cypherpunk" in a (English) search engine, I find this wikipedia page and similar articles. "Cypherpunk" as a written genre is effectively unknown to people in the English-speaking sphere.
Moreover, when I look up the phrase "panopticon implosion" I don't find anything besides random unrelated search results. It is effectively impossible for me to find this information. And even though I know what the words "panopticon" and "implosion" mean, and I can guess at the implied meaning of the phrase, the entire discussion you describe is one I've never heard before or can find on my own.
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- Location
- The Underdark
As a rule of thumb more is better. They are going to try with whatever they have as soon as they can, but the more bombers you can supply them with in that time, the better chances they believe they have.
GdI has problems with journalists since from the start of the first Tiberian war they were in Mr shiny heads pocket or just looking for clicks as it were and both regularly all the time reported that gdi did civilian massacres and other lies so they very quickly got sick of it.
I mean, the ST equipment takes 2 120 progress factories, or one 175 project, or a 150 progress project, so that's exactly as big as Simon is planning for or bigger! Given the QM's general trend towards bigger projects as time goes on, and the general complexity of the Aurora, we can expect it to be a bigger project than the original Apollo factories, but how much bigger than 70 progress is a bit unclear.
- Location
- Mobile, Alabama
Rephrase.
That did happen in CnC 4.
This is not CnC 4. Too many butterflies have flapped their wings. Looking at the game and assuming that's the future is an assumption bordering on dangerous.
Ace of Scarabs
Mechanoid Pilot
- Location
- Singapore
We've already gotten to the point that being forced to hold a command conference in a building half-eaten by Green Rocks in the middle of the Red Zone is no longer a serious concern.
Victor's justice doesn't mean that the victor has to ignore war crimes on their own side. Just that they can. And, you know, most people usually aren't that eager to convict themselves.
Now, if Private Bob decides that he wants to engage in some extracurricular murder and robbery, there's a decent chance that he'll be punished. He killed a shopkeeper, he robbed his store, and his actions violated military law. So his own commanders can arrest him and put him on trial.
If Private Sam decides to use prisoners of war to clear a minefield, and someone suggests that he's committed a warcrime, he can point to the superiors who gave him the order. Who can point to the superiors who gave them an order. Who can ultimately point to the government that either gave them an order or knew about the policy and permitted them to continue. Any prosecution of Private Sam would also open his superiors to prosecution because of command responsibility.
So, uh, Private Sam isn't getting prosecuted. You can say that's cynical, if you like. I would describe it more as "pattern recognition". The top military and civilian leadership of a nation is usually not keen on going to court, and possibly to jail, so they'll use their power to prevent that from happening.
- Location
- A haze of forgetfulness
- Pronouns
- She/Her
I found a 2008 blog post that while it doesn't contain the exact phrase it talks about the general idea?
Though this is a bit off topic I think so whatever.
staplesdex2
CLASSFIED
Question about sime technologies, is it possible to bring back the Firestorm Defense System and its associated Technologies? It seems like a good defense system that could be improved upon and we could use those to protect our important structures.
- Location
- The Underdark
The Firestorm was retired due to its limited effectiveness and extreme expense. However it was still being iterated on in 2052, and has continued to be iterated on to this point. It has just not reached a system readiness level where you can be expected to throw money at it.
Dmol8
The Undead Unhinged Lunatic of the Web
- Location
- Belgrade,Serbia
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
OK that's the Cypherpunk English Coding Circles. They are older and more active than the Writing Circles. I got introduced to the Cypherpunk Writing trough Dex. If you've ever played an RPG you'll break the gameplay over your knee, but it's story is basically a cypherpunk retelling of Neuromancer.
Welp the studio for the game is Czech. It would seem that @Simon_Jester is right about me once again. Cypherpunk writing is only a thing in Slavic English slang. Sigh. Is this the only English English forum I visit? Considering that my favorite RTS is Earth 2150 that is entirely possible. 
Sorry about me dragging in concepts badly again people.
No my point was that even when Kain had everyone over a barrel he couldn't get a truce from everyone let alone amnesty. As such that was the point of bringing up CnC 4.
Right. Never was disputing that. My point was just that the victors can choose to prosecute their own war criminals.
Also should I wait for you to reply to the rest of my argument? Or was this reply all?
Edit: Adding this in to avoid a double post from missing it the first time around:
Oh nice. How is it off topic when the very concept of Kane is that he is the man in the watchtower for the Brotherhood of NOD and on a more meta level was designed as a character to be such a presence?
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I either agreed with the rest of your argument, or lacked the historical knowledge to meaningfully comment, so that's all.
The nice thing about a "gilded cage" is that it is gilded. Of course, many Nod commanders want power, which we can't offer, but the prospect of a comfortable retirement will appeal to many.
K von Carstein
Likes to go for a walk
- Location
- Belgium
- Pronouns
- He
Don't worry🙂 Just explain it next time😉
For the firestorm System, in Canon it does still exist but has become increasing expensive and was generally not deployed for the entirety of the Third Tiberium War. We do see one in canon where Legion is assaulting the Lab containing the Tacitus. He had to disable generators if I remember correctly and that the system had changed drastically into being more of a bubble shield which you could not get through until the generators were destroyed or disabled. Making it seem it was only used due to staggering importance of securing of the facility from Nod.
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One of the things that has been mentioned on the Discord is that a fair chunk of Director Granger's time, and to some degree Hackett's as well, has been beating the "warcrimes friendly" personnel out of the GDI hierarchy. While there are still soldiers and agents who would commit warcrimes, the institutional structure to support/permit them doing so has been much lessened. And in an American-influenced military, *following* an order to commit a warcrime is itself a crime. Not that it necessarily gets prosecuted, but that's a failure of enforcement.
Granted, the ability of Director Granger to reform GDI (with the help of various subordinates like Doctor Granger) was in large part due to the nuking of Philadelphia station at the start of TibWar 3, which removed much of the existing hierarchy that kept the previous system in place. It is suspected that Kane is still smirking about this outcome.
A couple things: first, while you described your image of a panopticon society (which does not match GDI, and probably only marginally describes NOD), you didn't actually what form the implosion would take. Just that it could happen by overcoming said social isolation and pressure. Which I think is where the confusion started, since it's not an English/American concept.OK that's the Cypherpunk English Coding Circles. They are older and more active than the Writing Circles. I got introduced to the Cypherpunk Writing trough Dex. If you've ever played an RPG you'll break the gameplay over your knee, but it's story is basically a cypherpunk retelling of Neuromancer.
Sorry about me dragging in concepts badly again people.
Second, as mentioned, GDI does not run on a system similar to your description of a Panopticon. It is a surveillance state, in that there is pervasive counterintelligence action throughout society, but that does not cause social isolation, and minimal social pressure. NOD may or may not be closer, we don't really know, partly because it's a highly variable society. But they certainly don't use AIs - the one AI known to be active is LEGION, which is likely currently busy helping Kane with the Tacitus.
Also, one of the general issues with NOD is that after each period of inactivity, Kane usually has to re-establish his control and rule over the various factions of NOD. The Brotherhood is quite capable of operating without him, although in a less focused/efficient manner.
One thing of note is that the Shimmer Shield tech is probably going to synergize with Firestorm Shields by providing "edges" for it, or covering the areas it doesn't. (Such as "up".)
- Location
- New England
Heh, I remember first being given the opportunity to build a firestorm fence in Tiberian Sun. I took one look at it (it's a wall, eats lots of power and manual activation only), and never even built a single block of it. It's just so impractical. The good part about it was that there was the one scenario that came with a bunch of firestorm "fencing" pre-built, so I was able to sell it off for a little extra cash to build more Titans, RPG towers and pavement (to prevent those stupid Nod drill things from getting in my base).
That reminds me, is Nod still using those underground drill APCs and that sort of stuff?
That reminds me, is Nod still using those underground drill APCs and that sort of stuff?
While true that the shimmer Shield tech would probably synergize with the firestorm shield, the firestorm shields or a variant of it I am referring to was in the Mission Tacitus Regained, it was a complete Bubble shield which you could not get through, as it did not let you damage anything under the shield whether by ground or by air assaults or even by nuking if I remember correctly and had to dealt by destroying the power generation. It honestly reminded me of the firestorm defense Cabal continuously powered and kept sustained to prevent the destruction of his Core and you had to do the same tactic to get through.
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Krukov has designed the "Underminer", a rapid tunnel boring machine, and used it to carry swarms of Gana (proper term for Nod living weapons) in the Battle of St. Petersburg. Not aware of any other warlords using any form of tunneling.
Sailor_Skarro
The Lurker
It might be best to assume that the Indian Warlord/s have some of these.
Dmol8
The Undead Unhinged Lunatic of the Web
- Location
- Belgrade,Serbia
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
It matches GDI as it was before we came in especially in Tiberium Dawn. The EVA hacking sequence in the first game has a literal reference to the panopticon with the EVA unit being hacked taking the form of a digital watchtower. Like I have no problem in the Double Granger era rebuilding GDI without it's panopticon. It fits for what we did, but don't tell me GDI didn't have the elements of a global panopticon designed into it from the first game.
The implosion would start with having people be able to communicate with with their government and be heard. So with the current round of elections if we are lucky and we as treasury don't fuck up civilian economic deployments. As we have actually done everything else needed to get it started.
We have a complete global communication network, we need a right to social education to go with it. We have a universal basic income and we are getting towards universal healthcare. All that's left on our part is to convince the forgotten to join GDI fully since it's been mentioned before that people do have enough information gathering capacity to get the ball rolling.
Unfortunately it's after the implosion starts that we need to start looking for solutions different from the ones applied in real life since independent media is a non-starter in our current situation and making InOps look bad for it's FBI's laziest agents cosplay is currently failing for Litvinov. So alternative solutions to the problem of people wanting less jackboot on their face will have to be found.
Probably only if we manage to take more of the Yellow Zones.
Yes when Kane comes back each time he breaks the Brotherhood back into a panopticon with him as their watchtower, but after each war Kane gives up his function and the Brotherhood of NOD breaks into a bunch of feudal fiefs. I did not say that in my previous posts and that is on me.
Krukov has deployed the Underminer which can breach concrete.
Hopefully I'm being coherent enough cause I'm sleepy.
That might make sense considering Gana seemingly come from there (the ones seen at the Battle of Chicago used DNA from an Indian crocodilian species). Considering Stahl's biprop cannons have been used by multiple warlords, I'd expect the Underminer to become somewhat more widespread.
Edit: Thinking about it again, I'm not certain whatever Nod force exists in India would require a vehicle intended for offensive use against targets such as fortress towns.
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Unknown, they should still exist but the reason we never saw them in Third Tiberium War is primarily attributed due to underground environment changing from tiberium changing and making it so it was no longer viable to use them underground where there was tiberium, which is currently practically everywhere on the planet. It is also why you don't see the Montauk that Nod used like the Kodiak Airship you use in the GDI Campaign for Tiberium Sun as a Mobile Base of Operations since the global tunnel network could no longer be sustained and created efficiently and safely. It is likely however we will see them in India if the continuous anomalies we see there continue to increase.
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- Location
- Mobile, Alabama
Could be that a lot of underground stuff lost it's edge with Tiberium breaking deeper into the Earths crust.
What's the extent of our knowledge about Nod in India?