So you guys are saying that the new missiles can ONLY be fired out of modular pods, and can NEVER be just hung off pylons? I don't buy it for a second. They wouldn't be anything like 'universal' if that were the case.

They can be hung of off pylons, but that makes them less efficient. Modular pods have more missile density and pylons were part of the problem with the last version of the Orca.

It probably needs the refit to get the electronics needed use a QAAM and use the new options but there is a new missile close enough to the one used before that it can still be used. if this was not the case we would have been warned and the Orca refit would be a very high priority.

It might become a Very High Priority next turn now that the retrofit of Universal Missiles was done.
 
So you guys are saying that the new missiles can ONLY be fired out of modular pods, and can NEVER be just hung off pylons? I don't buy it for a second. They wouldn't be anything like 'universal' if that were the case.
No, however the changes from the URLS means that some of the old pylons do not work for the new missiles. The issue is that before we had a ton of different pylons to cover the various missiles produced across the military. That is changed as URLS now has 4 standard missile sizes and configurations. The Orca Dev was taken at the same time so the new Orca, A-16 is designed from the ground up to work with the URLS system. Also note that currently the A-15 has no anti-air ability, something fixed in the A-16

[ ] Universal Rocket Launch System Development
GDI's ground forces require a wide array of different rockets and missiles, ranging from simple and cheap tactical launch systems such as those mounted on the Mammoth and Pitbull, to heavy anti-tank missiles, and increasingly the large heavy strike length bombardment missiles. However, this has proven to be an increasing strain on the overall logistical system.
(Progress 63/40: 15 Resources per die) (High Priority)

During the lead up to the Third Tiberium War, GDI was producing over fifty different rocket systems, ranging from 58.4mm in diameter rockets for the Mammoth tanks to Sidewinders, Rattlesnakes, and various multirole missile platforms such as those found on the Pitbull and Missile teams. Some guided, some unguided, and none produced in enough numbers that GDI could ensure a steady and uninterrupted supply by the late years of the war.
The solution that Ground Forces came up with was a modular missile system. A series of sizes and components that could be fit together to fill nearly any role. Codenamed Thunderbolt, the missiles come in four sizes. T5, at 50mm in diameter, T10, T15, and T20 at 200mm in diameter. The other key feature is variable length, from a 50cm baseline, up to 3.5 metres with modular solid fuel sections. Each can mount standardized seeker heads, payloads, fuel and exhaust assemblies to produce a staggering array of potential rocket systems.
For example, as a signal rocket, a short T5 can be equipped with a flare, firework, or even an antenna system with wire, and fired up into the air without all that much difficulty. However, the same basic platform and launcher can be reconfigured to destroy light vehicles or deliver long range fragmentation charges into concentrations of NOD infantry. Or it can be loaded as a submunition round for the T20, with ten of them capable of being loaded into the rocket. Things become more interesting at the larger sizes. The T15 and T20 are planned to become the baseline of lightweight, high mobility rocket artillery systems, using a mix of guided or unguided weapons. A return of the MLRS of the first two Tiberium Wars has already been planned, relying heavily on the longest and heaviest of the weapons available.
The only holdout so far has been the Navy, which has cited its need for longer range and heavier missiles as a problem. And even so, the Navy has seen fit to propose Thunderbolt + as a future project, building in the capacity for larger systems. Fundamentally, by ensuring cross-compatibility, it will make it so that GDI should never have to worry about running entirely out of ammunition. In terms of deployment, GDI will begin by converting a long list of surviving munitions factories over to the new standard. However, with demand expected to spike in the coming years, a series of new factories have already been planned.
 
So with the Orca as it stands and the URLS, you do have things that can hang off the pylon. What you don't have is the full universal suite, and all the features. You will be able to put a dozen AGM configured T10s on it though.
 
Realistically, power armor for everyone is a goal for the Fourth Four Year Plan, not the Third, at this rate...

It should also be noted that some of your entries are worse or better than they look. For example, ablative factories will always be in demand as long as Nod doesn't give up using lasers entirely (and they're pretty heavily invested in lasers), so it's not just the current phase or two that needs completing. On the other hand, even with the stabilizers up there as a target, we probably don't need to complete as many ASAT phases as are presently visible, and there are probably more.
Well, Third or Fourth Plan is probably going to be a matter of political will, if you ask me. Any or all of these can be done in the next plan, it's just a question of if people are willing to commit to making it happen. Continuous Cycle Fusion alone greatly reduces the costs involved to 700 progress total in Heavy Industry from 1100 of an equivalent amount of fission plants if you're only looking at doing the Zone Armor. Set 1 can then be rolled over the course of a couple of years like we've been doing with Cruisers, giving plenty of time to let HI find the Capital Goods (or let LI do another phase of Johannesburg).

As for the rest, yeah that's fair. The Stabilizers has thousands of satellites in the constellation, so losing a few won't bring down the network alone. Though I do expect we're going to want to get ASAT up through Phase 5 eventually, just because we're going to be continuing to build up presence in LEO with additional stations, so it behooves us to actually protect it.
 
A reminder and a bit of advertising:

[ ]Plan In the Eye of the Maelstrom v3.0:
Infrastructure 5/5 Dice 95 Resources:
-[ ]Blue Zone Arcologies (Stage 2) 138/600 15 Resources per Die, 1 Die = 15 Resources
-[ ]Mecca/Jeddah Planned City (Phase 3) 538/640 20 Resources per Die, 4 Die = 80 Resources
Heavy Industry 4/5 Dice 60 Resources:
-[ ] North Boston Chip Fabricator (Phase 4) 970/1200 15 Resources per Die, 4 Dice = 60 Resources
Light and Chemical Industry 4/4 Dice 60 Resources:
-[ ] Pharmaceutical Synthesis Centers 0/250 15 Resources per Die, 3 Dice = 45 Resources
-[ ] Chemical Fertilizer Plants 184/200 15 Resources per Die, 1 Die = 15 Resources
Agriculture 3/3 Dice 40 Resources:
-[ ] Yellow Zone Purification Facilities (Phase 2) 12/160 10 Resources per Die, 2 Die = 20 Resources
-[ ] Spider Cotton Development 22/40 20 Resources per Die, 1 Die = 20 Resources
Tiberium 5/5 Dice + 6 Free Dice 220 Resources:
-[ ] Mecca/Jeddah Planned City (Phase 3) 538/640 20 Resources per Die, 1 Die = 20 Resources
-[ ] Tiberium Stabilizers 674/2000 30 Resources per Die 20 Resources per Fusion Die, 10 Fusion Dice = 200
Orbital 3/3 Dice 60 Resources:
-[ ] GDIS Pathfinder 158/300 30 Resources per Die, 2 Die = 60 Resources
-[ ] Security Reviews Orbital 1 Die
Services 4/4 Dice 35 Resources:
-[ ] Expand Medical Schools 207/300 10 Resources per Die, 1 Die = 10 Resources
-[ ] Domestic Animal Programs 0/200 10 Resources per Die, 2 Die = 20 Resources
-[ ] Indoor park programs 106/150 5 Resources per Die, 1 Die = 5 Resources
Military 5/5 Dice 85 Resources:
-[ ] Orca Refit Deployment 0/200 15 Resources per Die, 3 Dice = 45 Resources
-[ ] Governor Class Cruiser Shipyards:
--[ ] (Hampton Roads) 45/185 20 Resources per Die, 2 Die = 40 Resources
Bureaucracy 3/3 Dice:
-[ ] Security Reviews Orbital 2 Die
-[ ] Endorse a Candidate

95+60+60+40+220+60+35+85 = 655/655

This is my plan in which we continue to do all the things we need to do like Mecca, the Tiberium Stabilizer, GDIS Pathfinder and Governor Class Shipyards while also doing the Orca Refit. Feel free to put the part of it you like to use.
 
Calling SCEDQuest vote
[X]Plan Pathfinder Prep
Facilities: 40C
-[X][Carter]Tanegashima Space Center (Stage 3) 81/400 2 dice, 40C
-[X][Carter]Gagarin Station (Stage 1) 2 parts, 20 Launch Capacity
Moon Base: 10MC, 20 Launch Capacity, 1 Manned Mission Capacity, 8IP
Infrastructure:
-[X][Carter]Turn Hab Space into Living Quarters 0/4MC 4MC, 8IP, 5LC
Industry:
-[X][Carter]Construct RTG Array 0/2MC 2x, 4MC, 10LC
-[X][Carter]Send Regolith Brick Maker 0/2MC 2MC, 5LC
Assembly: 38 IP
-[X][Carter]Construct Part for Gagarin Station 0/10 IP 2 parts, 20 IP
-[X][Carter]RTG Package 0/5IP 2x, 10 IP; 3 IP towards 3rd RTG package
-[X][Carter]Regolith Brick Maker 0/5IP 5 IP
Development (5 Dice) +20 25C, 4IP
-[X][Carter]Lunar Excavator Development 0/50 0/4IP (5C/Die) 1 die, 5C, 4IP
-[X][Carter]Pathfinder Lander Development 0/250 (5C/Die) 4 dice, 20C
Space Command Mission Planning (3 Dice) +5
-[X][Carter]Mission: Orbital Scan - Mercury 31/50 1 die
-[X][Carter]Mission: Surface Exploration - Venus 58/150 2 dice
Requisition: 10C
-[X][Carter]LCR-SAT 10C Cost 1x, 10C
Missions:
-[X][Carter]Launch Mission: ELRCN 1 LCR-SAT 1 launch capacity
-[X][Carter]Launch Mission: Pardus Mare Frigorus: VTOL Leopard 1
-[X][Carter]Launch Mission: Pardus Mare Humorum: VTOL Leopard 2

76/135 Capital
41/80 Launch Capacity
50/50 IP
BOTcommander threw 2 100-faced dice. Reason: Tanegashima Space Center Total: 64
40 40 24 24
BOTcommander threw 1 100-faced dice. Reason: Lunar Excavator Development Total: 21
21 21
BOTcommander threw 4 100-faced dice. Reason: Pathfinder Lander Development Total: 197
52 52 48 48 2 2 95 95
BOTcommander threw 1 100-faced dice. Reason: Orbital Scan - Mercury Total: 58
58 58
BOTcommander threw 2 100-faced dice. Reason: Surface Exploration - Venus Total: 136
62 62 74 74
BOTcommander threw 3 100-faced dice. Reason: Mission Launches Total: 133
53 53 22 22 58 58
BOTcommander threw 3 8-faced dice. Reason: Lunar Resources Total: 16
8 8 1 1 7 7
BOTcommander threw 1 3-faced dice. Reason: Lunar Resources 7 Total: 2
2 2
BOTcommander threw 5 8-faced dice. Reason: Mars Resources Total: 27
8 8 7 7 4 4 6 6 2 2
BOTcommander threw 1 3-faced dice. Reason: Mars Resources 7 Total: 2
2 2
BOTcommander threw 1 3-faced dice. Reason: Mars Resources 4 Total: 1
1 1
BOTcommander threw 1 4-faced dice. Reason: Mars Resources 4 Total: 4
4 4
 
Second Forgotten Conference
Second Washington Forgotten Conference

While Parliament, the military, and most importantly the Department of Archives and History have taken the lead in diplomacy with the Forgotten, the Treasury also has its role to play, and with the Initiative growing ever stronger in comparison to the Forgotten, they have quite a bit of leverage to work with. Most of the conference events have been focused on working out territory, transit routes, access to the planned cities such as Chicago and Mecca for the relevant bands, alongside hundreds of other minor issues that have cropped up and have needed high-level talks, in some cases for years.

The Forgotten representatives are wary. While they had been generally grateful for the generosity of the Initiative four years ago, today the Initiative has upended the balance even more, and they cannot rely on the generosity of the Initiative to be maintained in the face of rapid mutation and closing extinction.

Put up in a series of encampments outside the city, they have been given gifts, primarily of old military equipment, ammunition, and other supplies. In return, they have given symbolic gifts of Tiberium (in reality green stained glass to represent Tiberium that had been turned over at the borders or at Initiative outposts). Whenever two Forgotten tribes meet, they often begin negotiations with exchanges of gifts, with the larger and more powerful band indicating their strength by offering grander and better gifts. With the Initiative the largest and strongest tribe on the planet, the gift giving has been equally grand, although little more than a footnote of a footnote when placed against the overall budget.

The conference began in a Washington that had completely transformed. Where there were once shell holes, there are now parks. Where there were ruins, arcologies and factories have risen. While not quite restored to its former glory, it is certainly far less sad than it had once been. Unable to make the same understated entrance as the last time, Dr. Granger has been pushed into the uncomfortable role as leader and moderator of the conference, a figure generally trusted to not push Initiative politics into the overall discussion.


Current Leverage: -14

Forgotten Commitments

[ ] Initial Forgotten Integration
While the Forgotten are a separatist group, and do not particularly wish to join GDI on any form of systemic basis, creating programs to help integrate and support the individuals who do want to return to the Initiative as full citizens will help ensure closer integration of Forgotten and GDI interests. While they will be a tiny minority, GDI can and will be able to better engage with citizens than outsiders.
(10 Leverage)

[ ] Delta Studies
With reports of extra sensory perception capabilities in some forms of the Forgotten, having an opportunity to study these abilities in a laboratory environment may well aid GDI in their studies of some of the more exotic forms that Tiberium can take.
(8 Leverage)

[ ] Reverse Engineering Assistance
The Forgotten are masters of reverse engineering and operating technologies and systems in conjunction that were never intended to go together. By opening up recruitment of many of their best and brightest, GDI can make use of this in its efforts to understand and find its own uses for alien technologies.
(6 leverage) (Scrin technology pool roll becomes d9-1 from d8-1)

[ ] Forgotten Biosamples
With the Forgotten having a nearly completely separate sphere of preserved and newly created crops and animals, preserving at least a majority of them is likely to be politically popular among some factions of the Initiative, and more importantly provide a broader base for future genetic engineering projects.
(2 leverage) (Unlocks new genetically engineered crops)

GDI Concessions

[ ] Initiative Communications Support
By supplying communications equipment, and allowing the Forgotten to use GDI's telecom satellites, they can become more interconnected and coordinated. While this will require additional production of capital goods and additional specialized factories, providing this kind of support will go a long way in both bringing the Forgotten closer to the Initiative, and in buying their support.
(-8 Leverage) (-- Capital Goods, -- Consumer goods)

[ ] Forgotten Agricultural Support
While many of the resources of the Forgotten have to be heavily mobile, they do have permanent settlements. Offering Initiative support for their upkeep, not just in supplying food, but actual aquaponic systems and advanced crops, can ensure that they have significantly improved nutrition.
(-6 Leverage) (New Project: Agricultural Support (Progress 0/150: 10 resources per die)) (Must be completed by End of Year)

[ ] Strategic Combat Support
With the Initiative's air force present and in growing strength, there are enough fire missions to not only support Initiative troops on the ground, but to provide aid to the Forgotten as well. By supplying them with communications equipment and the correct code, along with (in some cases) forward observers and IFF devices, GDI can ensure their survival in anything short of a full court press from the Brotherhood of Nod. (-6 Leverage) (-10 political support)

[ ] Medical Support Commitments
With the Forgotten hearing about the Zone Operations Command's request for a high speed hover ambulance, they have put in their voices for these, as a means of prompt medical evacuation to the nearest Initiative facility.
(-8 Leverage) (Must finish both Development, and the factory for the Zone Emergency Medical Evacuation Vehicle) (must be researched by the end of the year, and deployed by the end of next year)


If there are other proposals/demands that people want, I will add them as write ins.

** Four Hour Voting Moratorium **
 
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[ ] Reverse Engineering Assistance
The Forgotten are masters of reverse engineering and operating technologies and systems in conjunction that were never intended to go together. By opening up recruitment of many of their best and brightest, GDI can make use of this in its efforts to understand and find its own uses for alien technologies.
(6 leverage) (Scrin technology pool roll becomes d9-1 from d8-1)

Yessss.... we need this so much.

Also for the projects what is the time frame to finish the projects?
 
SCEDQuest (Check my math)
Facilities
Tanegashima Space Center (Stage 3) 145/400
Development (5 Dice) +20
Lunar Excavator Development 41/50
Pathfinder Lander Development 277/250
Space Command Mission Planning (3 Dice) +5
Mission: Orbital Scan - Mercury 94/50
Mission: Surface Exploration - Venus 204/150
 
[]Plan Give (almost )everything and take everything
-[ ] Initial Forgotten Integration
-[ ] Delta Studies
-[ ] Reverse Engineering Assistance
-[ ] Forgotten Biosamples
-[ ] Initiative Communications Support
-[ ] Forgotten Agricultural Support
-[ ] Medical Support Commitments

I think we can live without the 2 capgoods, besides that lets be nice to the Forgotten to turn them into the Remembered or something idk, taking everything except the thing that costs us PS.
 
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[]Plan Give everything and take everything
-[ ] Initial Forgotten Integration
-[ ] Delta Studies
-[ ] Reverse Engineering Assistance
-[ ] Initiative Communications Support
-[ ] Forgotten Agricultural Support
-[ ] Medical Support Commitments

I think we can live without the 2 capgoods, besides that lets be nice to the Forgotten to turn them into the Remembered or something idk, taking everything except the thing that costs us PS.
This would put us at -12 leverage.... so we should really see if we can ask for more. On the other hand all the projects should be doable in the timeframe. It is useful since stuff like the comms support will help work with them more.

Also why no air support? That keeps the forgotten able to survive and thus an allied force versus NOD.

Edit - noticed that air support was not included
 
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While I may have been tempted by simply doing every single option here, both for getting and giving in return, since it all looks doable, I'd have to question whether or not if there is any benefits to having continuously more amounts of leverage over them if there is nothing more to spend it on, especially at the cost of PS. Because as far as I can see, by taking all options, the total Leverage spent would be 24, while total Leverage can be gained is 32, and thus result in a total of -14 - (32 - 24) = -22 Leverage.

Or would there be something like Surpluses for having overwhelming amounts of Leverage, just like the other categories?
So, since you are looking like you are on course to fix a bunch of stuff in the next few turns, going by the plans discussed both here and on discord, I am going to bring up the other side of insufficiencies. Surpluses.

Surpluses are good. Now, that should not be particularly surprising to anybody. Having a large surplus in pretty much any area will see you getting projects to either
A. Turn that surplus to something else. (For example, a large logistics surplus might well allow you to turn it into tourism with things like civil travel aviation or cruise liners as you move resources from transporting goods to mass people transport)
B. Turn that surplus into another shiny (Like a large energy surplus will get you things like particle accelerators, supercomputers, or similar.)
C. Generate a stockpile of that resource for future use (like you have already seen with the farms)
Basically all of these take substantial penalties to that form of supply, but give you some other major shiny in return, or proof against negatives in the future.
 
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