Attempting to Fulfill the Plan: GDI Edition

[Simon_Jester]

It really does, we should make a rotation at least for sec, military sec is important right now due to how important it is that things get to the boots on the ground and birds in the air. Another that must not be screwed with is our communication protocols. Kane has a nasty habit of jacking into our comms and networks.

Edit: I'm almost certain that Kane talks too you more than your bosses sometimes.

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You're not wrong, but on the other hand we've been good little boys and girls about doing regular security reviews for quite a while, and we've only very recently gotten much else to do with our Bureaucracy dice.

So it's tempting to say "just one more turn."

 

[Derpmind]

Last time we reviewed Military, we were still losing resources and couldn't root the infiltration out due to a lack of new computer chips. A security review now could finish that problem and shake out a few resources.

That said, we also need to pump Military with more dice since it still needs tons of buildup and R&D. Not sure how well we can afford the 1 military die to do a security review currently.

 

[Absoloot]

Might as well keep it up. New Averages for Tiberium Spread Dice:

YZ Tiberium Spread Die Average : 56.41 over 22 dice
RZ Tiberium Spread Die Average : 62.33 over 22 dice

22 Dice now, and Red Zone has officially clicked over to 2 deviation above the mean:

YZ Tib Die Z-Score : Z = 1.04
RZ Tib Die Z-Score : Z = 2.00

That gives the following probabilities:

YZ: P(RZ_AVE>56.41) = 16.8%
RZ: P(YZ_AVE>62.33) = 2.7%

Yellow and Red are now in the 83th and 97th Percentile of highest results respectively, using a basic Z-test.

Here I'm assuming the SV Dice Roller uses the theoretical mean and standard deviation of a single d100, 50.5 and 28.86 respectively. My last post has a small error in that I input the mean as 50 flat for the last set of Data. This shifts the values down a bit, but this set is updated with the proper mean.

You think I should go back and edit the previous post to fix those numbers or just leave it? It like a 1% swing.

Edit: I wound up just building a generic formula block to crunch everything for me, so I went ahead and edited the old post w/ strikethroughs to preserve the mistake.

 

[yeastmobile]

Damn the tiberium dice have mutated as well.

 

[Crazycryodude]

You think I should go back and edit the previous post to fix those numbers or just leave it? It like a 1% swing.

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Eh I don't think it's a super big deal, they numbers are crazy either way and you made the correction this time.

Also wow those numbers are indeed crazy, Tiberium is *pissed*

 

[Vehrec]

here's a question: Do people want to rush the Army's projects (RWS, Rockets, Artillery+, Railgun Munitions) and maybe the Air Force as well, or do we want to do something for the Navy as well? I raised doing Point Defense on the discord and got uh, strong opinions.

 

[Woltaire]

Not sure about doing it now but after the election we should def funnel a lot to the military

 

[Chimeraguard]

If we're gonna be pushing RZ Containment to try and stem the tide of Red Zone Rolls, I'd say pushing out the Army projects is more important, since they're the ones who will be doing most of the fighting and dying trying to hold them.

Also, there's a big army campaign going on right now across the Ohio River Valley.

We still want to do Governor Cruisers since a Cruiser Rollout will have a big buildup time, but Fleet PD can probably wait a couple turns, since there's no real large-scale naval battle/amphibious assault action for us to deploy the BBs and CVs into.

 

[Absoloot]

We still want to do Governor Cruisers since a Cruiser Rollout will have a big buildup time, but Fleet PD can probably wait a couple turns, since there's no real large-scale naval battle/amphibious assault action for us to deploy the BBs and CVs into.

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I don't necessarily disagree, but if we always wait for conflict to happen to begin buildup we'll always be on the back foot.

So far we've been very reactionary, it might be a good idea to start planning Mil build up to get ahead of the most likely NOD developments.

For example, our Hydrofoils have pushed back the piracy, so I wouldn't be surprised if within the next 5 quarters NOD rolls out a new Naval threat to push back our shipping. Targeting logistics is Strategy 101.

 

[Image]

Can't wait for NOD too go full Cybran and have walking ships.

Anyway, once we complete the next quarter we should, barring unforeseen curveballs, be able to knock multiple military projects in one sitting. Perhaps finish up the full Steel Talons roster or complete the Navy Refit. The Marv Fleets required should be done by then with good rolls ad resources.

 

[aceraptor]

I don't necessarily disagree, but if we always wait for conflict to happen to begin buildup we'll always be on the back foot.

So far we've been very reactionary, it might be a good idea to start planning Mil build up to get ahead of the most likely NOD developments.

For example, our Hydrofoils have pushed back the piracy, so I wouldn't be surprised if within the next 5 quarters NOD rolls out a new Naval threat to push back our shipping. Targeting logistics is Strategy 101.

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So we need to push out the cruisers. Battleships and carriers aren't going to have enough coverage to deal with dispersed naval forces. They are for force vs force pitched combat. Cruisers are needed for having the coverage of the deeper ocean needed to force engagements and be affordable enough that we can deal with the attrition.

Hydrofoil are strictly for brown water operations. They can do jack shit for interdiction in deeper waters.

 

[BOTcommander]

here's a question: Do people want to rush the Army's projects (RWS, Rockets, Artillery+, Railgun Munitions) and maybe the Air Force as well, or do we want to do something for the Navy as well? I raised doing Point Defense on the discord and got uh, strong opinions.

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PD refits are an overlooked project, because once finished could lead to the technology being deployed elsewhere. For example on MARVs,bringing them one step closer towards land battleship status, or more general Iron Dome type civilian defenses.

 

[Illusion of Eris]

But they are far from the Armies first wish; it;l take time to trickle over to them, the ones who'll be holding the ground and taking lots of casualties; for them I'd say they might like if we first finally welded a damn machine gun to their tanks!

 

[Pyro Hawk]

Honestly, I want to complete the initial Crystal Laser project before deciding on PD refits. Because it sounds like it doesn't give us much initially, but rather upgrades and unlocks a lot of new projects. In which case PD refits and the further PD developments it unlocks might be superseded by something better, or the unlocks from the refits become much better and thus worth doing immediately.

 

[Daniel14541]

Yeah we've been having bad luck. But questers never cry about how unfair it is and the mechanics need to get changed when they hit a streak of really good luck. Our current streak of bad luck is just the statistical price that gets paid for runs of good luck, I don't think deep mechanical changes have to get made over it that's working as designed.

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I don't know what quests you have been playing but they absolutely do that. 2 turns of good luck in a row in any quest I've been in has had dozens of players complaining.

 

[Shard of Victory]

If people want to do Talons stuff, they should build myomer macrospinner. Also, zone command longs for last suit factory.

 

[DinoHank]

Since actually making a plan will make me go cross-eyed, I'll post a bit of a wish-list instead. No particular concern will be paid to resource cost or dice commitment etc.

Continued investment in Chicago is a must. There is probably a point at which we could let it rest, but that point is not now.
We presumably need at least one more project in order to actually start integrating fusion into our power grid, and given our usual energy situation, pursuing this should be a priority.
I'd like to suggest microgeneration as well, it's a cheap project and already done. An energy reserve would allow for some more daring plans, and would provide some protection if Nod strikes at our grid.
I've seen people discussing Boston, and I also think that is a good idea. 1200 progress is a lot, but if we never start, we'll never finish. Tokyo seems like something to pursue in the medium term, rather than immediately.
Superconductors are very desirable. I don't think more needs to be said.
Myomer Macrospinner seems like the highest prority to me. It will help the military, once we have some production it will help our industry and healthcare and as delicious icing on an already tasty cake it will provide both Cap Goods and Energy? Sign me up.

For agriculture, staying the course and completing perennials seems like the best choice. Afterwards I'd suggest Entari and maybe spider cotton if we have some spare resources or dice.

We are getting awfully close to our tib processing cap, so expanding that is something we will have to invest in soon.

All the space stations are important, I think I'd prioritize Enterprise in the hopes of resource gain that wont stress our tib processing and/or reduced space construction costs. Philly is also really good though...

I've got no strong opinions on services.

For the military I usually try to prioritize in three stages. #1: Are any of our branches involved in direct combat on a larger scale? #2: Are all our branches at a decent level of preparation/confidence and #3: What are we going to be asking of our forces in the future?
For #1 our ground forces and Air Force are actively involved in combat at Chicago. Therefore they should get priority. For #2 Navy and especially Talons need some love, but as they are not actively fighting they are merely second priority. #3 is about our future needs, and thus harder to predict, especially since planning is by committee and consensus and sometimes struggle with long-term thinking. Let's be honest: we are easily distracted. If our future priority is mining, ZOCOM should be prioritized. If it's Karachi, Talons and Navy. If Colombo, Navy, Navy, Navy and Air Force.

I want to pursue laser development as soon as possible. While we are literal decades behind Nod and unlikely to catch up without getting lucky with reverse engineering, better point defenses at least should be in reach.
While I think it's a low priority getting the last Zone Suit factory done and closing that project would feel really good. It's been with us since the beginning after all.

The Air Force needs new Orcas, no ifs or buts about it. The only question is if we can afford to postpone it for a turn or two in order to get a better product, or if we need to do it now.

While I think ground forces is a priority, I think the state of their artillery at the moment is Good Enough(TM), and we should focus on our tanks (or infantry if we had anything for them). Therefore, the AWS is what I'd argue for. It's a useful thing we need, the fact that it might provide some synergy with Titans is nice, but mostly I'm kind of sick of seeing it at this point.
More Ablat pucks goes without saying. If we do more here I'd suggest either rockets or railguns over arty or more shells.

For the navy I'd finish up the hydrofoils, and only then do the cruisers. If we have laser-based PD by the time we roll out cruisers, all the better, but as others have noted upthread the lead time on navy project might be significant.

For the Talons I'd finish up Wolverine deployment first. Titans are my next ask there, I think, but ideally only after getting myomer production up and running and having developed AWS and laser PD, as both of those seem like they have synergy. Pursuing Havoc development while researching more stuff to staple onto our Titans might be worth it.

Bureaucracy is mostly committed to security sweeps, but Interdepartmental Communication Initiative should be squeezed in when possible. Strategic planning would be great, but I've mostly resigned myself to stare at it longingly.

 

[sunrise]

Goals include getting the goods needed for Expand Strategic Planning Apparatus and the needed 5 development projects unlocked so we can see the cost.
No Governor Class Cruiser Development as i expect that will need capital goods and all 6 we might have are for Yellow Zone Light Industrial Sectors and Expand Strategic Planning Apparatus.
Next turn when we will get capital goods from the next phase of Johannesburg Myomer Macrospinner its time for the cruiser.
GDSS Philadelphia can complete with 2 dice but i expect the bonus to be high enough that 30% higher chance of getting it is worth 20R and a orbital dice.
I think besides Philadelphia there are no projects that we need to spend additional dice to get them to complete before the election.

[] Plan Military Developments
infra 60R
-[] Tidal Power Plants (Phase 2) 0?/200 3 dice 30R 34%
-[] Rail Link Reconstruction (Phase 2) 40/200 2 dice 30R 83%
HI 50R
-[] Heavy Rolling Stock Plants 111/250 2 dice 20R 57%
-[] Blue Zone Microgeneration Program (Phase 2) 54/120 1 die 5R 66%
-[] Yellow Zone Power Grid Extension (Phase 3) 71/350 1 die 5R
-[] 1 fusion dice 20R
LCI 4 free 80R + 1 free
-[] Chemical Precursor Plants 36/200 2 dice 30R 29%
-[] Yellow Zone Light Industrial Sectors 327/400 1 dice 10R 56%
-[] Johannesburg Myomer Macrospinner (phase 1) 0/90 2 die 40R 89%
Agri 30R
-[] Perennial Aquaponics Bays 177/350 2 dice 20R 24%
-[] State Operated Breweries 69/125 1 die 10R 73%
Tib 95R
-[] Tiberium Prospecting Expeditions (Phase 4) 99/150? 1 die 5R 96%
-[] Chicago Planned City (Phase 2) 43/160 2 Tib dice 40R 93%
-[] Red Zone Containment Lines (Phase 3) 8/180 2 dice 50R 56%
orbital 60R
-[] GDSS Philadelphia II (Phase 3) 229/360 3 dice 60R+ 93%
Services 50R
-[] Durable Goods Libraries and Central Repositories 50/200 2 dice 30R 70%
-[] Ethnic Restaurant Program 97/150 1 die 10R 91%
-[] Fashion development houses 0/225 1 die 10R
Mil 5 + 3 free 100R
-[] MARV /hubs 2 dice 40R
-[] Crystal Beam Laser Prototype Development 0/40 1 die 20R 88%
-[] Remote Weapons System Development Predator 0/40 1 die 10R 88%
-[] Wolverine Mark 3 Deployment 58/150 1 die 10R 37%
-[] Ablat Plating Deployment (phase 1) 152/200 1 dice 10R 81%
-[] Titan Mark 3 Development 0/30 1 die 10R 99%
-[] Securtiy review
Buro +1 free dice
-[] Interdepartmental Communication Initiative DC 90 2 dice 89%
-[] Securtiy revieuw(mil) 2 dice 98%
525/530

 

[Void Stalker]

We aren't pulling stuff from museums by Word of GM.

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Good to know, though I have to imagine that finishing the rolling stock plant will either increase the effect or drop progress cost for rail networks. Might try to finish that along with working on yz or fusion power. More so since if people want governor cruisers we are going to need a lot more power.

My top priority, aside from finishing off Philadelphia Phase 3, is throwing everything we have into a consumer goods surge. I know it'll be last-minute, but last-minute still means good shit hitting the shelves in the weeks right before the election, as I understand it. That's not a bad thing.

Finishing some military development projects is good though too, because it makes Hawks happy and we're still gonna be dealing with a lot of Hawks.

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Yeah, looking at percentages philly is going to need all 3 dice to have a good chance to finish next turn, I was hoping I could put 2 and start on another space station. I am going to have to look at the percentages as I do want us to finish some of the cons goods projects (YZ light for example) even though we did a solid cons good turn we could use 1 more before election, also heavy mil investment before elections can further fracture the mil party and is something we should be doing as we need to play catch up (we did a lot of econ investment to set the foundation now is the time for the foundation to start paying for itself).

Honestly, I want to complete the initial Crystal Laser project before deciding on PD refits. Because it sounds like it doesn't give us much initially, but rather upgrades and unlocks a lot of new projects. In which case PD refits and the further PD developments it unlocks might be superseded by something better, or the unlocks from the refits become much better and thus worth doing immediately.

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Thats a fair point, I think I need to try and fit one dice into that so we can start chipping away at PD with 1 or 2 dice starting in Q1.

 

[Simon_Jester]

If people want to do Talons stuff, they should build myomer macrospinner. Also, zone command longs for last suit factory.

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I'm sure they do, but they already have like five and until now our Energy budget was very tight. We might be able to afford the sixth factory now, but we need to have some Energy left over for the civilian economy; it's unsustainable to spend 500+ Heavy Industry project each year or so building power plants that go literally nowhere but the military with little or nothing left over. Too many good civilian projects require Energy.

Yeah, looking at percentages philly is going to need all 3 dice to have a good chance to finish next turn, I was hoping I could put 2 and start on another space station. I am going to have to look at the percentages as I do want us to finish some of the cons goods projects (YZ light for example) even though we did a solid cons good turn we could use 1 more before election, also heavy mil investment before elections can further fracture the mil party and is something we should be doing as we need to play catch up (we did a lot of econ investment to set the foundation now is the time for the foundation to start paying for itself).

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That's the logic. On the other hand, we only have so many free dice to go around... Prioritizing is gonna be tough this turn.

 

[Cursix]

For #2 Navy and especially Talons need some love, but as they are not actively fighting they are merely second priority.

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Debatable. We've already seen how neglecting the Navy will lead to repercussions and we've been told what we've done so far just is not enough to cover everywhere. And a lot of stuff is locked behind Talons options as they're meant to be the bleeding edge.

 

[BoSPaladin]

Debatable. We've already seen how neglecting the Navy will lead to repercussions and we've been told what we've done so far just is not enough to cover everywhere. And a lot of stuff is locked behind Talons options as they're meant to be the bleeding edge.

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Yeah very debatable. Like, until recently we were losing stuff to Nod Pirate attacks since our navy doesn't have adequate security.

Remembering that the blue zones are spread out all over the planet the Navy needs just as much investment as the other branches if we're to keep everything together and mutually supporting multiple blue zones.

 

[DinoHank]

Debatable. We've already seen how neglecting the Navy will lead to repercussions and we've been told what we've done so far just is not enough to cover everywhere. And a lot of stuff is locked behind Talons options as they're meant to be the bleeding edge.

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I mean, you're not wrong, but they aren't currently getting shot at (above the usual background level, anyway). In an ideal world, we could invest at least a little bit in everything, but we have to prioritize. The navy and the Talons should get theirs, absolutely, but I think army and Air Force needs it more, at least this turn and maybe next. That doesn't mean I think we should give them nothing. One project for them, two for the army or something maybe?

 

[BeepSmile]

I'm excited to see the narrative effects of the Prospecting actions.

Just wondering, have they ever been chosen before?

 

[Simon_Jester]

Goals include getting the goods needed for Expand Strategic Planning Apparatus and the needed 5 development projects unlocked so we can see the cost.
No Governor Class Cruiser Development as i expect that will need capital goods and all 6 we might have are for Yellow Zone Light Industrial Sectors and Expand Strategic Planning Apparatus.

Click to shrink...

Remind me again why we need Expand Strategic Planning Apparatus? Seeing costs is nice but I'm not sure it's critical; we get by fairly well without it.

Next turn when we will get capital goods from the next phase of Johannesburg Myomer Macrospinner its time for the cruiser.

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If we can expect Capital Goods, then I guess that's worth it.

[] Plan Military Developments
infra 60R
-[] Tidal Power Plants (Phase 2) 0?/200 3 dice 30R 34%
-[] Rail Link Reconstruction (Phase 2) 40/200 2 dice 30R 83%

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I don't think we really need to work on Tidal Power next turn, given the energy surplus and the part where we have some Energy-net-positive industrial projects waiting in the wings... BUT Tidal Power is just about the cheapest thing the dice have, unless we want to throw three dice at Blue Zone Residential Construction to get a shitload of new housing before the election and see if that makes a lot of Blue Zoners happy.

HI 50R
-[] Heavy Rolling Stock Plants 111/250 2 dice 20R 57%
-[] Blue Zone Microgeneration Program (Phase 2) 54/120 1 die 5R 66%
-[] Yellow Zone Power Grid Extension (Phase 3) 71/350 1 die 5R
-[] 1 fusion dice 20R

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I'm not clear on what this means by saying "1 fusion dice 20 R." Ohhh, I see, that's for spending on the next-generation fusion power project! I see now. Well, I'm not entirely happy with the low resource budget here... but I get the logic. And since my own notion is to at least create a "make the people happy right before the election" plan, and heavy industry ain't exactly a cornerstone of Consumer Goods output, this works reasonably well for me.

LCI 4 free 80R + 1 free
-[] Chemical Precursor Plants 36/200 2 dice 30R 29%
-[] Yellow Zone Light Industrial Sectors 327/400 1 dice 10R 56%
-[] Johannesburg Myomer Macrospinner (phase 1) 0/90 2 die 40R 89%

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This is in keeping with the essential logic of your plan, but I'd really like to get Yellow Zone Light Industry done before the election and this plan makes that a crapshoot.

Agri 30R
-[] Perennial Aquaponics Bays 177/350 2 dice 20R 24%
-[] State Operated Breweries 69/125 1 die 10R 73%
Tib 95R
-[] Tiberium Prospecting Expeditions (Phase 4) 99/150? 1 die 5R 96%
-[] Chicago Planned City (Phase 2) 43/160 2 Tib dice 40R 93%
-[] Red Zone Containment Lines (Phase 3) 8/180 2 dice 50R 56%

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Respectable, I suppose... though I don't feel the burning urgency of Chicago that hard. Then again there are reasons for it. I'm trying a 'voter-friendly' plan myself, but that doesn't mean this is wrong.

Services 50R
-[] Durable Goods Libraries and Central Repositories 50/200 2 dice 30R 70%
-[] Ethnic Restaurant Program 97/150 1 die 10R 91%
-[] Fashion development houses 0/225 1 die 10R

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Hmmm, maybe. Given the lack of free dice for anything but the military in your plan, I'm iffy on this.

Mil 5 + 3 free 100R
-[] MARV /hubs 2 dice 40R
-[] Crystal Beam Laser Prototype Development 0/40 1 die 20R 88%
-[] Remote Weapons System Development Predator 0/40 1 die 10R 88%
-[] Wolverine Mark 3 Deployment 58/150 1 die 10R 37%
-[] Ablat Plating Deployment (phase 1) 152/200 1 dice 10R 81%
-[] Titan Mark 3 Development 0/30 1 die 10R 99%
-[] Securtiy review
Buro +1 free dice
-[] Interdepartmental Communication Initiative DC 90 2 dice 89%
-[] Securtiy revieuw(mil) 2 dice 98%
525/530

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OK, trying to prioritize to create my CONSOOM plan... well, the military security review probably doesn't absolutely have to be done this turn, which would free up two free dice in effect (one not spent on Bureaucracy, one not spent on Military to make sure we actually spend six dice) We MIGHT then want to cut one project to shift the military/civilian balance a bit farther.

I'm excited to see the narrative effects of the Prospecting actions.

Just wondering, have they ever been chosen before?

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I don't think they existed until this turn- they seem to have been unlocked by our finishing the surface-level anti-tiberium perimeter around the Blue Zones.