Part of the reason why the regency war kicked off is that Nod saw the writing on the wall. And that was with our economic growth, and substantial military investments, we were going to soon reach the point where even if they were fully united that they would be unable to meaningfully oppose us. At that time, 10 mil dice/turn was "preparing to conquer the world" levels of military investment.

The war backfired horribly on Nod. They lost so much population, industry, and tiberium harvesting operations, that now the "preparing to conquer the world" level of military investment is under 10 mil dice/turn.

That isn't to say that we've beaten them. First and foremost, Nod is transforming its tactics and strategies from peer power military conflict back to insurgency and terrorism. To deal with those will mostly require us to be improving QoL, and generating a lot of revenue that the rest of the GDI can direct towards internal security.

Kane may try to pull off bullshit to re-even the odds between the two groups. It's also possible that he'll go to the GDI and offer them a deal to defeat tiberium and get him off planet. At this point, more military investment is unlikely to be as effective in dealing with Kane as investments in orbital, or other sectors of our society.

The real wildcard is the rediscovery of the Scrin, as the supermajority of our military investments to date will have no affect on preventing them from reaching Earth.
 
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Go easy on the new guy people.
But yeah, you just won, hard. It is more that you did not win hard everywhere, which is pretty normal. Infinite needs and limited resources are the name of the game.
 
Sorry about that. I may have seemed a bit salty, because at the point in the quest where I am, the military is still begging for new hardware that was in the request lists for years. So, last 2 questions, housing has a surplus of +31, right? Does a surplus housing mean empty houses left alone? If so, why are there refugees in lousy housing? And if I am wrong, what does a housing surplus of +31 indicate?

And can someone tell me how are the pluses and minuses converted to points? Like how many points do, say 5 pluses convert to? And how do the quantities added by the projects work? Like if we complete a housing project that rewards 4 points of housing, do we go to +35 housing, or is there some other calculation?

And lastly, thanks for clearing up my mistakes politely and not immediately jumping to my throat for being salty.
 
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pluses and minuses converted to points? Like how many points does, say 5 pluses convert to? And how do the quantities added by the projects work? Like if we complete a housing project that rewards 4 points of housing, do we go to +35 housing, or is thare some other calculation?
So we have moved away from that system, but basically it is 2^(X-1). So + = 1 ++ = 2 +++ =4. +++++ =16
And if you complete a project that means that you would go from +31 to +35 unless something (like refugees or new births) are consuming that.

So, last 2 questions, housing has a surplus of +31, right? Does a surplus housing mean empty houses left alone?
So yes, surplus housing means empty units. Mostly that means empty apartments. The thing is that I am modeling it where people, if they can, will move to better apartments/better housing if they can manage it. So an arcology is nearly always full, while the immediately postwar commieblock constructions are empty. And the refugees are getting put there because the space is there.
 
Sorry about that. I may have seemed a bit salty, because at the point in the quest where I am, the military is still begging for new hardware that was in the request lists for years. So, last 2 questions, housing has a surplus of +31, right? Does a surplus housing mean empty houses left alone? If so, why are there refugees in lousy housing? And if I am wrong, what does a housing surplus of +31 indicate?

And can someone tell me how are the pluses and minuses converted to points? Like how many points do, say 5 pluses convert to? And how do the quantities added by the projects work? Like if we complete a housing project that rewards 4 points of housing, do we go to +35 housing, or is there some other calculation?

And lastly, thanks for clearing up my mistakes politely and not immediately jumping to my throat for being salty.
Sorry about jumping on you, there is currently a discussion of how much to scale back military spending, which has occasionally gotten a bit heated.

Housing having a surplus of +31 does mean we have empty living space, yes. But a lot of that living space is ... not all that good. To put it mildly. Because towards the start of the quest, we were building relatively small, ugly, brutalist apartments and stuffing whole families in them. If you've heard the term "commieblock", that's them. Also, a good chunk of that +31 is bunkers underneath our Fortress Towns, which are mostly in harm's way, again not particularly pretty, and also mostly in Yellow/Green Zones.

Our short/medium term goal in terms of housing is to get the number that are listed as being in "low quality housing" down to zero, which currently means putting lots of dice into building Apartment complexes, and hopefully getting the (sub-)department of Arcologies started to have an automatic process of building the top-tier housing that are the Blue Zone Arcologies.

calling them commieblocks is doing them a disservice. they are well constructed buildings and comfortable to live in.
They're sturdy, yes. They are also cramped and ugly. They might be okay as a studio apartment for a single person, but when we were stuffing relatively-large families in there, there was entirely justified complaining.
(Not that we had the resources to do any better, at the time.)
 
Some people did, some of that was us tearing down older construction to do new construction in block form when we had a major housing issue so people who lost their houses were unahppy
 
It's also worth noting that even our low quality housing and fortress town housing is a big step up from nod housing in yellow zones. Plus all the other bonuses like "technology", "personal property", and "food".
 
Yeah, all of our housing is safe, well maintained and of good quality construction. The problems the low quality stuff tends to have is being cramped, not as good as the high quality stuff and in some cases being inside an a military fort (although if anyone is living in those long term it's either because they have a job in the area like tib mining or it's one of the very rear line forts)
 
I am so looking forward to the day when we can finally replace the commieblocks with something nicer.
 
While too cramped to offer a full range of amenities, such as four unit stoves, or full sized ovens, these apartment units are substantial improvements over refugee camps.
Things like this get said about them. Better than a refugee camp. They are just too small. And too sturdily built to make knocking down interior walls likely to pass muster. Improving them could involve bulldozing the best placed ones so a phase of apartments could be built in better locations at reduced logistics cost. It wouldn't save effort on the build itself though.
 
If the QM is calling them commie blocks, we should probably accept that they kinda are commie blocks instead of arguing with the QM about how stuff are in game.

It's not to say that commie blocks are bad though. For a lot of people, refuges going from ram-shacked and ruined homes with tiberium growing on their walls, it's gonna seem like a 5 star penthouse in comparison.

It's absolutly a good, fantastic thing that literally everyone in the GDI can get their own rooms and apparments, even something as simple as a commieblock.

But it's still at the end of the day, low-quality housing compared to Archologies.

Securing everyone housing should be pur first step as the treasure of the Global defence initiative.

As players, we shouldn't stop there though and transition into ensuring everyone get's high quality home's as a follow up to that. Instead of dimissing them as "housing number's are postive", balancing between that and our other economic needs.

We given them the means to live, now we gotta make sure it's a life people wanna live.
 
Q3 project I want to get to:
[ ] Microfusion Cell Development (Tech) (New)
A micro scale fusion cell, designed for personal scale high density energy needs, is of critical importance, especially with the advent of ever more power hungry personal systems, ranging from energy weapons, to personal tools for space construction. While it is almost certain to be Elerium hungry, that is an unfortunate requirement for such systems.
(Progress 0/60: 20 resources per die)
Maybe Q3, maybe Q4. Our priority should be getting the crystal beam lasers rolled out for industry, both for the Energy and so we don't have to stress about "but what if we get really shitty rolls" and wastefully throw like three dice worth of overkill at the crystal beam project.

So whether I'm comfortable with any diversion of effort away from crystal beam lasers in Q3 is gonna depend on what the rolls for the winning Q2 plan do.

Advanced alloys might be worth investment as well. "Lighter and more effective materials" sounds like "easier to construct with", I.e. discounts for construction, which we do a lot.
Yeah, but it also sounds like "now you need STUs to build anything," which isn't so good.

And we need to figure out Chicago 4 - should we do it or abandon it in favour of additional Tib refineries?
I think at this point we should do the refineries, but I also think we should at least consider putting dice on Chicago Phase 4 in Q3 or Q4 anyway. Nothing else in Infrastructure is that urgent apart from apartment spam, and we're doing quite a lot of that. Pushing Chicago higher can only be a good thing, and that on top of the refineries gives us so much refinery cap breathing room that we'll be able to smoothly fit in the job of refitting the refineries (again) to the improved Hewlett-Gardner process we're probably gonna develop soon, even while greatly increasing income in a hurry.

So, as someone very new to this thread and still catching up, I happened to read the last plan update. And from what I am seeing Bintang is eating up a lot of our logistics, is that right? Is there anything in the actions that can help scare her off, if not defeat her?
So I know a few people have covered this, but let me give you the highlights.

We fought a big-ass naval battle and sank a bunch of her boats. She sank a bunch of ours and went all Godzilla on some chunks of Tokyo. However, she took enough of a beating that her forces are probably gonna have to pull back a bit. Furthermore, we have so much Logistics that we can just tank the harm she's causing us; it's bad but it's not unmanageable. Long-term, we're building up a new fleet to confront her and other Nod naval threats more effectively, but that's a long term move because ships take years to finish and all we can do is build the yards and wait.

Building those yards has been, if you check just the past few turns, a huge priority of ours lately.

And overall from the beating that NOD is giving GDI and the very little military investments that we are doing compared to all the bullshit that they are pulling out of their ass on the regular and at prodigious speeds, is there any hope of us winning the war against them? Or is this going to be a attrition war that, in the end, we will lose?
Speaking from 2061Q1, this is almost literally Opposite Day from us in every respect. Look up "Operation Steel Vanguard." Nod's warlords were planning to dogpile us in 2060, but GDI critted on intelligence gathering and got wind of it. So we went all smashy smashy on them first- got the drop on them just as they were getting ready to go.

In the resulting offensives, GDI took large swathes of territory from several Nod warlords. We hit Gideon's belt of Yellow Zones so hard that his territory is now cut into three pieces (the other two pieces have basically stopped taking his orders). We reconquered the entire East Australian Yellow Zone. We've got whole-ass projects in Tiberium that basically boil down to "now that you have chased Nod entirely out of this big blob of land directly adjacent to a Red Zone, we can really go to town on this Red Zone!"

We only stopped punching Nod in the face because we intercepted comm chatter of Nod warlords passing out nuclear launch codes to their subordinate generals. The warlords were starting to get so desperate to stop fighting a war of attrition that they were losing that they were willing to risk a full nuclear exchange to stop the beatings.

Our military investments are pretty good, though the current situation has suggested at holes that we'll need to plug if we want to stay strong. Big ones being more ships (navy is our weakness), power armor for the Ground Forces (especially with Nod unleashing giant cyborg laser crocodiles and shit on us; our infantry are getting too lightly armed and squishy to be very relevant), and the SADN system in case any of the warlords get a bit more desperate and start trying to pop our major cities and industrial centers with long range cruise missiles.

Sorry about that. I may have seemed a bit salty, because at the point in the quest where I am, the military is still begging for new hardware that was in the request lists for years.
Back up a bit and consider how that works.

Our Military projects list consists of literally everything the Military can even imagine asking us to fund, that they think would do them any practical good on the battlefield. Try counting just how many dice each project currently on the list would take. One Military die usually gets us about 75-80 Progress, on average. Remember that lurking behind each Development project is a sizeable Deployment project, and many of the Developments are useless until we deploy.

I don't know how long it would take us to work through the entire list of Military projects, but the answer is "a hell of a lot more than ten turns." Probably more than twenty, I suspect.

Inevitably, then, the military is gonna ask for stuff that we just cannot give them because we're too busy giving them other things they also need very much. We've been investing 10+ Military dice per turn for something like 8-12 turns now, and a lot before that too, and it just isn't enough to finish everything.

You can make a case that in some situations, we've misallocated resources and done something for one part of the military when we should have used those resources to do something else. But we're never, ever going to get to a place where every military project that pops up gets finished within a year or two. There will always be Cool Shit the military's been thinking about for several years and we've just never had the time and funds to get around to it.

calling them commieblocks is doing them a disservice. they are well constructed buildings and comfortable to live in.
They're well constructed, but they're also pretty new still, so the fact that they aren't falling apart yet doesn't prove much. And they may be comfortable in that they're well insulated and well laid out and all, but they're fucking tiny. Because we needed to cram as many people as possible into a limited number of new buildings.

can we take an action to upgrade them to higher quality since they are empty right now , before the refugees get to the point were that isn't an option , reducing the low quality housing malus would do wonders for our political points
We've heard noises about a "refit old housing" option becoming available.

One thing that occurs to me is that a lot of the old commieblocks are very close to city centers and generally in locations that were adequately served by available transportation even back when we hadn't done nearly as much reconstruction of the transit networks as we have now. They're probably on good real estate and in good locations, even if it sucks to live in the actual buildings... hm.

As players, we shouldn't stop there though and transition into ensuring everyone get's high quality home's as a follow up to that. Instead of dimissing them as "housing number's are postive", balancing between that and our other economic needs.

We given them the means to live, now we gotta make sure it's a life people wanna live.
Just to keep us centered and avoid people starting to accuse each other of things that we haven't even been doing (which always gets ugly)...

We have been doing that. If it weren't for the huge refugee wave from Steel Vanguard, it seems fairly likely that we'd already be on track to get everyone out of low quality housing by the end of the Plan. As it stands, we're struggling to keep ahead of the refugee numbers and that's a problem... but we can manage.
 
Also: We are barely scraping ahead on housing despite a massive refugee wave that we generated due to hitting the Brotherhood of Nod hard enough that greater than ten percent of their population fell out is kind of a good problem to have.
 
Our Military projects list consists of literally everything the Military can even imagine asking us to fund, that they think would do them any practical good on the battlefield. Try counting just how many dice each project currently on the list would take. One Military die usually gets us about 75-80 Progress, on average. Remember that lurking behind each Development project is a sizeable Deployment project, and many of the Developments are useless until we deploy.

I don't know how long it would take us to work through the entire list of Military projects, but the answer is "a hell of a lot more than ten turns." Probably more than twenty, I suspect.

According to the Big Excel Spreadsheet of Doom I made to keep track of everything, it will take ~313 dice to finish all currently available projects in Military. Or roughly 39-40 turns of 8 dice investment. This does count all the MARVs though, discounting those leaves ~121 dice (~15 turns). Those numbers don't count the deployment projects, nor the follow on waves of Zone Armor, which would add a significant amount to that.
 
Also: We are barely scraping ahead on housing despite a massive refugee wave that we generated due to hitting the Brotherhood of Nod hard enough that greater than ten percent of their population fell out is kind of a good problem to have.
Quite true.

According to the Big Excel Spreadsheet of Doom I made to keep track of everything, it will take ~313 dice to finish all currently available projects in Military. Or roughly 39-40 turns of 8 dice investment. This does count all the MARVs though, discounting those leaves ~121 dice (~15 turns). Those numbers don't count the deployment projects, nor the follow on waves of Zone Armor, which would add a significant amount to that.
Yeah, so probably something like 20 turns, ignoring MARVs.
 
Regarding the Processing Goals, it might be more efficient to just create Processing Plants rather than Chicago. Our Tib Dice after the Tendrils is less valuable than Infra which is being pulled on Apartments, Shuttles and the upcoming arcology bureau.
 
Also: We are barely scraping ahead on housing despite a massive refugee wave that we generated due to hitting the Brotherhood of Nod hard enough that greater than ten percent of their population fell out is kind of a good problem to have.
Greater than 10% right now, not including the future refugees. I expect that we're already at the maximum for refugee flow as is though. Meaning as time goes on, we'll make more and more ground against the Low-Quality Housing backlog. Nothing else, we've already reduced the backlog enough that everyone who wanted better quality housing in GDI pre-war has had an opportunity to get it. Its mostly refugees in the fortress towns and commie blocks.
 
Are we going to do a big push on tendrils/claws the turn before redistribution so we can complete them the turn after and boost our income significantly?
 
Regarding the Processing Goals, it might be more efficient to just create Processing Plants rather than Chicago. Our Tib Dice after the Tendrils is less valuable than Infra which is being pulled on Apartments, Shuttles and the upcoming arcology bureau.
Yeah, but with the other benefits of Chicago, it presents a rather appealing case.
Hard to judge between the options due to differing restrictions, needs and benefits; but I think that both options are equally viable.
 
Regarding the Processing Goals, it might be more efficient to just create Processing Plants rather than Chicago. Our Tib Dice after the Tendrils is less valuable than Infra which is being pulled on Apartments, Shuttles and the upcoming arcology bureau.
Remember, there's a lot of good things we can do with Tiberium dice.

Like Red Zone abatement. We can never really have too much of that, and it's good if we build up a buffer for that eventual hopefully distant day when something bad happens and the Red Zones are in danger of rolling forwards.

The arcology bureau is, quite frankly, something to do in 2061Q4. It's not a major factor in our calculations; it means we have 17 Infrastructure dice to spend rather than 18.

Suborbital Shuttles, well. It depends. We are basically one die away from completion of Phase 1, so the question is whether we want to press forward. Arguably there's no time like the present, and with only about 500 Progress to go, completing the whole project or most of it and getting +16 Logistics (or +8, easily "tapped" up to +16 with a die or two) is an attractive prospect. We have the money right now, and we won't in 2062, and so maybe we should.

That's potentially an investment of another 6-7 dice.

Apartments, well, we average two dice per phase. If we wanted to be incredibly ambitious and build enough for all the people now in low quality housing and all the anticipated refugees from Q2 through Q4 (to be clear that is roughly 23+30 = 53 Housing or nine phases)... We'd need eighteen dice, which is actually about all we have. Housing either of those groups would be several dice...

So yeah, to be fair, apartments plus shuttles could easily take all the remaining Infrastructure dice (note that in this case, most of the +Logistics from the shuttle service just goes to offsetting the -Logistics cost of building 5-6 phases of apartments).

On the other hand, we could fit Chicago in and still have enough to make a lot of progress on the apartments, enough to keep ahead of the refugees even if they continue to show up full force through the end of the Plan. We'd just have to put off Suborbital Shuttles Phase 2+3 until later.

Of course, the problem then would be that we'd burn through another -10 Logistics just from building those apartments (five phases), and Chicago itself uses another -2. So if we're not building any +Logistics projects, things actually get a little narrow on that front. Hopefully, over the course of the coming year, the military's extra Logistics demands will relax and we'll claw back some of the -7 we're losing to that, hopefully along with the raiding... So maybe it's not urgent. But it IS the kind of thing that should make us want to consider +Logistics projects like Suzuka, Civilian Drone Factories, or Personal Electric Vehicle Plants. Though all those cost respectable numbers of dice in their own right, and dice aren't exactly freely available in Heavy Industry.

Are we going to do a big push on tendrils/claws the turn before redistribution so we can complete them the turn after and boost our income significantly?
No way to be sure. Plans might choose to put off Phase 2 of tendrils until 2062, or make progress on it now, or half and half. Claws deployment is a project where we don't even know the cost or Progress requirements, so that's even harder to figure out.

Yeah, but with the other benefits of Chicago, it presents a rather appealing case.
Hard to judge between the options due to differing restrictions, needs and benefits; but I think that both options are equally viable.
We could use the Capital Goods, and the Consumer Goods would help take the edge off of public frustrations as they appear.
 
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