I don't think we need to worry about that. The fact this religion's leader is a foreign head of state (Queen Chevaline) is enough reason for any government leader to NOT want it to be popular in their country.
Not really. An immigration push is more likely to get the penniless people by its nature as an advertisement. Being rich with resources means you already have the resources to find out about foreign lands on your own without resources, thus a higher proportion of immigrants before advertisements is likely to be made of the skilled and affluent than after such. Both before and after will still be made up of majority penniless people since affluent people don't usually have reasons to move and refugees are almost always going to have nothing but the clothes on their back, but an immigration push would increase the amount of penniless people relative to the minority affluent and skilled immigrants.
On the first part, that's my point. I was literally using it as an example that our actions have natural consequences even if we don't see them! Why do you guys keep trying to not address my main point and instead acting as if I'm harping on the specific examples being big boogiemen that you need to defend when I'm not doing that? This is why I don't like to bring up examples despite SV considering it "good debating etiquette." When examples are brought up, almost no one actually stays on topic and just tries to be particular instead of engaging with the central idea that the examples are supposed to push.
Dude, wealth doesn't do anything whatsoever about what I said with ADMINISTRATIVE CAPACITY. That's the actual ability for a bureaucracy to handle people and process information. Throwing money at problems doesn't matter. Money just means we have the ability to support a larger administrative capacity, not that we have the capacity right now already. The whole refugees point is to show that we've repeatedly seen that we literally can't really process another immigration wave right now because our ADMINISTRATIVE CAPACITY is already reaching its stress test.
As weaver said
there's a lot of heavy biological differences. For one, alicorns are literally just combinations of the three pony races. Heavenly dragons are generally more intelligent and not bound by the greed curse of Discord, cannot breath fire like Earth Dragons:
The only actual biological similarities are in base traits that likely all dragon variations that could pop up share. It seems far more likely that the quest is going for a "western dragon" vs "eastern dragon" type of thing with Earth and Heavenly Dragons being species variations and not Heavenly Dragons just being some kind of "ascended Earth Dragon", moreso considering the philosophical aspect that in Eastern philosophy an actually ascended state of being needs to master both Heaven (the mind/"magic") and Earth (the body) to reach as such.
He wouldn't. Don't confuse the Garrick and Gryphonian's culture and values as matching your own just because we've been guiding them. That's one of the bigger problems I've seen consistently pop up in pretty much every argument or debate that happens in this quest. There's always at least one side that claims "Oh well the Empire/our people/Garrick wouldn't want this or do this" when it disagrees with your own morality or values despite the fact that all signs typically point to the opposite.
I'm surprised that we didn't do the Shrines this turn with the Neighpon personals, honestly.
I'd be up for the Shrines. I just wanted the Imperial Cult to finally get off the ground.
this is a bit of an exaggeration. Haven't we been explicitly told that social mobility HAS become more common, especially after the winter wars?
Sure, but it's worth remembering this:
She can, and has, travailed into our empire. This is not something we can ignore.
You do know we don't have to take an action for the Church of the Lady to get more influence in our borders. Remember this?
The fact that the CotL got the biggest influence boost from that worries me. She knows how to pull strings.
I didn't say class is stagnant. I responded to the post that said "class divide is minimal" which is standard Horatio Alger-style "rags-to-riches" propaganda that being in a liberal economy rather than a feudal one means few people are actually at the bottom (typically with the epithet that those who are at the bottom deserve to be there).
Of course they will fall without another crisis causing floods of refugees (though that also relies on the famine being stopped quickly). Do remember, however, that this conversation started because people have consistently complained each turn why we haven't done it already. I was justifying why it would've been a bad idea to do it during the past few decades of constant refugee flows, and why it would be bad to do it in the near future until things settle down (assuming we don't manage to protectorate all of Maretonia which would likely take away from that).
Be interesting at least. Another thing to add to the genetics pile, like my dream of having Qilin bloodline mixed into the monarch of the Empire. Mwahahaha!
Oh I know. That's why I added that "in balance" instead of just saying "circle of life." They act themselves as some kinda guardians and enforcers of a natural balance to the extent that it itself is unnatural.
the low fertility of Neighpon was specifically a Qilin thing, so maybe Oni, Kitsune and Tanuki don't actually have that problem. Neighpon went through their own unification with those races, and I'm not actually sure about THEIR population numbers (though I'd assume they started lower than the Qilin at least).
Hey, one step at a time!Be interesting at least. Another thing to add to the genetics pile, like my dream of having Qilin bloodline mixed into the monarch of the Empire. Mwahahaha!
The low fertility rate is a Qilin thing, yes, but they are also an island country and unified far less peacefully than us, to the extent that they killed off more of their population. Therefore, that means they kinda need all the population they already have. Sorry if I didn't make my meaning clear.
Based on the gryphon's worldview as described by Questor, they probably won't care about the environment beyond how it affects them and their allies. If the environmental changes affect them negatively like polluting drinking water or over hunting wild game then they might take steps to stop it. If draining a swamp might cause some inedible toad to go extinct they wouldn't care at all. In some cases they might feel a moral obligation to destroy certain ecosystems. For example, if they can't wipe out a particularly dangerous predator that's preying on livestock because a forest makes it easy for them to hide then the gryphons might deforest the whole area just to make sure they're all dead.
Well its the duty of the empire to take care of their citzents. Im not overly concerned that the sky dwarfs arent what Peta think themselves as.
I expect the marshal bonus of fire breathing dragon to increase with time as well.
Omake: We Were Kings.
A short speech to the Assembly of Aerial combat1 regarding the rediscovery of the Griffon Empire, and their airships, given sometime after first contact.
"
We were kings.
For all of history we have ruled the skies, our only competitor; the Dragons2. We were the best of the best, from our scouts to our mobile fortresses, none had the same power as us.
For millennia we have been the militant arm of the tribes. When Discord twisted the world to his whims, we were the first to respond, and we were the last to fall. With the founding of Equestria, and the banishment of Discord, we formed the first elite flight squadrons; the Wonderbolts and Shadowbolts3.
We expected to have this be the way things were to be until the very end of time, for who else had the military tradition of the Pegasi? Who else could control the very skies?
No one, until now.
The Griffon Empire4, a power rivalling Equestria. The Griffons have military traditions of generations, natural weapons in the form of beaks and talons, as well technology beyond what we thought was possible.
Many of you have seen their airships patrolling their borders, and most of you understand what this means in regards to the power of this Empire.I will not go on for long on the strength that these ships allow the Griffons to project, but it is important that you all know this; we no longer rule the skies.
The griffons can employ any number of previously ground bound emplacements on these warships, and our magic can be neutralized by their so-called Black Knights5. Already we are hearing reports that they have killed Dragons, and destroyed a flying fortress.
It is crucial that we make peace with them, for we are outnumbered, and out armed. The only way we could retake our place at the top would be to acquire and copy their airships, and even then I believe they will have an edge.
We have lost an arms race we never knew we were a part of, and we will be playing catch up for a long time to come.
However, we still have a way to meet them on equal terms; our magic. While I did state that they have anti-magic capabilities, these are based on an unknown metal, as well as possessing little to no magic of their own.
As such I believe if we increase the amount of research done on potential applications of Pegasi magic, we may be able to meet them there.
We will never be able to meet the Empire's industrial output, but we will always have an edge in regards to magic, and we must lean into that if we are to ever become the kings of the sky once more.
"
1 One of the councils of military leaders formed soon after Equestria's founding.
2 For most of history Pegasi have competed with the dragons for aerial supremacy, until the discovery of the Griffon Empire.
3 The elite flight squadron of the night guard, later absorbed into the Wonderbolts with the banishment of Nightmare Moon
4 See; A history of the Griffon Empire.
5 An elite order of knights, equipped with anti magic weaponry and armour.
Omake for you @Questor
I'm sure if they haven't, their false religion will soon reach them. Though they'll probably not find a good foothold due to the deification of the current rulers.
In a face to face meeting, where no one else can hear. And after verifying either of the sisters are changlings in disguise
What about Neighpon? They were part of the Alliance to stop Sombra. So shouldn't they be on good terms as well.
