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In practice what would happen is Nordland wouldn't recognize your land claim because contesting neighboring land claims is Nordland's favorite pastime, and they will happily send arbitrary amounts of people to get killed by elves over worthless slices of forest with regularity.

Hashing out the border of your land claim with those same elves would be an issue, since it's not like they ever talk to anyone unless they are forced to and they do not believe in signposts so you'll only find out you trespassed after they kill your first explorers. And if you go to war with them and have a chance of winning they'll pull some ridiculous con, like the one they are pulling on Middenland right now (Ulric is Asuryan my ass!).

Honestly, if you want to be an EC best conquer the Border Princes. You'll have to fight a lot of Waaghs but it's still preferable.
It's been said by Boney himself that, in fact, anyone who can clear out a big chunk of land from beastmen and such within the Empire's borders is, in fact, going to be recognized as the ruler of that land by ECs. Are you seriously trying to argue WoQM?
 
It's been said by Boney himself that, in fact, anyone who can clear out a big chunk of land from beastmen and such within the Empire's borders is, in fact, going to be recognized as the ruler of that land by ECs. Are you seriously trying to argue WoQM?
Well, to play devil's advocate, even if they would recognize you as the ruler of the land you clear, that doesn't mean you would be recognized as elector count.
 
It's been said by Boney himself that, in fact, anyone who can clear out a big chunk of land from beastmen and such within the Empire's borders is, in fact, going to be recognized as the ruler of that land by ECs. Are you seriously trying to argue WoQM?
That recognition isn't worth anything, though. They'll still happily contest each other's land claims because squabbling amongst themselves is a good 50% of what ECs do. That's why when Stirland urgently needs an army to help clear Sylvania, and the Emperor runs down the list of every single province, the conclusion is that none of them can be relied on to do a single thing, because half of them are squaring off with each other over stupid things.

By comparison being an EC in the Border Princes, with all your neighbors on the other side of Black Fire Pass, is heaven. So long as you can survive the Orcs anyhow.
 
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That recognition isn't worth anything, though. They'll still happily contest each other's land claims because squabbling amongst themselves is a good 50% of what ECs do.
It's also been explicitly established that taking and holding land in the Empire is going to be far easier than in Border Princes.
 
It's also been explicitly established that taking and holding land in the Empire is going to be far easier than in Border Princes.
Taking land, where land is a random not too large piece of forest, yes. Taking enough land to be an EC, not so much. Specially since the available option is Drakwald, which has never been reclaimed for a reason. An army fit to take and hold that against the Forest Goblins and Beastmen could easily hold the Border Princes instead.
 
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It's also been explicitly established that taking and holding land in the Empire is going to be far easier than in Border Princes.
Which is why we helped with the greatest reclamation of land the Empire has made in centuries:

Sylvania.

A pity we were fired before we finished that up, though it didn't completely stop us from meddling a bit :)
 
Sure they would care. They would cheer. Nobody likes Drakenwald.


They can:
A) Declare someone else the EC and do nothing to actually enforce that claim, making their impotence obvious, and looking weak is never good.
B) Go to war to put someone else's ass in the EC seat.
C) Accept that there is now a new loyal province that pays taxes instead of a heavily armed foreign polity.


You can also sell land for a great deal of money to tide you over until you finish clearing some of it.

You assume people, and especially nobles, are rational actors, and not greedy fucks or hubristically prideful fucks or religiously zealous dogmatic fucks that do not quite get the consequences of their own actions.

Sure, the majority could be rational. It also could be not rational. Its a coin toss.

And no, a stupid Elector Count would not be quickly removed, Dieter IV wasn't, and he was an Emperor, and we do not need to even sink as low as Dieter Iv to find people that oppose us.

And of course, there is the problem that a wizard EC could theoretically be ordered by the Emperor or the Supreme Patriarch on the votes, which would open a reasonable can of worms. They can even order us to step down, which realpolitic wise wont work, but it will be a clusterfuck if we want to keep our oaths for Dawi diplomacy and will result in us being labeled a black magister (in command of a province, yeah, but so what ? We were obviously trying to become a traitor/play politics for our own beenefit/do a power grab, so we deserve the label.)

I should clarify, though, that I am not against it, merely stating a possible worst case scenario that could reasonably happen depending on who is who. I am not trying to say that idea is impossible or unfeasible or anything like that, merely that we really should get our ducks in a row (optimally, more ducks than necessary so that people won't backstab us/events do not blindside us) before attempting the conquest, if we decide to go that route.

It's been said by Boney himself that, in fact, anyone who can clear out a big chunk of land from beastmen and such within the Empire's borders is, in fact, going to be recognized as the ruler of that land by ECs. Are you seriously trying to argue WoQM?

Getting land is one thing.

Being an Elector Count (essentially a top dog) is quite another.

We could own huge swathes of land and still be told "Good. Now you pay taxes to this EC because you are his subordinate, because the land is part of his province", because that is how the medieval contract of multiple tiered ownerships works. We could even own so much land that it is subordinate to multiple different ECs, wouldn't give us the voting rights or other legal rights.
 
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Well according to Boney, this map is pretty precise, and shows lots of interesting places that are really close Black Blood Pass, some of which are.
  • The Last Hope Inn, a place famous for being the last safe point for Murderhobos beforeenteringthe Chaos wastes (which may have even more interesting things to buy than a trade center)
  • Several settlements of Northern Dwarfs, that can give us information about the Northern Dwarfs whereabouts and potential runic loot that we can get for Kragg and Borek
  • Hellpit, a skaven fortress of the Moulder Clan that is much more likely to have BOOKS than the combes.
So, yeah there are quite a few interesting places that we can potentially get extremely interesting loot on our way back...
Uuuhhhhh. I think you need to adjust your optimism meter a couple dozen notches down. We have no evidence Norse Dwarfs are alive and even if they are they're probably hidden weeeelllll beyond our ability to find. And Hellpit? Ahaha no. Thats more suicidal than poking at Cor Dum. Without whatever Dum leashes is on him right now.

On another note, I am kinda disappointed that the We's method of communication was just sound. Been reading Children of Time which contains a society of sapient spiders and their language is a cool mixture of palp and foreleg semaphores/sign language along with sending messages via vibrations through a shared string of web. No noises since the spiders didn't really evolve vocal cords. Their communication is an extension of various natural processes.
 
We have no evidence Norse Dwarfs are alive and even if they are they're probably hidden weeeelllll beyond our ability to find. And Hellpit? Ahaha no. Thats more suicidal than poking at Cor Dum. Without whatever Dum leashes is on him right now.
We don't need them to be alive to loot their settlements though.
And about Hellpit, I really want a high stake infiltration on the trip and since Dum did not work out, well...
 
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How does Pall of Darkness interact with walls?

Most relevantly - could we cast it through a doorway, and then substance of shadow through safely, knowing we'll be stepping into a dark space?
 
The look she gives you is long and thoughtful, and by the quiver of her lips it's clear she's fighting back a smile or even a laugh, but she eventually says yes so you're able to tell her your idea for the details and flee as soon as she accepts that too. Her acceptance means you only spend most of the rest of the day hiding in the privacy of your dragon chair as you wait for your nervousness and embarrassment to abate. It's so much easier in the books.
Hey @BoneyM, how exactly did Mathilde flee here? Please tell me she suddenly turned invisible and/or teleported away right after saying goodbye.
Or did she Shadowsteed home?

"This is was embarrassing and I'm so glad it's over and I want to vanish right now" helped me beat my best cycling speeds when I was a teenager, so I'm wondering how these things go when you can do actual magic.
 
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  • Several settlements of Northern Dwarfs, that can give us information about the Northern Dwarfs whereabouts and potential runic loot that we can get for Kragg and Borek
Let's take a reality check for a moment here. Most of them are likely dead, and the runic stuff stolen by Chaos. We'll probably have to high roll to find anything that's not incredibly depressing or locked in a vault we can't access.

  • Hellpit, a skaven fortress of the Moulder Clan that is much more likely to have BOOKS than the combes.
Calling it a Skaven fortress is very much underselling it. We do not want to go near Hellpit.
 
How does Pall of Darkness interact with walls?

Most relevantly - could we cast it through a doorway, and then substance of shadow through safely, knowing we'll be stepping into a dark space?

As a general rule, you need line of sight to whatever you're casting a spell at, and if it has a mental effect on someone they can be able to resist it if they're alert and strong of will.

No line of sight, no spell.
 
Well according to Boney, this map is pretty precise, and shows lots of interesting places that are really close Black Blood Pass, some of which are.
1. The Last Hope Inn, a place famous for being the last safe point for Murderhobos beforeenteringthe Chaos wastes (which may have even more interesting things to buy than a trade center)

2. Several settlements of Northern Dwarfs, that can give us information about the Northern Dwarfs whereabouts and potential runic loot that we can get for Kragg and Borek

3. Hellpit, a skaven fortress of the Moulder Clan that is much more likely to have BOOKS than the combes.
So, yeah there are quite a few interesting places that we can potentially get extremely interesting loot on our way back...

1. The Inn seems cool, but mostly as a way to meet cool people and get information, perhaps they sell some local curios at inflated price but I'd imagine for everything else there'd be more buyers than sellers. I mean, I guess it's possible we meet adventurers coming back from the north wanting to sell their loot but that seems unlikely.

2. Do we even know the location of those presumed ruins? Even if we do, chances are they're occupied by now, probably not by dwarves. I'm all for preventive scouting but getting deep enough to see the good stuff might be a bit too much nevermind the fact that stealing is a good way to bring trouble on the expedition.

3. As others have mentionned, I probably wouldn't venture too deep there. Might be persuaded to scout the outskirts if we need to, but not much more than that.

If we wanted loot, going back to Uzkulak might have been the most fruitful option frankly. I do agree that there are probably some interesting sights to see on the way though.
 
I'd sooner infiltrate Skavenblight than Hellpit.

Also we are on, Protector right now. Any serious infiltration should, obviously, use Night Prowler. Thus we are to avoid infiltrations that are likely risky.
 
If we wanted loot, going back to Uzkulak might have been the most fruitful option frankly. I do agree that there are probably some interesting sights to see on the way though.
Maybe this is a little metagaming, but I doubt that Boney would have offered many new oddities if we came back to Uzkulak... I mean he has always tried to make our shopping sprees in comercial hubs something more unique.. and going to the same market with a difference of only a few weeks, I really doubt that something interesting would have spawned there.

Not just YOLOing in for no reason.

Well, intel an loot are as good reasons as any other.
 
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