Again location matters, the spice route is the most profitable not the most traffic. Barak Var is the most traffic area for trade since it is the center of dwarf trade.
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Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest
- Thread starter Boney
- Start date
- Fantasy Users' Choice!
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- Tags
- warhammer warhammer fantasy fantasy be gay do crimes (gay) female protagonist pansexual protagonist ck2 quest divided loyalties mountain vietnam ranald is real this is a dwarf quest (dwarfs) this is maybe an elf quest this is not a vampire quest this is not an empire quest try it and find out open voting
Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
- Location
- New Brunswick, NJ
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
So, it's true that right now K8P is not as strategically important as Barak Varr. One of the reasons the Library is a neat boon is that it changes that; by creating something that doesn't exist anywhere else, it forces people to care about Karak Eight Peaks, which helps the long-term health of the Karak. I will happily trade "the library is ten percent less awesome than it could be if we started it in Barak Varr" for "the library is in Karak Eight Peaks and not in Barak Varr."
Build it, and they will come.
Build it, and they will come.
- Location
- Finland
you build the biggest library in a world in a location accessible through safe routes (and dwarfs will make those routes safe), you ill get visitors.
- Pronouns
- She/Her
If we want 8 peaks to become a center of trade we need to conquer iron rock and black crag. Securing both those locations would allow greater trade and allow more than one trade route to the greater world. Also we have to bring in settlers. Not just anyone but craft men's and learned people. I am not against the library but it is a long term goal that should be revisited in another place or if 8 peaks can be secure enough to get traders coming through.
There is one route right now that is consider safe. 8 peaks does not have the population or traffic to be of use. Build the library somewhere worse or wait for 8 peaks it to become important enough to warrant it. Not a lot of people actually like to read. These may come as a shock but most people don't go to the library. Yes we may get some scholars but 8 peaks is in a bad location.
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- She/Her
This is not an either or situation. What we spend our Boon on will not affect any hypothetical assaults on Karak Drazh, which will need to wait for a couple of turns regardless.
Yes. Ours.
It's like someone's forgetting about the mines underneath the Karaks, or the potential foodstuff produced by the halflings, or the quality wood from the Ulrikkadrin, or the various high-quality silk produced by the We that will turn K8P into the new Silk Road. Or, you know, the massive security provided by 8 surrounding mountains defended by dwarves. The Centre of Learning project's just adding on top of everything that's already there, aside from whatever domestic projects Belegar is now free(-er) to start with now that there's no longer any meaningful infestation of Skaven or Ork tribes to worry about.
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Still have to get people to move to 8 peaks which is a long trek from the empire along a route that constantly has to be patrolled. It takes time to build a population of people that can actually read. The largest library in the world does not matter if we can't protect it or get people to it.
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- She/Her
Again. Trade route. We will get many passing merchants along the silk road who will be able to use and donate to the library. Then they will bring word to both the Old Worlds and Ind and Cathay which will attract more traders and scholars etc etc. It will essentially form a positive feedback loop of good press for the Karak as a whole.
Dude, it's not like everything's getting done in even just a few years. We're not on a time crunch , we're not gonna be rushing Belegar to complete everything in a snap. And it's not just the populace of K8P that'll be using the facilities, it'll be visitors and scholars throughout the empire (and I'm gonna pre-empt what you're thinking: this means not just magic-users, but mundane scholars too).
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- Location
- New Brunswick, NJ
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
Most of the route is doable via river or tunnel. There isn't a lot that is overland.
Plus, like I was saying: if you create reasons for people to want to go to K8P, they will create more demand for safer routes, which increases the support for pacification campaigns against greenskin strongholds. Civilizing a frontier is all about feedback loops.
I will bet you that almost all of these questions will be answered with some combination of "it depends" and "try it and find out."
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Well yeah, it's a vanity project. If it were proposed to Belegar under ordinary circumstances he'd probably stroke his beard and explain diplomatically (if he felt like being polite) that it's an interesting idea, but K8P isn't really the best location for reasons X, Y, and Z and there's better things to put his Kingdom's resources towards.
That's why you use the transcendent boon and he just shrugs and makes it work however he can.
That said.... for every king and every kingdom there's always going to be something better they can do with their time and money then building a massive library. It's always going to be a vanity project waiting for a ruler or similarly powerful individual with a powerful obsession to come along and force it. So yeah, K8P might not be the ideal location, but it's the location we have and where we have the power to make it happen. And while the ideal location for a Great Library might be somewhere else, if the superior somewhere else's aren't actually going to build one (and if they were, why haven't they already) then it's better it exists at K8P than doesn't exist at all.
chocolote12
A Penguin Flailing Against The Keyboard Of Life.
- It would be located at the top of a dwarf held mountain, secured from the outside by dwarven gates, and from besieging armies by the Eye of Gazul. Presumably it would also be manned by dwarven librarians, who would tend to the books meticulously and be incredibly hard on would-be thieves.
- It would get a standard amount of academic traffic for one of the largest human-accessible libraries in the world; that is, a lot of academic traffic.
- It'd be as effective as dwarves could make it, assuming you meant how well it'd be constructed and laid out? Libraries don't exactly have a productivity meter or anything.
- As much as you'd expect from a growing jewel of the southern old world that sits on multiple dwarven holy sites and happens to be creating and exporting its own silk.
- If we let them, certainly.
- No. Nobody expects to learn those. Dwarves are notorious for murdering people who suggest otherwise.
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I ask the Gm not you these questions so unless you can provide the quotes you are just saying what you want instead of what the gm says.
All right, you've got a lot answers for your questions about the learning megaproject that you don't seem keen to on accepting. Let's weigh those against your ideas then
2.) Give the thread a specific example or scenario then where the favor would be useful in repairing elf-dwarf relations
1.) What happens then if we bank the favor, Mathilde bites the dust in an adventure in some distant land, leaving Belegar unable to pay back a massive favor?
2.) Give the thread a specific example or scenario then where the favor would be useful in repairing elf-dwarf relations
Travel to where? And why? What would all that entail?
- Location
- Manchester, UK
- Pronouns
- He/They
Personally I see the library and research academy as an outgrowth of a boon of "unlimited budget for the gathering of information"
The QM doesn't answer questions about the future. Everything chocolote said is 100% accurate, and probably more information than you'll get from poking the QM and ignoring the facts that are in the actual story...
chocolote12
A Penguin Flailing Against The Keyboard Of Life.
Fool, do you not recognize the QM?
That was a joke. More seriously, Boney only tells us stuff we should already know. 'Try it and find out' is boilerplate for 'Mathilde has no clue'. All of those questions have common sense answers, so it would be a great surprise to me if the QM said anything contrary to the gist of them.
Or this. 'You just don't know the future' works too.
(We come back as a ghost.
)You spelled it right. ; _ ;
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These are all immensely dependent on a huge number of future events.
- Location
- Before the Ninth Gate
The GM will answer questions Mathilde knows the answer to but we don't, as we are supposed to be Mathilde. But Mathilde doesn't know what the future will hold outside of her own reasoning, which is the threads.
Mathilde only knows 1 and 6 for sure (1: obviously, dwarves made it. 6: If they do, and aren't dwarves, they're idiots). We know Mathilde knows this because the thread can reasonably figure this out, and Mathilde is the thread.
2,3,4, and 5 are all try it and find out, because a) Boney doesn't want to do the reasoning for the thread, that's part of the game, and also Mathilde can't predict the future. These are all dependent partially on how well the silk trade takes off.
SuperSonicSound
Shadowmancer of the Shadow Cabal
Holy shit your name isnt Chocolate??????!!!
Mind actually blown.
Mind actually blown.
ok, I really didn't want to say it before, but there has been a real undercurrent of 'bad faith debating' in your whole argument up to now, but that's the cake.
If you don't want public reply to your questions and arguments, PM the GM, don't post on a public debate forum.
1 the debt goes unpaid. It is sad but it is what it is.
2 the favor is a get out of jail card can Or anything we want to be used for anything that is the problem with giving examples.
3 we can travel to Estia, Tilea, Araby and create trade routes and a information network with the EIC. We could travel to Naggaroth and use the token. We can go burn down Sarostia. We can go to Lustria. The dreadnought gives us a mobile lab that can travel the world.