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It... wasn't exactly about that. I'm thinking of the things that generally lead to issues in relationships, imbalance in power and responsibility, differences in experience, the ability to actually understand and relate to each other... things like that. The only people who could really understand Mathilde's constant drive to make the world a better place and her commanding nature would be someone who has ruled over at least some form of territory and population. The only people who could understand her relationship with magic or combat experience is someone who has been on similar adventures, and has enough power of their own to at least feel like a peer, if not necessarily a close one. It's not about the social position, it's about what that position entails and how it would have shaped a person.
And I wasn't trying to suggest we start building Panoramia up just so we could romance her, I was trying to say the only way she would become a viable option is if she got built up, if we had a better rapport with her, stuff like that. Cause to effect, not effect to cause. I would vote for building the relationship with Panoramia anyways, but it would need to win enough to consider her a romance option. Basically this:
What you try to explain here and what you wrote back there are two very different things. What you described seems frighteningly close to a Hikaru Genji Plan. I am incredibly leery, and disgusted, of anything even approaching such a plan.
 
You know, I don´t like romance in quests, especially in quest with such a huge player base like this one, because they almost always cause the dreaded Waifu Wars, which made many great quests hit their lowest lows...

But, if we want to find Mathilde´s Husbando, then we should use our social turn to meet new people, to see if any of them is a good fit four her, but as long as we focus our social actions in less than 1/4 of the characters (many of whom it is almost impossible to pursue a romantic relationship with) we are not going to find him or her...
 
Finally I did not miss a shipping talk!!

Panoramia had a strong start with her fangirlishenss, she has potentially interesting backstory we have learned hints about, we got closer to her when she went into combat against our orders and we explained why it is such a bad idea.
I want to spend more time with Panoramia, she is interesting, be it as a romantic interest or just a friend, she feels like an interesting addition to the story in a way that other wizards (except Gretal) in K8P just aren't.
So true, honesty I felt her positive mindset would have a good impact on Mathilde after a long day, as for her fears that would disappear as long she interact and understand Mathilde.
Also it would be interesting to deal with her Jade Order family.

He's a peer(for now), Mathilde gets along with him, understands how he ticks, goes on adventures with him, etc.

That already gives him vastly more IC justification than most people, considering the list had people Mathilde literally talked to twice.
While that's true but the issue is Johann is work and you don't bring your work home, otherwise you end up talking about work which is not good for long term so no he's better off as friends

Anyway I find it weird you guys judge their social ranks as pros and cons for Mathilde romantic points.
Their ranks got nothing to do with romance and if people have issues then they can say it to scary Grey Wizard why she can't marry the lesser rank Jade wife.
 
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There was a time when I supported romance, but these days, none of the options really appeal to me.

I ship Mathilde x work and Mathilde x Ulgu

Same. No one around Mat inspires me any kind of romance. Moreover, all the shipping, memeing and all has soured me about the very idea of romance.

Finally, I think about our 6 APs and the fact that:
- hubby/waifu/pet would likely have sooner or later some problem that we would need to solve, meaning spending AP on him/her/it...
- In case of a hubby, expectations would be to spawn. Meaning 2 turns of pregnancy and likely 1 AP to give birth. Maybe multiple times throughout the years...
- In order to not raise some kind of sociopath(s) we would also likely need to spend APs on the kid(s)...

No, just no.
 
What you try to explain here and what you wrote back there are two very different things. What you described seems frighteningly close to a Hikaru Genji Plan. I am incredibly leery, and disgusted, of anything even approaching such a plan.
Perhaps on the surface, but throughout my original post, and the ones preceeding it, I was constantly mentioning the personal relationships, the experience, and the responsibilities we would have. In no way am I trying to find a perfect political partner or anything like that. I was simply giving my opinions on who would fit both the narrative of the story and Mathilde's personal abilities, character, and goals in life.
Anyway I find it weird you guys judge their social ranks as pros and cons for Mathilde romantic points.
Their ranks got nothing to do with romance and if people have issues then they can say it to scary Grey Wizard why she can't marry the lesser rank Jade wife.
As I'm trying to explain, it's not the rank that gets me, but what that rank means. Roswita and belegar both know the weight of rulership and leadership, and while Panoramia might eventually go on enough adventures to meet Mathilde as a peer in life experience, right now all she's got going for her is being cute and potentially interesting. She just wouldn't understand Mathilde, as shown by her reactions to our Tower-weeding suggestion and the lecture on safe magic use.
Same. No one around Mat inspires me any kind of romance. Moreover, all the shipping, memeing and all has soured me about the very idea of romance.

Finally, I think about our 6 APs and the fact that:
- hubby/waifu/pet would likely have sooner or later some problem that we would need to solve, meaning spending AP on him/her/it...
- In case of a hubby, expectations would be to spawn. Meaning 2 turns of pregnancy and likely 1 AP to give birth. Maybe multiple times throughout the years...
- In order to not raise some kind of sociopath(s) we would also likely need to spend APs on the kid(s)...

No, just no.
I highly doubt Boney would burn us for that. it would all be social actions, at worst.
 
Yeah, and some of those people on the list are insane stretches imo.
We work with him and don't hate him, hooray. Or more specifically, he works for us.
Like, if he was more interesting character, or had more active screentime beyond work, maybe i could see it.
But as it is, not really.
Of our subordinates he's had the most interaction with us outside of work. With us helping him to raise his pet wolf rats. He has been highly although not the highest voted in things like @das_slash dream daddy picture and this social vote. I personally find his character; being a muscle wizard, caring pet owner, engineer, and intelligence operative for the gold college (that's how I'd summise his goal to reverse engineer skaven tech) etc. To be very engaging.

Edit: also he looks like Alexander Armstrong from full metal alchemist which means he is objectively the most attractive person in the entire cast.
Anyway I find it weird you guys judge their social ranks as pros and cons for Mathilde romantic points.
Their ranks got nothing to do with romance and if people have issues then they can say it to scary Grey Wizard why she can't marry the lesser rank Jade wife.
At least my concerns about social rank are not to do with other peoples acceptance. Rather, they are about power imbalances within the relationship. If panoramia passes her Magister exams then she would be happier and if we started a relationship with Johann then I would support letting him go from our employment and replacing him with one of the ducklings.
 
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I highly doubt Boney would burn us for that. it would all be social actions, at worst.

Social actions have no mechanical benefits, as has been repeated ad nauseam. They are just there to give screen time to characters.

Hubby/waifu/pet has a bad case of burn-out? I'd be really surprised if only a social action would help.

Pet/kid needs parental love, affection and education? I'd rather think APs would be warranted.

APs are APs. They show what we prioritize at any given time. You want to add family time to our schedule? It's only natural that our work and studies would suffer. Trying to game the system with only social actions to have your slice-of-life cake and eat it too seems to me to be unfair.
 
While that's true but the issue is Johann is work and you don't bring your work home, otherwise you end up talking about work which is not good for long term so no he's better off as friends
Uh...Johann is the only person on the list we actually talked about non-work stuff with on a regular basis in the past three years.
 
Social actions have no mechanical benefits, as has been repeated ad nauseam. They are just there to give screen time to characters.

Hubby/waifu/pet has a bad case of burn-out? I'd be really surprised if only a social action would help.

Pet/kid needs parental love, affection and education? I'd rather think APs would be warranted.

APs are APs. They show what we prioritize at any given time. You want to add family time to our schedule? It's only natural that our work and studies would suffer. Trying to game the system with only social actions to have your slice-of-life cake and eat it too seems to me to be unfair.
Eexcept, you know, the whole addition of the social turns was for explicitly that reason, because otherwise Boney would never find the time to write more complicated personal relationships, and because there were a lot of complaints about how the APs shouldn't really take all her free time like they did.
 
Perhaps on the surface, but throughout my original post, and the ones preceeding it, I was constantly mentioning the personal relationships, the experience, and the responsibilities we would have. In no way am I trying to find a perfect political partner or anything like that. I was simply giving my opinions on who would fit both the narrative of the story and Mathilde's personal abilities, character, and goals in life.
I don't have an issue with people finding people for what ever reason they decide. The issue I had with your post is the following lines.
Basically what I'm saying is that everyone else needs work. Out of them all, I would be willing to vote for building Panoramia up, but if we wanted something soonish, then Belegar and Roswita are the best options.
This makes it sound like instead of finding people who are good romantic matches you are advocating for Mathilde to "grow" people into better romantic matches. This may not have been your intent. If it wasn't I hope you find a better way to phrase your opinion. Because the way you did phrase it sounds really really really bad.
 
My view on Panoramia is that her initial fangirling has permanently rules her out of consideration. She came across as childish, so the desire to romance her just feels inappropriate. She really doesn't come across as anything resembling a peer.

Of all the wizards, Johann is closest to a peer. Even though he failed, he tried to get one over on Mathilde. He was someone who tried to engage her on her level. It's not his fault that Mathilde's institutional backing from the Grey Order was too strong for him to overcome.

The fact that he's literally golden is a bonus, as Mathilde becomes increasingly dwarfy.
 
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While that's true but the issue is Johann is work and you don't bring your work home, otherwise you end up talking about work which is not good for long term so no he's better off as friends
I've seen it work just great is your work happens to be your life.

Ultimately, people are varied. Almost any kind if relationship can work with the right people, and there are much less hard rules about relationships than people here seem to believe.
 
I don't have an issue with people finding people for what ever reason they decide. The issue I had with your post is the following lines.

This makes it sound like instead of finding people who are good romantic matches you are advocating for Mathilde to "grow" people into better romantic matches. This may not have been your intent. If it wasn't I hope you find a better way to phrase your opinion. Because the way you did phrase it sounds really really really bad.
...I can see how it would look that way, yeah. Give me a moment.
 
Of our subordinates he's had the most interaction with us outside of work. With us helping him to raise his pet wolf rats. He has been highly although not the highest voted in things like @das_slash dream daddy picture and this social vote. I personally find his character; being a muscle wizard, caring pet owner, engineer, and intelligence operative for the gold college (that's how I'd summise his goal to reverse engineer skaven tech) etc. To be very engaging.
I think that's Max. could be wrong though.
It's possible we have had most interactions with Johann (those rathounds give us a decent reason to take an interest), i would not know.
Yet i have so little idea of him beyond "the engineer kid"

We really need more social turns.
interacting with one or two persons in 6 month chunks at any major way really limits our options to get to know people.
 
I've grown to like Johan and Mathildes dynamic. That Mathilde distrusted him at first because he was just a much smoother operator than her but both of them managed to get over it was amazing. And their attack on Skryre showed that they can work together in entertaining ways on the battlefield. "Surely there must be some reason this is a terrible idea." - indeed. This would make them a power couple, which is appreciated in the Warhammer World. I like how Johan and Mathilde almost naturally created a "good cop - bad cop" dynamic with the ducklings. His role in this as well as how he decided to keep and raise the wolfrat puppers makes me think well of Johans fatherly qualities.

I also like that he is almost finished with Gilding himself, which should make him largely unaging. Since we definitely will figure out a way to make Mathilde immortal as well, this would prevent any seperation from old age, which would be inevitable with a Dwarf or a non-mage.

I don't really think much of shipping, but of the current people in the hold Mathildes relationship with Johan seems the most multifaceted and real to me.
 
I think that's Max. could be wrong though.
It's possible we have had most interactions with Johann (those rathounds give us a decent reason to take an interest), i would not know.
Yet i have so little idea of him beyond "the engineer kid"

We really need more social turns.
interacting with one or two persons in 6 month chunks at any major way really limits our options to get to know people.
No, Max is the book guy who's largely content to be Mathilde's Journeyman scribe semipermanently, provided he gets to go shoot some orcs every so often.
 
I think that's Max. could be wrong though.
It's possible we have had most interactions with Johann (those rathounds give us a decent reason to take an interest), i would not know.
Yet i have so little idea of him beyond "the engineer kid"

We really need more social turns.
interacting with one or two persons in 6 month chunks at any major way really limits our options to get to know people.
Wow, you have not paid much attention then, though I can't blame you since even I get a little mixed up with all the wizards. Max is the guy who writes our papers, Johann is the papa rat, the golden man, the muscle wizard, the engineer, the guy who lied to us and pretended to be a Journeyman when he was really a Magister for... some reason, and the guy who went with us to fuck up Skryre. he also likes artillery whereas Max likes gyrocopters.
Since we're on the topic though, I'm curious to hear some plans for the next social turn, since we've apparently got time to burn and there's been a lot of concernns over it for various reasons. Long-term plans would also be cool, instead of just going one turn at a time.
 
Since we're on the topic though, I'm curious to hear some plans for the next social turn, since we've apparently got time to burn and there's been a lot of concernns over it for various reasons.
The only people I have seen express concern over social turns are a few who want to meet more people but mostly the shippers. Social turns are social turns. I see very little reason to be concerned over them.


By the way, did Mathilde and Johann actually grab those gasmasks?
Yes they did! At least one before Mathilde teleported away and Johann ran in to smash things.
 
Well, I'm not sure how much of it is him, and how much of it is his wife. The dwarves seem to think it is much more his wife's accomplishment.

And I think I agree with them. That woman is awesome.

1) It takes two to tango.

2) His wife's role can't be underestimated, but the way I understood it, dwarf males are usually the ones to blame for not being enthusiastic enough in the bedroom, hence my stance that Kazador is an optimal rolemodel for dwarf (males).
 
But more than that, I think the comparison is a little unfair to my boy Thorek. He's the equivalent of a Professor at a major university: he splits his time between his students and politics, and then takes whatever's left and spends it on research. Kragg seems more like a fellow at a national lab: all he does is research, all day, forever. And it's not as though one of those jobs is inherently better (and it's often true that the former is more productive, ultimately).
The irony is that Kragg was saying this to Mathilde, who is over here trying to wear like five different hats.
My view on Panoramia is that her initial fangirling has permanently rules her out of consideration. She came across as childish, so the desire to romance her just feels inappropriate. She really doesn't come across as anything resembling a peer.
She was kind of embarrassing when we met her literal years ago, and therefore that takes her out of consideration permanently?

It's going to be tricky to find someone to romance who has never done anything ridiculous around us. I mean, for one thing, that criteria includes Mathilde more than anyone else
 
All this talk of who we should ship Mathilde with is pointless.

After all, Mathilde x Kragg OTP. :V
 
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