- Location
- Before the Ninth Gate
So there seems to be some buy in, so I'll add it:
Any changes?
Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest
- Thread starter Boney
- Start date
- Fantasy Users' Choice!
Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
- Pronouns
- He/Him
I have no reason to go trying to steal from Hashut if it isn't immediately in front of us.
Don't let our luck against Mork make you cocky.
Don't let our luck against Mork make you cocky.
- Location
- New Brunswick, NJ
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
*points aggressively at signature quote*
(I don't want to harsh anyone's fun times, but seriously, we have a lot of neat projects that we already have plot hooks for, we do not need to invent extras out of whole cloth.)
(I don't want to harsh anyone's fun times, but seriously, we have a lot of neat projects that we already have plot hooks for, we do not need to invent extras out of whole cloth.)
- Pronouns
- It/They
Nehekharan's had to earn their shit, though, and could lose it.
Nagash and the vampires did lose it in fact.
They just found a replacement.
Elves are much worse, because the dark elves get to keep all their advantages despite being a blight upon the planet that contributes nothing of worth.
- Location
- Before the Ninth Gate
Yeah, but there were a number of people who were down for it. The threadmark is a compilation threadmark, and so does not exclude plans because others dislike them, or even if a majority dislike them.
- Location
- Manchester, UK
- Pronouns
- He/They
Both the Horned Rat and Hastur mugging plans basically require going down the Theurgy skill tree. They're both on the same potential future branch of that tree that may or may not even exist - but heh, at least it has a short-term goal attached to the plan
chocolote12
A Penguin Flailing Against The Keyboard Of Life.
The entire point of the post they maintain is to catalog the random extra plot hooks the thread cooks up.
The idea is more any god with a treasure pile. Hashut is just the example given because it probably has one and we don't like them, due to the whole chaos god business, and it being thematic for Ranald to go after them (which might help with the actual integration of the power).
Being cocky is thinking we'll pull it off without a hitch. Like, thinking that toasting the Million Orc Brigade is a done deal is being cocky, because it disregards the threat they represent. Just coming up with something cool we could try isn't being cocky. If it ever actually comes up in the quest we'll be able to make a judgement about the details of the task, rather than generalizations about overviews or such.
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Nagash was far from mortal at that point.
- Location
- New Brunswick, NJ
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
Originally it was to store, like, outlines for complicated things we already have hooks for (snake juice, making a staff, making better armor, etc.). I feel like it is worth distinguishing "things the QM has told us are possible and the thread built plans for" from "things the thread decided they thought was neat and the thread invented ideas for" because I am an extremely boring person who uses the phrase "epistemic status" in casual conversation.
On a short-term note, I was discussing with @BungieONI earlier how I really want to take a Ranald-focused action next turn. Either studying the Coin or some devotion-to-Ranald option unlocked by the Temple-building we did this turn.Both the Horned Rat and Hastur mugging plans basically require going down the Theurgy skill tree. They're both on the same potential future branch of that tree that may or may not even exist - but heh, at least it has a short-term goal attached to the plan
Even if we don't get in the god-mugging business... after this whole *flails around a bit* thing, I'm feeling a need to connect with our own god. He, after all, probably has an even better idea of how awful the Horned Rat is than we do.
- Location
- Before the Ninth Gate
As the person running it, I generally don't want to be in the position of arbitrating what the QM has said has hooks and hasn't had hooks. I don't want to inject my biases into this, and don't want the threadmark to become a point of argument. I just want to store info on plans so the thread can keep track of older plans without forgetting them, so that the thread can keep track of progress we have made on the plans, and so the thread can reasonably pursue long term goals (even if I don't know if they are viable).
Because of this, the threadmark disclaims the QM saying things are possible. I do try to link to WOG if it is possible though.
- Pronouns
- It/They
Both the Horned Rat and Hastur mugging plans basically require going down the Theurgy skill tree. They're both on the same potential future branch of that tree that may or may not even exist - but heh, at least it has a short-term goal attached to the plan
Tongs first, all wizards can use that.
Theurgy later.
chocolote12
A Penguin Flailing Against The Keyboard Of Life.
All wizards could use Theurgy, if they weren't squares.
- Location
- Before the Ninth Gate
Completely disagree. If anything, Theurgy is still shareable, and could cut down on wizards going to chaos.
- Pronouns
- It/They
All wizards could use Theurgy, if they weren't squares.
You mean if they were all god botherers.
Hell i doubt its a thing we can do anyway.
Theurgy is the sort of thing that a god grants you the ability to do.
If the gods of the empire wanted theurgy it would be a thing already.
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Mopman43
Mountain-Hermit of Nitpeak
- Location
- Vermont
Most Wizards are generally secular, which is the exact opposite of 'god botherer'?
- Location
- New Brunswick, NJ
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
Sure. I wasn't jumping on you for cataloging it. I was just trying to inject some reality into the thread before people got carried away.
For example.
(The "tongs" project is one a few people in this thread decided was possible and kept talking about, poked at the QM until he added an "investigate if this works" option (as opposed to the Study Ranald's Coin option, which was there from the start), and is literally the source of the quotation in my sig.)
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- It/They
You can't theurgy without the gods.
So its not a thing most wizards can use.
Because they're secular.
- Pronouns
- It/They
The tongs project is one thats already proven possible because its how necromancy works.
Getting theurgy from the mortal half is pie in the sky, nehekhara and Brettonia got it from their gods.
- Location
- Before the Ninth Gate
I actually don't like the Tongs project myself (It leads to Dhar, if you ask me). But also, I don't think it's my place to crush these dreams when dealing with plan threadmark, which is why it is there.
- Pronouns
- It/They
High magic and nature itself proves that winds can interact with out turning into dhar.
if it can be done in nature it can be replicated by man.
Besides we have the belt for the inevitable screw ups.
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- Location
- Before the Ninth Gate
Look, I entirely disagree with this. High magic means all 8 working at once. Nature doesn't have these examples.
- Pronouns
- It/They
If all 8 can work together without turning into dhar... then why not just two.
If it anything it seems like it would be easier.
- Location
- The Star Kingdom of Manticore
So tongs using dhar had been proven. Using tongs on anything other than dhar has not been proven. I fully expect that if we use tongs on another wind all we will get is dhar. That's just me though and I know some people think differently.
- Pronouns
- It/They
You guys need to be more optimistic.
- Location
- New Brunswick, NJ
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
Using a single, pure wind to manipulate a mixture of the winds is substantively different from using a single, pure wind to manipulate a different pure wind without letting them mix at any point.
Like, if it were that easy, someone else would have done it already. We cannot be the first wizard to have thought of this. We have a few unfair advantages (Windsage, reading the Liber Mortis), but I am still skeptical that it is possible; it seems like if it were a thing that can be done, someone else would have done it, and we have not gotten any seeded plot hooks to go after this. It is purely a brainstorm of the thread.
Using arcane energies to manipulate divine energies, on the other hand, is something that not just any wizard off the street can do (it requires 1. a deep connection with a god, which most wizards lack 2. a god that is okay with this sort of tomfoolery, which most gods are not). I have a much easier time believing that between Windsage, Avatar, and Ranald being more open than other Order gods to being experimented with, we will be able to develop something cool and unique, and the fact that we've had several dangling plot hooks specifically aimed at investigating this phenomenon indicates that Boney has something planned for us heading down this track, whether that be "theurgy" or something else.
High magic is not "using winds to manipulate other winds." High magic is "one spellcaster manipulating multiple winds directly without them combining in the caster's soul and becoming Dhar." That, again, is very different from the "tongs" project.
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