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Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest

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Zero Gravitas said:
The thing is there's always going to be immediate problems somewhere be it K8P or Sylvania or Altdorf unless we trust Belegar and his council (or the Empire in the case of Sylvania and Altdorf) to solve them.

Ultimately I'd say it isn't a bad thing to let people live without Mathilde's constant attention for a turn or two because ultimately K8P will need to figure out a way deal with its stuff without relying on Mathilde or Kragg.
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So let me clearer. I don't see it as beneficial to vote for it this turn because of the stated reasons. I do however think its worth at least a bit of time next turn, if we clear out some of our commitments this turn.
 
Tower of Gazul is fricking scary. I don't know why, but for some reason I expected it to sound and feel like firing a stationary mega-Helstorm Rocket Battery.

The reality is far more disturbing. I agree with Kazrik's and Belegar's sentiment completely.
 
[ ] Plan Season of the Rat
-[ ] MAX: Unknown black gem, stolen from the Skaven.
Would have prefered AV, but his lack of enhanced magesight might miss something, which is specially bad when i want to test security first. we promised ourselves we would see this done, lets keep that promise.
-[ ] JOHANN: Join him on raids with the aim of finding Skaven Gas Masks and correspondence (Clan Skryre).
Need those masks to deal with our mark, we are a poison gas magnet in a palce full of Skaven, and this could take a while to research, get them now.
-[ ] DUCK: Johann's investigation into the ratling gun has hit a wall. See if you can help.
Need to clear his schedule so he can deal with the masks, also it seems he will be stuck here forever if we don't help and we have a lot of things for him to research, this is a major bloackage and part of the reason for our backlog, he was meant to be researching something every turn on his own time and can't because of this, lets fix it.
-[ ] EIC: Start building a paramilitary river navy to ensure the coming trade explosion doesn't lead to a similar explosion in riverine banditry.
Caravello learned this lesson too late, it's not too late for us yet, not married to this, could change if people care about something else.
-[ ] PAPER: The ability of Alkharad to assume a projected form of mist.
Get it before it fades, we can watch more waaagh later.
-[ ] PENTHOUSE: Have a gyrocopter landing pad built into your balcony.
It's not a penthouse without an helipad, more rooms is also ok.
-[ ] QRECH: Try to convince him outright to teach you Queekish.
--[] COIN: The Gambler
Big risk, big rewards,
-[ ] GAMBIT: Convince Qrech that the Underempire has no way of knowing he's even alive, and that he should prioritize the comfort with which he will live the rest of his life.
Not even a lie, not necessarily at least, we can sell this, if done properly he will see the teaching us as a test.
-[ ] SELF IMPROVEMENT: Practice shooting while invisible. (applies to Substance of Shadow; will apply to Invisibility)
We got the spells, now have to capitalize on them, we avoided the negatrait, but a tool we are not familiar with is not a tool we can trust.
-[ ] The Colleges want you to do a series of lectures on your paper, Waaagh and Peace. Travel to Altdorf and do so.
Did someone say Magister Lord?
-[ ] Investigate how living things react to exposure to the Vitae.
We need to start if we want to ever propose it, if we keep to schedule we should get at least 3 AV actions before proposing to Belegar, let's start now.

[ ] Plan Season of the Slow Rat
-[ ] MAX: Unknown black gem, stolen from the Skaven.
-[ ] JOHANN: Join him on raids with the aim of finding Skaven Gas Masks and correspondence (Clan Skryre).
--[] COIN: The Gambler
-[ ] DUCK: Johann's investigation into the ratling gun has hit a wall. See if you can help.
-[ ] EIC: Start building a paramilitary river navy to ensure the coming trade explosion doesn't lead to a similar explosion in riverine banditry.
-[ ] PAPER: The ability of Alkharad to assume a projected form of mist.
-[ ] PENTHOUSE: Have a gyrocopter landing pad built into your balcony.
-[ ] Supply a steady stream of Queekish documents for Qrech to translate, and carefully check the results for consistency. (Use Skryre documents)
-[ ] GAMBIT: Convince Qrech that the Underempire has no way of knowing he's even alive, and that he should prioritize the comfort with which he will live the rest of his life.
--[ ] COIN: The Deceiver
-[ ] SELF IMPROVEMENT: Practice shooting while invisible. (applies to Substance of Shadow; will apply to Invisibility)
-[ ] The Colleges want you to do a series of lectures on your paper, Waaagh and Peace. Travel to Altdorf and do so.
-[ ] Investigate how living things react to exposure to the Vitae.

Same as before, but a more steady (and slow) approach to Qrech.

I realize we could deal with our mark with the training, but as the Skaven recently demonstrated, Gas casualties are no joke, those masks are a game changer.

Edit: Moved coin on slow plan to gambler to guarantee correspondence.
 
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BungieONI said:
So let me clearer. I don't see it as beneficial to vote for it this turn because of the stated reasons. I do however think its worth at least a bit of time next turn, if we clear out some of our commitments this turn.
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Lets just get all of this clear. What exactly do you think Mathilde's commitments are this turn?
 
veekie said:
I don't think they're time sensitive?
They're long term stuff, if this turn goes well we should have a military and technological lexicon, and can drop the raiding.

Which means Johann does the gem, Max probably finishes the translation, and we do the Vitae next turn.

Whereas I'm unwilling to drop the arcane mark training.
I can be persuaded on Wolf, but we need him to talk if we want to try for spoken Queekish next turn
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So the issue I have with all of that was that a prominent argument in the current Project Plan winning was that we would have time to shake loose for other side stuff.

If we don't do that then I find it strange. It also pushes of the Vitae, again, to the next Project Vote where we have an opportunity to start resolving the valid issue that people want to do more basic research on it. I also consider getting the Vitae researched so we can hand it to Kragg as soon as possible to be very much worth our time due to the possibilities it presents. Particularly with the threats we face.

Neshuakadal said:
Lets just get all of this clear. What exactly do you think Mathilde's commitments are this turn?
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AV and the gem with our Golds. So that next Project Vote cycle we have actually answered the concerns of folks not wanting to propose it because we don't have some sections of basic research done in regards to it and living flesh. The gem because we took it with the express interest of studying it, and if we don't take up that commitment its a step in the same trend that means our stuff sits on a shelf till we get to it.

Both of these I saw brought up during the debate for Project Current Needs, along with the idea that'd we take a project which would give us some side time for other stuff.
 
We began working on Queekish at the same time that we got the tower, it's a good methodology, let's keep it going by starting with AV now.
It's not time sensitive no, but that mentality is how it remained in storage for a decade.
 
BungieONI said:
AV and the gem with our Golds. So that next Project Vote cycle we have actually answered the concerns of folks not wanting to propose it because we don't have some sections of basic research done in regards to it and living flesh. The gem because we took it with the express interest of studying it, and if we don't take up that commitment its a step in the same trend that means our stuff sits on a shelf till we get to it.
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Do we want to propose the AV though?

We're already sharing credit for Queekish with K8P, it seems excessive to share it for AV.
 
Further clarification on why I think we should do my preferred options:

-We want the Skyre lexicon, so we must take a Translate My Documents action:
--If we take only one raid its possible we don't have enough documents to produce a respectable lexicon.
--Fortunately Johann and Gretel are good at stealth and we can spend those actions instead. Once we have the Skryre lexicon I don't think we need another minion raid, Eshin is a personal only job. This means Max can do the Vitae with us and Johann can do the gem
.

-We want to try for Spoken Queekish next turn so we should take the Buttering Up Qrech option this turn. It also opens the option to ignore him on future turns, which will reintroduce flexibility once we finish the current task.
--Fortunately we've spent a year with him as our prisoner by now. If he's human-approximate in sociability(which I'd note even regular mice and rats are, so if theres deviation its Warp God Bullshit), he should be moving solidly into a case of Stockholm Syndrome.
--Additionally, to take into account the portions beyond human senses of smell or hearing, Wolf must be able to talk to obtain useful information.
-The Arcane Mark is an unacceptable risk in a region with Skryre presence. Tame it, Boon of Hysh gives us a safety margin, but I'd really like to be able to keep from getting downed by the poison before I can activate it.


And thats all of Mathilde's actions taken.
 
Zero Gravitas said:
Do we want to propose the AV though?

We're already sharing credit for Queekish with K8P, it seems excessive to share it for AV.
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If we don't we don't, but if we don't vote for AV because we want to head off any possibility of it getting shared because we want to study it ourselves and get all the credit we end up not voting for AV and getting no credit because it doesn't progress.
 
[] Plan: Let's Squeek v2
-[][MAX] Study an artefact: Skaven book on the Anatomy of Chaos Dwarves, partially translated.
-[][JOHANN] Join him on raids with the aim of finding written correspondence (Skryre).
-[][DUCK] Hubert wants glory. Take him on a sortie, with the side-goal of finding written correspondence (Mors).
-[][EIC] Start building a paramilitary river navy to ensure the coming trade explosion doesn't lead to a similar explosion in riverine banditry.
-[] Supply a steady stream of Queekish documents for Qrech to translate, and carefully check the results for consistency.
-[] Use King Belegar's pull to bring in some linguistics experts from the Empire's universities, though after proper vetting and swearing them to silence.
-[GAMBIT] Convince Qrech that the Underempire has no way of knowing he's even alive, and that he should prioritize the comfort with which he will live the rest of his life.
-[] Wolf is fully grown and a Very Good Boy. Train him. (increases his intelligence, he may learn to speak Praestantia)
-[] Investigate how living things react to exposure to the Vitae.
-[PENTHOUSE] Have additional rooms excavated underneath your Penthouse: -100gc for 4 rooms.
-[Serenity] The ability of Alkharad to assume a projected form of mist. (ALMOST FADED)
-[COIN] Deceiver: Help with Qrech Gambit

Max continues on with the Book Translation.
Johann gets more Documents as does Hubert.
Not choosing our favorite again to spread out our attention some.
Keep supplying Documents to Qrech, because you do not fix what's not broken.
Bring in an expert to help out. For all our talents we are not a linguist.
Train Wolf in anticipation of spoken Squeekish.
Do something with Vitae as the flex action.
 
@veekie the problem with taking documents from Skyre with Johhan is that we haven't convinced our Skaven prisoner to help us against anyone but Mors. So you need a different place for the documents you are going to had him to translate. You can take Skyre stuff, only if you want Mat to translate them herself, as a second check on how the translation stuff is doing.
 
Decided to take a stab at plan making, the main thrust of the plan as the name sugests, is to satisfy and prepare for delayed gratification.
[] Plan Delayed Gratification
-[][MAX] Study an artefact: Skaven book on the Anatomy of Chaos Dwarves, partially translated.
-[][JOHANN] Join him on raids with the aim of finding written correspondence (Skryre).
-[][DUCK] Johann's investigation into the ratling gun has hit a wall. See if you can help.
-[][EIC] Put policies in place that local news should be collected and sent to you (rumour mill).
-[] Supply a steady stream of Queekish documents for Qrech to translate, and carefully check the results for consistency.
-[GAMBIT] Convince Qrech that the Underempire has no way of knowing he's even alive, and that he should prioritize the comfort with which he will live the rest of his life.
-[ ] You have set up a Shrine to Ranald. Expand it into a Temple to the Gambler - a gambling hall with clean cards, guaranteed unloaded dice, fresh sawdust in the fighting ring, and a lottery every Festag. Costs 100gc.
-[] Investigate how living things react to exposure to the Vitae.
-[] Wolf is fully grown and a Very Good Boy. Train him. (increases his intelligence, he may learn to speak Praestantia)
-[PENTHOUSE] Have additional rooms excavated underneath your Penthouse: -100gc for 4 rooms.
-[Serenity] The ability of Alkharad to assume a projected form of mist. (ALMOST FADED)
-[COIN] Deceiver: Help with Qrech Gambit

First Max should keep working on the Book, that is a no brainer. Finish the work and helps withe current task.
Johann helps us loot Skyre so we can expand the lexicon and get gas masks.
Duck helps Johann since he has been stuck for a year already, the rest will keep but he is the one not making any progress.
EIC gets rumor mill because the idea is that we get information from it and we have dalayed getting the most basic information consistently to long already, deeper information will likely take more action and other things can wait a turn so this should be first so we stop being mostly blind to the world.
Task action keep working on Qrench to expand Lexicon and in preparation for trying to have him teach us the spoken version in the future.

Then the long Delayed temple and juice actions since the main reason we proposed this project was to gain the time to do this.

Finaly we teach Wolf, not only would be very usefull to have him able to speak in general but we need his help when we go for spoke queekish.

Any coments ?
 
veekie said:
Further clarification on why I think we should do my preferred options:

-We want the Skyre lexicon, so we must take a Translate My Documents action:
--If we take only one raid its possible we don't have enough documents to produce a respectable lexicon.
--Fortunately Johann and Gretel are good at stealth and we can spend those actions instead. Once we have the Skryre lexicon I don't think we need another minion raid, Eshin is a personal only job. This means Max can do the Vitae with us and Johann can do the gem
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We can either guarantee correspondence with the coin, or obviate it with asking Qresh to teach us.
veekie said:
-We want to try for Spoken Queekish next turn so we should take the Buttering Up Qrech option this turn. It also opens the option to ignore him on future turns, which will reintroduce flexibility once we finish the current task.
--Fortunately we've spent a year with him as our prisoner by now. If he's human-approximate in sociability(which I'd note even regular mice and rats are, so if theres deviation its Warp God Bullshit), he should be moving solidly into a case of Stockholm Syndrome.
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We can also do this now with the proper actions, just need the proper gambit, not certain of course, but massive payoff if we succeed, thats what the coin is for
veekie said:
--Additionally, to take into account the portions beyond human senses of smell or hearing, Wolf must be able to talk to obtain useful information.
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nice and flavorful, but of little consequence right now.
veekie said:
-The Arcane Mark is an unacceptable risk in a region with Skryre presence. Tame it, Boon of Hysh gives us a safety margin, but I'd really like to be able to keep from getting downed by the poison before I can activate it.
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The mask gets this while also protecting the rest of our troops, those deaths are piling up on Belegar's conscience. possible game changer for the empire.
 
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primemountain said:
@veekie the problem with taking documents from Skyre with Johhan is that we haven't convinced our Skaven prisoner to help us against anyone but Mors. So you need a different place for the documents you are going to had him to translate. You can take Skyre stuff, only if you want Mat to translate them herself, as a second check on how the translation stuff is doing.
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Boney already mentioned he's fine with undermining the others.


Zaratustra said:
Decided to take a stab at plan making, the main thrust of the plan as the name sugests, is to satisfy and prepare for delayed gratification.
[] Plan Delayed Gratification
-[][MAX] Study an artefact: Skaven book on the Anatomy of Chaos Dwarves, partially translated.
-[][JOHANN] Join him on raids with the aim of finding written correspondence (Skryre).
-[][DUCK] Johann's investigation into the ratling gun has hit a wall. See if you can help.
-[][EIC] Put policies in place that local news should be collected and sent to you (rumour mill).
-[] Supply a steady stream of Queekish documents for Qrech to translate, and carefully check the results for consistency.
-[GAMBIT] Convince Qrech that the Underempire has no way of knowing he's even alive, and that he should prioritize the comfort with which he will live the rest of his life.
-[ ] You have set up a Shrine to Ranald. Expand it into a Temple to the Gambler - a gambling hall with clean cards, guaranteed unloaded dice, fresh sawdust in the fighting ring, and a lottery every Festag. Costs 100gc.
-[] Investigate how living things react to exposure to the Vitae.
-[] Wolf is fully grown and a Very Good Boy. Train him. (increases his intelligence, he may learn to speak Praestantia)
-[PENTHOUSE] Have additional rooms excavated underneath your Penthouse: -100gc for 4 rooms.
-[Serenity] The ability of Alkharad to assume a projected form of mist. (ALMOST FADED)
-[COIN] Deceiver: Help with Qrech Gambit

First Max should keep working on the Book, that is a no brainer. Finish the work and helps withe current task.
Johann helps us loot Skyre so we can expand the lexicon and get gas masks.
Duck helps Johann since he has been stuck for a year already, the rest will keep but he is the one not making any progress.
EIC gets rumor mill because the idea is that we get information from it and we have dalayed getting the most basic information consistently to long already, deeper information will likely take more action and other things can wait a turn so this should be first so we stop being mostly blind to the world.
Task action keep working on Qrench to expand Lexicon and in preparation for trying to have him teach us the spoken version in the future.

Then the long Delayed temple and juice actions since the main reason we proposed this project was to gain the time to do this.

Finaly we teach Wolf, not only would be very usefull to have him able to speak in general but we need his help when we go for spoke queekish.

Any coments ?
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Its pretty close to my plans barring the gem.
 
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[] Plan Slow and Steady
-[] MAX: Study an artefact: The book on Chaos Dwarf anatomy.
-[] JOHANN: Study an artefact: The unknown black gem.
-[] DUCK: Adela's started her education in Dwarven engineering. Escort her to do field-testing with some of Gotri's prototypes, and grab what Queekish you can while doing so. Clan Skryre.
-[] Found an internal investigation division, to investigate possible misconduct.
-[] Supply a steady stream of Queekish documents for Qrech to translate, and carefully check the results for consistency.
-[] The Colleges want you to do a series of lectures on your paper, Waaagh and Peace. Travel to Altdorf and do so.
-[*] Hire a Priest of Esmerelda to teach the We.
-[] You have set up a Shrine to Ranald. Expand it into a Temple to the Gambler - a gambling hall with clean cards, guaranteed unloaded dice, fresh sawdust in the fighting ring, and a lottery every Festag. Costs 100gc.
-[] Investigate how living things react to exposure to the Vitae. COIN.
-[] Have additional rooms excavated underneath your Penthouse: -100gc for 4 rooms.
-[] The Gambler: Investigate how living things react to exposure to the Vitae.
-[] Serenity: The ability of Alkharad to assume a projected form of mist. (ALMOST FADED)

This is a great deal like BoneyM's Plan Queekish and Temple Sneks Adela. However it switchs out attempting to find human slaves here in K8P and instead goes help the colleges with any orc troubles they may have. Skaven slaves tend to live very short lives so I find the idea that we will find any human slaves in an area devoid of most humans a pretty far flung idea.
 
Please please please consider the college conference, we could get Magister Lord which would benefit us from here onwards, its too good to pass up.
 
BungieONI said:
Its pretty close to my plans barring the gem.
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While I would love to study the gem, we are a bit starved for Gold actions right now with Max soft locked on the book and needing Johaan to grab correpondence and gas mask, and we have to recognize we mostly want it for potential enchanting and right now we can't spare the focus, I think we have to accept that while it is the next item in the queue it still has to wait untill said queue actualy moves.
 
Neshuakadal said:
This is a great deal like BoneyM's Plan Queekish and Temple Sneks Adela. However it switchs out attempting to find human slaves here in K8P and instead goes help the colleges with any orc troubles they may have. Skaven slaves tend to live very short lives so I find the idea that we will find any human slaves in an area devoid of most humans a pretty far flung idea.
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Amusing name slip but yes I am also reconsidering the slave idea for other stuff.

Like so.

[] Plan Queekish and Gem Sneks
-[] MAX: Study an artefact: The book on Chaos Dwarf anatomy.
-[] JOHANN: Join him on raids with the aim of finding written correspondence and a gas mask in Clan Skryre.
-[] DUCK: Johann's investigation into the ratling gun has hit a wall. See if you can help.
-[] Found an internal investigation division, to investigate possible misconduct.
-[] Supply a steady stream of Queekish documents for Qrech to translate, and carefully check the results for consistency.
-[] Study an artifact: the unknown black gem.
-[*] Hire a Priest of Esmerelda to teach the We.
-[] Gain enough control of your attraction to smoke and gases to have it collect away from your face. (NEW)
-[] Investigate how living things react to exposure to the Vitae. COIN.
-[] Have additional rooms excavated underneath your Penthouse: -100gc for 4 rooms.
-[] The Gambler: Investigate how living things react to exposure to the Vitae.
-[] Serenity: The ability of Alkharad to assume a projected form of mist. (ALMOST FADED)


[] Plan Queekish and Rapport Sneks
-[] MAX: Study an artefact: The book on Chaos Dwarf anatomy.
-[] JOHANN: Join him on raids with the aim of finding written correspondence and a gas mask in Clan Skryre.
-[] DUCK: Johann's investigation into the ratling gun has hit a wall. See if you can help.
-[] Found an internal investigation division, to investigate possible misconduct.
-[] Supply a steady stream of Queekish documents for Qrech to translate, and carefully check the results for consistency.
-[] Study an artifact: the unknown black gem.
-[*] Hire a Priest of Esmerelda to teach the We.
-[] Seek to build a stronger rapport with Qrech, and provide enough sources of mental stimulation that you can turn your attention elsewhere. (NEW-ish)
-[] Investigate how living things react to exposure to the Vitae. COIN.
-[] Have additional rooms excavated underneath your Penthouse: -100gc for 4 rooms.
-[] The Gambler: Investigate how living things react to exposure to the Vitae.
-[] Serenity: The ability of Alkharad to assume a projected form of mist. (ALMOST FADED)


[] Plan Sneks with Temple
-[] MAX: Study an artefact: The book on Chaos Dwarf anatomy.
-[] JOHANN: Join him on raids with the aim of finding written correspondence and a gas mask in Clan Skryre.
-[] DUCK: Johann's investigation into the ratling gun has hit a wall. See if you can help.
-[] Found an internal investigation division, to investigate possible misconduct.
-[] Supply a steady stream of Queekish documents for Qrech to translate, and carefully check the results for consistency.
-[] Study an artifact: the unknown black gem.
-[*] Hire a Priest of Esmerelda to teach the We.
-[] You have set up a Shrine to Ranald. Expand it into a Temple to the Gambler - a gambling hall with clean cards, guaranteed unloaded dice, fresh sawdust in the fighting ring, and a lottery every Festag. Costs 100gc.
-[] Investigate how living things react to exposure to the Vitae. COIN.
-[] Have additional rooms excavated underneath your Penthouse: -100gc for 4 rooms.
-[] The Gambler: Investigate how living things react to exposure to the Vitae.
-[] Serenity: The ability of Alkharad to assume a projected form of mist. (ALMOST FADED)

Taking into accout what people seem to want.
 
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I am against any vote that spends only 2~3 actions on the actual job. Learning Queekish is important not only to Belegar but also to the Empire and beyond and halfassing her way through that because of pet projects feels wrong.
 
Glau said:
Most likely would be the merc treasure hunters who ran away from the expedition before Karag Nar. Maybe would have learned some queekish by now?
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They'd have had to get through a Kvinn-Wyr full of trolls or a Citadel and a caldera full of greenskins to even have a chance of being enslaved by Skaven.

veekie said:
Could think of a Write In however:
[ ] Write in: Convince Qrech that with Moulder gone from Eight Peaks, and their center of power far from the Empire, you no longer have any conflicts in interest with his clan and that it is in Moulder's best interests that the other Skaven of Eight Peaks suffer a similar fate.

@BoneyM thoughts on this?
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It might be worthwhile to solidify that, but you're already more or less at that point, as he's said that Eshin and Skryre getting dunked on is relevant to his interests.
 
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