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Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest

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It was confirmed some time ago and generally accepted as a fact by the thread since then; WoG retrieval should not be particularly difficult.

Edit - there you go.
Adhoc vote count started by Derpmind on Oct 28, 2019 at 12:20 PM, finished with 162 posts and 72 votes.
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I'll be contrary and say that while we almost died, it's not that big a deal, and not something we need to change around our plans due to.

We rolled horribly, for an extended period of time. This will always be a danger, and not something we can prevent without becoming a priest of popcorn god. Additionally, strings of bad rolls are unlikely. Additionally, the endless cycle of 'be more killy to survive' -> 'get into bigger fights' is something to be careful of.
 
Horium said:
Maybe something to be considered.

Whether due to protagonist syndrome, avarice for dwarf favour, genuine desire to limit dawi casualties or a mix of all above, we are perhaps being overzealous and are overreacting in our battle actions.

Mathilde bring unique capabilities to the dwarf toolkit, and has leveraged those same capabilities to great strategic success, it's true.

However, sometimes it feels like the playerbase considers the only path to victory having Mathilde do everything by herself, with nobody else trusted/expected to do their part of the job.

I mean, other people on our side are competent, too. Powerful and brave, as well, more often than not.

I am not saying that Mathilde should stop sabotaging, scouting, assassinating, dispeling or doing whatever else she (the thread) decides she should do.

I am just saying that perhaps we should trust others to do their part, at least somewhat.
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Part of it is that protagonist syndrome isn't just a baseless feeling that the thread comes up with; when we are told that we're useful and when we act our actions matter, it means that we can look at all our good results and think that if we don't do similar things we won't get similar results. And our victories were already pretty hard won; the casualty rates for Kharag Lhune were just silly, for example.

It might be more anxiety than sound wisdom, but it's not going to be a feeling the thread can shake so easily; there'll always be the feeling that we could have done more.

Especially when we know that in canon Karak Eight Peaks was a decades prolonged last stand, rather than any sort of beacon of hope for the dwarven people. There's a strong impetus on the thread for our battles to not only achieve victory, but to make it look easy.
BoneyM said:
Hard limitation. Muscles don't work properly if there's a root crawling through them.
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Well, that sounds like a job for our Stand, then. :V
 
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When it comes to disengaging, it's hard to beat an Illusion + Smoke and Mirrors combo. Of course, Illusion is Fiendishly Complex and requires concentration, but Shroud of Invisibility lets us get some breathing room.

I don't think that we need to do anything particularly special in response to this - it's just one of the known deficiencies in Mathilde's skillset coming up, and learning the rest of the spellbook would probably patch that hole.
 
TotallyNotEvil said:
I got the impression the item would last more than that, but still only a fight essentially.

I think we should do the two Partially Learned ones first, otherwise we "risk" rolling them on the gacha, which is a bit of a waste as they only take half an action to learn, and would be occupying the slot of something that doesn't.

I'd be cool with Partially Learned + Spell Learning (College, gacha) + Vitae research (probably "exact circumstances for transformation", as that seems relevant to virtually anything we do with it).
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I've got a plan that has the spell learning and vitae research.

[] Plan Papers Please
-[] Have Maximilian write papers on subjects you dictate.
--[] Write a paper on your personal understanding of countering Waaagh Magic.
-[] Have Johann study your Eshin throwing star.

-[] Have the Eight Peaks branch keep a careful eye on the mood and actions of the Undumgi. Or [] Found an internal investigation division, to investigate possible misconduct. Or [ ] Start hiring handlers who can then start hiring informers and begin to collect non-public information.

-[] Magic Club stuff

-[] Travel to the Grey College and attend lessons there. (1 College Favour per class; 100gc can be paid instead for non-magical classes)
--[] Attempt to learn our Partially learned spells.
Variant possibility or addition in place of Dictation -[] Travel to the Grey College and attend lessons there. (1 College Favour per class; 100gc can be paid instead for non-magical classes)
--[] Powerstones

-[] [Vitae] Investigate the exact circumstances required to induce a transformation.
Possible addition in place of Dication. -[] [Vitae] Investigate how living things react to exposure to the Vitae.

[] Have Maximilian write papers on subjects you dictate. (Easy to drop and do something else in its place.)
-[] Write a paper on the Waaagh energy and magic witnessed during the Expedition.
-[] [Free Paper] Write a paper on the Black Orc Warboss' worship of Only Gork, and what you saw of the Rogue Idol ritual. Or [Free Paper] Necromantic Telepresence.

-[] Belegar Task

-[] [Free] Have a tower built atop Karag Nar: -100gc for 1 room, bonus to room's purpose.

[X] Try to find your Ducklings and fight by their side.
[X] Leave Karagril to see if any other factions are intervening.
[X] Wait until battle begins in earnest and then take the Orcs by surprise.

Any of these would make me pleased as punch.
 
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Redshirt Army said:
When it comes to disengaging, it's hard to beat an Illusion + Smoke and Mirrors combo. Of course, Illusion is Fiendishly Complex and requires concentration, but Shroud of Invisibility lets us get some breathing room.

I don't think that we need to do anything particularly special in response to this - it's just one of the known deficiencies in Mathilde's skillset coming up, and learning the rest of the spellbook would probably patch that hole.
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Illusion a big cloud of smoke and laughter, then let it go.
 
TotallyNotEvil said:
I was under the same impression, yeah. That we could get down to 1 wound, heal on our turn, and keep going.

This changes the calculus very significantly.

Upside, at least, is that Speed of Light is a straight up upgrade.
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Uhhh, what? I wonder how many people were sending Mat in under that impression? No wonder lots of folks think this is fine and keep pushinf for ever more assasinations.
 
TotallyNotEvil said:
I was under the same impression, yeah. That we could get down to 1 wound, heal on our turn, and keep going.

This changes the calculus very significantly.

Upside, at least, is that Speed of Light is a straight up upgrade.
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My impression was that healing in combat was basically impossible because of the time needed to cast the mnemonic, which bore out in the Alkharad escapade since we healed after he lit his brain on fire.
 
Can't blame Boney for going with more reasonable interpretation of how our stuff works, instead of making Mathilde entirely capable killing pretty much every single tabletop Lord solo. :<
 
[X] Leave Karagril to see if any other factions are intervening.
[X] Wait until battle begins in earnest and then take the Orcs by surprise.
 
@BungieONI, I like the outline, though I would drop the Dictation action in favor of extra college for Powerstones. It's only one fewer paper, albeit likely at lower quality.

(That said, I'm not sure the "go to college and attempt to learn partially-finished spells" is a valid option. My understanding is that our options are "request tutelage in one spell of our choice," or "roll class gacha," or "stay home and attempt to learn spells of our choice on our own"; the last would allow us to finish off our partials, but we wouldn't get the benefit of college instruction (though we would get our Ulgu tower if we choose to have built that). @BoneyM, is my interpretation of our spell-learning options correct, or am I missing something important?)
 
One thing can immediately help tremendously: trying to see through Pall of Darkness with our new magesight.

"Everyone but you is blind" is hilariously effective.

@BoneyM Would constant Sky Walk boots be something that we can achieve? I figure it might make running away much easier if the roof is sufficiently high, and dorfs do like high chambers don't they. Especially with a Pall of Darkness/Invisibility to help.

Would just a normal (not constant) but very easy to trigger Sky Walk help any?

Also, does the Belt preclude a wind-magic Talisman of Protection? If not, how much for each level of protection?
primemountain said:
Uhhh, what? I wonder how many people were sending Mat in under that impression? No wonder lots of folks think this is fine and keep pushinf for ever more assasinations.
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Yeah, I was confident that, short of being killed in one round, we could keep going for a while.

Given all the comments about our cockroachness, I think a lot of folks thought the same.
 
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