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Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest

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Redshirt Army said:
This is where I'm at, yeah. There isn't exactly a thriving beacon of research and learning in Kislev at the moment, nor is there a popular literary tradition. There's still going to be a fair amount of unique insights and hidden gems when you're talking about the accumulated books of an entire country, but it's probably "only" going to be, like... half of Nuln, in scale, maybe? Two-thirds?

If we make the copying agreement reciprocal, with Kislev being allowed access to LK8P's books to start to create such a tradition, and to be able to rebuild without losing knowledge with each Chaos incursion, then I think that there's a very good argument to be made that Kislev will actually benefit more from it than we will... which I'm fine with. Knowledge preservation isn't a zero sum game, having more copies of information in more places is all to the good.
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Even if the actual math doesn't check out, this kind of philosophy towards the why of asking for library is why I'm not against asking for a library focused boon, even as memetic as "B O O K" can be.

The entire point of this was ensuring Kislev would be strong when it needed to be strong, and knowledge sharing like this aids in that. It offers the kind of price that makes Kislev stronger for having paid it. (Which is also my standard for transcendent boons in general, really.)

In theory, Kislev also has Karak Vlag for that, and Vlag is the better option for preservation in most cases, IMO. That said, the Great War Against Chaos shows the same proximity that helps in day to day matters can also make them both vulnerable to the same disaster if the scale is large enough. So from that perspective three-part redundancy does feel like a sweet spot, especially when the lesser used third part is half a continent away.

I'm not set on this course, because there may be something better suited to that purpose, but I think this is reasonable for that purpose in what it seeks to do.
 
Nurgle said:
Actually how big a favor do we have? Because if we can get more cooperation between the empire and Kislev that would help.
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"More cooperation" is pretty vague. Library backups is more cooperation. Expanding trade, through the EIC or otherwise, is more cooperation. When you talk about cooperation, you need to specify the form it takes - at least to know who profits from it and how, how much effort it takes from the participants, and how it looks for everyone involved (see: Boyars opposing tributary rollout because they see it as them spending resources for Imperinyi glory).
 
Andres said:
I think he was talking about making that argument with the Tzar. Now that Boris is the Tzar, it's something he can do for free.
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Not quite, as I understand it:
Boney said:
He sighs. "Long term infrastructure project, yha? Small, bit by bit improvements over time. That does not work, not with how things are now. If this project was Kislev's project, I could have made it a matter of pride for Kislev, that could have gotten at least most of the resources it needs. But now it is Imperinyi project - I know this is not fully the case, but that is how it is seen in Kislev. If improvements are not obvious, then Kislev's resources for Empire's glory is how it will be seen, and that is an argument that cannot be won." He pauses, his eyes on your face. "Not with the Tzar."

"Is it a matter of resources?"

"Nie, not directly. Kislev is not a rich land, but it is a large land. What it lacks in treasure it has in muscle and will. But the Tzar goes unchallenged because he leaves the Boyars be, so those resources go towards their own comforts and projects and glory. Even if he wished to change things, he could not - the Boyars are so accustomed to his ways they will not accept his changing them. And I know for sure that he does not wish to change things."
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Tzar Vladimir could not AND did not want to make Boyars spend resources on an "Empire's project". Now Boris is a different kind of Tzar, and that is obvious, but I'm pretty sure there will be grumbling over the change. And the more he forces on the Boyars, the more they'll grumble.

He does seem to have a powerful personality and established allies, so I'm confident in his ability to wrangle Kislev into doing better, but it's not quite free in terms of political capital.
 
@Boney Just to check, but Esoteric Dwarven books on Greatswords do exist but just aren't available for general purchase, right? And as a general rule, can we assume that any given culture either has the full +5 for a topic or no relevant books at all?
 
I think Boris could sell a Book deal that does not go too far into the "grab every piece of text in the nation, by force if necessary" direction as a coup for Kislev.
Because after Nuln, we have a pretty badass set of books, and Kislev will probably get more Book out of the deal than we do (assuming they can be arsed to send some scribes to make copies, which they might not), especially long term.
 
Andres said:
@Boney, can back-fill get us Obscure+ Old World Pantheon books?
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We're limited to just Extensive via Barak Varr, either via out-of-pocket purchases or backfill. Backfill doesn't make our dwarf contact more able to obtain books that the cults take pains to keep out of the hands of the public.

StormySky said:
@Boney Just to check, but Esoteric Dwarven books on Greatswords do exist but just aren't available for general purchase, right? And as a general rule, can we assume that any given culture either has the full +5 for a topic or no relevant books at all?
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I was given to understand that maybe the Dwarven understanding of Greatswords did end at Extensive because it's just the Cult of Gazul that has anything at all on them or uses them in the Karaz Ankor.
 
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Just realized that Mathilde is really overachieving on her habit of making allied rulers either dead or depressed. Abelheim died, we gave Belegar a crisis of faith, and now we've managed to make the tzar dead and make the tzar depressed. I'm concerned about what the next step will be, because I don't see how we escalate from here without involving necromancy.
 
adaer said:
Just realized that Mathilde is really overachieving on her habit of making allied rulers either dead or depressed. Abelheim died, we gave Belegar a crisis of faith, and now we've managed to make the tzar dead and make the tzar depressed. I'm concerned about what the next step will be, because I don't see how we escalate from here without involving necromancy.
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Don't forget that Abelhelm also had a crisis of faith before dying because Kasmir was Kasmir (and we didn't tell Abelhelm about that until the issue became obvious and ugly). That was resolved eventually, but still!

Also, we gave Luitpold news amounting to "hey there's Yet More Existential Dangers to the Empire than you thought", and he sighed and approved of us going to Do Something about it, hopefully.
 
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Andres said:
@Boney, can back-fill get us Obscure+ Old World Pantheon books?
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Not with Mathilde's current contacts.

StormySky said:
@Boney Just to check, but Esoteric Dwarven books on Greatswords do exist but just aren't available for general purchase, right?
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Right. To get the full +5 for that you'd have to delve through all the Cult of Gazul's manuals that they generally don't share with outsiders, plus go through a bunch of deeply archived historical writings of Dwarven thoughts on Elven styles and techniques from before and during the War of the Beard.

StormySky said:
And as a general rule, can we assume that any given culture either has the full +5 for a topic or no relevant books at all?
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Yes, the variable is how much effort it would take to scrape together that full +5.
 
Boney said:
While it would been better for widespread usefulness if the way the Matrix would interact with Shadow Knives was by allowing the host to fire the spell in the direction of their choice
....
The Tzar, despite being widowed, is not as alone in bed as your plans would have hoped.
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For a few moments there I was worried all the planning would be foiled by the Shadow Knives shooting out of the Tzar and non-fatally stabbing his companion
 
The Lone badger said:
Which makes it look like an actually-quite-competent lahmian faking natural causes.
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Well competent lahmian who is also too clever by half, but that is a common trait among vampires. If you want to fake natural causes there are simpler ways. That are not as detectable afterwards like smothering him with a pillow.
 
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mastigos said:
For a few moments there I was worried all the planning would be foiled by the Shadow Knives shooting out of the Tzar and non-fatally stabbing his companion
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Even then, maybe the Seed would help? Though if the companion had other minor injuries we didn't notice, and the Seed hit those too... On the other hand, I bet they'd be too freaked out about the dead Tzar to notice that scrape from when they tripped and landed badly three days ago is gone unless it was a big one.
 
Boney said:
Right. To get the full +5 for that you'd have to delve through all the Cult of Gazul's manuals that they generally don't share with outsiders, plus go through a bunch of deeply archived historical writings of Dwarven thoughts on Elven styles and techniques from before and during the War of the Beard.
[...]

Yes, the variable is how much effort it would take to scrape together that full +5.
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Adds notes to my library docs
 
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How many unique combinations of two or more of the eight Winds would there be? I think it's 247 but it's been a long time since I regularly did maths with letters in it.
 
Boney said:
How many unique combinations of two or more of the eight Winds would there be? I think it's 247 but it's been a long time since I regularly did maths with letters in it.
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Well, 1 for the full eight, 8 for the sevens, 28 for the twos and sixes, 56 for the threes and fives, 70 for the fours.

So 28+56+70+56+28+8+1=247, assuming I did my math right and no Dhar is involved as a "ninth Wind".

Edit: Ulgu'd. I really need to pick up the pace on my mental math, what with me having seen the post 0-1 minutes after Boney posted.
 
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