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There might be a burrito clause, but nobody said anything about fish and chips!
I think that if Mathilde becomes a goddess, the things she can and cannot do with magic will change.
Mathilde can join the new food pantheon as the goddess of Burritos. And goddess of Trying To Impress Your Girlfriend With Conjured Burritos So She Stops Making Fun Of You Because You Can't Cook And Then Panicking Because You Really Like It When She Hugs You From Behind To Help You Cook.
That last one doesn't sound like an Aspect that would be very useful, but she gets a lot of mileage out of it.
 
Hekarti (and Atharti) are actually Daughters of Ranald, just from a tyrst with Mathlann instead of with Shallya. This can be seen in Her symbol of Fish (Mathlann) and Chips (Ranald)
 
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This talk of Masteries is making me want to theorize about how Forgettable, Mindhole, and the Memory Packet spell work. Not to try to finagle a spell idea out of it, but just to spitball the mechanics.

Forgettable:
Forgettable: People can't seem to remember your face. Characters who've met you must succeed on an Intelligence Test to recall who you are.

Mindhole
Relevant facts;

Relatively Simple (M - 2 to cast, M - 3 to cast reliably.)

"A target at short range will forget everything they know of you.

- You have no way of controlling or limiting this effect. It's all or nothing."

From Realms of Sorcery, pg. 164
Casting Number: 8
Casting Time: Half action
Ingredient: Fingernail clippings of the person to be forgotten (+1)
Description: You cause one character within 48 yards (24
squares) of you to wholly forget you exist. If the target
fails an Opposed Will Power Test with you, all knowledge
and memory of your existence is wiped from his mind.
He can still notice you as normal and remember anything
so perceived going forward

Mathilde could throw them around with ease as an average Grey Journeywoman. The material component is possibly the most generous one I've ever seen or heard of, which I'm sure helped.

Way back when, Mathilde described Mindhole like this;
Threadmarks: Purge of the Haunted Hills - Nachexen, 2476

...or Shadowcloak, for instance. Your spells draw more from the mystical significance of shadows - the sudden plunge into darkness of Mindhole, the tireless advance of the dusk and dawn of Shadowsteed.

So my theory is this;
once upon a time, some poor Grey rolled Forgettable. Perhaps out of pragmatism, spite, or a desire for recognition, they managed to Codify it into the spell we know today as Mindhole.

My guess is that Mindhole works by using the shadow of the Wizard casting the spell as a sort of template.

A shadow being a featureless non-entity cast by something, that nevertheless matches the shape of the caster.

The wizard then uses the shadow template and coshes/sieves the target in the brain-soul. The memory bits of the wizard in question are then attracted to the 'big' Ulgu template of the wizard, neatly being extracted from the target.


So, the Memory Packet.

The March to Karak Eight Peaks - Week 3 - The Forest of Gloom

They are ratmen, boundless in number; in your tongue, they are called Skaven."

The words echo unpleasantly in your head, and grow. A thought unfolds uncomfortably in your mind, and you're taken back to a day forgotten some fifteen years ago. A voice, unfamiliar to you, droning in a bored voice. "Number thirty-two. The Ratmen and the Conspiracy of Silence. If you believe you are accessing this memory in error, please contact the Grey College at your earliest convenience." Information blossoms, summoned by a name erased from history.

Like most of the thread, I also think the foundation of this technique is Mindhole.
The trajectory seems pretty obvious, right? Some lucky Grey managed to get a spectacular Mastery of Mindhole that allowed them to selectively delete memories. But the memory isn't deleted / destroyed? And it can be recalled with a codeword??
Hmm. Let's run that theory again.

A Grey rolls the mastery gacha and gets a Mindhole that can wear off (Mindbox?). This seems pretty bad, right? However, they're a Grey and used to rules-lawyering finangling with metaphysics. They don't Codify it straight into a spell. They work on making it part of a Ritual instead.

Rituals are a much more immobile endeavor, compared to spells. Good for infrastructure or long term impact, not great for immediate punchiness. But they can be designed for multiple participants, and those participants can be lower in strength (Magic Score) than a Wizard trying to Cast an equivalent effect. You know, like the Perpetuals that the Colleges are full of.

So something like this;
2 Ritualists - Perpetuals are ok, their strength is buoyed by experience and being located directly in the Grey College, and the effect is Relatively Simple.

1 Template - the Lecturer whose information will be sealed away. As we can see in vanilla Mindhole, you can cast it for someone else ('s fingernails). And if they're a Perpetual as well, they'd fill the 'ulgu laden' requirement.

The Targets - 10-15 grey wizardlings. This is where the real reliability is. If you had one wizard with the 'Mindbox' mastery, they'd get exhausted doing all the lectures and then chaincasting the spell. With a Ritual, you could theoretically scale it to affect a small area instead of an individual. Like, say, a classroom.

So the magic effect isn't the lecture itself. The magic is a shadow on the memory of the lecture, obscuring it until the light of the keyphrase dispels it and rejoins the information to the rest of the mind* (with slightly distressing results, judging by Mathilde tasting blood).

*Alternate metaphor: the magic is a box that seals away the information, until the key of the passphrase opens it and frees the lecture.




as you might have guessed from my other posts, I like theorizing about Boney's Sevirrics.
 
This talk of Masteries is making me want to theorize about how Forgettable, Mindhole, and the Memory Packet spell work. Not to try to finagle a spell idea out of it, but just to spitball the mechanics.

Forgettable:


Mindhole


From Realms of Sorcery, pg. 164


Mathilde could throw them around with ease as an average Grey Journeywoman. The material component is possibly the most generous one I've ever seen or heard of, which I'm sure helped.

Way back when, Mathilde described Mindhole like this;


So my theory is this;
once upon a time, some poor Grey rolled Forgettable. Perhaps out of pragmatism, spite, or a desire for recognition, they managed to Codify it into the spell we know today as Mindhole.

My guess is that Mindhole works by using the shadow of the Wizard casting the spell as a sort of template.

A shadow being a featureless non-entity cast by something, that nevertheless matches the shape of the caster.

The wizard then uses the shadow template and coshes/sieves the target in the brain-soul. The memory bits of the wizard in question are then attracted to the 'big' Ulgu template of the wizard, neatly being extracted from the target.


So, the Memory Packet.



Like most of the thread, I also think the foundation of this technique is Mindhole.
The trajectory seems pretty obvious, right? Some lucky Grey managed to get a spectacular Mastery of Mindhole that allowed them to selectively delete memories. But the memory isn't deleted / destroyed? And it can be recalled with a codeword??
Hmm. Let's run that theory again.

A Grey rolls the mastery gacha and gets a Mindhole that can wear off (Mindbox?). This seems pretty bad, right? However, they're a Grey and used to rules-lawyering finangling with metaphysics. They don't Codify it straight into a spell. They work on making it part of a Ritual instead.

Rituals are a much more immobile endeavor, compared to spells. Good for infrastructure or long term impact, not great for immediate punchiness. But they can be designed for multiple participants, and those participants can be lower in strength (Magic Score) than a Wizard trying to Cast an equivalent effect. You know, like the Perpetuals that the Colleges are full of.

So something like this;
2 Ritualists - Perpetuals are ok, their strength is buoyed by experience and being located directly in the Grey College, and the effect is Relatively Simple.

1 Template - the Lecturer whose information will be sealed away. As we can see in vanilla Mindhole, you can cast it for someone else ('s fingernails). And if they're a Perpetual as well, they'd fill the 'ulgu laden' requirement.

The Targets - 10-15 grey wizardlings. This is where the real reliability is. If you had one wizard with the 'Mindbox' mastery, they'd get exhausted doing all the lectures and then chaincasting the spell. With a Ritual, you could theoretically scale it to affect a small area instead of an individual. Like, say, a classroom.

So the magic effect isn't the lecture itself. The magic is a shadow on the memory of the lecture, obscuring it until the light of the keyphrase dispels it and rejoins the information to the rest of the mind* (with slightly distressing results, judging by Mathilde tasting blood).

*Alternate metaphor: the magic is a box that seals away the information, until the key of the passphrase opens it and frees the lecture.




as you might have guessed from my other posts, I like theorizing about Boney's Sevirrics.
If it's a ritual it doesn't necessarily need to be based on anything. Rituals can effectively accomplish any goal. The memory lock might well just be a ritual someone invented, rather than being linked to a mastery (or spell, depending on whether Mindhole came first) at all.
 
once upon a time, some poor Grey rolled Forgettable. Perhaps out of pragmatism, spite, or a desire for recognition, they managed to Codify it into the spell we know today as Mindhole.
While that's certainly possible, and maybe Forgettable or something like it was used in the making of the Memory Packet, I think there's a much stronger and more obvious candidate for the origins of Mindhole:
Nepenthe: Using a fingernail from the individual the target wishes to forget, the user can create magic smokey liquid to fill a small cup. If a willing individual drinks from this cup, they will forget one individual (that they want to forget) and everything involved with that individual. The spell is permanent.
Since we know the Hedgewise were among the founders of the Grey College, and since the material component is nearly identical, I think a connection is extremely likely. Mindhole is a less versatile than Nepenthe, as it can only make the target forget a specific person (the caster), but it makes up for that by being more "aggressive" (can be used on unwilling target and doesn't require the target to drink anything). That seems like the sort of changes a Grey Wizard might make to the spell when translating it into Ulgu and attempting to make it useful to the Grey Order.
 
Absolutely unbelievable that I missed an update. I regularly check my notifications to see if an update has happened, but the Teclis one slipped me by, probably because it wasn't 1k+ words. I usually check posts that long. I don't know why the notificaitons tab didn't tell me that Boney dropped a threadmark.

Anyways, because I missed saying this after so many updates, I'd like to thank Boney *checks how many updates I missed* x4 for all the updates he's been churning out. I love them all, even if I'm not saying anything. I'm always thinking about this quest, I just don't have the time and energy to keep up with the thread and contribute.

I will say though, I do check out every post that quotes me, and it makes me happy that my informational posts are still being used.
 
Absolutely unbelievable that I missed an update. I regularly check my notifications to see if an update has happened, but the Teclis one slipped me by, probably because it wasn't 1k+ words. I usually check posts that long. I don't know why the notifications tab didn't tell me that Boney dropped a threadmark.
I had the same thing happen, I didn't even realize that updates had started back up until like a week ago. It was nice to come back to multiple updates, though.
 
Does our new swording style even have a 'now you are fighting on horseback' part to it?
You know, it occurs to me there we also have the ability to summon and dismiss a horse at will. Added to our experience making our sword style, this means Mathilde is in the perfect place to invent Hidden Horse Style. And as a bonus, we could teach it to the rest of the grey order without needing special equipment or new spells!
 
From what I understand, Mathilde's sword style is a combination of Greatsword fighting techniques, which is a ground based fighting style for combat in the battle field, combined with Dwarven techniques for fighting in cramped spaces like tunnels, and also the patience and moderation style Dwarves have. That's why we have a bonus in cramped spaces, chokepoints and against enraged or unthinking human size opponents. Although far as I understand it, this doesn't work against unpredictable opponents like Orcs? Might be misremembering a Boney WoG.

The second part of Mathilde's fighting style is then based on her teleporting sword, allowing her to bypass opponent's guard, switch between hands while fighting, incorporating dual handed combat techniques, using Vampire Hunter tactics to attack from unexpected areas in opponent's lethal areas, and controlling the momentum of her weapon to leverage its pecularities.

None of these things seem to translate on horseback, which has an entirely different martial background. Greatswords don't use horses, otherwise they'd be Reiksguard, and Dwarves shun cavalry. Mathilde's weapon doesn't lend itself to horseback, and I'm somewhat unsure of how the sword teleportation would work if we're moving at our Steed's breakneck pace. We'd deposit our sword in the pocket dimension, traverse like 50 m, then have to resummon it into our hand without it slipping or us missing the weapon.
 
Mathilde holding a chokepoint would be amazingly brutal.

Martial 25+10, enemies get no Martial bonus to their defenses, massive damage, nullify magical effects, doubled damage reflection, no fatigue, regenerating.
 
Codex is right, the styles Mathilde has studied don't really lend themselves well for fighting on horseback.

On top of that, the majority of mounted knights in the Empire wield lances/spears, with only like two canonical orders wielding large swords - the Knights of the Jade Griffon (zweihanders), and the Knights of the Bull (two-handed swords). It's not really a typical weapon to use atop horseback.

If we ever do get around to trying to become better at mounted swordsmanship, it's a good possibility that we'd ask around on Bretonnia. Their Knights probably have far more expertise in this specific martial combination.
 
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If we ever do get around to trying to become better at mounted swordsmanship, it's a good possibility that we'd ask around on Bretonnia. Their Knights probably have far more expertise in this specific martial combination.
Tabletop-wise, the main users of greatswords on horseback are the Questing Knights (because one of the parts of the Questing Vow is to 'set down my lance').

Not sure if Soizic would be a helpful authority though, given she doesn't even have a horse.
 
If we ever do get around to trying to become better at mounted swordsmanship, it's a good possibility that we'd ask around on Bretonnia. Their Knights probably have far more expertise in this specific martial combination.
There's at minimum a tradition of hand-and-a-half swords among Bretonnian (presumably) Knights:
So when King Belegar Ironhammer says make swords, the Grandmaster of the Karak Azul Blacksmith's Guild learned to make a sword, and not being one to reinvent the wheel, a glance can show you where they took their lessons. The representatives of the Knights are presented swords that bear striking resemblances to the hand-and-a-half swords of Bretonnia.
Perhaps there would be some applicable mounted techniques to synthesise.
 
Mounted combat is such a weird direction for someone with Mathilde's advantages. Thanks to enchanted robes and a sword that only exists if it needs to, she is the least encumbered version of her loadout to exist. Not to mention that she has access to both hands unless she is literally hitting something or blocking.
Being on a horse doesn't really synergize with that. Her next step should instead be doing a degree in backflips and dramatic dodges with a secret order of Ranaldian martial artists or something in that vein.
 
Being on a horse doesn't really synergize with that. Her next step should instead be doing a degree in backflips and dramatic dodges with a secret order of Ranaldian martial artists or something in that vein.
Swordmasters of Hoeth if anyone, I think, they're the ones doing things like 'cutting down arrows flying at them'.
 
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