Remove ads

Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest

Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
Reader mode
Chlof said:
I actually did something similar;

I was gonna go with Ranald but Warframe decided that was too vulgar.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I named my Felyne companion Ranald, but I had no idea what fur color a Ranald cat would be so I just went with a two tone black/white fur pattern, which is aesthetically pleasing and matches Mathilde's color scheme.
 
Codex said:
I've also decided to go for Greatsword despite my favored weapon being the Longsword. Although, being honest, the Greatsword in this game is Guts' Dragonslayer sized rather than the more realistic ones.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

So, all my knowledge about Warhammer pretty much stems from having read the entirety of this thread, so I got to ask the question: ARE Warhammer greatswords realistic? Considering the setting, I imagine it would also have dragonslayers and buster blades rather than historically accurate greatswords.

Then again, is the answer to that question even a yes or a no? I have read (in this thread) that the titular warhammer was initially historically accurate before it became a fantasy weapon. It could be that they are depicted as both at different times, because from what I understand, Warhammer does that.
 
storryeater said:
So, all my knowledge about Warhammer pretty much stems from having read the entirety of this thread, so I got to ask the question: ARE Warhammer greatswords realistic? Considering the setting, I imagine it would also have dragonslayers and buster blades rather than historically accurate greatswords.

Then again, is the answer to that question even a yes or a no? I have read (in this thread) that the titular warhammer was initially historically accurate before it became a fantasy weapon. It could be that they are depicted as both at different times, because from what I understand, Warhammer does that.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Well, that depends on the user. Humans and Asur tend to use realistic ones, whereas orcs and chaos are more fantasy. In case of Mathilde, she is likely to be using a weapon in style of her original mentors aka Stirland's Greatswords which makes it very likely to be some vatiation of a historical german zweihander.
 
storryeater said:
I have read (in this thread) that the titular warhammer was initially historically accurate before it became a fantasy weapon.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I mean, I've heard various reports of the original being lost with Sigmar and the emperor's one being a replica too. Which would be kinda hilarious to have sigmars hammer be realistic and then people went to recreate it and exaggerated the hell out of it because Sigmar lol. Not what actually happened, but it'd be funny.
 
Can't comment on great swords.
I do know that Ghal Maraz would be unrealistic in real-life. In a setting where magical weapons and demi-humans (or similar) are a thing I am less sure of its realism.
 
storryeater said:
So, all my knowledge about Warhammer pretty much stems from having read the entirety of this thread, so I got to ask the question: ARE Warhammer greatswords realistic? Considering the setting, I imagine it would also have dragonslayers and buster blades rather than historically accurate greatswords.

Then again, is the answer to that question even a yes or a no? I have read (in this thread) that the titular warhammer was initially historically accurate before it became a fantasy weapon. It could be that they are depicted as both at different times, because from what I understand, Warhammer does that.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
The empire greatswords aren't that terrible. The length and shape is mostly right (I've got one that goes to about my chin, so 1.70 I guess). The issue is that the handle is too short. With a greatsword, a third or more of the entire length is just the grip, so you can use leverage to get it moving. Of course, Chaos is also overly spikey, but that goes for all their stuff.

Double-headed, huge axes (looking at you Grimnir/Gotrek/Borek) are much more unrealistic, because all that metal creates a huge cost and makes it a total bitch to swing, and tires you out. The huge hammers have the same issue. And that's also the reason why buster swords are dumb. Of course, when you get into magic and superhuman abilities, design considerations change.
 
There is also the issue of how they are used. You don't have entire units of big sword boi's.

Greatswords job was to be the one guy in the middle of the pike and spear wall breaking shafts and running forward and taking shots at anyone with their weapon pinned and then running back.
 
Jyn Ryvia said:
There is also the issue of how they are used. You don't have entire units of big sword boi's.

Greatswords job was to be the one guy in the middle of the pike and spear wall breaking shafts and running forward and taking shots at anyone with their weapon pinned and then running back.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
They did also see use as a weapon of choice for bodyguards. Including bodyguarding the banner carriers.
 
Codex said:
I've also decided to go for Greatsword despite my favored weapon being the Longsword. Although, being honest, the Greatsword in this game is Guts' Dragonslayer sized rather than the more realistic ones.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I haven't played any game more recent than 4, but focusing on any single weapon seems like it would rob these game of so much joy. MHtilde deserves some quality time with stuff like the murder bagpipe and and the chainsaw halberd!
 
BurnNote said:
The empire greatswords aren't that terrible. The length and shape is mostly right (I've got one that goes to about my chin, so 1.70 I guess). The issue is that the handle is too short. With a greatsword, a third or more of the entire length is just the grip, so you can use leverage to get it moving. Of course, Chaos is also overly spikey, but that goes for all their stuff.

Double-headed, huge axes (looking at you Grimnir/Gotrek/Borek) are much more unrealistic, because all that metal creates a huge cost and makes it a total bitch to swing, and tires you out. The huge hammers have the same issue. And that's also the reason why buster swords are dumb. Of course, when you get into magic and superhuman abilities, design considerations change.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
For reference:

Jyn Ryvia said:
There is also the issue of how they are used. You don't have entire units of big sword boi's.

Greatswords job was to be the one guy in the middle of the pike and spear wall breaking shafts and running forward and taking shots at anyone with their weapon pinned and then running back.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
You're overgeneralising. You're referring to the specific use of zweihanders by the Landsknechte. A disputed use at that, becasue whether they were actually used as anti-pike weapons is not a settled question.
 
Well, there is the Montante, basically a Greatsword but different, which has techniques specifically to guard a defenseless person and to fight against multiple enemies at once using sweeping strikes to threaten multiple enemies at once and keep them at bay. Unfortunately Wikipedia only has german oder italian articles.
In general, big two-handed swords werent much of a battlefield weapon. As far as I know, they got used for a few decades against pike formations and then phased out for more effective sword and shield fighters. Their main use was as a civilian duel and self defense weapon.
Id say that as long as you can use your body to shield against projectiles, maybe because your wearing plate armour, or those arent a consideration, a Greatsword makes a quite decent weapon for a bodyguard.
 
I actually gotten to see someone use a Zweihander who was really damn good with it. While they were showing off the dude was able to casually feniet their swings so fast that I didn't realize what quite happened. It also important to note is that when you get hit by a proper swing, those things are gonna knock you on your ass. And if your on your ass in that time of war, you were fucking dead.

Edit: Not that I'm arguing that it's the best weapon. It just that people can get VERY good with it. Same way people who are good with a lucerne hammer can make it almost look like a dance. I seen a dude show how you can fient a body stab with one of those and at the last second point further downard and catch someone's knee on the flat part of the hammer. Causing their knee caps to explode.
 
Last edited:
Wiggy said:
I suppose that makes sense since they serve as the bodyguards for the elector counts on the battlefield. Kind of an awful weapon for a bodyguard when indoors though...
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

If I recall correctly, the long handle of a greatsword would let you level it like a spear and you could use that to thrust and parry in enclosed spaces, using the flat of your blade to slap away your opponent's weapon.

Actually lifting the blade above your head for an overarm swing is kinda a terrible idea because it wrecks your arms, unbalances you and leaves your chest exposed. Ideally you always want to keep your weapon as close to your centre of gravity as possible. Interestingly, this gives swordswomen a slight advantage over swordsmen because it's easier for a woman to maintain her centre of gravity.
 
deathofrats0808 said:
You're overgeneralising. You're referring to the specific use of zweihanders by the Landsknechte. A disputed use at that, becasue whether they were actually used as anti-pike weapons is not a settled question.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Yeah, though I'm not aware of other cases of a battlefield unit using them (but I'm also by no means an expert). The other use (for the montante) I'm aware of is for bodyguards to handle large groups of poorly armed/armored attackers. Which matches the stated purpose of the Greatswords, if not their use on the battlefield. We can speculate that evolved out of the need to chop up big nasties (and leaders throwing their best people, aka their personal guard, at the problem).
MiracleGrow said:
I actually gotten to see someone use a Zweihander who was really damn good with it. While they were showing off the dude was able to casually feniet their swings so fast that I didn't realize what quite happened. It also important to note is that when you get hit by a proper swing, those things are gonna knock you on your ass. And if your on your ass in that time of war, you were fucking dead.

Edit: Not that I'm arguing that it's the best weapon. It just that people can get VERY good with it. Same way people who are good with a lucerne hammer can make it almost look like a dance. I seen a dude show how you can fient a body stab with one of those and at the last second point further downard and catch someone's knee on the flat part of the hammer. Causing their knee caps to explode.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Nerdasaurus Rex said:
If I recall correctly, the long handle of a greatsword would let you level it like a spear and you could use that to thrust and parry in enclosed spaces, using the flat of your blade to slap away your opponent's weapon.

Actually lifting the blade above your head for an overarm swing is kinda a terrible idea because it wrecks your arms, unbalances you and leaves your chest exposed. Ideally you always want to keep your weapon as close to your centre of gravity as possible. Interestingly, this gives swordswomen a slight advantage over swordsmen because it's easier for a woman to maintain her centre of gravity.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I've got some very limited experience using it. You absolutly need to keep your sword moving if you want to do strikes, but it's also decent at stabbing, and you can halfsword it (many are explicitly designed for it, that's what those small spikes around the middle are for: hand protection. Yes, actual, realistic and useful spikey bits). It's not super faster, but it takes up a lot of space with each swing (good for keeping people back), and the momentum is brutal. Which is also why I've never done much sparring with it, nobody wants to be on the other side of that.

I've done more sparring against a foam replica of the same length, but lacking the weight. It's a little annoying to deal with the extra length, but not all that different from a longsword. A little worse, honestly. The impact is what makes it scary.
 
Last edited:
storryeater said:
So, all my knowledge about Warhammer pretty much stems from having read the entirety of this thread, so I got to ask the question: ARE Warhammer greatswords realistic? Considering the setting, I imagine it would also have dragonslayers and buster blades rather than historically accurate greatswords.

Then again, is the answer to that question even a yes or a no? I have read (in this thread) that the titular warhammer was initially historically accurate before it became a fantasy weapon. It could be that they are depicted as both at different times, because from what I understand, Warhammer does that.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I would like to clarify what a Monster Hunter Greatsword involves:
I can guarantee you she doesn't fight like that. The sword is so heavy that the hunter literally swings their body around and are almost launched by the slashes they make.

When it comes to art and models, the Greatswords of the Empire use Zweihanders. Mathilde based her own sword on that. I'm pretty sure it's not a buster sword. Not that I doubt it exists in Warhammer, just that most humans wouldn't be able to wield one with any sort of efficiency.
CeBrudras said:
I haven't played any game more recent than 4, but focusing on any single weapon seems like it would rob these game of so much joy. MHtilde deserves some quality time with stuff like the murder bagpipe and and the chainsaw halberd!
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Game's hard. Playing through it with one weapon is pretty heavy on the mental tax and muscle memory has to be retrained everytime. I have no doubt someone more skilled than me could do it, but generations has six styles for each of its 14 weapons. I don't have the time or patience to master all of them, much less become proficient at them.
 
storryeater said:
So, all my knowledge about Warhammer pretty much stems from having read the entirety of this thread, so I got to ask the question: ARE Warhammer greatswords realistic? Considering the setting, I imagine it would also have dragonslayers and buster blades rather than historically accurate greatswords.

Then again, is the answer to that question even a yes or a no? I have read (in this thread) that the titular warhammer was initially historically accurate before it became a fantasy weapon. It could be that they are depicted as both at different times, because from what I understand, Warhammer does that.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Zweihander from the 15th to 16th century do get ridiculously long, especially considering the lower average height of the time period.
 
So with the vote slowed down if not stopped what do you guys think we should get as far as library purchases go? I kind of want to go Eonir again something like this:

[ ] [LIBRARY] Library of Mournings: Old Ones and Linguistics Extensive and Esoteric

Old Ones is relevant for the Project, especially the big ticket stuff like foundation and linguistics will take out bonus from +11 to +16 which may not seem like a lot, but if we are going for the High Nehekaran, which can be useful for everything from RoW to reading the vampire books to Tomb King Waystones we want a really high roll so we can get it done in 1 AP not 2. That +5 has well a 5% chance to be the difference between having the language done and ready for use next turn or having to wait one more turn.
 
Last edited:
DragonParadox said:
So with the vote slowed down if not stopped what do you guys think we should get as far as library purchases go? I kind of want to go Eonir again something like this:

[ ] [LIBRARY] Library of Mournings: Old Ones and Linguistics Extensive and Esoteric

Old Ones is relevant for the Project, especially the big ticket stuff like foundation and linguistics will take out bonus from +11 to +16 which may not seem like a lot, but if we are going for the High Nehekaran, which can be useful for everything from RoW to reading the vampire books to Tomb King Waystones we want a really high roll so we can get it done in 1 AP not 2. That +5 has well a 5% chance to be the difference between having the language done and ready for use next turn or having to wait one more turn.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

I think a lot of people want metallurgy for the Waystone gold, which means going through Barak Varr. I can take it or leave it myself, but I do want to pick up books on Nehekeran history and religion at some point. Maybe their magical traditions as well, but that probably means going through the colleges. Also Eike's been asking us some morality questions, and our library has an explicit "Ethics +0" category at the moment, so maybe filling that out could be interesting? Again I can take it or leave it, it's not super important.
 
Codex said:
I'm pretty sure it's not a buster sword. Not that I doubt it exists in Warhammer, just that most humans wouldn't be able to wield one with any sort of efficiency.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I could see a Blood Dragon using their super strength and a massive sword to just absolutely cleave their way through an arbitrary number of low level soldiers, maybe... Vampire reflexes probably make using the weight to enable crazy midair dodges plausible too! That's fun.

Isn't there an aqshy spell that just makes like a 20 ft long sword of fire in one of the versions? Flaming sword of rhuin I think it was? Bright wizards sure know how to handle living in a death world.
 
Wiggy said:
I could see a Blood Dragon using their super strength and a massive sword to just absolutely cleave their way through an arbitrary number of low level soldiers, maybe... Vampire reflexes probably make using the weight to enable crazy midair dodges plausible too! That's fun.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I think it'd be more of a Strigoi thing- they're the bloodline for brute strength.
 
Last edited:
Remove ads
Lonesome Thorek
  • Apocrypha
    • Thorek had attended many a social gathering in his day, and while he still prefered the brew with the lads and lasses after a hard day of work, in his time, he had dealt with Imperial Dwarves, Kings, Guildmasters, Umgi Lords, Slayers, etc. he liked to think himself a pretty people savvy dwarf.

    But as he sipped his wine (which we would never admit out loud tasted pretty good), he still had to admit that he was somehow out of his depth. Even after all his time in this city (which he would never admit looked pretty good even by dawi standards) he still wasn't sure how to interpret all social cues from such a foreign society. How the hell was an honest dwarf supposed to react when he suspected his interlocutors made fun of him with their smirks and wordplays, of course, never something clearcut enough to give him cause cause to complain especially since he didn't completely master Tel-Eldarin yet (not that he'd ever admit the difficulty he faced with the subtilities of a language based on entirely different paradigm than Khazalid or even Reikspeil), but still leaving him with the impression that those damn nobles were playing wordgames around him.

    Still, he would carry on, the project was to important both for Karaz Ankor as a whole and for his own damn pride. He had to admit that when the young Mathilde had come to him for help, he didn't realize just how much of an opportunity it was. But in time, he understood better why he was choosen even over ever Kragg the Grim (wasn't that something to brag about when pretenting to grumble), for the Living Ancestor would probably have lost his temper a few times at those slippery elves by now. And he WAS making progress despite it all.

    He just was a little lonely for more grounded company is all (not that he'd ever admit it).
     
    Last edited:
  • Apocrypha
    • Mopman43 said:
    I think it'd be more of a Strigoi thing- they're bloodline for brute strength.
    Click to expand...
    Click to shrink...
    Yeah, that's fair.

    As for book votes... Well, getting rid of that Physics 0 would be nice for my completionist side and probably also help if we ever want to do that Branalhune action about the flash it makes when it vanishes underwater. Mathilde trying to figure out how to weaponize sudden vacuums sounds entertaining.

    And yeah, that ethics 0 is kinda glaring even if it's kind of hilarious. Otherwise... Getting more on the elven gods would be nice to keep plugging away at our understanding of the elves. Khaine in particular might be useful for learning about the Druuchi, though I don't know how open the Eonir would be on any info about him. And I'm pretty sure Khaine's a proscribed god in the empire so those sort of books would be a touchy subject? Hm. Still might be worth trying.
     
    Reader mode
    You must login or register to reply here.
    Remove ads
    Back
    Top