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We already did this. Remember that there is no difference between a god and soul which means when we have fingerprinted Ranald it was his soul stuff we did to. Human souls should be no different.
I don't think we've verified that there's no difference between a god and a soul?

But yeah, the Ranald fingerprint is what made me think of the idea. Comparing how AV interacts with human soulstuff or something compared to how we've seen it interact with Ranald's soulstuff sounds like it could yield some very interesting implications.
 
I really should be going to sleep rather than letting my thoughts run wild at such a late time, but still...

Thinking about 3 statements, one mine (well, mine but it was connected to stuff said in the posts) and 2 of Boney's.

*Human wizards possibly becoming Wind Elementals, or otherwise their Soul turning into Wind; or partly turning into Wind at max
*The Underearth/Glittering Realm was made properly part of the physical world, and the Gods retreating from walking the world after the Great Vortex
*The general mentioning of how "Runecraft is using only what was taught by the Ancestor Gods. It's not... making up new-stuff-that-is-still-just-Runecraft. Everything that can be made in Runecraft, is something that stemmed from teachings or principles passed down by the Ancestor Gods."

And... ... I think that third bit might be literally true?

As in, I think the Ancestor Gods became the Gods of the Underearth or in a sense became the "system" of Runecrafting itself. I think that to enter into the Underearth is to become part of the Underearth, similarly-ish to how one dying and becoming part of the Aethyr would be for a human. I don't think they're like AIs or static beings or cosmic principles or anything though. I think they're still people, that they're... still just Dwarfs. Just, very heavily awesome and of-the-Underearth-Dwarfs.

I had a post or two that mused about Rituals and the nature of magic a while back, and it talked about how much effort stuff took, but also that expended effort and time and sheer-fuck-you-do-what-I-say could echo on in the Aethyr or become part of the Aethyr or etc. And how maybe some Gods were humans who simply did big enough and important enough and magical enough things, they they shaped the Aethyr. ((Also, there'd be other ways than just that way to become a god; for instance, instead of doing it "the hard way" or the "with your own two hands" way you could, of course, be familiar enough with the rules and laws of Aethyr-physics that you'd be able to take advantage of the rules and laws to become a spirit or god. Or, of course, you could have a patron; you could partake of their essence, and do the fuedal equivalent of be given a fief to rule in their stead. Along with other possible things, etc.))

I'd wondered whether the Dwarfs achieved Godhood via similar amounts of "effort" and "sheer fuck-you-do-what-I-say" at the Aethyr.

That is, I mused that "They repel the Aethyr, rather than interacting directly with it, sure... but maybe they could, like, cause big enough ripples in the Aethyr with their not-being-affected-by-the-Aethyr-ness that this would still create a God-shadow of themselves, and then they'd slowly merge with it? And because it was a Dwarf-made Aethyr-shadow, and Dwarfs are super stubborn and unchanging, these were very different Dwarfs. Maybe that's what they did with the Underearth." For for a better metaphor; they used magnetism to repel metal, whereas Wizards and Priests attract or manipulate metal.

But now I've had the thought that what happened was... So, they cut off the Underearth. And then they started shaping it and ordering it.

But the way they became Ancestor Gods was by... making themselves part of the Underearth, and the Underearth part of themselves. That is, they defined the Underearth by the definition of 'themselves' and 'themselves' were 'the set of rules and traditions and stuff of being Dwarfy and of Runecasting.'

So, anyway, back to my bullet point number three.

*The general mentioning of how "Runecraft is using only what was taught by the Ancestor Gods. It's not... making up new-stuff-that-is-still-just-Runecraft. Everything that can be made in Runecraft, is something that stemmed from teachings or principles passed down by the Ancestor Gods."

About how "Anything in Runecraft is ultimately sources from the Ancestors" and how it might be literally true.

It might be by having Runecraft be, in part... the manipulation of gods. Or, well, the gods' appendages. Or the application of the gods' rules.

In other words it's a bit like saying "There are only 26 letters in the English alphabet, so any English word you make up is going to be made up of only those 26 letters ultimately."

That's how it might be that every "new discovery" of Runecrafting is actually "an old discovery."

And also, that's how and why it would be super blasphemous for anybody else to use Runecrafting. Or for any Dwarf to use any non-Ancestor-God-derived runes. Because it's the very stuff of their Gods. Their afterlife. Their souls. Their culture and tradition and their dwarfiness.

Who would you trust with the gestalt collective soul-stuff of the Dwarf race? Very fucking few people! What foreign or questionably-sourced stuff would you risk using (like Frundar runes) when you, in your age where you've lost so much knowledge that you might not even know what you'd be risking by doing so, might be risking your race's soul and gods? You'd risk very fucking few things.

When you have a sense of "The possible consequences are enormous. I do not know enough to know what might cause mistakes or problems." the obvious conclusion to take, especially if you are Dwarfy, is "I'd better not risk it at all."

Add on top of that simple responsibility of "It's not just me at risk here; it's possibly my whole race" and also "It's not just the current people at risk; it might also be all the people of the past at risk. The legacy of all those who came before. ... And also, those people may be in the afterlife too, so it might not just be legacy either!"

And Dwarfs feel responsibility and safety and legacy stronger than humans do.

A human can afford to be reckless with magic because he is ultimately risking "just" his own soul, and the health of anybody in his vicinity, and the sorrow of anybody who knew him that he might leave behind.

A Runesmith is potentially playing around with his race's entire history or entire hoard of wealth or genetic code or whatnot. You don't mess around when the consequences are not just for you, but potentially for all of your race, too.

You mess around with stuff that might kill you, and only you or those nearby you. But you don't mess around with Runecraft.

A human giving away magic spells or rituals, is 'just' giving away potential military power or upgrades to somebody who may potentially be an enemy. Basically, it might just be technology theft or trade or etc. A Dwarf might be in a lot more hot water and with bigger stakes.

This might prompt a chicken or an egg question I suppose. Does the sense of responsibility and tradition and caution and need-for-certainty come first, and result in this kind of Runecraft and this kind of shaping of the Aethyr into the Underearth; because they're simply trying to make the best possible runecraft/realm and the most Dwarfy possible runecraft/realm. Or do the deeds come first, and Runesmiths simply get an extra helping of responsibility and caution and conservatism on top of regular Dwarf amounts of it, to instill best-practices.
 
When Matty was looking at Ranald directly in the warp She says Gods are human souls but bigger.
Mathilde doesn't say that. She does mention that a fragment of Ranald's soul looks like a bigger (much bigger) human soul, but we know nothing about the rest of Ranald's soul and its similarity to mortal souls.
The fragment of the being you can see does not look materially different from the soul of the beings around you, just - 'just'! - astonishingly greater in size and intensity.
 
The only way I can think of to get AV into contact with a soul would be to feed it to a vampire, since they actually have the mechanism to metabolize soul stuff to begin with. Sadly I do not think we will be getting a friendly vampire anytime soon.
I wonder if it would have the same effect as dragon blood, or if it would simply make the vampire warp/explode.

Édit: maybe we could give it to Alkharad's skull? :V
 
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I wonder if it would have the same effect as dragon blood, or if it would simply make the vampire warp/explode.

Édit: maybe we could give it to Alkharad's skull? :V

I think it would have the same effect as if they had fed from the Wasp, so they would be getting its magic, its power. We know that feeding off corpses and animals enough will lead to a Strigoi so maybe long term AV feeding would lead to a vampire with daemonic characteristics.

Sounds like a great paper: How to make daemon-vampires by Mathilde Weber. :V
 
Humans have this biological instinct that makes it so we are hardwired to see humanoid shapes where we can.

Mathilda spoke in same update on how infinitly large and memorizing Ranald looked, enough so she did theorize him saying no to look at the coin was for her own safety.

So, a small fragment if Ranald's soul having slight shapes if human soul isn't conclusive all by itself.

Atop the fact, even if it was in Ranald's case, it's important to remember that Ranald is supposedly a ascended human, we have enough hints with Loec, Kislev and Nekehara that it isn't that straightforward, but it does mean we can't be sure that Ranald's god soul is the typical god soul.

Ranald and Sigmar as well, might be only human-shaped God souls, compared to a "natural born god" like Ulric or Ranald's daughters
 
If AV becomes identical soulstuff upon coming into contact with soulstuff, would it be possible to use AV to enlarge a soul?

...Is that a potential road to apotheosis if one had access to a staggeringly preposterous amount of AV?

...Also, if Gods and souls are not so different, then what does that say about Divine magic? Is "create your own type of magic" a function of Souls in general, not just of Gods?

Is a person's consciousness like the natural Lore of their Soul?
 
If AV becomes identical soulstuff upon coming into contact with soulstuff, would it be possible to use AV to enlarge a soul?

...Is that a potential road to apotheosis if one had access to a staggeringly preposterous amount of AV?

...Also, if Gods and souls are not so different, then what does that say about Divine magic? Is "create your own type of magic" a function of Souls in general, not just of Gods?

Is a person's consciousness like the natural Lore of their Soul?

Not everything is natural function it likely requires the insight of gods who dwell in the warp to hand out lores of magic.
 
Um, technically there's probably a way to get AV in contact with a human soul. Just... kill the person and position the AV such to ensure that the human's soul will pass through the AV. ((Might be hard to avoid Winds being let loose from the deed too though, so... Maybe if you had multiple bits of isolated AV petri dishes above the soon-to-be-killed-person. Some of the AV would get hit by Winds. Some of the petri dishes of it would get touched by the soul though.)) Probably better to use an animal instead. More ethical. ... Or an orc or druchii I guess, but, well.

I've often wondered what would happen if AV was fed to an Apparition. (I assumed they'd either get a battery recharge. Or they'd grow stronger.)

Or if AV touched an Apparition; would it the AV turn into disconnected essence-of-that-Apparition, the way it turned into disconnected God-stuff? If so, Apparition-stuff unconnected to any Apparition? The way the bit of Ranald-stuff wasn't connected to Ranald? That could be real cool. ... Or it could be nothing. It could be that Will-less Apparition-stuff is just... ... Aetheric Vitae.

I've also wondered what kinds of effects AV would have if it touched a Ghost. Or if a Ghost drank some.

Unfortunately, most of those tests are hard to do ethically or with sufficient privacy. Ghosts are possible to do ethically, if we get a Priest or Purple Wizard to conjure up a ghost... unfortunately, that would require revealing AV to that priest or wizard, so.

Or it'd require a stationary or friendly ghost. Which... might be possible, actually? The ghost of the original Van Hal was said to have helped guide people to... I forget if it was to his journal, or to take out his fallen apprentices, or to help end the undead menace, or something. I think I recall the rumor or legend in-quest saying that the ghost helped out, though.

Or maybe it'd require rituals or a seance to conjure up a friendly ancestor spirit.


At some point though, I want to test out if AV can boost the Enchanting process. What if it can empower or boost your magic item crafting? (It can probably recharge magic items the way it can recharge Dwarf runes of course. But probably that's not a super efficient usage of AV. Probably expensive.) Curious whether AV can help make better, higher quality or higher powered, magic items in the first place. Or maybe it can make it safer to make high-energy magic items. By providing sessile forms of winds.

Or maybe it's better for Alchemy rather than Enchanting. Sadly we don't have the Gold College's alchemy method or whatever method they use to make magic items from all the Winds (suspected to be Earthbound magic). I suspect AV would be of super interest to the Gold College, that it'd let them bypass a laborious and painstaking process of poking magic stuck in the earth in favor of just being able to manipulate AV. They'd kill for such a thing. Probably call it Quintessence or Prima Materia or something (two names that I'd thought up for AV at the time we were naming it, but only brought it up too late, so it never got any traction or interest, ah well) or some other Alchemy-related name.

Meanwhile, we just have potions. Sadly, Mathilde isn't a potion-brewer. But if she were, maybe she'd be able to run an extra test on the Vitae. But who wants to pick up yet a third or fourth (staff-carving, enchanting, power-stone making, apothecary potion-making) magic discipline just to run an experiment for a type of item-crafting (potions) we probably won't use much anyway? Power Stones are much more cool and relevant anyway. Especially as Power Stones apparently mature into Orbs of Sorcery. ... Although, if Power Stones turn into Orbs of Sorcery, maybe Potions or Scrolls turn into some Superior Version too...

... Actually, maybe that's what Gold Order alchemy is? Potion-brewing or Enchanting enhanced with the addition of Undifferentiated Sevir? It's just, they painstakingly get it from the ground like they're extracting particles of gold. Whereas AV is... well, there.


... Actually, I wonder how Scrolls are made. A scroll is a castable spell. Do scrolls fall under Enchanting, the art of making magical items, or are they yet another discipline if a related one?
 
If gods are made from or feed on worship, they should look humanoid, because most of their worshippers are humanoid. Doubly so for gods whose primary worshippers are human and who see them as humanlike.
 
If AV becomes identical soulstuff upon coming into contact with soulstuff, would it be possible to use AV to enlarge a soul?

...Is that a potential road to apotheosis if one had access to a staggeringly preposterous amount of AV?
A totally weird thing but.... For some reason this reminded me of Weird al Yankovich's song Fat.

I'm trying to figure out why I made the connection.
 
I had an incredibly realistic dream today. So much so that when I woke up, I genuinely had to take a moment to remind myself that Mathilde did not dual wield two Branulhunes. She doesn't even have the requisitive ability to do that. It was so inefficient and yet I was so sure for a moment that Mathilde was a dual wielder. So weird.
 
I had an incredibly realistic dream today. So much so that when I woke up, I genuinely had to take a moment to remind myself that Mathilde did not dual wield two Branulhunes. She doesn't even have the requisitive ability to do that. It was so inefficient and yet I was so sure for a moment that Mathilde was a dual wielder. So weird.
Alternate timeline where Mathilde made her first steps into swordfighting not under Greatswords but with some two-weapon trainer.

Only the Empire is kinda lacking those...

Slayers, Witch Elves, Eshin Assassins do, but not many remotly sane people?
 
Hmm, it seems Mathilde didn't notice anything particularly, uh, noticeable when she met a Damsel.
It took some waiting for her conversation with Soizic to finish, but you manage to ensnare the Damsel that had come with the Bretonnian delegates in conversation. "We are, in the abstract, not uninterested," she says with a coy smile once you broach the subject of the Waystone Project. "And had you accepted our invitation to pursue your research in Carcassone, we would already be working hand in hand with you. But you chose otherwise, and while our hearts can recover from being snubbed so, those you did choose are ones with whom entangling ourselves could be problematic - both in regards to their distant kinship with our own, sometimes-troublesome neighbours, and in regards to baser matters of conflict and trade."

"As far as I am aware, there is no conflict between Athel Loren and Laurelorn-"

"As far as you are aware," she echoes. "As far as I am aware, too. But we would have to become much further aware for that to be a safe endeavour. And the effort of becoming so much further aware is effort that could be spent elsewhere - such as, for example, the Iron Orcs of the Irrana Mountains. But if you were to come to us with something more tangible than dreams, then perhaps we might be tempted." She gives you a parting smile and a little wave before she disappears back into the crowd.
I was wondering if perhaps Damsels might have larger souls or something, to maybe... make it easier to Windherd within their own souls or something like that?

Whatever soul stuff might be going on with Damsels apparently isn't something we can observe with Windsight in a casual conversation, unfortunately.

But, hmm, that makes me think of the Hedgewise again, and the apparent ability of theirs to dual-spec into Ulgu.

It was theorized earlier in the thread that it might be because they do so much with items and whatnot rather than with their own souls for Hedge Magic that that could be possible...

But Hedgewise are all about like, boundaries and stuff, right? What if they do some boundary stuff involving their soul to enable the double-spec?

But then, looking it up, its specifically about the boundary between the physical and immaterial, so I dunno... (also in retrospect that definitely makes the casual budget seviroscope that one lady did make a lot more sense, its just bringing the immaterial to the physical thats literally their whole thing)
 
I had an incredibly realistic dream today. So much so that when I woke up, I genuinely had to take a moment to remind myself that Mathilde did not dual wield two Branulhunes. She doesn't even have the requisitive ability to do that. It was so inefficient and yet I was so sure for a moment that Mathilde was a dual wielder. So weird.
Perhaps we could teach our shadow how to wield a sword.
 
Alternate timeline where Mathilde made her first steps into swordfighting not under Greatswords but with some two-weapon trainer.

Only the Empire is kinda lacking those...

Slayers, Witch Elves, Eshin Assassins do, but not many remotly sane people?
Marius Leitdorf is a dual wielder. He is pretty strong at WS6 with both a Runefang and a normal hand weapon.

I suppose one could make the argument that he isn't sane, but he is perfectly capable in combat.
 
On the note of Mathy's shadow...
Unnatural Shadow: Your shadow has a mind of its own, moving around to inspect its surroundings and coil around things and people it takes a liking to. This is, needless to say, very unnerving.
I wonder what Panoramia thinks of Mathilde's shadow? I'm guessing it would have taken a liking to her, and likes to coil around her.
 
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