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Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest

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Codex said:
Well, I completely agree with the Khaine is terrible statement. I've been shouting it out loud and proud from the rooftops any chance I get. But every time I say it people point out that maybe Khaine isn't so terrible, the Druchii are, and that Khaine is necessary. I've conceded on that point, but man would it be funny if Khaine was usurped by Ulric in Laurelorn, as everyone who wants to be part of a House of War decides to go Ulric instead of Khaine. Ulric is not a nice god, but he is leagues better than Khaine, so I'd appreciate it.
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I feel like there is something to be said for recognizing that war is a vile thing and accordingly having a God of War that is a total piece of shit.
I wonder if Ulric could take Khaine's place in the Mandala. It kind of makes more sense than him replacing Ereth Khial because he's kind of standing in for the same role, but I wouldn't be surprised to learn that even without any Great House revering him Khaine still has more political power than Ereth Khial.

ReImagined said:
Roswita's dealing with it.
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But did we ever find out how she's dealing with it? It's not important or anything, I'm just curious.
...if she gave the mining rights to dwarves as a reward for their part in the battle or something then that's a really convenient mining force nearby for us to use.
 
Codex said:
Well, I completely agree with the Khaine is terrible statement. I've been shouting it out loud and proud from the rooftops any chance I get. But every time I say it people point out that maybe Khaine isn't so terrible, the Druchii are, and that Khaine is necessary. I've conceded on that point, but man would it be funny if Khaine was usurped by Ulric in Laurelorn, as everyone who wants to be part of a House of War decides to go Ulric instead of Khaine. Ulric is not a nice god, but he is leagues better than Khaine, so I'd appreciate it.
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I'm not sure I'd argue that a war god is "necessary", but if if it were, Khaine is probably the worst non-chaos god to pick for that role.

Ulric, Myrmidia, and Grimnir are all much better war gods than Khaine, and I'm glad the Eonir are starting to leave him behind.
 
Nerdasaurus Rex said:
I'm not sure I'd argue that a war god is "necessary", but if if it were, Khaine is probably the worst non-chaos god to pick for that role.

Ulric, Myrmidia, and Grimnir are all much better war gods than Khaine, and I'm glad the Eonir are starting to leave him behind.
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I'd say that for a society in Warhammer, a War God is probably beneficial, considering the nature of the world as it is. Khaine is just a nasty expression of that.
 
Nerdasaurus Rex said:
Man, Divided Loyalties as a generational game sounds fun.

That said, Boney has a ton of ideas for future quests, and I'm not ready to say goodbye to Mathilde just yet.
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Obviously, I have absolutely no desire to have Mathilde die literally anytime soon. I'm merely pointing out that Boney does have ideas for sequels:
Boney said:
I've got well-developed and workable ideas for two sequels and three entirely new quests, one of which with a completely written OP ready to go. Which one I end up using is a decision I'll make when I need to.
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We're no longer at the point where Mathilde dies, it's game over, we enter a different quest universe. Now, that might still be the case, it's up to Boney's decision, but there was one point where he considered that with Mathilde dead there would be no more DL.
 
Codex said:
I'd say that for a society in Warhammer, a War God is probably beneficial, considering the nature of the world as it is. Khaine is just a nasty expression of that.
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Aren't the elvish gods more representations of their domains? (at least that's how I understood it) so khaine being cruel and brutal would fit with war being horrible.
And the human and dwarf gods are more removed from their domains...
 
Tobtorp said:
Aren't the elvish gods more representations of their domains? (at least that's how I understood it) so khaine being cruel and brutal would fit with war being horrible.
And the human and dwarf gods are more removed from their domains...
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Khaine isn't just brutal because it's necessary. He's brutal because he enjoys it. He cripples and blinds Vaul then chains him to an anvil to endlessly forge weapons for him. Not only is that cruel, it's pointlessly and inefficiently so. Imagine blinding and crippling the guy who makes your weapons.
 
Codex said:
Khaine isn't just brutal because it's necessary. He's brutal because he enjoys it. He cripples and blinds Vaul then chains him to an anvil to endlessly forge weapons for him. Not only is that cruel, it's pointlessly and inefficiently so. Imagine blinding and crippling the guy who makes your weapons.
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As an interaction between individuals, it's pointless cruelty. But if viewed from a more symbolic lens..."War mutilates Craftsmanship and bends it to violent ends" is not an unreasonable sentiment to have embodied in a cultural mythos.
 
Codex said:
Khaine isn't just brutal because it's necessary. He's brutal because he enjoys it. He cripples and blinds Vaul then chains him to an anvil to endlessly forge weapons for him. Not only is that cruel, it's pointlessly and inefficiently so. Imagine blinding and crippling the guy who makes your weapons.
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That was in a fight to be fair. It's not like the myth has Khaine just randomly decide to cripple Vaul for fun.
 
Wiadi said:
As an interaction between individuals, it's pointless cruelty. But if viewed from a more symbolic lens..."War mutilates Craftsmanship and bends it to violent ends" is not an unreasonable sentiment to have embodied in a cultural mythos.
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Except it's not just one or the other, it's actually both. The thing about Elves is they never view things from one lense. The gods are both individuals and metaphors. My puny human brain doesn't give a shit.
Boney said:
Elven Religion
The Elven Gods are metaphors for the many facets of the Elven mind and soul.
The Elven Gods are shorthand for the ideals that Elves strive to reach, and the imperfections with which they must grapple.
The Elven Gods are a creation myth, providing a bevy of just-so stories to understand the many wonders of the natural world and the forces that gave rise to them.
The Elven Gods are mythologized taxonomy, the embodiment of the collective efforts of the Asur to impose order and understanding on an inherently chaotic world.
The Elven Gods are a magical force shaped and empowered by the collective psyche of their worshippers.
The Elven Gods are actual beings that once ran around the place, squabbled with each other, and hit Daemons with swords, and They like it when you do nice things for Them.
Elves believe all of the above to be simultaneously true.
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This is exactly what I mean. I legitimately don't want a repeat of this argument that keeps popping up every time I say Khaine is an asshole. I'm not going to respond anymore for my own sanity.
 
Codex said:
This is exactly what I mean. I legitimately don't want a repeat of this argument that keeps popping up every time I say Khaine is an asshole. I'm not going to respond anymore for my own sanity.
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Khaine is absolutely an asshole, I don't think anyone tries to say otherwise. But as a representation of war that's very accurate, war is horrible, brutal and terrible. War makes you do horrible things to other people and war makes people into horrible things.
 
Tobtorp said:
Khaine is absolutely an asshole, I don't think anyone tries to say otherwise. But as a representation of war that's very accurate, war is horrible, brutal and terrible. War makes you do horrible things to other people and war makes people into horrible things.
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Yes, but is that a concept worthy of respect, worship, and veneration?

Just because it exists doesn't mean we have embrace it as part of our psychological makeup.
 
Nerdasaurus Rex said:
Yes, but is that a concept worthy of respect, worship, and veneration?

Just because it exists doesn't mean we have embrace it as part of our psychological makeup.
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Boney said:
"The Cytharai represent the world as it is now. The Cadai represent what we strive to make it. To embrace one while ignoring the other leads to either depravity or derangement. So we recognize Khaine just as we recognize that the world contains violence and hatred, but anyone who pays attention to only that facet of life is doomed. It is no wonder that human worship of Him goes poorly."
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