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There was an option to have Egrimm work on enchanting the Seviroscope, which I think would be a neat thing to do instead of tossing him a random artifact to study.

That is a a fair point but I am not sure if that would be wind herding, in which case we might want to do something more than that almost failed saddle before we try to mess with Kragg's brain mats

could i interest you in some..undead.

Sure, as soon as you figure out how to change Imperial law and the perception of the entire Old World about the whole 'raising the unhallowed dead' thing. :V

I will once again point out that we don't know enough about any more non-Order magical traditions (except maybe Ice Granny's coven, not the ice witches in general, but this coven.) to make just going up to them a good idea.

Let's instead do the 'get to know' action with one of the magical Elf clans.

please?

That is a fair point, which one would you like to take on?

now that we know something is up with Pragg and we have been given the hint that Karak Varg might have stuff from the fire spire in the vault. it might be better to ask them instead.

Why not both?
*insert meme here*
 
That is a fair point, which one would you like to take on?



Why not both?
*insert meme here*
House Tindomiel

Most importantly (in my mind): is their interest in friendly relations with humans evangelical in nature?

Because that's a no go for the colleges in general and could reck the whole project if they try to use it as way to interact and preach to human magic users.
 
Because that's a no go for the colleges in general and could reck the whole project if they try to use it as way to interact and preach to human magic users.

So just to be clear, you are so concerned about the preaching to the Verenans that you would rather not deal with the Cult at all? I think that might be a bit of an overstatement when we are talking about one of the major Cults of the old world and one that is based around seeking truth and protecting obscure lore. We have so much to learn and so much to share it seems like a great pity to go 'I do not trust those priests with their preaching ways'.
 
Since others are thinking about plans for next turn here is my preliminary plan:
Obviously by dint of using the Father and recruiting the Hedgewise your plan already has my approval vote, but I do have some disagreements I want to get into:
  • I think we should dictate the Windsoak Mushroom book to Max. Consider the fact that your own plan will probably create two new paper topics (Lustrian rubbing and Ghyran nut), and neither of those will be written for at least two turns (this one and the next). In particular, note that the only real effect of studying the Lustrian rubbings is getting a new paper topic, unlike other objects that can be used somehow after being researched (such as the nut, the weapons, and the shrine(?)), so I think it's a better use of Max talents to have him write the book. That way it will also be ready in time for Panoramia's graduation to Magister (or, if she graduates this social turn, it will serve as her first published work as Magister).
  • We have three long term research trees (AV, swording, and Windherding), and over the last four turns we had an action dedicated to one of each (turn 35 advanced none of them and had studying the Golden arm as our sole backlog action). For this turn I would prefer to advance the backlog of non long term actions, with my preference being Egrimm studying the Kurgan weapons and Mathilde codifying rite of way, both of which are things we really should get around to doing. Studying the nut actually falls into this category, however...
  • I would prefer to hold off on the nut for now, at the very least wait until Panoramia is Magister (and thus has more access to the resources of the Jades). I also really feel we should codify Rite of Way already.
  • I have some reservations about the library action but let's talk more about it after we see how the Quinsberry one goes.
  • EIC action is good, but I would prefer to set up a shadow HQ in the sunken palace. Honestly my main worry is that this action leads to follow up actions and the new shiny actions means we never get around to setting up a shadow HQ. I want to work on the EIC's intelligence network already, and this is a pretty basic thing.
  • Unlike the Gambler, when turning the coin to the Father you don't need to specify which action it applies to.
We still have to see how the Ice Witch business shakes out at the end of this mini-arc, and it might be that you'll need to change the Ice Witches action if for some reason it doesn't work out (or if it works out so well that we don't need an additional action spent on it?) but all in all this is a pretty solid plan in my opinion.
 
House Tindomiel

Most importantly (in my mind): is their interest in friendly relations with humans evangelical in nature?

Because that's a no go for the colleges in general and could reck the whole project if they try to use it as way to interact and preach to human magic users.
...you ARE aware that Verena is very well represented in the colleges right?
 
So just to be clear, you are so concerned about the preaching to the Verenans that you would rather not deal with the Cult at all? I think that might be a bit of an overstatement when we are talking about one of the major Cults of the old world and one that is based around seeking truth and protecting obscure lore. We have so much to learn and so much to share it seems like a great pity to go 'I do not trust those priests with their preaching ways'.
I thank Hekarti preachers, a god most humans think is a evil elf god of dark magic, hard sell to most the bosses as on the up and up. (Exactly with the example of knaine)

And Mathy might not think their help it's worth being the one that is responsible for them if they start making moves in the colleges.
 
I thank Hekarti preachers, a god most humans think is a evil elf god of dark magic, hard sell to most the bosses as on the up and up. (Exactly with the example of knaine)

And Mathy might not think their help it's worth being the one that is responsible for them if they start making moves in the colleges.

I doubt one in a thousand people even know that Hekrati is and the elves are about as likely to preach as a tree is to fly, their religions does not work like that.
 
Hekarti is an elf goddess, and that means humans worshiping her is bad news no matter what her sphere or domain is.

That doesn't mean we should ignore her cult, however, same way we didn't ignore the cult of Vaul.
 
I doubt one in a thousand people even know that Hekrati is and the elves are about as likely to preach as a tree is to fly, their religions does not work like that.
But those one I. A thousand will be people that can knock on doors and give very bias according to important ears.

Look, I'm not saying it's the end all be all, just that I would like to know what they might want before we are at the table.
 
But those one I. A thousand will be people that can knock on doors and give very bias according to important ears.

Look, I'm not saying it's the end all be all, just that I would like to know what they might want before we are at the table.

But that is how a recruitment action works, they tell us what they want and then we say yes or no, it has been specifically asked of the GM, a recruitment action does not lock us into saying yes to any requests. It is not like the notion of saying no in a negotiation is some kind of massive social faux pas.

Look at it this way.

If we do a get to know action
-and they want us to do something we do not want to deal with we stop there and lose 1 AP in the bargain
-and they want us to do something we can manage then we still have to do another action, that is 2 AP

If we do recruit right off the bat
-and they want us to do something we do not want to deal with we say no and that is still 1 AP spent
-and they want us to do something acceptable, then we say yes and still only one AP spent so far

I know the above looks really mechanical, but it is just the easiest way to illustrate how we can choose to spend the most valuable of Mathilde's resources in character and out of character, since it impacts what the narrative looks like. Don't get me wrong if you just want to see more of Timonel I have nothing against that, but I do not think the question of what if they ask us for something unacceptable will play into this, Mathilde is a Lady Magister, the buck stops with her unless she is declaring war on someone or similar decisions
 
I expect that Dwarfs have entire realms worth of literature on how to kill them.
On killing Forest Spirits? Sure. On Apparitions? Unlikely. They don't interact much I suspect.

Hekarti is an elf goddess, and that means humans worshiping her is bad news no matter what her sphere or domain is.

That doesn't mean we should ignore her cult, however, same way we didn't ignore the cult of Vaul.
No it's not. Hekarti specifically might cause some issues, but it's not as though as worshipping Elven gods is inherently bad.
 
-[ ] Attempt to bring a non-Order magical tradition into the Waystone Project (Nordland Haléthan Hedgewise)
--[ ] COIN: The Father
Ranald gave us the Father Coin so that we could get to know his family. Immediately trying to milk it for profit without getting to know them at all actually sounds fairly ungrateful to me, bordering on repulsive tbh.

Losing the goodwill that the Coin affords us by overreaching like this is entirely plausible IMO.

-[ ] Study an artefact: Ghyran Nut with Panoramia.
I agree on spending time with Panoramia, but what makes her a good candidate to examine the Ghyran Nut? To me she seems like the worst candidate possible, since she will want the Nut to feed poor little starving halflings while we want it for politics and the magical stability of the world.
 
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I agree on spending time with Panoramia, but what makes her a good candidate to examine the Ghyran Nut? To me she seems like the worst candidate possible, since she will want the Nut to feed poor little starving halflings while we want it for politics and the magical stability of the world.
On the other hand, we trust Panoramia completely. There's no risk of her going to tell others we have us, and so of people trying to pressure it. And Panoramia isn't an idiot, I'm sure we can convince her it's more profitable as a diplomatic tool than fertiliser.
 
Ranald gave us the Father Coin so that we could get to know his family. Immediately trying to milk it for profit without getting to know them at all actually sounds fairly ungrateful to me, bordering on repulsive tbh.

Losing the goodwill that the Coin affords us by overreaching like this is entirely plausible IMO.

Er... what now? I did not even propose using the father coin at all. Also we have very little evidence that Hekrati is anything to do with Ranald's family.
 
But that is how a recruitment action works, they tell us what they want and then we say yes or no, it has been specifically asked of the GM, a recruitment action does not lock us into saying yes to any requests. It is not like the notion of saying no in a negotiation is some kind of massive social faux pas.

Look at it this way.

If we do a get to know action
-and they want us to do something we do not want to deal with we stop there and lose 1 AP in the bargain
-and they want us to do something we can manage then we still have to do another action, that is 2 AP

If we do recruit right off the bat
-and they want us to do something we do not want to deal with we say no and that is still 1 AP spent
-and they want us to do something acceptable, then we say yes and still only one AP spent so far

I know the above looks really mechanical, but it is just the easiest way to illustrate how we can choose to spend the most valuable of Mathilde's resources in character and out of character, since it impacts what the narrative looks like. Don't get me wrong if you just want to see more of Timonel I have nothing against that, but I do not think the question of what if they ask us for something unacceptable will play into this, Mathilde is a Lady Magister, the buck stops with her unless she is declaring war on someone or similar decisions
And while it fine for you to be that AP focus, I don't like doing things that don't make sense as a person just because it's mechanically efficient.

People try to get to know people before making big deals like this.

Mathy knows the dwarfs and the colleges deeply, so it made sense to go right into political talk.

Not so much for everyone else
 
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I agree on spending time with Panoramia, but what makes her a good candidate to examine the Ghyran Nut? To me she seems like the worst candidate possible, since she will want the Nut to feed poor little starving halflings while we want it for politics and the magical stability of the world.

I do not think starving is the word for that. Somehow I think rotund might be the better term for the halflings of Karag Nar. Also agreeing to study something with someone does not give them joint ownership over the thing studied, if Panoramia wants to use it for something we do not the word 'no' is still in Mathilde's vocabulary.
 
And while it fine for you to be that AP focus, I don't like doing things that don't make sense as a person just because it's mechanically efficient.

People try to get to know people before making big deals like this.

Keep in mind one AP is not just the time we pop in and the few minutes we see on screen, it is a whole month of talking. I do not think the distinction between one month and two months is that large in that regard.
 
There's no risk of her going to tell others we have us, and so of people trying to pressure it. And Panoramia isn't an idiot, I'm sure we can convince her it's more profitable as a diplomatic tool than fertiliser.
A druid could probably do a lot more with the seed than just fertilizer.
Also agreeing to study something with someone does not give them joint ownership over the thing studied, if Panoramia wants to use it for something we do not the word 'no' is still in Mathilde's vocabulary.
We gave the arm to Johann, so I don't think it's unreasonable to expect that she will ask, and refusing might bring unnecessary friction into the relationship.

Even if she logically sees the value of keeping it for politics, feelings have a tendency to not care about that. I don't believe that the benefit of secrecy even remotely outweighs the potential for trouble.
 
It's been pointed out Boney regularly and even recently, that humans worshiping elf gods go over the deep end fast.
I don't remember any discussion saying anything like that. Where did that happen?

In five thousand years there is very little the Dwarfs didn't interact with.
Except for the fact that Apparitions seem to entirely be found around casters, and the Dwarfs have been interacting with casters who are likely to have them for less than 200 years. I find it unlikely the Elves sent students who had that sort of thing happen to them to go do research with the Dwarfs, and there's no evidence the Dwarfs ever got access to the White Tower or similar instituions on Ulthuan. All the people who would have been vulnerable to that sort of thing were likely kept well away from meeting Dwarfs as their training was incomplete.
 
I don't remember any discussion saying anything like that. Where did that happen?


Except for the fact that Apparitions seem to entirely be found around casters, and the Dwarfs have been interacting with casters who are likely to have them for less than 200 years. I find it unlikely the Elves sent students who had that sort of thing happen to them to go do research with the Dwarfs, and there's no evidence the Dwarfs ever got access to the White Tower or similar instituions on Ulthuan. All the people who would have been vulnerable to that sort of thing were likely kept well away from meeting Dwarfs as their training was incomplete.
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Elves worship all of their Gods as different aspects of themselves, with more focus on those that represent where they devote most of their attention but overall rather rounded. In the Old World, humans are a lot more all-in on one chosen God, with only situational deference shown to the others. This means that when humans pick up the worship of an Elven God without any changes made to the strictures or doctrines or texts to account for the difference in how they worship, things can get rather intense and unpleasant even when it's a 'good' God, and can get downright horrendous with the nastier ones. So it's standard practice to not have texts on Elven Gods available to the general public.
 
We gave the arm to Johann, so I don't think it's unreasonable to expect that she will ask, and refusing might bring unnecessary friction into the relationship.

Even if she logically sees the value of keeping it for politics, feelings have a tendency to not care about that. I don't believe that the benefit of secrecy even remotely outweighs the potential for trouble.

We gave the arm to Johann after a second vote and frankly I think you do Panoramia a disfavor by painting as some sort of irrational actor who would try to leverage her feelings and relationships to get the Ghyan nut for nebulous 'halfling purposes'. It feels a pit like trying to build a tower of assumptions out of one brick.
 
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