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Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest

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IronFist said:
If you found a priest that accepts that what they do is in anyway similar to magic, and if that miracle wielding priests interacts with the energy of their god in the same way a wizard interacts with their wind.

But those are two very big "ifs".
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It honestly seems like something that would work better as priests leveraging wizards rather than wizards teaching priests. If we assume that gods are big enough to calculate big, subtle spells as well as stuff like healing, then having them do a divine spell that relies on being fed winds seems a better bet.

Interestingly enough, windherder becomes very relevant as more winds are added, to allow them to feed into the same person without tangling into dhar.
 
K von Carstein said:
What do you mean by that?🤔
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DragonParadox said:
A running joke that has mutated many many times about what is or is not an appropriate spell suggestion (when you can replace the subject of a spell with a burrito and the logic still works than it is not admissible). In this case I suspect that the idea is 'if we cannot magic up a burrito than we can make one via political power as GM'
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Behold, Burrito Madness.
 
There is only one divine caster that I think would in any way be somewhat receptive to experimentation with Mathilde, and even that would be questionable. I'm talking about Heidi.

I think in general trying to discuss such heretical things as Magic and Divine coming from the same source with a priest is more likely to end in absolute outrage as the Priest declares Mathilde a blasphemer in most cases. Chances are we wouldn't get burned for just making a suggestion, and Mathilde isn't brazen enough to do it blatantly, but it's a failing proposition with most priests. Ranald is a bit different though, being generally more amused by Mathilde's antics than anything. Even still he warned Mathilde to not look at/study him directly, so even he has limits to what he will allow, and it's not like he super clearly defined them either.

Considering divine casters Mathilde knows, Kasmir is a no go. Mathilde hates Sigmar and he's probably an extreme enough god he would Smite them without question for experimentation, assuming Kasmir even goes along with it which I don't think he will. He's atypical but he's still a Sigmarite Priest. Heideck is a wild card and we don't know him well enough. Heidi is the only possibility that comes to mind, and hell we already saw an example of two magics entertwiing in her body. Mathilde even straight up says "if those two energies were Winds, they would curdle into Dhar". It should be noted however, that while Heidi has Shallya's magical signature entwined in her soul, it's most likely just the effect of the ritual to make her younger and therefore a passive effect. There could be a whole world of difference between active and passive effects when it comes to the gods.

There are a few mitigating factors to this however. One, nobody knows Heidi is a Divine Caster except Mathilde and Ranald. If Mathilde tried experimenting with her, she would have to drag her to a laboratory or work with her in private for long, extended periods of time that likely disrupt Heidi's very busy schedule. And then people are going to start asking questions about this Grey Wizard that hangs out so frequently with Heidi. Coming in and out for social visits is one thing, performing extensive experimentation is another. Next thing you know you start the next Altdorf scandal.
 
Heidi's a caster? I don't remember anything about it. She's certainly favored by Ranald and has a whole bunch of fortuitous breaks funneled her way, but I don't remember any divine magic being explicitly used by her.
 
silentorphan said:
Heidi's a caster? I don't remember anything about it. She's certainly favored by Ranald and has a whole bunch of fortuitous breaks funneled her way, but I don't remember any divine magic being explicitly used by her.
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Here you go:
Boney said:
You observe her very carefully as you approach, with more senses than even most Wizards could boast. Your impression from years earlier is unchanged, she's definitely no Vampire, but there are hints of energies to her that definitely aren't normal. Two types of energies, actually, swirling around each other in a way sure to result in Dhar if they were the Winds you were familiar with. But these are even more exotic; they have the tang of the Divine, one very familiar, one not.
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Boney said:
She waves a hand in what most would take to be a dismissive gesture, but you can faintly see the energies radiating off it and encompassing the room.
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Boney said:
But she bit off more than she could chew too, and it just so happened that the landlady was the hoarder type and left several wooden stakes and a vial of holy water in the nightstand - or at least, it just so happened after I gave probability a few good kicks in the ribs.
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She waves her hand and creates a field of silence to shut out eavesdropping, and she specifically says she "gives probability a few kicks in the ribs" not that Ranald gave it to her. She's a divine caster.
 
I honestly think most priests would go for it phrased as 'your god demonstrating mastery over the magics of wizards', but they might read between the lines and see us getting curious about the guts of reality...
 
Codex said:
I think in general trying to discuss such heretical things as Magic and Divine coming from the same source with a priest is more likely to end in absolute outrage as the Priest declares Mathilde a blasphemer in most cases.
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Priests of Verana would likely be on board woth experimentation since she's all about knowledge.


Codex said:
Coming in and out for social visits is one thing, performing extensive experimentation is another. Next thing you know you start the next Altdorf scandal
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I mean whilst an affair is an explanation the more likely explanation courtiers would jump at is that Heidi and Mathilde are coordinating high level intelligence or diplomacy (possibly whilst also having an affair).
 
I guess I'll just point out a running background thing from my reread for DL in regards to Heidi actually
Boney said:
A guard on the door is staring intently down the corridor in the way opposite to you, but that he keeps glancing back in your direction and then trying to act like he wasn't makes it clear he's not the most surreptitious sort. You show him mercy and slip through the door he was supposedly watching, and roll your eyes at the sigh of relief as the guard resumes his normal posture where both ends of the corridor are visible to him.
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First, I found this quite funny. This guard is so bad at keeping secrets I don't think he'll be able to keep it to himself that he saw a Grey Wizard entering the Empress' room.
Boney said:
While the Empress is surrounded by a thick swarm of priestesses, midwives, ladies-in-waiting, and various other courtly hangers-on as the projected day of birth approaches, that she greets you like an old friend combines with the reputation of the Grey College to ensure that they all step very lightly around you. The constant internecine status conflicts in the Imperial Court are well known, and you're not here to start fighting in them, you're just here to see that your oldest friend's biggest gamble continues to go smoothly.
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Boney said:
You don't witness the birth itself, though you're right there with Heidi's hand trying in vain to crush yours through Aethyric Armour; the entire business is genteelly screened off with a series of curtains, some seemingly designed specifically for this.
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Boney said:
"I'd say so." You smile as a thought occurs to you. "How about Mandred?"

She bites her lip. "The Skavenslayer? Saved and united the Empire... I like it."

The child stirs slightly as his tiny shirt is unbuttoned, and you prick a forefinger with a shadowchisel and draw a cross in blood above his heart. "Ranald greets you, Mandred. May this world bring you joy, and may you bring joy to this world."
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I admit that my first thought upon rereading this chapter is "Shouldn't Luitpold be doing this?". Mathilde is getting her hands crushed and helped name Mandred (although I don't think anyone knows that she named him) while Luitpold is nowhere to be seen. I guess he's busy or something, but man. Missing your wife's birth.
Boney said:
Some of the crowd around her hold drinks and light snacks for their mistress, but others hold paper and slates, and every now and then one is dispatched to send or retrieve a document for some obscure purpose. Heidi is not resting on her laurels, and though her official station begins and ends with the creation of the heir that is currently charging around the grass waving a wooden sword at imaginary foes, the position can allow immense amounts of unofficial influence, and Heidi appears to be taking full advantage.

As you approach, a wave of nudges spreads through the small crowd and you find yourself facing an array of speculative looks. They part at your approach, and Heidi makes a delighted noise and unceremoniously unseats the previous favoured who had been sitting beside her on the bench. A rapid-fire series of orders scatters the coterie with a series of tasks, including fetching drinks and snacks for you, and the two of you are very quickly left alone. "So," she says with a smile, "I hear you're making a wave or two amongst the Colleges."
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I imagine the people surrounding her aren't particularly pleased with how they get kicked out every time Mathilde comes in. This is actually brought up later by Mathilde.
Boney said:
Then that plan came crashing down with a stage-whisper that could have drowned out a trumpet: "Oh, I quite recall her from my time with the Empress!"

As almost every head in the room swivels as one, you're reminded of some of the messier times you've assassinated a Warboss. You barely have time to sigh in resignation as the unstoppable horde of determined status-seekers descends upon you.
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Another reason to be relieved we're not doing court politics in Altdorf, this would be a constant thing. Mathilde isn't particularly good at dealing with hanger ons and courtier status seekers.
Boney said:
The Laurel's Rest is one of the most expensive and exclusive hostels in Altdorf, and one would expect that even a Lord Magister would have to marshal some resources to finagle their way in. If the ladies-in-waiting who accompany the Empress everywhere are harbouring any sort of grudge that you'd somehow managed to slip effortlessly into the position of the Empress' confidante, they might have expected that this is where you'd get your comeuppance. If so, they shall have to live with disappointment, as the Greatsword bodyguard are used to you, the doorman is trivial to slip by, and when your presence is noticed, it's by the Halfling kitchen overseers who take it in turns to shake you by the hand and bombard you with questions about goings-on in Karak Eight Peaks, where they apparently have kin. When you manage to extricate yourself, you slip into a chair across from Heidi and conceal a smirk as the hangers-on are dismissed to the other side of the room.
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Yet again, the courtiers get dismissed when Mathilde comes in. I imagine if we were a mainstay in Altdorf we'd have to deal with plenty of petty gossip and stupid rumors.

The idea that Mathilde has a whole group of irritated nobility that resent her and she barely pays attention to them is quite amusing actually.
 
Codex said:
I admit that my first thought upon rereading this chapter is "Shouldn't Luitpold be doing this?". Mathilde is getting her hands crushed and helped name Mandred (although I don't think anyone knows that she named him) while Luitpold is nowhere to be seen. I guess he's busy or something, but man. Missing your wife's birth.
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I thought that in medieval times, the husband normally isn't in the same room when she's giving birth. The only thing that really signals that he's busy is that the Emperor wasn't there afterward, when Mathilde and Heidi named and baptized the baby.
 
Codex said:
I admit that my first thought upon rereading this chapter is "Shouldn't Luitpold be doing this?". Mathilde is getting her hands crushed and helped name Mandred (although I don't think anyone knows that she named him) while Luitpold is nowhere to be seen. I guess he's busy or something, but man. Missing your wife's birth.
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The Cults of Taal and Rhya teach that there are Men's Secrets and Women's Secrets, and that childbirth is part of the latter category, so no man should be present unless absolutely necessary.
 
silentorphan said:
The only thing that really signals that he's busy is that the Emperor wasn't there afterward, when Mathilde and Heidi named and baptized the baby.
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I mean, that's probably intentional, no? Doubt Luitpold would be pleased that his wife and one of his Magisters went and dedicated his heir to a god before the proper time, and to Ranald at that.
 
Boney said:
A lot of Dwarves are dead. Many of them respected Elders from powerful Guilds. Elders from Karaz-a-Karak, on their way home from assisting Karak Eight Peaks, while travelling on Barak Varr's ship on Barak Varr's river, while engaged in a peaceful mission of reconstruction. Once news of this spreads, we're going to be about a shaved beard away from the greatest mobilization of the Karaz Ankor in four thousand years.
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While looking for quotes from Boney because I remember him saying that Barak Varr's ships are the only ones capable of moving upstream of the Blood River, which I can't seem to find for some reason, I came across this.

I'm so glad Mathilde risked her life to save 312 dwarves. A lot of Dwarves died still, but I think it moved the problem from "almost War of the Beard" bad to "patiently analyse the evidence, find out the culprit, obliterate them".
 
Codex said:
First, I found this quite funny. This guard is so bad at keeping secrets I don't think he'll be able to keep it to himself that he saw a Grey Wizard entering the Empress' room.
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To be fair, there's a difference between keeping secrets (mostly not blabbing) and being subtle/acting. I doubt he's going to talk, that would be a serious fuckup in security.
Codex said:
I admit that my first thought upon rereading this chapter is "Shouldn't Luitpold be doing this?". Mathilde is getting her hands crushed and helped name Mandred (although I don't think anyone knows that she named him) while Luitpold is nowhere to be seen. I guess he's busy or something, but man. Missing your wife's birth.
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There is a reason she was one of the more popular characters in the romance vote.
 
Codex said:
While looking for quotes from Boney because I remember him saying that Barak Varr's ships are the only ones capable of moving upstream of the Blood River, which I can't seem to find for some reason, I came across this.

I'm so glad Mathilde risked her life to save 312 dwarves. A lot of Dwarves died still, but I think it moved the problem from "almost War of the Beard" bad to "patiently analyse the evidence, find out the culprit, obliterate them".
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Thorgrim (and Belegar) are probably too canny to jump in beards first before finding the culprit.

All those Dawi dying would have ended the Orkal and general reclamation process on a sour note - which even with Vlag getting recovered would have still left a ligering bitterness.

As it is not only did Mathilde mend some bridges between Karak Eight Peaks and Karaz-a-Karak but her rescuing the 312 dwarfs might have pushed Thorgrim over the top into switching from Slayer mode - and also into recognising Mathilde as a dwarf.

Still expecting an epic reaction from the Karaz Ankor when the culprit is found - just one made by much happier and vastly less grim dwarfs.




BurnNote said:
There is a reason she was one of the more popular characters in the romance vote.
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She got outstripped by quite a few people - the really surprising thing is that she did very well by comparison to any dwarf.
 
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