- Location
- Leeds
Can we bind an apparition to bring us delicious Burritos from a local restaurant? If we bind enough we could franchise a delivery service
Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest
- Thread starter Boney
- Start date
- Fantasy Users' Choice!
-
- Tags
- warhammer warhammer fantasy fantasy be gay do crimes (gay) female protagonist pansexual protagonist ck2 quest divided loyalties mountain vietnam ranald is real this is a dwarf quest (dwarfs) this is maybe an elf quest this is not a vampire quest this is not an empire quest try it and find out open voting
Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
- Location
- Manchester, UK
- Pronouns
- He/They
I'd take it as the people writing the core not thinking it through, and those writing Realms of Sorcery giving the issue a second look and going "Yeah, no."
Either that or it's meant to be 1 in 10 of those with remarkable talent, rather than 1 in 10,000 of those with remarkable talent, and someone slipped up in the editing process.
you know, While i'm not sure how it will develop, getting all our income ducks in a row will be something we need to do in the near future.
I'm not actually sure we will be getting an income as the head of the Waystone project.
I'm assuming most funding will come from the colleges, empire and the Elves.
but how much of that will be goods and resources, and how much of that will be coin to spend as needed is up in the air.
then we have salaries, the people we want will all be highly skilled and so expect good pay for those skills.
Hopefully, the Elves will pay for their own people, but the gold boys and the runesmith(lord) will need to be paid first. (what is the expected pay for a Ruresmith, master Runesmith or Runelord? 2ed doest really say. but I would assume a lot with how much dwarfs value their skills.)
then we got to pay any of the other groups that might or might not join, from hedgewise to damsels.
the researchers are going to be a income sink if themsleves.
then we got to think about ingredients, expeditions to waystones or dungeons, bribes, security and armed forces for when on expeditions, etc etc
its the problem for every start-up really, the boss is the last one to get paid until things hit a point.
I'm not actually sure we will be getting an income as the head of the Waystone project.
I'm assuming most funding will come from the colleges, empire and the Elves.
but how much of that will be goods and resources, and how much of that will be coin to spend as needed is up in the air.
then we have salaries, the people we want will all be highly skilled and so expect good pay for those skills.
Hopefully, the Elves will pay for their own people, but the gold boys and the runesmith(lord) will need to be paid first. (what is the expected pay for a Ruresmith, master Runesmith or Runelord? 2ed doest really say. but I would assume a lot with how much dwarfs value their skills.)
then we got to pay any of the other groups that might or might not join, from hedgewise to damsels.
the researchers are going to be a income sink if themsleves.
then we got to think about ingredients, expeditions to waystones or dungeons, bribes, security and armed forces for when on expeditions, etc etc
its the problem for every start-up really, the boss is the last one to get paid until things hit a point.
- Location
- Utrecht
A runelord would have the same pay Mathilde got as a Grand Master.
- Location
- Denial
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Does the staff turner position draw a salary? Probably not worth the time investment but it could be a somewhat interesting way to draw in a steady income, and it would give a chance to develop Mathildes staffmaking skills. Especially if we find out we can use windherder to improve them.
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mathilde was a 'loremaster' in dwarf 'pay scales' though, not a runesmith.
I'm not sure Loremasters get the same pay as runesmiths...
- Location
- Utrecht
Iirc there were three levels of pay.
1) Journeyman
2) Master
3) Grandmaster
Runesmiths would be masters, and Runelords would be grandmasters.
But, Like Mathilde the Loremaster got a subsidy for books, A Runesmith would probably be paid for expenses incurred while on the job (i.e. cost of reagents, materials, etc). Which given the setting are roughly as expensive as the stuff Mathilde was buying.
pucflek
Verified simpleton
- Location
- Czech Republic
Imma be real with you chief, i worked in manufacture and its not fun
I think Runelords occupy a really weird spot where they might be getting the salary but its more out of pride than actual need to be paid, because noone but a great dwarf king can actually afford the real Runelord rates. Each and every runelord is basically Supreme Patriarch, equal to a king of hold in status. Now its not specified which hold, and some of them are quite insignificant, but OTOH, i don't think there are any kings that would actually try to order around Kragg or Thorek, including even Thorgrim.
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- Location
- Denial
- Pronouns
- She/Her
I'm imagining it as more a craftswoman receiving occasional custom orders, tailoring the staff to fit the wizard. I have no idea how often magisters get promoted though, if it is too common that would easily become not feasible as a quest mechanic.Imma be real with you chief, i worked in manufacture and its not fun
pucflek
Verified simpleton
- Location
- Czech Republic
Considering the fact that literally noone decided to occupy the position in decades, it has to be a massive pain in the ass, on top of making staffs just not being that fun (likely very corelated).
Also i think each college has upwards of 50+ magisters iirc? So total of 500 magisters at least, just about at any given time. Lot of who probably don't have staffs and would be interested because they joined after the staff turner position was left fallow, even if some of the more industrious ones made their own like Mathilde.
- Location
- Utrecht
Oh yeah, it's definitely a formality, especially with the likes of Kragg and Thorek. They're probably wealthy enough that getting a few hundred more gold is not material anymore.
You have to pay them like a grandmaster because that's the bare minimum that's socially acceptable for a Dwarf of their standing.
If Runed objects made by a Runelord are effectively priceless, how do you put a price on their time?
Although, with this reasoning, one still has to to figure out how one gets to that point. I mean, at a certain point in time, they must have needed to charge money to get that Rich.
- Location
- Earth
Also Melkoth's Battlemages keep breaking theirs.
- Location
- Denial
- Pronouns
- She/Her
I thought it was a position solely serving the grey college, otherwise I have to imagine it would be a position in the golds. If we assume each college has their own turner it becomes a lot more reasonable for the position to be vacant since there is only a pool of 50 magisters, and in the greys where their wizards are encouraged to be useful many simply wont have the time amidst their other duties. You need someone who has both the time and the talents to fill the role. Honestly for 50 magisters it sounds doable for Mathilde to fill the role, the main issue really is that I can't see it winning against all the other stuff competing for our AP.
- Location
- Utrecht
If anything i'd think it would be the Bright college. With Adela crafting a partial staff as a Journeywoman, and Tarnus having crafted the Staff of Volans, they seem to have the strongest staff crafting tradition.
NeonLights
Formerly Reliable_2IC
- Location
- In shambles
If money ever becomes a problem, we could always get the EIC into banking.......
- Location
- Finland
Ofcourse not, that would be just silly.
It poops salt and spits grains.
It also pisses beer.
- Location
- Greece
I have read xianxia with less absurd numbers. Most of them go for one in a hundred.
And absurd numbers are xianxia's thing.
And the population of their worlds rarely fall below a trillion, (often, that is just a country, and often, they have multiple worlds each) so while they are overinflated at least the math checks out.
That sounds like it must be the source of the confusion. It's even worse than I thought. Those numbers are ridiculous even before you factor in canon's ridiculously low population levels.
- Location
- UK
Is being a Battle Wizard ridiculously hazardous with crazy huge turnovers also a canon thing? I'm beginning to wonder if 'canon' WHF even has Battle Wizards...
pucflek
Verified simpleton
- Location
- Czech Republic
It does. It doesn't have a huge turnover because they are rarely made to fight, but their casting can get gnarly in a way normal wizard's doesn't usually.
NSMS
Probably evil, unfortunately.
- Location
- A rapidly widening tear in the fabric of reality
News at Eleven: Fantasy Writers Lack a Sense of Scale!
Though seriously, even the biggest hack should have realised that powerful battle mages being 1-in-10 billion would mean even on present day Earth we wouldn't have one, let alone a medieval equivalent...
ShyPerson
Guardian of the dead’s final rest.
- Location
- Sweden
- Pronouns
- Him/He
It's a 2nd edition RPG thing, invented to differentiate the wizards players act as and the wizards in the tactical game. And the RPG was very generous with staking negative afflictions on the players.
It is, though the canonical RPG depiction of them has them being a step up from Lord Magister. I decided that doesn't make sense with how lethal Battle Magic is described as being to the user and how those that specialize in it aren't allowed to mingle with polite society, so I made it a separate career track instead. Otherwise there'd be only single digits of Battle Wizards total in the Empire at any given time.
deathofrats0808
Don’t think of it as dying; just as leaving early
- Location
- Earth
Technically it would mean modern day Earth would likely have one, but it wouldn't be unexpected not to find one.
Not exactly. The term predates 2e significantly, first turning up (as far as I can find) in the Empire's 4th Edition Army Book. Even Battle Wizards being Wizards of a particular caliber, rather than just Wizards who are trained for war is a distinction from earlier than 2e. It's only the difference in power and of number that was established by 2e. Rather poorly as it turns out.
Turn 34 Social - 2486.5 - Part 3
[*] Panoramia, to properly finishing catching up with her.
[+] The Wizards of Karak Eight Peaks (locked in)
[+] Social interaction initiated by someone else (locked in)
[+] The Wizards of Karak Eight Peaks (locked in)
[+] Social interaction initiated by someone else (locked in)
Panoramia once boasted to you of how indolent her winters were, but with her spending more and more time at your abode, you've gotten to see it for yourself and you're starting to think she was less than honest. Sure, she's not exactly energetic in the colder months, but wherever she's lazing seems to accrete untidy piles of notes and reference materials, and though she often looks like she's napping you can tell by her breathing that she's still awake, just deep in concentration. Her winters are nowhere near as frittered away as she implied, even if she's not trudging around in the dirt during them. It does make her very easy company when you're engaged in your own research. Many days pass in comfortable silence broken only by the rustling of pages, scratching of quills, and crackling of the fire.
"What was Karak Vlag eating all that time?" she asks suddenly one day, and you look up from your own reading to see her frowning curiously out at you through the gap between her book and the blanket she's currently draped in.
"Stonebread and mushrooms, I gather. Dwarves don't like to grow crops underground, but they can if they must."
"Why don't they like it? It seems like it would be right up their alley."
"The Farmers and Herders Guild used to have strains of crops that could grow underground, but most of the Guild and their crops were wiped out in the Time of Woes. So nowadays growing underground requires either a series of mirrors and a new entrance to defend to bring in sunlight, or a Runesmith spending time on illuminating Runes, which is something that isn't directly defending the Karak. Growing and herding on the mountainsides can be kept entirely in-guild for the Karaks that still have Clans dedicated to it, or done by Brewers and Rangers for those that don't. Or they can trade. A big part of the Silver Age was the alliance with Sigmar proving that humans were reliable enough to depend upon to supply foods."
She frowns. "We are?"
"Well, when they're buying it with Dwarven gold and goods, we are."
"What about the one down south? Kazrik's hold?"
"Karak Azul? They're the exception. They took in most of the survivors from here and Karak Drazh and Karak Izril and they didn't have anyone nearby to trade with, so they've got Clans dedicated to both the old ways and the new, which is enough to be self-sufficient."
"Will the other Holds be learning from them, now that they have access to them?"
You shake your head. "Probably not."
"Why not? They're Dwarves. I thought being self-sufficient is their thing."
You shake your head again. "Most Dwarves would rather master a highly-respected craft than be forced by necessity to learn a less-respected one. And farming is one of those. Even those from Clans dedicated to farming prefer to grow for the Brewers and only make bread from imported grains - brewing is one of Valaya's spheres, after all, so that's seen as 'better'."
Her frown deepens. "They don't respect farmers? I've never gotten that impression from them."
"They don't respect Dwarven farmers. There's no Ancestor God of Farming, so if you are farming, you're doing something their Ancestor Gods didn't consider important. Humans have Rhya and the Halflings have Esmerelda-"
"No, she's for cooking and feeding. Agriculture is Josias."
"Right, so humans and Halflings are following the example put down by what the Dwarves see as our own Ancestor Gods. Just as the Elves were with Isha, back when the Dwarves were trading with them - which was right from the start, Grimnir and Caledor Dragontamer set the foundations for that alliance during the Coming of Chaos. Then after the War of the Beard, they start trading with humans instead - Nehekhara and early Tilea and Mourkhain and, eventually, the Empire. So subsistence farming became associated with their dark age, and they prefer to trade for food and farm for brewing feedstock. They see that as the ideal, and consider turning Dwarf-grown grain into food instead of beer wasteful."
She considers that for a while. "Didn't you say Karak Azul seemed like the healthiest of the Old Holds?"
"That sounds like something I'd say."
"So they're happier than the other Old Holds, which are doing 'better' by Dwarf standards but are still miserable, and you said Karak Vlag seemed in good spirits despite their circumstances."
You nod. "My theory is that it's an immediacy thing. If there's an enemy right in front of them that they're thwarting, they focus on that instead of the wider circumstances."
"What if it's a diet thing? You remember the slime I was studying? From the Skaven?" You nod. "The animals that eat it seem to be in perfect health physically, but they become jittery and more prone to fighting, especially over food. What if the Dwarves have a similar problem with their diet?"
You frown at that. "Well, the Karak Vlag Dwarves - well, the one of them I saw, anyway - was much thinner than most Dwarves I've seen. And Karak Azul Dwarves tend to be leaner as well. If the diet they see as a sign of success is failing them in some way..." You shake your head. "No, that doesn't make sense. The Young Holds have the same diet, and they don't have the same malaise."
"Perhaps not exactly the same," Panoramia says thoughtfully, looking about herself, and then shifting in place until an arm makes its way out of the blankets to pick up a quill.
"Looking for a new project?" you ask curiously.
"The Eastern Valley will still need me to be on hand for some time, but it's getting to the point where it's reactive, rather than proactive. Even if we start turning the Caldera into pasture as well, that will be much simpler than making actual cropland. There's been some interest in the Order of challenging the humoral theory as a way to undermine the Elementalists, so if there's some sort of case study to be had amongst the Dwarves, it could be seen very positively."
You give her a considering look. "Thinking of rebuilding bridges?"
She sighs. "Maybe. I've been thinking of finally trying for graduation - my feelings on the whole Earth Mother situation hasn't changed but I'd be okay with swearing oaths to the abstract concept of the natural cycle of life embodied in the Jade Wind that just happens to have the label of 'Earth Mother', which is apparently seen as acceptable."
"If you're willing, I think you absolutely should. You're already treated as a Magister in every meaningful way here, so you deserve the official recognition."
She smiles at you, and you smile back.
---
"Behold!" you say, pulling the sheet off the finished painting with a flourish. The other Wizards lean in to examine it.
"Why am I sleeveless?" Johann asks, looking at the lovingly detailed biceps on display. Well, not quite looking, but still seeing. You had the artist use a different metal as a base for each pigment.
You shrug. "Artistic license, I assume."
"Probably the same reason I was given so many muscles," Maximilian says, looking at his own representation.
You shake your head amusedly. "Max, you're a blacksmith. A blacksmith studying under a Dwarf. If anything, he understated it."
"Is that a Pistolier cuirass?" Hubert asks. "Why would I be wearing that?"
"Am I really that tall? And looming?" Gretel asks.
"At least he got the marks of rank correct," Adela notes. "Non-Wizards usually don't."
You smile and sit back as the Wizards each nitpick their own depictions. The artist might have taken a few liberties, but you feel like he managed to capture the essence of the Wizards quite well. "Well," you say after giving them enough time to get it out of their systems, "my main concern was losing some of us to the Expedition, but this will still serve as a welcome memento of our time together. As I'm stepping down as Loremaster of Karak Eight Peaks, I will no longer be responsible for Wizard-wrangling, and I would expect that my replacement would be rather more hands-off with us all. So this may be the last time we're all officially gathered in one place."
"Why are you stepping down?" Hubert asks with a frown.
"Because I can do more good elsewhere. There's an opportunity for a joint research project with Laurelorn, and whatever the actual results of the research end up being, normalizing relationships with Laurelorn could defuse a lot of tension back home. I won't be disappearing from Karak Eight Peaks entirely, though - my home and my friends and several of my ongoing projects are still here. Johann and Max will be joining me in Laurelorn, and I know Panoramia is continuing on with the Halflings, but I'd like to know where our Journeymanlings see themselves in the years to come."
"With the Winter Wolves," Hubert says immediately. "If King Belegar decides he no longer requires my services as an envoy, then I'll join their ranks proper."
"Are you giving any thought to promotion?" you ask gently.
"No," is his only response.
You nod. "Very well. Gretel?"
"The Besiegers will be active around here for the foreseeable future," she says. "There's always work protecting caravans, and Barak Varr has us on retainer for some ideas they have in the Border Princes. And I've heard rumours of Nehekharan tombs in the area, if I do manage to track them down then a study of them would be of great interest to the Order."
"You be careful with them. They tend to be touchy about their treasures."
She nods. "Of course."
"Adela?"
"The Order is always interested in building good relationships with components of the Empire's military, so they're giving me a stipend to continue my work with the Gunnery School here."
"I can see why having a resident Bright Wizard might be useful for an organization dedicated to the creative application of explosions." You look around the circle of Wizards. "I'm glad you'll all be sticking around. My door will always be open to any of you."
---
"I have investigated further the stone-folk you live amongst," Cython says conversationally, delicately lowering a tome onto a nearby pile.
"Oh?" you ask, looking up from your own pile. You do a lot of reading and you're always looking for ways to do so while also accomplishing something else, and building a rapport with the Karak's largest and most dangerous neighbour is as good a cause as any. That is why you had a room built into your penthouse that was conveniently accessible and large enough to be comfortable for it, and regularly transfer sections of your library on the topics it expresses an interest over to that room.
"They remind me in some ways of my tamed, Windless cousins, hidden away underground and pining for their long-gone glory days as they are slowly eroded by the nature of the world. But they do not deny themselves the embrace of the Winds out of overweening pride, but because their essence completely precludes doing so. And even then they have done as much as they possibly can to harness the Winds with their Runes. I find myself admiring their endurance and artifice, and wondering if I would be capable of such if the Winds were denied to me, or if I would merely slumber away the millennia underground until oblivion claimed me." Cython shakes its head. "I had wondered why someone who had attuned themselves so adequately to a Wind would choose to spend their years in the service of such creatures. I shall do so no longer."
You smile up at it. "I'm glad you've reconsidered them. They can be very reliable neighbours."
"That also explains why they did not fit the model of the Elves. They rebelled against their Gods, and fashioned those that led the rebellion into their new pantheon. Investigating those beings directly might lead to useful insight on the nature of the Divine, but I doubt they would welcome such direct study, and in any case they present an entirely different riddle to the one that occupies me."
"What leads you to the conclusion that they rebelled against their gods, rather than not having any in the first place?"
It cocks its head. "An interesting point," it says after a while. "It could be that... no, there are the splinter faction in the east. Unless... where did they find their God?"
"They don't exactly proselytise about Him, but what little we know is that they encountered Hashut at Uzkulak, when they were trying to shelter from the Coming of Chaos in insufficiently-deep tunnels."
"So did He go to them, or did they go to Him? Either way..." It hums a low, reverberating tone. "I will have to investigate further, but my impression has been that the Dwarves are rather religiously monolithic. Only one major schism in a long history, and the schismatics have been equally tightly bound to their new patron. That suggests that some property of the Dwarves prevents them from being either attracted or attractive to most, but not all, Gods. Even those that had the attention of the Lord of Excess took a remarkable amount of effort to subdue. You theorized that their imitation of their holy warriors was to make a mockery of them, but I wonder if that was required to make any progress at all with them. Either as trickery, or as imitation."
"You've read my papers?"
It nods. "I greatly enjoyed the one about the inability of the Shartak to adapt to Azyr."
"So maybe... what, Dwarves are just as incompatible with the Divine as they are with the Arcane? Which makes them more difficult to convert?"
"More difficult, or less beneficial, or both. But that raises a question in itself."
"What makes Hashut different?"
"Precisely. The Ancestor Gods are easy - they started as Dwarves, and ascended. Or perhaps descended. Did Hashut? Or is there some other mechanism at play?" It hums again, lowering its head to run an eye over the titles of the stacked books. "Are there any other species with their own unshared pantheons?"
"Well, yes. The Halflings." It turns its eye to give you a searching look. "Like humans, but shorter. You must have seen them, they're inhabiting the Eastern Valley, among the farmlands."
"I had simply assumed you used your young to tend the fields. They are a distinct species?" You nod. "Where did they come from?"
"We don't know, they've been living among us for as far back as written history goes. They came west with the tribes that eventually formed the Empire."
"And their Gods? Do they conform to the usual archetypes?"
"I'm not all that familiar with them, I'll have to borrow some research materials for you. But I do know that their main Goddess, Esmerelda, is the Goddess of Food and Hearth, which seems more similar to Valaya than Rhya or Isha - especially since they have a separate, masculine God of Farming, Josias."
"Are they notably resistant to magic?"
You frown in thought. "Perhaps. They produce Wizards only very rarely, and I remember hearing rumours as a child that they're resistant to mutation, though it was framed as being because they're already mutants." You think further. "There's Ogres, too. I've only read about them, but they supposedly only rarely serve Chaos, and most of them instead worship some sort of God of Eating called the Great Maw. I've got some books on their society, mostly from when the Dwarves were expanding into the mountains they inhabit."
"There is a greater variety of species here than in the west," it notes.
"Simple geography, perhaps? Less formidable natural barriers to stop the spread of species. Dwarves are from the south and Ogres from the east, after all."
"Perhaps," it says thoughtfully.
---
Library Purchases
Budget: 600gc for this turn. Anything not spent will not accumulate.
[ ] [LIBRARY] No purchase.
[ ] [LIBRARY] Write-in.
Dwarf Favour Purchases
Aethyric Vitae can be spent instead of favour at an exchange rate of 3 favour per gallon; for Rune-related purchases, this will also guarantee the cooperation of Runelords who may otherwise be disinterested. To use this, simply add 'paid by Vitae' or similar to an item you are voting for.
[ ] [DWARF] No purchase.
[ ] [DWARF] Write-in.
College Favour Purchases
[ ] [COLLEGE] No purchase.
[ ] [COLLEGE] Write-in.
Other Purchases
[ ] [PURCHASE] No purchase.
[ ] [PURCHASE] Write-in.
- There will be a twelve hour moratorium, because it's been a while since the last update and a while since the last purchase vote.
- Though Mathilde is leaving the role of Loremaster, the Great Library will play a similar role in future turns, so this shouldn't be seen as a 'last chance' to acquire books on someone else's dime. You get twice as much because there was no purchase round for Turn 33.
- Mathilde will be able to borrow enough books on and from Halflings through Panoramia to satisfy Cython's curiosity, and will do so automatically.
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