Warhammer Fantasy: A Dynasty of Dynamic Alcoholism

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I see a lot of hints i this chaoter that the asur in the warband wants to leave the rest behind, and Sadrina is doing a lot of work to prevent that from happening.
With that in mind I believe it is unwise to help the siege. That would further fray the party cohesion.
 
The siege of the Athari has tightened, giving the besiegers a chance to tighten their outward lines in turn. Protecting against would be siege breakers from outside is siegecraft 101 - hitting them now that it's entered an organised, slow phase rather than when they were still trying to take the temple by storm will be a much tougher proposition. Also to be frank, it's a center for Druchii resistance to Alyssa - if her enemies aren't going to rally and make a move there themselves then there's no point in us doing it.

Arenas and food are still good, strategic choices but I'm thinking anchor stone complex right now. They must be reinforcing all the good targets where we can build our strength further after the recent raids and now that they're paying attention to our force as a factor in its own right. That draws strength from elsewhere. An anchor stone has been hit before but not by our style of assault so the odds are the defenses there will not be as set up for us as they would be at the other types of target. Hitting a complex will force Alyssa to beef up the defenses at all of the anchor stones in response - which thins the opposition when we go back for food or reinforcements.

Finally, the complexes are where we're most likely to catch a sorceress or two. Picking off sorceresses is how we win.
 
[X] Plan: Lift Siege and Tor Rest


I can understand the idea to hit the complex but that would be overstretching at this point one of there most protected areas i say we safe that for later after we got the other arena's

But we must give the atharti Cult more breathing room hit the alyssan forces there so that they can back territory

And seeing the tunnels are being searched we should leave and take one of the empty tor's as a ned hide out
 
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torroar said:
Frederick…laughs.

And laughs.
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And so Ceogorach noticed..... And sent more fun

Plan: Sustenance and Shelter
[x] Fire and Food: There are other food production sites, silos, storage. It's time that some of them cease to exist. Ransack them to feed your own warband, and deny their contents and production to the enemy. The daemons might not need food or water, but the Druchii damned well do, and without the latter, they cannot sustain the presence of the former. You've destroyed one pyramid, you can destroy others. They'll be more defended, assuredly after the last one, but you can still hopefully manage it.

[x] Target a Tor: Some noble families aligned with Alyssa. Some did not, and suffered for it. There are some that lay either empty, or loosely garrisoned. It will take time to locate one and shift the warband within, but it would be potentially a safer location than the tunnels that the Druchii are now starting to investigate for your presence. It's possible you could be discovered in this new location as well, but what choice is actually correct will be the one proven so after the fact. If it worked out, it would be the most restful place your warband could have.

We need rest for the big fight.
We need food for after and for the take over/Escape.
And these Tor's are defensible.

Hope we find Hultressa in one so we can link up.
 
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Empire History Corner on Gorthor the Cruel New
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    • NutMaster said:
    I'm not very knowledgeable about lore, was this a reference to how that one Ludenhof send all the civilians against beastmen so they won't eat up the resources? I hope despite everything, things won't get that bad in Ostland because I can certainly see Anna pulling a similar trick.
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    It's a bit more than that, though that did happen.

    In the history of the lore of the Empire, and a few of the factions in and around it, there are a few particular standouts for being responsible for causing absolutely horrendous immense destruction to the Empire itself. Basically, 'the times the bad guys did really good' as it were. Beyond the Vampire Wars, the three separate campaigns by the Von Carsteins to consume the Empire from within and wrest control over it entirely for the Midnight Aristocracy. Another one known of and respected and feared in the distant past would also be Gorbad Ironclaw. Even in the canon where it is acknowledged that yes yes Grimgor is 'da biggest and da baddest' and all that, he is also just straight up not the worst threat - at least until End Times I guess where killing an Overtyrant makes him soooooo cool and tough that they call him the avatar of the Great Maw or whatever the heck that was about. This can be seen by him getting so bored easily, attacking his own people if he can't fight literally once every 24 hours, and how he stood around battling one guy and didn't notice how basically his entire WAAAAAGH!! died around him against Crom, was repeatedly rebuffed by Katarin of the 2520s sending blizzards at his face to prevent him from even reaching the city, etc. Gorbad Ironclaw was the actual worse threat to the Empire, centuries before, because he was clever enough and strong enough, maybe not enough to beat Grimgor in a duel, but in terms of effectiveness, way better. Gorbad razed Solland so bad it never came back, and nearly managed the same to Wissenland.

    Gorthor the Cruel was the greatest leader the beastmen ever had in the Empire's history, and came about when a great number of the Empire's troops were off fighting in the Crusades in Araby.

    He was the one Beastlord who was so tough, so strong, so blessed by the Dark Gods, that none have matched him since. Not even One-Eye from canon, technically, because Gorthor was so blessed that a straight up aura of Chaos power would form around him when he fought as a sign of the Dark God's favor. Also, he was specifically noted to be possessed of vision, and the will to 'sear it into the minds of his followers'. He gathered basically all the beastmen of the Empire at the time and sent them at Ostland, practically shattered the province to pieces. He was so bad they straight up thought he wasn't even a beastman, but a daemon. Broke towns, armies, castles, etc. and devastated the province utterly.

    Then ran into a huge Black Orc WAAAAGH!! and killed them too. When he started marching to Hochland, Ostland tried to send what meager reinforcements they could muster, and Gorthor got a vision from the Dark Gods about it so he turned around and stomped them flat to leave his flank clear. Then he headed towards Hergig. They were ever stronger, ever more numerous, ever more blessed by the Dark Gods, and seemed to stretch across the horizon.

    Now, Mikael Ludendorf, the Count of Hochland at the Time, was not well-loved. Or loved at all. He was ruthless, cold, and feared by his own men and people. His elite troops were all in Araby. No good infantry, no heavy cavalry. Zero chance of contesting the beastmen on the open field.

    So, what did Mikael Ludendorf do, knowing this?

    First, he ignored the pleading of his people to save them and the countryside of Hochland from the beastmen, and instead focused everything he had solely upon the defenses of Hergig itself.

    Second, he broke his troops into mounted pistoliers and outriders to fight a running rear guard battle to hold back the enemy from reaching Hergig as long as possible, and the rest into defense preparation workers. The good people of Hergig were forced into hard labor, with little sleep or food, to do so. Many died of exhaustion outright. Others who tried to flee were caught and executed as traitors. I'm actually not entirely sure where I read this, I'm like 65% sure I really did, but he also appears to have shanghaied a group of dwarfs, basically enslaved them to work in his foundries and workshops to produce weapons/armor/cannons, and got a Grudge levied against him as a result of doing it.

    Third, he burned the forests around Hergig to create open killing grounds for his ranged troops, filled the entire area beyond in the trees with snares and traps, poisoned every well outside the walls he could reach, brought in all livestock that could be and slaughtered them for meat and supplies if they could not be sheltered or were not meant for it, and had the cookpots, plowshares, and even the bells of the shrines melted down to make even more weapons.

    It took three weeks or so for Gorthor to finally get past all those defenses, and their intolerable progress had been slowed enough that the beastmen and the Beastlord had gotten frustrated with their slowed pace, and up to the walls. Another twenty two days after beginning the siege that they broke through the gates and got into the city, only after Gorthor invigorated the horde by proclaiming they could feast upon the whole populace of Hergig and he'd only take Mikael Ludendorf's head himself to eat.

    Instead of paraphrasing the rest, I'm just going to straight up use the Armybook's section that the Wiki sources from:

    The Burning of Hergig said:
    The horde of Beastmen poured into the city after them as a flood breaching a dam. The braying herds sought out the defenders wherever they were to be found, making little or no distinction between soldiers and citizens. In no time at all, many of the buildings within the walls were ablaze and the fighting boiled down to a series of savage, running battles in which individual townhouses became bastions and open streets became killing grounds.

    Slavering Chaos Warhounds fought Imperial hunting dogs, and Harpies engaged in bitter aerial melee against noble hunting birds and elite Griffon riders. The air soon became full of terrifying shrieks and cries as hawks, eagles, falcons and Griffons snapped and ripped the flesh of their hideous foes. Far below, resistance collapsed before the terrifying stampede of the Minotaurs. The Empire Greatswords of Hochland were the only warriors with the courage to face them. A handful of Minotaurs were hamstrung by the warriors' double-handed blades, before their skulls were split in turn by the gigantic greataxes of the bull-headed creatures.

    Tuskgor Chariots rode down the brave but perhaps foolish Imperial spearmen who stood resolute before them. Masses of Gors overran the entrenched war engines of the city and butchered the crews, even though hundreds of Beastmen were blasted apart or mowed down in the process. Hochland marksmen shot at the Beastmen leaders from hidden windows high above the streets, but Harpies pulled them from their hideaways and tore them apart. Priests of Ulric and Sigmar tried to outdo each other by attacking the Beastmen with ever-greater displays of holy wrath and Divine Magic, but the Bray-Shamans rallied the warherds with their own mastery of the Lore of the Wild and drove them ever onwards.

    For three days and three nights the battle raged on, with no quarter being asked for, or given. In the end, the Beastmen finally drove most of the defenders out of the city's south gate, and slaughtered those who remained. They were victorious but their casualties were horrendous. At least half of the horde was either dead or seriously wounded. Most of their chariots were crushed by stones thrown from the walls or broken in the savage street battles.

    With only a handful of troops left, Count Mikael withdrew to his palace. He ordered the archers on the walls to shoot with flaming arrows, and soon every building not already set ablaze by the Beastmen was burning at the hands of the defenders. Hundreds of Beastmen, along with many civilians hiding in cellars and attics, were roasted alive. The Elector Count appeared not to care -- there was no place in his city for those who would not fight.

    When his chief councillor suggested surrender, Mikael flew into a rage. He sent the man to Gorthor, saying that he was more a Beastman than a true son of Hochland. Gorthor offered the man freedom if he betrayed his lord and let the Beastmen into the palace. The councillor, loyal to his liege lord to the last, refused and was eaten alive by Gorthor himself.
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    It was only then that reinforcements arrived, in the shape of hundreds of elite veteran Knights of the Blazing Sun charging into the beastmen from behind. Gorthor's horde was finally wavering, on the lip of breaking, and so Mikael Ludenhof charged out of his palace, basically the only standing structure left in the entire city of Hergig, and the fighting intensified further still. Eventually, knowing he needed to strike down the final lynchpin of the resistance so he could try and reorient on the furious knights tearing his horde to pieces, he went for Ludenhof who was dressed in his and I quote 'resplendent ancestral plate', demanded he face him in a duel, and for some insane reason Ludenhof agreed despite his remaining captains protesting otherwise.

    You know, because Warhammer.

    Anyway, again, the sourcebook describes this just fine:

    The Death of Two Monsters said:
    For almost an hour the two fought on the great palace steps. Both the enemy armies paused, near-exhaustion, waiting for the outcome of the duel -- the Beastmen braying and barking with bloodlust, the Men silent, anxious and desperate. It seemed that the Elector Count would surely fall before the fury of the gigantic Beastlord, yet time and again he somehow parried Gorthor's incessant attacks. Then Gorthor struck such a heavy blow that the count's shield was splintered and his ancient plate armour rent in two. Gorthor's spear pierced Mikael Ludendorf's body, the Beastlord putting all of his strength into lifting the spear high into the air even as the transfixed Mikael slid down its length. At the very instant of Gorthor's victory, the Elector Count's Runefang, his magic sword of office, swept around almost of its own accord and plunged itself into Gorthor's chest. It seemed that the blessed blade hungrily drank the blood of the monstrous Beastman. Gorthor the Beastlord and Count Mikael Ludendorf of Hochland died together in that instant, each the equal of the other in the judgement of the gods they served.
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    Beastmen collapse, fall back, retreat, and no one is charismatic or powerful enough to be Gorthor's equal amongst them.

    Hochland's troops are too exhausted to chase them.

    Whole massive swathes of Hochland and Ostland become lost to the wilderness, never to be reclaimed and solely the territory of beastmen amongst overgrown ruins of Imperial settlements.

    Mikael Ludenhof was a cold bastard, monstrous even to his own people, but in the end through his actions he ensured that while Gorthor would reach Hergig he would go no further anywhere else and his grand vision of apocalypse and every human settlement ever a burning ruin would not come to pass.

    That was the guy that Anna was reading up on.
     
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    • torroar said:
    and for some insane reason Ludenhof agreed despite his remaining captains protesting otherwise.
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    I mean the main reason why these kinds of duels stopped happening in real life was that guns started making the honor duel between champions poinltess as they relied less then on the strengeth of a army but the tactics but in something like warhammer well sometimes beating the biggest guy can still do enough morale damage (when some can solo entire armies)
     
    Thanatosra said:
    I mean the main reason why these kinds of duels stopped happening in real life was that guns started making the honor duel between champions poinltess as they relied less then on the strengeth of a army but the tactics but in something like warhammer well sometimes beating the biggest guy can still do enough morale damage (when some can solo entire armies)
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    Oh for sure, that's Warhammer Fantasy and 40k both. Magnus even did one a little while ago. Chaos and Greenskins and Dwarfs still do the duels, Empire, etc. Shattering morale by killing the leader is quite important, and also sometimes the leader is the one with the skills, brain, magic, or blessings that by removing them ensures that you could win against the remainder of their forces. Or not, and it's just a chance to kill them and take them off the board even if their troops will tear you apart afterwards.
     
    torroar said:
    That was the guy that Anna was reading up on.
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    Hehe that's very ominous, Cause if there was someone who could do what ludenhof did, it would be Anna. She already showed how Ruthless she can be with how she used the Mercenary army.

    However I hope she's gonna use that info more to prepare Wolfenburg and the other major cities for a major attack and a siege.

    torroar said:
    Whole massive swathes of Hochland and Ostland become lost to the wilderness, never to be reclaimed and solely the territory of beastmen amongst overgrown ruins of Imperial settlements.
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    Does this still hold true or has our investment in the province changed that?
     
    Ragingbear21 said:
    Does this still hold true or has our investment in the province changed that?
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    You've somewhat begun the process, but it's difficult. Every year, some village gets attacked, raided, razed. You make new ones, and so on. It's been an ongoing struggle. We're talking many, many, many centuries of wilderness overtaking the areas, maps changing entirely to reflect it, etc. The Forest of Shadows was named that because of Zacharias, who was finally defeated, but actually full on reclaiming all the areas properly is the work of many, many years of careful cutting of the forest back, clearing of the old spaces, consecrating them more likely than not after the beastmen have had custody of the area for generations, building them back up, defending them, populating them, etc. Vast swathes means vast, you know? Still, you've started re-gnawing at the edges, and that's more progress than has been done in a long time.
     
    [X] Plan: Kill and Climb
    -[X] Converge On A Complex: The Dhar Anchorstone Complexes are some of the most vital parts of the Ark, and yet, the Druchii can only put so many defenders so many places. Any of these locations will be well defended, and assuredly stationed with at least one or two sorceresses, but each one lost reduces Alyssa's power and capability to respond to you. Actually damaging the Anchorstone might take more time and strength than you possess, especially if you want to escape the resulting fallout of its destruction, but clearing a complex and fleeing will also demand that Alyssa rededicate more forces to staff and control it once more. She literally cannot risk leaving one attended, not after losing one.
    -[X] Retreat To A Roost: One of the least traveled parts of the Ark are the enormous, claw-shaped roosts upon which the vast flocks of harpies that once resided. Filthy, murderous creatures as they are, they were used as scouts and flying chaff by the Ark's forces out on deployment, but at Salkalten they were violently brought to earth. One of the roosts is actually where Johanna resided for a time after barely making it onto the Ark. They would be uncomfortable, yes, but the roosts are apparently rarely ever bothered with because of the stench and refuse, something the Witch Elves confirmed. So it would be safer to reside in for the night than most other options.
     
    [X] Plan: Lift Siege and Tor Rest

    We need the Dark Elves to keep fighting each other. Every cultist or daemon banished in the siege means one less out targeting our little group of resistance fighters. Also may give Hultressa the chance to rally some support to herself as well.
     
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    ChosenMan65 said:
    We need the Dark Elves to keep fighting each other.
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    And they're going to continue to.

    There's almost no scenario where Alyssa can wipe them out in the next day that doesn't also wind up with Natasha and co getting absolutely slapped down in crossfire of such a massed attacked were she to try and get involved in it.

    If Alyssa nearly loses an Anchorstone outright, then the very premise of why she should continue to hold power over the Ark comes to an end. That will combine with how the Path of Glory was taken and then awarded to a loyal subordinate...Who subsequently got ganked almost immediately afterwards. With food running out.

    There simply won't be any reason left for anyone to follow her, save for the replacement being just as incapable, if not moreso.

    And that's what will cause her coalition to fracture for real as people move to secure their position in the absence of Alyssa's ability to guarantee it for them
     
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