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Oh yeah, no difference this round just making sure. Mire Ward's limitations would be a lot less worth it if it only did -1.
Plan forthcoming in a minute, just working out the math.
NorseQuest (A Norse Xianxia)
- Thread starter I.F. Ister
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- Original Fantasy Action
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Oh yeah, no difference this round just making sure. Mire Ward's limitations would be a lot less worth it if it only did -1.
Plan forthcoming in a minute, just working out the math.
Hey @Imperial Fister how is the opposed roll-on revers momentum works? Like our opponent gets a penalty to equal to their speed in the roll off, is that a dice penalty or a straight on?
Also would our wrestling skill include both Gilma and fang or just Gilma?
This is the trick I'm talking about.
Also would our wrestling skill include both Gilma and fang or just Gilma?
This is the trick I'm talking about.
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- He/Him
So, here's that plan:
[X] Plan You Can't Use Shields Without Wrists
-[X] 50d6 Attack (46d6 tricks)
-[X] 54d6 Defense (54d6 tricks)
-[X] 0d6 Intercept
-[X] Open up with two 80d6+5 Sharpened x39 Lightning-Enhanced Shatter-Wrist Tricks w/Puncture (-50 Orthstirr each, stoking all Sagaseeker's Aspects and using his Orthstirr for this as much as possible) to break his wrists and stop that shield nonsense, followed by two 78d6+5 (w/Hugareida) Sharpenedx34 Lightning-Enhanced Flashfire Cleaves w/Puncture (-50 Orthstirr each), and then followed by a total of four 65d6+5 Sharpenedx31 Lightning-Charged Skewer-Flick attacks w/Puncture (-45 Orthstirr each) being careful to flick him back and forth within the Mire Ward, and then up to four 9d6+5 Sharpened x4 Lightning-Charged Basic Attacks (-5 Orthstirr each). If at any point he Stokes Aspects to fix his wrists or otherwise make them functional again, or avoids the initial two attacks we will interject with up to six total additional 80d6+5 Sharpened x39 Lightning-Enhanced Shatter-Wrist Tricks w/Puncture (-50 Orthstirr each) instead of other attacks.
-[X] If he gets away from us, drop Mire Ward, use Ember-Wing Cloak (-6 Orthstirr) to close with him again, and pop a new Mire Ward (-6 Orthstirr) if it took him a meaningful amount of time to get away from it.
-[X] Against any attack not using Puncture or a Fleinn use Halting Vortex (-4 Orthstirr) if possible, against non-Puncture attacks with a Fleinn or that we otherwise can't use Halting Vortex on use Focus Guard (-7 Orthstirr). In response to anything with Puncture or that gets past our Perfects in some other way after the first melee attack use up to three 60d6+9 Reinforcedx42 Slice Aside defenses (-50 Orthstirr each, using our Armor's Orthstirr on the first one) using 9d6+5 Sharpened x4 Lightning-Charged Basic Attacks (-5 Orthstirr each) as the counterattacks.
-[X] If we are attacked in melee while we have 6 or more Stoked Dice use Contested Movement (-3 Orthstirr, 8d6+Stoked Dice) and counterattack with a Sharpened Lightning Charged Skewer-Flick w/Puncture (-15 Orthstirr), and abort to a Focus Guard (-7 Orthstirr) if that does not work.
-[X] Tactics – The plan here is to break his wrists, then go to town in melee, breaking them again as needed if he fixes them (the goal here is to only be making attacks that aren't wrist-breaking if his wrists are already broken). Pretty straightforward, really.
If this whole thing goes off I feel like we win. If it doesn't, well, we gave it our best. It does not try and save Orthstirr as that seems like a fool's errand here.
[X] Plan You Can't Use Shields Without Wrists
-[X] 50d6 Attack (46d6 tricks)
-[X] 54d6 Defense (54d6 tricks)
-[X] 0d6 Intercept
-[X] Open up with two 80d6+5 Sharpened x39 Lightning-Enhanced Shatter-Wrist Tricks w/Puncture (-50 Orthstirr each, stoking all Sagaseeker's Aspects and using his Orthstirr for this as much as possible) to break his wrists and stop that shield nonsense, followed by two 78d6+5 (w/Hugareida) Sharpenedx34 Lightning-Enhanced Flashfire Cleaves w/Puncture (-50 Orthstirr each), and then followed by a total of four 65d6+5 Sharpenedx31 Lightning-Charged Skewer-Flick attacks w/Puncture (-45 Orthstirr each) being careful to flick him back and forth within the Mire Ward, and then up to four 9d6+5 Sharpened x4 Lightning-Charged Basic Attacks (-5 Orthstirr each). If at any point he Stokes Aspects to fix his wrists or otherwise make them functional again, or avoids the initial two attacks we will interject with up to six total additional 80d6+5 Sharpened x39 Lightning-Enhanced Shatter-Wrist Tricks w/Puncture (-50 Orthstirr each) instead of other attacks.
-[X] If he gets away from us, drop Mire Ward, use Ember-Wing Cloak (-6 Orthstirr) to close with him again, and pop a new Mire Ward (-6 Orthstirr) if it took him a meaningful amount of time to get away from it.
-[X] Against any attack not using Puncture or a Fleinn use Halting Vortex (-4 Orthstirr) if possible, against non-Puncture attacks with a Fleinn or that we otherwise can't use Halting Vortex on use Focus Guard (-7 Orthstirr). In response to anything with Puncture or that gets past our Perfects in some other way after the first melee attack use up to three 60d6+9 Reinforcedx42 Slice Aside defenses (-50 Orthstirr each, using our Armor's Orthstirr on the first one) using 9d6+5 Sharpened x4 Lightning-Charged Basic Attacks (-5 Orthstirr each) as the counterattacks.
-[X] If we are attacked in melee while we have 6 or more Stoked Dice use Contested Movement (-3 Orthstirr, 8d6+Stoked Dice) and counterattack with a Sharpened Lightning Charged Skewer-Flick w/Puncture (-15 Orthstirr), and abort to a Focus Guard (-7 Orthstirr) if that does not work.
-[X] Tactics – The plan here is to break his wrists, then go to town in melee, breaking them again as needed if he fixes them (the goal here is to only be making attacks that aren't wrist-breaking if his wrists are already broken). Pretty straightforward, really.
If this whole thing goes off I feel like we win. If it doesn't, well, we gave it our best. It does not try and save Orthstirr as that seems like a fool's errand here.
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CedeTheBees
Probably high right now
- Location
- Somewhere
- Pronouns
- They/Them
[X] Plan You Can't Use Shields Without Wrists
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- He/Him
Momentum Reversal is a Trick you use within an existing grapple to gain control or escape, not a defensive Trick to use outside of one, or at least that was what we bought it for. The defensive grapple Trick where someone attack you and you grapple them is one of the others, which are only at Vague right now.
So it seems pretty definitively that when he's actually making a serious effort for a rolled defence, he can match 60d6.
Try for 80d6 on a couple of Shatter-Wrist Tricks?
We also really want to trigger some Contested Movement if at all possible here; they don't cost Orthstirr, but also crucially when we used it before, we caught him flatfooted. We can use both uses of Fight of your Life on one, and our Stoked Pool on the other.
EDIT: Haha, great minds think alike.
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Yeah, I'm always sad when we just barely fail. Should've put in more dice last round. Ah, well hindsight is 20/20 and all that. But yeah, breaking his wrists seems right...and despite these attacks being expensive as hell, any defenses he makes will be even more so...by a lot. Sharpen grants an efficiency advantage here.
We're sadly out of both Stoked Pool and Fight Of Our Life, having used them all on Contested Movement in the first two rounds.
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- Location
- some computer lab
[X] Plan You Can't Use Shields Without Wrists
Oh snap, I missed that we used our last Contested Movement before he unveiled his Twist at us. Clever.
Trying the same thing again but with more dice wont be that helpful, there is nothing stopping him in putting more power in his defense to compensate and were back to square 1.
We should try something else.
- Location
- Space between realms
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- He
[X] Plan You Can't Use Shields Without Wrists
@Imperial Fister, would beating him on a Slice-Aside mean that he can still use a shield to stop the Basic Attack we throw as a counter-attack?
So I get where you're coming from here and am open to ideas, but AFAIK, we never actually tried the Shatter-Wrist Tricks? We got a round break before we had the chance to use them.
They are also specifically designed for dealing with shields, so it's not like, the worst idea in the world that they might be useful here.
So I get where you're coming from here and am open to ideas, but AFAIK, we never actually tried the Shatter-Wrist Tricks? We got a round break before we had the chance to use them.
They are also specifically designed for dealing with shields, so it's not like, the worst idea in the world that they might be useful here.
- Location
- Bretonnia
- Pronouns
- He/Him
[X] Plan You Can't Use Shields Without Wrists
This looking more and more like a loss for us, but at least we put up a decent showing.
This looking more and more like a loss for us, but at least we put up a decent showing.
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We haven't tried Shatter-Wrist yet. And he's been leaning fairly hard on shields for his defenses, which shouldn't help against that specifically. So I wouldn't characterize this as trying the same thing again. It's the same thing we were about to try if last round hadn't ended, but we never got the chance to actually give it a shot.
I.F. Ister
Fortifying The Thread
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- He/They
When using Momentum Reversal, you get bonus dice depending on how much faster your opponent is then you. 1 extra dice per level of speed.
Your wrestling skill is both Glima and Fang.
It actually also can be used to enter into a grapple.
Depends entirely on the timing of things.
Okay, if we beat him on a Slice-Aside, and his other wrist is broken, can he use a shield to stop us? 😅
What about the rolled dodge defence he used before against FFC?
AeonIlluminate
The power of friendship and aggressive landscaping
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- They/Them
[X] Plan You Can't Use Shields Without Wrists
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- He/Him
Nice.
So, wait, would that be a rolled attack or defense using Combat Pool, or would it make the roll into opposed wrestling?
Either way our wrestling isn't quite good enough for me to think the risk is worth it. Once we have, like, Glima and Fang at 5 (which we probably will by the end of this trip), I'd be a lot more confident. But knowing how it works is important in the long run.
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I think that Shatter-Wrist Trick is the right idea here, but it feels like he's too smart for us to break both his writs and go to town on him? That's the one aspect of the current plan I'm not sure about. Once he sees the threat he'll probably stop using shields. Which does not mean that Shatter-Wrist is not useful - it definitely is a good idea IMO - but more as a way to force the fight onto our terms I think?
Also I think we should try to charge up our Stoked pool for a Contested Movement at the end, it would be a good way to deliver a finishing blow since he's demonstrated no ability to counter Contested Movement other than subterfuge with a shield. (Which he won't have.) The current plan actually has enough Basic Attacks to give us a decent dice bonus, so maybe we should include this as a contingency?
Also I think we should try to charge up our Stoked pool for a Contested Movement at the end, it would be a good way to deliver a finishing blow since he's demonstrated no ability to counter Contested Movement other than subterfuge with a shield. (Which he won't have.) The current plan actually has enough Basic Attacks to give us a decent dice bonus, so maybe we should include this as a contingency?
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The issue is that, with his weapon swapping shenanigans, being down one hand doesn't really stop him from using a shield. Also, his ability to adapt to this specific strategy on the fly within a specific round is hopefully not great.
Hmmm. Yeah, alright. I doubt things will get to that point, but I'll add it to the plan. EDIT: And added.
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- Pronouns
- He/Him
[X] Plan You Can't Use Shields Without Wrists
When I say stopping him, I mean more that he will realise if he swaps to a shield in the other hand, that wrist may get broken as well, and since he won't want that to happen, he'll stop using his shield.
Actually, looking at it, even as little as two Basic Attacks would give us enough dice for a pretty comfortable advantage on a Contested Movement. Which we know he can't stop; every time we've used CM it has worked, and the only time it didn't work was with the Hidden Blade Twist, which he can't do again.
So I would advocate moving two Basic Attacks up in the order here - maybe even at the start, or just after the FFCs - to set up our finisher, which should be Contested Movement + our highest damage attack. (Probably FFC, given Sparkbomb won't work on him?)
I.F. Ister
Fortifying The Thread
- Pronouns
- He/They
The rolled dodge was a generic dodge trick, nothing special. He could use that if he so chose.
Answering that question would be giving you a bit too much detail on how the hotswapping works. I left a hint for you in this update, though.
Against a basic attack, few people will use tricks to defend.
Specifically, it works by waiting for the enemy to attack—not exactly a tall order when they're faster than you—before forcing them into a wrestling contest.
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I don't see that as a reason to not break his other wrist...it is still an attack and does damage, not huge damage, but still.
So, this isn't actually true. He rolled around a 42 on the dice on his first Contested Movement roll. So he added some dice there...that's the average on 14d6, exactly as much as we get from our base pool and 2 Basic Attacks. Plus, if he has Stoker State he can add those dice...that may even be what he did on that one. He's done basic attacks since then, too, so he could've built it back up. I'm not comfortable doing it with less than 9 bonus dice, and even then it's dicey. I don't think it's probably worth moving those attacks earlier in the turn order for something as risky as this.
And, for the record, FFC is only better than Skewer-Flick if his armor is unpierced due to fire resistance coming into play (11 FFC vs. 8 SF...it's 7 FFC vs. 8 SF with pierced armor)...it's thus better if done early, but not if done late.
So...is there a defense roll with combat pool followed by a wrestling contest, or does the Trick replace the defense roll with opposed wrestling? That's the part I'm most unclear on.
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