NorseQuest (A Norse Xianxia)
- Thread starter I.F. Ister
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- norse mythology (mythology) original xianxia cultivation western cultivation ask sirihand did your mother tell you anything? discussion pleases yggdrasil farming gloating gets people killed granary management hubris is a coward's word you will die norsemen do not die when they are killed the qm has a bad memory the qm is bad at math viking courtroom drama (legal drama) vikings open voting
What in the world even is 'scientific' cultivation, when it seems like the point of cultivation is warping objective reality with your ideals?
Like, every cultivation system Fist has mentioned has strong elements of Right (for that culture) makes Might. How do you make a purely scientific alternative, completely bare of anything like morals, ideals, values, so on? And why would you do so?
Like, every cultivation system Fist has mentioned has strong elements of Right (for that culture) makes Might. How do you make a purely scientific alternative, completely bare of anything like morals, ideals, values, so on? And why would you do so?
Alectai
Speaks Words of Wisdom... On occasion
Well, honestly, it's probably more likely that Daoist Cultivation wins out, because it covers esoterica, legacy, and sheer girthiness in all forms, and unlike the Christian style, they can absolutely throw entire seas of cultivators at you if that's what it takes, because they're set up like a giant pyramid scheme, but even the lower rungs trivially outcompete anything but other Cultivators, and the higher tiers are no weaker than the top tiers of the other settings, so they get the best of all worlds while paying nothing significant to get it. (The overwhelming majority of the population being stuck at subsistence level is not a downside when you can still field millions of lay cultivators). Science requires the world to fundamentally obey certain rules and refuse to bend from them without equally understood exceptions, which is thrown out the door when some random girl can learn to freeze space because she had a really good first kiss.
And thus, you get your Standard Cultivation Setting where everyone has the same base culture and the same fundamental understandings of how Cultivation Works, and all other styles have been erased from history.
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I don't know if 'scientific cultivation' would be a thing per se? Like, cultivation seems based on culture and ideals, not technology per se. There'll definitely be non-religious secular forms of cultivation, but they seem likely to be based on philosophies rather than science per se. So definitely at least one for the Enlightenment, but not necessarily 'science' per se. Marxist Cultivation would be very interesting, for example...not necessarily good, but interesting.
I don't think this is likely, honestly. The cultural stuff seems inherent and this world is headed on the same trajectory as ours, and Chinese culture has not conquered the world, so I don't think it will here either.
I also don't think we have any evidence that the Chinese can mass produce cultivators more easily than Christians can. It's possible they could, but that's not true in every cultivation setting and seems unlikely to be true here.
We do still have Reinforce Shield going, yeah.
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Do we know it works like that in universe?
That seems immensely powerful. It's not like we're getting literally smote by sacred power just for attacking Christians, or that the Norse are about to be smacked down by the biblical twelve plagues…
Alectai
Speaks Words of Wisdom... On occasion
Just bringing up Charlemagne apparently got Hallr--the Absolute Godslaying Unit himself--feeling spooked.
Remember, the Christian Cultivation method goes up to 15 Decades and then apparently a Crucifix, yet even a 10th Decade Knight is enough to absolute shitstomp an entire platoon of seasoned vikings, requiring mister "Half-Step Steelfather" Steinarr himself to salvage that shit.
That's only 2/3rds of the way through their Cultivation[/i].
Yes, but what does that have to do with the theoretical overwhelming structural advantages of Chinese cultivation?
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- Bretonnia
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Honestly, the only thing that Norse cultivation seems to have over Christian cultivation seems to be how accessible it is. From what I can tell, Hallr was a fucking exemplar of Norse cultivation, and yet there are still people that have got him shitting his pants. Granted, I don't think Charlemagne is 'people' - he's a legend, but the general gist of it to me seems to be that Christian cultivators are generally stronger than Norse cultivators around their level.
On the contrary, from your description alone, I can see one rather significant weakness, namely unity. To paraphrase a certain webcomic I enjoy (Far Side of Utopia), based on your description, if the Daoists even exerted five percent of their focused attention, they could do almost anything in the world. The problem is that if five percent of the Daoist cultivators tried to conquer, say, Europe, then at least another five percent would choose to take advantage to steal the Sects' resources/secrets/lives while their backs are turned.
The Christians and Muslims, meanwhile, could declare a Crusade/Jihad if attacked like you describe. The Norse pagans are far less united, but the nature of their cultivation means they don't really need to be. Fighting off a foreign invasion against mighty odds makes one heck of a way to get to Valhalla.
Then there's the vulnerability such an effort has to decapitation strikes. If, as you say, the top levels are roughly equal in skill, that opens up serious opportunities for dueling. If a leader refuses such a challenge, then they'll lose face and be seen as a coward by their subordinates, increasing disloyalty and infighting. If they accept the challenge, then they run a rather solid risk of dying, which leads to more infighting with each lost leader.
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- Hell
Not to say you are not right about Christian Cultivators having plenty of time to advance the cultivation of their peers, but depending on how closely the Bible in-universe follows our Bible, they might also have a time limit of 70 years, 80 tops as opposed to the traditional Xianxia Cultivation that allows for longer lifespans.
Sirrocco
Pedantic
Christian cultivators are worse at things like Farming. Norse cultivation is all about "being a paragon of a human being in general" and that means being good at all sorts of things.
Chrstian cultivators also require a lot more support. Like, this guy has platemail,
Norse cultivators get stronger by fighting, too, accumulating Orthstirr quite rapidly if they don't die. Halla has snowballed immensely over a couple years. Knights and priests likely have to spend their time locked in training, meditation and prayer.
Sneak Peak: The Greaser, The Cyborg, and The Ex-Slave
I.F. Ister
Fortifying The Thread
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- He/They
"Adam, you absolute moron!" The gasmask-clad woman in the puffy, blue jacket snarled as her hair whipped in the wind. "Did you really, really think that it would be a good idea to punch the Boneriders' damn Bonerlord in the fucking face?!"
"Correction: It was a kick." The camera-faced cyborg raised a finger as he sprinted alongside the buggy racing across the flat, wide-open sands of the Wailing Basin. A horde of whooping and hollering bikers followed on their smog-belching, spike-laden monstrosities.
"What the fuck ever!" She threw her hands in the air as she slumped back in her seat. "Ah well, at least we've got the McGuffer part and they — and those necromancer jackasses — don't."
"Addition: And Vincent Montague."
"That bastard too, yeah. What the hell kinda psycho has fucking Kung-Fu maids?!" She muttered and scowled as an old wound throbbed — curtesy of one of the aforementioned Kung-Fu maids' razor-filled feather dusters.
"One with good taste, Suzie." Adam grinned from the driver's seat as his pompadour bobbed in the wind — the Boneriders had shot out the windshield earlier in the chase.
Suzie scoffed behind her mask. "C14, back me up here. Kung-Fu maids shouldn't exist."
"Uncertainty: There was an odd swagger to their movements — a swaying of the hips. My meat parts had a reaction."
"Fucking meat parts?!" Suzie's left eye twitched, like she couldn't quite believe what she was hearing.
"Affirmative: Yes, meat parts. They swelled."
Suzie's glove-covered palms met her gasmask-wearing face with a light slap as she groaned long and hard. From the corner of her eye, she watched as the bikers drew closer and closer — they all watched.
Despite the jovial nature of those riding on board the buggy — or running beside, in the case of C14 — an undercurrent of tension curled around their spines and gripped their hearts tightly. After all, the Boneriders weren't going to just let them escape with the only McGuffer part they'd gotten a firm grip on since this horrible game began.
But none of the team were the weak whelps they were so many months ago — when this all started and the McGuffer Device was revealed.
So when the first of the bikers — a spiked helmet-wearing, cigar-smoking, graybeard of an old man — rolled up on a wheelie with chain whip raised high above his head, the team were ready for action.
"On your left, Suzie!" Adam shouted out as he swerved away from a rather nasty pothole.
Hanging on for dear life, Suzie growled out some nonsensical answer as she whipped out her hand and breathed out rah. Smoky power pooled in her palm and streamed behind her in thick blobs of black, choking clouds.
Casting her gaze towards the cigar-smoking biker, she cracked a grin hidden behind her mask. "Haven't you heard? Smoking kills!"
An explosion of smoke swallowed the bike and biker and hid them from view. The only evidence to what happened to the old man was a choked scream and a wet, sickening crunch.
Suzie blinked in shock as what she just did struck her like a lightning bolt. "Did I just..."
"Affirmative: That was a good one-liner."
"Fucking damnit!" She screamed her rage at the heavens as she slammed a fist into the buggy's chassis. "You fucking fucks are rubbing off on me!"
Adam laughed. "If that's us rubbing off on you, I can't wait till you get stained!"
Suzie's rage shook dust from the heavens.
0~0~0
AN: This is less an actual bit from the Quest and more just a peak at protagonists and a hint at the plot.
The protagonists, of course, being;
-Adam Rancer: The pompadour-styled, leather jacket-clad cool dude of the bunch
-Suzie Sadowski: The gasmask-adorned, angry-as-all-hell smoke machine of the bunch
-Cameraborg-C14: The camera-faced, machine-bodied technical fighter of the bunch
"Correction: It was a kick." The camera-faced cyborg raised a finger as he sprinted alongside the buggy racing across the flat, wide-open sands of the Wailing Basin. A horde of whooping and hollering bikers followed on their smog-belching, spike-laden monstrosities.
"What the fuck ever!" She threw her hands in the air as she slumped back in her seat. "Ah well, at least we've got the McGuffer part and they — and those necromancer jackasses — don't."
"Addition: And Vincent Montague."
"That bastard too, yeah. What the hell kinda psycho has fucking Kung-Fu maids?!" She muttered and scowled as an old wound throbbed — curtesy of one of the aforementioned Kung-Fu maids' razor-filled feather dusters.
"One with good taste, Suzie." Adam grinned from the driver's seat as his pompadour bobbed in the wind — the Boneriders had shot out the windshield earlier in the chase.
Suzie scoffed behind her mask. "C14, back me up here. Kung-Fu maids shouldn't exist."
"Uncertainty: There was an odd swagger to their movements — a swaying of the hips. My meat parts had a reaction."
"Fucking meat parts?!" Suzie's left eye twitched, like she couldn't quite believe what she was hearing.
"Affirmative: Yes, meat parts. They swelled."
Suzie's glove-covered palms met her gasmask-wearing face with a light slap as she groaned long and hard. From the corner of her eye, she watched as the bikers drew closer and closer — they all watched.
Despite the jovial nature of those riding on board the buggy — or running beside, in the case of C14 — an undercurrent of tension curled around their spines and gripped their hearts tightly. After all, the Boneriders weren't going to just let them escape with the only McGuffer part they'd gotten a firm grip on since this horrible game began.
But none of the team were the weak whelps they were so many months ago — when this all started and the McGuffer Device was revealed.
So when the first of the bikers — a spiked helmet-wearing, cigar-smoking, graybeard of an old man — rolled up on a wheelie with chain whip raised high above his head, the team were ready for action.
"On your left, Suzie!" Adam shouted out as he swerved away from a rather nasty pothole.
Hanging on for dear life, Suzie growled out some nonsensical answer as she whipped out her hand and breathed out rah. Smoky power pooled in her palm and streamed behind her in thick blobs of black, choking clouds.
Casting her gaze towards the cigar-smoking biker, she cracked a grin hidden behind her mask. "Haven't you heard? Smoking kills!"
An explosion of smoke swallowed the bike and biker and hid them from view. The only evidence to what happened to the old man was a choked scream and a wet, sickening crunch.
Suzie blinked in shock as what she just did struck her like a lightning bolt. "Did I just..."
"Affirmative: That was a good one-liner."
"Fucking damnit!" She screamed her rage at the heavens as she slammed a fist into the buggy's chassis. "You fucking fucks are rubbing off on me!"
Adam laughed. "If that's us rubbing off on you, I can't wait till you get stained!"
Suzie's rage shook dust from the heavens.
0~0~0
AN: This is less an actual bit from the Quest and more just a peak at protagonists and a hint at the plot.
The protagonists, of course, being;
-Adam Rancer: The pompadour-styled, leather jacket-clad cool dude of the bunch
-Suzie Sadowski: The gasmask-adorned, angry-as-all-hell smoke machine of the bunch
-Cameraborg-C14: The camera-faced, machine-bodied technical fighter of the bunch
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You don't even need that, honestly. A Norseman without a farm has to have a way to survive and get glory, but neither of those actually require even as much material support as a farm.
Sirrocco
Pedantic
Congratulations, Halla. You're the protagonist. No, really. The most impressive Viking of his generation burned it all into giving you the "protagonist" card. You and your line are the only ones that can save us from inevitable doom. Don't screw it up.
Though I gotta wonder... there are a bunch of cousins out there that got inheritances from Hallr. Did they also get the "persistent bloodline" treatment? ...because that could be cool.
Worth noting that Steinarr himself isn't a Steelfather. There's some ground left to thread on the Norse Cultivation side too.
Still, yes, when it comes to bringing out the big guns, it looks like there's a quality vs quantity thing here.
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- Hell
...I think there is a theme in Xianxia stories, that if you get high enough cultivation, you just do not need to eat or sleep and can subsist on just energy. I wonder if that is a thing here.
I.F. Ister
Fortifying The Thread
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- He/They
I've always thought that the 39-clues novels had interesting world-building in the form of different branches of the same family pulling shenanigans and scheming against each other.
Sirrocco
Pedantic
Ah! And that explains one of the other terrifying things about Norse Cultivators.
They can travel.
This little warband can go... pretty much wherever the boats take them, Do Awesome Things, and have their Cultivation thank them for it. As long as none of them outright die, the primary limiting factor is "ran out of space on the boat for loot". Christian priests that leave their churches take a hit, and if they have no congregation they take another hit, and they probably don't have much left once they're done. Knights can travel, but without the resource footprint feeding them stuff, they're going to be slowly losing out as well. A group of a dozen viking warriors heads out on a quest? That's "Ah! Folkmarr's getting started building his jarl-saga a bit young is he? Always knew that was a kid with ambition." A group of a dozen knights does that? That's the equivalent of a barony going to war, at significant expense.
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From what Gabriel's interlude indicates, ongoing Knight cultivation doesn't require continuing resources behind time and energy from the knight themselves (he notes that the only reason he can't do it is the shackles). The expense is in having gotten them to that point. Like the armor, the horse, the training...they're an investment. Norse cultivators really aren't.
So the difference is expense more than mobility.
My man, i loved that series
yah keep in mind even the big boy armor we see in the crafting informational is probably lesser in make and they might have better iron than us too without going into magic iron. The knight's armor are also inscribed with a ton a Latin, even a squire is a massive money sink since he has non Latin armor, horse armor, cultivator horse, and cultivator falcon. The preist is not anywhere as threatening as 6th decade knight which would make quick work of us because he has way less money invested.
This is actually a positive for them, in Norse cultivation everyone does it just a bit so they all fight over the cool resources and each toher instead of consolidating it in the hands of their most talented like Christians do. Plus Christian dice might be better than ours we don't roll d6s we roll d3s using a d6, they might have proper d4s with [-1, 1, 2, 3] as the result
One sorta leads to the other though? The high investment required means that those financing it, aka the peasants and/or the liege, will expect a return through fulfilling feudal obligations. Those obligations are what keep the Knights more sedentary, as I doubt oathbreaking is good for a Knight's cultivation.
I see so much arguements about how much Christian's are better cultivation system than Vikings. Like personally I am rather impressed by how the Norse system works versus the elite few of the Christian system. Like why is having the few who go out and be impressive a bad thing. Like you would think the constant fighting would make the Norse much more dangerous overall than the Christians in that case. But might be me not caring at the power of infrastructure I guess.