Forge of Destiny(Xianxia Quest)

Yeah, I absolutely am going to advocate doing Market next week come hell or high water. That plus four Breakthrough actions (Though we can likely get away with Conditionaling one or two of them).

Should be able to squeeze in FSS training and EPC development--the latter should actually push us to EPC 5.

Yeah, the way I plan to handle things is three 'Guaranteed' Breakthrough Actions, and then one conditional "Breakthrough or do EPC", then our "Definite" major action as FSS training. Should be able to get some good Minor juggling in that way, since we can use the EPC training to attach the MaSu duo. Then for Minors, I'm looking at Shopping, Golden Fields Group, and that should get us most of our options sorted out, and largely ahead of the Minor hurricane!
 
Last edited:
I haven't been following the thread super closely for the last couple of updates but I have to admit I'm a little baffled that the market minor didn't get taken. Especially when people are so gung ho about minmaxing cultivation plans. Just the drugs we've been exposed to include stuff that nets us essentially free cultivation actions.

I guess it's kind of excusable if our heavy focus on breaking through precludes the use of expensive drugs, but there could easily be something like "get a bonus physical cultivation roll if you open a meridian this week" that would make ramping back up to peak less of a waste of time.

If such a medecine exist, my salt will be legendary. :V
 
And we average 34/training. Being within 50 means needing about 1.5 training actions/missions. The chance of us being successful enough to hit EPC5 is basically zero.
It's ... possible. It would require exceptional resources to even come close and a market action last turn so we could have used any drugs that would have boosted EPC up to close that gap. Unless we can use the drugs mid-turn, which is entirely unprecedented.
 
It's ... possible. It would require exceptional resources to even come close and a market action last turn so we could have used any drugs that would have boosted EPC up to close that gap. Unless we can use the drugs mid-turn, which is entirely unprecedented.
Even good drugs won't push us to 50 successes. Drugs on that tier would be wasted on a single action of art cultivation, they're the kind we want pill weeks for.

There simply won't be a way to achieve EPC5 in one action. It'll need two, which means hoping to hit it this week is a waste of our time.

We'd be better off doing mission this week and mission next week, for example. We would gain more and spend the same amount of time.
 
Even good drugs won't push us to 50 successes. Drugs on that tier would be wasted on a single action of art cultivation, they're the kind we want pill weeks for.

There simply won't be a way to achieve EPC5 in one action. It'll need two, which means hoping to hit it this week is a waste of our time.

We'd be better off doing mission this week and mission next week, for example. We would gain more and spend the same amount of time.
EPC success 93/200 as of right now. Average success, as you mentioned should be 34. 93 + 34 = 127. Goal is for 30 successes from Tower mission. 127 + 30 = 157. Goal for EPC5 is 200. 200-157= 43. 43 successes are the target number.

Talent + Stones (2 Ys; 1 Gs) + EPC + Starlit Meadow + Tutor
6 + 15 + 20 + 12 + 5 + 15 = 73 dice. 73 x .5 = 36.5 + ((36.5 x .2) x. 5) = 40.15 success average + 5 auto successes = 45.15.

Target number 43 successes; average number 45.15 successes. Target number reached and exceeded by 2.15 success

This is, of course, assuming everything goes perfectly. Completely debatable if it is worth a green stone, but it is possible even without the drugs that we might have gotten.
 
EPC success 93/200 as of right now. Average success, as you mentioned should be 34. 93 + 34 = 127. Goal is for 30 successes from Tower mission. 127 + 30 = 157. Goal for EPC5 is 200. 200-157= 43. 43 successes are the target number.

Talent + Stones (2 Ys; 1 Gs) + EPC + Starlit Meadow + Tutor
6 + 15 + 20 + 12 + 5 + 15 = 73 dice. 73 x .5 = 36.5 + ((36.5 x .2) x. 5) = 40.15 success average + 5 auto successes = 45.15.

Target number 43 successes; average number 45.15 successes. Target number reached and exceeded by 2.15 success

This is, of course, assuming everything goes perfectly. Completely debatable if it is worth a green stone, but it is possible even without the drugs that we might have gotten.

It would be ridiculous to spend tutoring and a green stone on EPC.

e: In comparison to missions, every mission we complete gets us about 5/6 an action in sect points for tutoring down the line. Using single action tutoring loses us 1/2 an action in sect points. The net result is 1/3 of an action (2-10/6) for two missions, versus 1.5 actions (1+1/2) for single action tutoring (and a GSS). This all for one week of EPC bonuses, which even if maxed aren't worth that cost for only one week.
 
Last edited:
It would be ridiculous to spend tutoring and a green stone on EPC.
The point, however, is that it is not impossible. It is entirely possible to get EPC5 in a single action.

You may argue that spending the exceptional amount of resources on a single cultivation roll is not worth it, but the math says it is possible. I frankly don't care as my concern is getting Bronze next week and I am perfectly happy with delaying EPC5 a week or 2 in order to accomplish that.
 
The point, however, is that it is not impossible. It is entirely possible to get EPC5 in a single action.

You may argue that spending the exceptional amount of resources on a single cultivation roll is not worth it, but the math says it is possible. I frankly don't care as my concern is getting Bronze next week and I am perfectly happy with delaying EPC5 a week or 2 in order to accomplish that.

That's a meaningless distinction. The very definition of an academic point.

I'm happy delaying EPC5 a week or two too. My point is it's impractical to spend the action on training it, and as you kindly outlined, requires absurd dedication of resources. It's much more practical to attempt to gain actions with missions and set us up for tutoring later, which will still land us EPC5 in the same practical time but with extra actions in tutoring later.
 
All this is perfectly fine, it just means that I can put something else in that spot, no biggie. Like starting the Dragon questline or something.
 
I'm sill waiting on yrsillar's input on my idea for a conditional 4th breakthrough attempt to try to put us over the topo if needed before I come up with my plan(well, that, and see what minoirs besides shop we have)
 
The next week major actions can be more elegantly set as this:

[] Plan: Template
-[] Cultivate in White room with character A, if Ling Qi fails breakthrough cultivate physical else cultivate whatever meridian
--[] Do minor action X
-[] Breakthrough attempt 1
-[] Breakthrough attempt 2
-[] Breakthrough attempt 3
--[] If Ling can't attempt this do other major action
-[] Free space Free action
--[] Attached minor Y
-[] Minor action 1
-[] Minor action 2
-[] Minor action 3

The idea is that since Ling Qi is always going to cultivate in the White room we can simplify the conditional so that yrsillar will already know how to write it without needing to roll beforehand (and this will also allow us to attach a minor action to it).
 
Next week we will be able to train FSS too.

My preference for next week will be therefore 4 breaktrough attempt, FSS and EPC.

Put a mission on the first conditionnal and spiritual cultivation the second.

This way there is a chance for the next level of EPC. And yes it's closed door. But this week plan was supposed to clear the minors.
 
Last edited:
I may sound like a broken record because of this, but the dragon vale is more urgent than EPC or Zeqing, at least for the next week.

Zeqing's tutoring and EPC are both ongoing projects which give us value as time goes on.

Dragon site is an opportunity, whose value decreases as more weeks pass.

1. Obtaining it is probably necessary for even a chance for Zhengui to advance to green, and will help him in any case.

2. It will help tremendously our own cultivation due to way it will interact with sable pills (and similar drugs).

3. It will give us a way to pay back Meizhen for looking out for us at the price of her own cultivation, and would give her an edge she needs against Sun Liling in the tournament.
 
Last edited:
We're taking plans? Let's talk plans.

In terms of majors, there are 3 immediate goals we want to do (Bronze, EPC5, Dragon), one ongoing goal (Zeqing training) and one for a slightly longer term goal (getting Appraisal). Let's look at those.

I'll get to minors later, let's look at those for now.

Majors
Bronze:
By far the most important thing we can get to advance our cultivation. Once it's out of the way we get ~3 major actions/week back, which will make attaching minors much easier.

With 4 actions we're at 56-60% of getting it, of which ~30% are in 2 actions (and the odds of bronze if we do a 3 action week).

EPC5:
We can expect some phys/spirit and yin art cultivation dice, a virtual GSS (if we're lucky), and possibly a new moon quest chain.

The utility of getting it a week early depends on our bonuses there, but overall it's not a very huge xp loss if it's delayed a week. We can, e.g, do a Silverblood week and open a meridian, which together with a mission means only Zeqing training suffers. If we're not bronze then the loss is even smaller.

Getting EPC5 will take 2 actions, either training or mission. If we can choose we should prefer missions since they also give sect points, which are equivalent to tutor weeks later.

Dragon's Vale:
This is, honestly, something we should have done a long time ago. We know there will be narrative benefit to Zhengui and Meizhen's growth, and in hindsight we could've attempted it as early as week 37.

Besides the benefit to our friends and spirits, getting the Vale means we can gain an effective ~14 successes towards spiritual in a week where we open a meridian in the White Room while training spiritual at the Vale.

This makes meridians the best indirect way to work towards appraisal (besides AC training on silverblood, which is a bit stronger), and can potentially shave a week off our time to Appraisal. The current timing for week 43 Appraisal is quite tight.

Slightly longer term, we definitely want access to the site by week 44 or 45 which is when we'll be ready to do a SLP week. Just the site will give 140 Qi xp per SLP week assuming 6-action ones. Plus, it's a better Wood training site than the one we have and TRF kind of needs all the help it can get.

Zeqing:
Training music arts with Zeqing is likely better than any tutor we can get, and advances our social link with her (and likely Hanyi). It is, by far, the most efficient art training action we can do, and we can do it every week.

The question is, do we want to do it immediately and delay some of the other major action targets that give permanent cultivation benefits.

To those worrying, there shouldn't be a problem to attain Early Green or even Appraisal level in FVM and FSS. Mission successes from EPC and our naturally high dice allow us to advance music yin arts extremely fast (easily over 100xp/week).

Appraisal:
There are 3 reasons we want appraisal for:
> +1 spiritual auto
> the ability to use 2 GSS on SLP weeks (and other focus weeks)
> ability to train Appraisal arts. Likely one of our music ones.

From messing around with my planner, it turns out we can reach Appraisal in 3 or 4 weeks of training, getting it at the end of 43 ir 44. This requires 2 or 3 spiritual training actions (or free rolls) depending on target week, virtual GSS, and use of tutors on weeks 41 through 43 (with missions so we're not bleeding sect points).

Appraisal arts are iffy since they're a huge action investment. As I see it, rhe main benefit to getting Appraisal early enough is an early SLP week, in which we can try saving an action by opening 2 meridians with one, and the planning flexibility having it out of the way would allow.

All in all, Appraisal is a surprisingly low investment and can be attained very fast.

-------

Those are major action goals, but what about a specific plan for week 40?

Well, assuming we want 4 breakthrough actions (something most of us agree on I think), here's the basic layout:

> 4x breakthrough attempt actions
--> 2 or 3 is a conditional recovery, the alternative we put here has ~30% chance of happening
--> action 4 is a conditional attempt, and the alternative has ~50% chance of happening
> 5th action is free and allows us to guarantee an action (and also attach minors to)
> 6th action (if we're going closed door): a second guarantee and place to put a minor on

Assuming we prioritize EPC and Dragon site, here's what it means:
> Unless we go closed door we can't guarantee EPC5, ~50% is the best we can get and makes dragon vale unlikely
> If we guarantee Vale, EPC5 becomes ~30% and getting a mission 50%
> Closed door would let us guarantee a mission (sect points!) and have a guarantee and a 50% to decide between EPC5 and dragon, plus a 30% chance of training with Zeqing (or training spiritual/opening a meridian)

That's majors. Now let's talk minors.

Minors
Market is necessary. Perhaps not super critical if we can get our monthly discount GSS without a visit, but it's priority #1 even without it. Value of information is high and we'd feel pretty stupid if we ignore it only to find out they sell Highsuns or something.

Han Jian, we've ignored him for 5 weeks now, which is a big problem. I hope that minor still exists and that the SL still holds.

MaSu, we've ignored them for 4 weeks, and while it's not as necessary as Han Jian one, it's a minor to maintain and advance SL with 3 people. We kind of dropped the ball here as well, I hope we still have the option to do it.

Suyin. Sorry Suyin but your workplace and more creepy formations aren't as neglected as our other SL's.

Zhengui. It's possible we won't have Zhengui minor and it will either be a major Gu Tai training action, or a minor that involves both. If we do still have it, I would suggest we seriously consider skipping this week if it means something like getting +1 week at the Vale, or doing one of our neglected SL minors.

Meizhen. I asked yrs about the sentiment behind it in a PM and here's what he said:
its basically just Ling Qi deciding that she wants to contribute something materialy valuable to Meizhen for once
Still kind of iffy but a lot less ominous than we feared. There should be no problem to combine it with dragon major when we take it.

----

And that's it for next week our current immediate goals.

My personal plan preference is towards a 5-action week with guaranteed Dragon Vale and a 50% shot at mission, with either 30% EPC training (and thus EPC5) or Zeqing. This likely offloads EPC5 to week 41 to get Vale early, since a 1-week delay for EPC5 is the least important to me.

Minors TBD but preference order is:
Market >> Han Jian ~ MaSu > Zhengui ~ Meizhen (if taking dragon) > else

Attaching 2 of those minors in a 5-action week will be a pain, especially for those reluctant to double-attach, but I'd rather lose an attach minor than do closed door and delay SL's further.
 
Last edited:
Black Noise and I worked through a lot of the possibilities re: Appraisal in the same way and I basically agree and concur with all of his priority math. Dragon and EPC5 need done either this week or week 41, Bronze needs done yesterday, Appraisal can happen as early as week 43 and needs to happen at latest week 45 (so there is time to train FVM7 if we so choose; week 46+ would be giving up on it).

Where I disagree is that I think we should go closed door this week. With 4 breakthrough actions, a mission (for EPC), and obtaining the dragon site all on week 40, we can guarantee 2 completely free actions week 41 even if we want to push for the earliest green appraisal. No other set of actions lets us free slots on week 41 as easily.

Why do we need these actions? Because we have a hefty chance of still needing bronze breakthrough week 41. More than a 44% chance, which is freaking high.

In addition, we will find minors far easier to attach when we aren't doing 4 breakthrough actions every week. Even if we arent closed door, we are going to struggle with unwanted double attach minors, which people don't like.

Closed door was an expectation of a fair number of voters because we picked the 3 breakthrough action last week. It is a necessity to avoid continuing an action crunch into week 41.
 
Last edited:
Black Noise and I worked through a lot of the possibilities re: Appraisal in the same way and I basically agree and concur with all of his priority math. Dragon and EPC5 need done either this week or week 41, Bronze needs done yesterday, Appraisal can happen as early as week 43 and needs to happen at latest week 45 (so there is time to train FVM7 if we so choose; week 46+ would be giving up on it).

Where I disagree is that I think we should go closed door this week. With 4 breakthrough actions, a mission (for EPC), and obtaining the dragon site all on week 40, we can guarantee 2 completely free actions week 41 even if we want to push for the earliest green appraisal. No other set of actions lets us free slots on week 41 as easily.

Why do we need these actions? Because we have a hefty chance of still needing bronze breakthrough week 41. More than a 44% chance, which is freaking high.

In addition, we will find minors far easier to attach when we aren't doing 4 breakthrough actions every week. Even if we arent closed door, we are going to struggle with unwanted double attach minors, which people don't like.

Closed door was an expectation of a fair number of voters because we picked the 3 breakthrough action last week. It is a necessity to avoid continuing an action crunch into week 41.
The case for closed door on week 40 is strong, but not that strong. My proposed plan gets the Vale and has us in one of several states:
  • (30% successes, success) Bronze with EPC5 or 1 away from EPC5 but with Zeqing that week
  • (20% fail recover fail) no progress towards Bronze but we do get mission and have 4 actions next week for recovery+breakthrough. EPC/mission and recovery are guaranteed, and the latter can hopefully be done at Vale with an attached minor
  • (~28%) Bronze but without a mission, no problem in this case
  • (~22%) 2/3 Bronze, no mission, need recovery next week. This is the problematic one since we'd be missing 2 EPC actions and need 4 breakthrough for week 41. I'd say we save the closed door for this case instead of doing it upfront

We'd have to be unlucky to need closed door week 41, and the worst case week 40 does leave us with 4 actions we can safely dedicate to breakthrough on week 41.

That plus minors on week 40 being more valuable (since they let us address very neglected SL's earlier) is why I'm not advocating closed door myself.
 
Last edited:
. It will give us a way to pay back Meizhen for looking out for us at the price of her own cultivation, and would give her an edge she needs against Sun Liling in the tournament.
I contest this. Dragon Site is not even particularly good when you have the White room; the only advantage it has is being able to use the bonus multiple times per week, which is of rather limited use for Ling Qi and quite probably also for Bai Meizhen.

As for "paying back" Meizhen, giving her what is practically public information hardly makes a good gift.
 
I contest this. Dragon Site is not even particularly good when you have the White room; the only advantage it has is being able to use the bonus multiple times per week, which is of rather limited use for Ling Qi and quite probably also for Bai Meizhen.

As for "paying back" Meizhen, giving her what is practically public information hardly makes a good gift.
Dragon Site can be used for arts, matches up with a lot of Meizhen's primary elements, and gives a narrative bonus to spirit beasts with appropriate elements (like Cui and Zhengui).
 
Dragon Site can be used for arts, matches up with a lot of Meizhen's primary elements, and gives a narrative bonus to spirit beasts with appropriate elements (like Cui and Zhengui).
Dragon Site is rather mediocre for arts, being solidly inferior to The Black Pool or even the Starlit Meadow. It is better than the Growing Cavern or other lower-end cultivation sites, but it isn't on the level of the actually valuable sites.

It does give a bonus to Spirit Beasts, fair enough - though I think calling it a "narrative" bonus is very much a misnomer.
 
It does give a bonus to Spirit Beasts, fair enough - though I think calling it a "narrative" bonus is very much a misnomer.
*shrugs* I just called it that because there are no quantified mechanics for it's effects on spirit beasts.
Dragon Site is rather mediocre for arts, being solidly inferior to The Black Pool or even the Starlit Meadow. It is better than the Growing Cavern or other lower-end cultivation sites, but it isn't on the level of the actually valuable sites.
Comparing it to Starlit Meadow seems weird considering they work on different elements, though I guess the bonus compared to our/her predicted current sites isn't that much of an improvement.

If nothing else if we're taking the Dragon Major it's an easily attached minor, and I think it would still be useful for Meizhen outside of it's effect on Cui.
 
Hey doods, just popping in to give a status update. Things are still in progress.I would like to apologize for the steadily lengthening times between updates, but my writing time has been getting kind of cramped lately between work and leisure factors. However, things should improve and hopefully I can return to a quicker schedule by March.
 
On a secondary note, on running the numbers.I really lowballed the threshold for appraisal by a lot, given the narrative weight to advancing through green and the growth of npcs. So unfortunately I am going to be raising the threshold to 1200
 
Back
Top