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Forge of Destiny(Xianxia Quest)

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Thor's Twin said:
@Alectai Yeah, I'm not asking if they are only going to be calculated using last week's results, but I am asking if the determination of who has improved the most happens at the beginning of week 12 or the end of week 12. If it is at the beginning of week 12, then we won't be able to use the drug rush to get large results and impress even further, so we should use all of the possible drugs to increase our cultivation this week. If it is at the end, and Elder Su counts week 12 cultivation efforts, then our drug rush will most likely net us a library pass.
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It seems to be something to both reward the best, and add another target to further their growth. Hence, I suspect the announcement will be made as the truce is ending.

So it's likely that the performance in week 12 will also be taken into account.
 
Vote tally

TotallyNotEvil said:
[x] Beneath the Horizon of my Contempt Mk 2
-[X] Two Red Stone, 1 Gushing Spring Pills
-[X] Warn our friends about the Creep and our plans of doing drugs.
-[X] Instructor Zhou Class (Locked-In)
--[x] Start using arts in class. Now that an enemy knows about them, it's more valuable to try and improve in a real world situation then keep them hidden.
-[X] Go up to the vent to cultivate with Su Ling and Li Suyin
--[X] Physical Cultivation
--[X] Cultivate Forgotten Vale Melody
-[X] Talk to Han Jian, he did mention wanting to do some training
--[X] Sable Crescent Step
--[X] See about inviting Su Ling and Li Suyin
-[X] Explore the mountain
--[X] Production Hall, see what you could get for the staff. Maybe a quote for how much a similar talisman would cost would let you know how much it's truly worth?
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This plan could become much more efficient if you swapped out Physical Cultivation with Zephyr's Breath, and used a Sable Light Pill and a Qi Foundation Pill. That would give us three rolls for Qi Increase, with a lot of dice.
Adhoc vote count started by notanautomaton on May 8, 2017 at 3:20 PM, finished with 297 posts and 33 votes.
  • [x] Beneath the Horizon of my Contempt Mk 2
    [X] Beneath the Horizon of my Contempt.
    [X]Fast and Steady
    [X] Plan Creep protection
    - [X] Resources: 2 Red Spirt Stones
    -[X] Spend some time with Gu Xiulan and ask for advice... she has to have some experience with unwanted... suitors, right?
    -[X] Go up to the vent to cultivate with Su Ling and Li Suyin
    --[X] Cultivate Spiritual
    -[X] Talk to Han Jian, he did mention wanting to do some training
    --[X] Reveal SCS and FVM
    [X] Beneath the Horizon of my Contempt.
    -[X] Two Red Stone, 1 Argent Accumulation Pill, 1 Gushing Spring Pills, 1 Qi Foundation Pill.
    -[X] Instructor Zhou Class (Locked-In)
    --[x] Warn Gui Xuilian and Han Jian that we've picked up a Stalker. Also that we're going to be doing all the drugs next week, and probably won't be good company.
    --[X] Start using arts in class. Now that an enemy knows about them, it's more valuable to try and improve in a real world situation then keep them hidden.
    -[X] Elder Su's Class (Locked-In)
    --[X] Ask Elder Su how would one go about getting the next Argent cultivation art once one get the 5th layer.
    --[X] Argent Soul
    -[X] Go up to the vent to cultivate with Su Ling and Li Suyin
    --[X] Warn them that we're going to be doing all the drugs next week, and will have a zombie for a face.
    --[X] Cultivate Forgotten Vale Melody
    -[X] Talk to Han Jian, he did mention wanting to do some training
    --[X] Sable Crescent Step
    --[X] See about inviting Su Ling and Li Suyin
    [X] Cultivate on your own
    -[X] Qi
    -[X] Head to the market for some shopping
    [X] Plan Art Prep
    - [X] Resources: 2x Red Spirit Stones, Gushing Water Pill, Qi Foundation, Sable Light
    - [X] Ask Han Jian and Gu Xiulan if they ever figured out what the tokens do
    [X] Cultivate on your own
    --- [X] FVM
    --- [X] ZB
    -[X] Talk to Han Jian, he did mention wanting to do some training
    --- [X] Train SCS
    --- [X] Warn about Huang Da and his capabilities
    --- [X] Ask to invite Su Ling and Li Suyin
    --- [X] Reveal FVM and SCS
    --- [X] Let them know that we're going to do heavy cultivation next week so we might be imitating a corpse doll
    -[X] Go up to the vent to cultivate with Su Ling and Li Suyin
    -[X] Physical
    --- [X] If Su Ling and Li Suyin don't know yet, update them on Huang Da's capabilities and actions (using vent while we're not there)
    [x] Beneath the Horizon of my Contempt Mk 2
    -[X] Two Red Stone, 1 Gushing Spring Pills
    -[X] Warn our friends about the Creep and our plans of doing drugs.
    -[X] Instructor Zhou Class (Locked-In)
    --[X] Start using arts in class. Now that an enemy knows about them, it's more valuable to try and improve in a real world situation then keep them hidden.
    -[X] Go up to the vent to cultivate with Su Ling and Li Suyin
    --[X] Physical Cultivation
    --[X] Cultivate Forgotten Vale Melody
    -[X] Talk to Han Jian, he did mention wanting to do some training
    --[X] Sable Crescent Step
    --[X] See about inviting Su Ling and Li Suyin
    -[X] Explore the mountain
    --[X] Production Hall, see what you could get for the staff. Maybe a quote for how much a similar talisman would cost would let you know how much it's truly worth?
    [X] Plan Market and Celestial Tokens
    -[X] [Pills] Two Red Stone
    -[X] [Free action] Warn our friends about Huang Da and our plans of doing drugs.
    -[X] [Free action] Refill Qi Cards. One for Mist of Vale and ally if possible, one for Crescent's Grace, and ask Bai Meizhen to fill the last.
    -[X] Instructor Zhou Class (Locked-In)
    --[X] Start using arts in class. Now that an enemy knows about them, it's more valuable to try and improve in a real world situation then keep them hidden.
    -[X] Go up to the vent to cultivate with Su Ling and Li Suyin
    --[X] Physical Cultivation
    -[X] Talk to Han Jian, he did mention wanting to do some training
    --[X] Sable Crescent Step
    --[X] See about inviting Su Ling and Li Suyin
    -[X] Head to the market for some shopping
    --[X] Try and find the original owner first to sell the staff, as she's likely to want it the most thus be the best customer due to it's status as heirloom. Check her background first, and if she's liable to initiate conflict gift it to Elder Su instead.
    --[X] With Gu Xuilan's aid.
    - [X] Try to puzzle out the tokens left from the test
    --[X] Ask Gi Xuilan and Han Jian if they figured out what they can do.
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notanautomaton said:
Vote tally


This plan could become much more efficient if you swapped out Physical Cultivation with Zephyr's Breath, and used a Sable Light Pill and a Qi Foundation Pill. That would give us three rolls for Qi Increase, with a lot of dice.
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Except that's a huge waste of a Sable Pill, on a roll that isn't at all maximized for it. The Sable Pill is for, well not closed door cultivation because we aren't quite there yet, but as close as we can get.
 
hmmm, I thought it was written down who won the Qi pills this last week, but I can't find it. Would someone point out who won the Qi pills this week, because I don't think Creepydude did?
If Creepydude didn't get a Qi pill this week even though he broke through to yellow then he might be out of the running for the top three spots, which would be ironic because he fought us for the express purpose of securing one of the top three.
 
TheLastOne said:
Except that's a huge waste of a Sable Pill, on a roll that isn't at all maximized for it. The Sable Pill is for, well not closed door cultivation because we aren't quite there yet, but as close as we can get.
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We really need to use them before we Break Through due to the likely case that they won't be useable in Yellow. As such we can afford to use them somewhat (we're only losing one-two rolls) suboptimally. Unless we can use multiple Sable Light Pills to get ten Qi increase rolls in the final week...
 
notanautomaton said:
We really need to use them before we Break Through due to the likely case that they won't be useable in Yellow. As such we can afford to use them somewhat (we're only losing one-two rolls) suboptimally. Unless we can use multiple Sable Light Pills to get ten Qi increase rolls in the final week...
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Sable Light Pills have no limit on when we can use them.
 
@yrsillar if we use multiple Sable Light Pills in a week, do we get a roll for each action and each pill? So if we spent five actions on the relevant actions, would we get ten rolls, or five?
 
Alectai said:
Yeah, pretty sure that we can't use Red Stones anymore once we hit Yellow.

That being said, the spirit vein we found is good for Yellow too, so yay?

Anyway, speaking of Pill Week, how are we going to distribute our actions?
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Something like:
[]Elder Su: Heart Meridian
[]Tea: SCS
[]Cultivate: Leg Meridian
[]Cultivate: Heart or Lung or Spine Meridian (depending on what people want)
[]Suyin: SCS
[]Han Jian: FVM

This would let us have 23~ Overflow from the three discrete meridian actions, and, depending on how Overflow works for Arts as well as training bonuses I am not quite sure on yet, 10~ for FVM and 7~ for SCS. So Peak Red with a good margin if @TotallyNotEvil's plan wins this week.
 
Arkeus said:
Something like:
[]Elder Su: Heart Meridian
[]Tea: SCS
[]Cultivate: Leg Meridian
[]Cultivate: Heart or Lung or Spine Meridian (depending on what people want)
[]Suyin: SCS
[]Han Jian: FVM

This would let us have 23~ Overflow from the three discrete meridian actions, and, depending on how Overflow works for Arts as well as training bonuses I am not quite sure on yet, 10~ for FVM and 7~ for SCS. So Peak Red with a good margin if @TotallyNotEvil's plan wins this week.
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I would say we should go


Elder Su: Lung Meridian
Tea Heart
Suyin SCS
Han Jian FVM
Personal Zephyr, Leg.

We get a lesson bonus from teacher - while Lung is probably a safe roll either way, I want no surprises on a roll that can hurt us to fail. The other two Medridian go into personal because we get somewhat better we get bonuses when training with others, so I want to maximize those towards our more important arts.


Edit: Did tea get the teaching bonus less time? If so, we should shift ether SCS or FVM there.
 
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If we wanted to do a full tea, art, and meridian turn, then wouldn't it be smart to also use Zhou's class to train an art?

Zhou: FVM
Elder Su: Lung Meridian
Tea: Heart
Suyin: Leg
Han Jian: SCS
Personal: Zephyr and ?? (another meridian)

With the sable pill, this would get us 7 individual Qi procs
 
Thor's Twin said:
If we wanted to do a full tea, art, and meridian turn, then wouldn't it be smart to also use Zhou's class to train an art?

Zhou: FVM
Elder Su: Lung Meridian
Tea: Heart
Suyin: Leg
Han Jian: SCS
Personal: Zephyr and ?? (another meridian)

With the sable pill, this would get us 7 individual Qi procs
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Can we use Zhou's class that way? He has a much more regimented class then Elder Su.
 
TheLastOne said:
I would say we should go


Elder Su: Lung Meridian
Tea Heart
Suyin SCS
Han Jian FVM
Personal Zephyr, Leg.

We get a lesson bonus from teacher - while Lung is probably a safe roll either way, I want no surprises on a roll that can hurt us to fail. The other two Medridian go into personal because we get somewhat better we get bonuses when training with others, so I want to maximize those towards our more important arts.


Edit: Did tea get the teaching bonus less time? If so, we should shift ether SCS or FVM there.
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No, we should got Heart, Spine, and Arm. We need more combat power, and we need it fast.
 
TheLastOne said:
We get a lesson bonus from teacher - while Lung is probably a safe roll either way, I want no surprises on a roll that can hurt us to fail. The other two Medridian go into personal because we get somewhat better we get bonuses when training with others, so I want to maximize those towards our more important arts.
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Training with others- or lessons- don't seem to work like what I feel you think.

Lessons from teachers give a static bonus for the week toward specific actions we can have (for example currently, 4 for AS, 4 spiritual, 3 meridians/Qi), it doesn't matter if you are in the lesson or alone when cultivating for a particular thing as long as you had the lesson.

Cooperative study, OTOH, give a small bonus (usually +2) for the kind of thing you are training for for the week. So if you train with Li Suyin an Art, you gain +2 for any arts during the week, even if you are also training others alone. Likewise, it can also give +2 or +1 to actions that are 'down the tree'. So, Art would influence Spiritual Cultivation. Argent Soul would influence Spiritual Cultivation. Neither Art nor Argent Soul would influence each others.

Your plan works, too, it's just that going ZB gives a bit less Overflow depending on how it works- I myself don't mind having less Overflow, but I suspect some people will want it.

@Thor's Twin I would like that... but it means not getting to Peak Gold, and a lot of people really want that.

@Humbaba I'm still weirded out you are seemingly missing that getting AS4 before yellow is not impressive, it just means she won't throw us out of the class. Working toward AS5 before yellow is definitely something that she wants, as not only does she know getting it in Late Red is great though not needed, and getting it as fast as possible in Yellow is what one should do, but she also personally is putting a lot of effort into teaching AS currently, and thus knows it will be much harder to reach it after the lessons end.
TheLastOne said:
Can we use Zhou's class that way? He has a much more regimented class then Elder Su.
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Yeah we can, Yrsillar mentioned it recently.
notanautomaton said:
No, we should got Heart, Spine, and Arm. We need more combat power, and we need it fast.
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Urgh, let's not have more than one arm every ten hearts. Spine is maybe.
 
notanautomaton said:
No, we should got Heart, Spine, and Arm. We need more combat power, and we need it fast.
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Don't disagree, but we'll get arguments if we go for arm arts. A number of people really don't want attack techniques even though they'll eventually become essential. We know we'll probably need more unlocked for SCS and FVM, so going for them is a safe vote.
 
TheLastOne said:
Don't disagree, but we'll get arguments if we go for arm arts. A number of people really don't want attack techniques even though they'll eventually become essential. We know we'll probably need more unlocked for SCS and FVM, so going for them is a safe vote.
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I'm hoping that those people will have quieted down after the Huang Da fight, where we would have done much better with an Arm or Spine art.
 
@Arkeus I'm not saying that we shouldn't try for peak gold, what I'm saying is that if we are dead set on a tea, sable week then going all in might be the way to do it. We can retool our cultivation afterward to make up the deficiency in physical cultivation that occurred in week 13 if needed.

@notanautomaton Probably not. We were fighting him on less than half qi and damage art would not have allowed our allies to touch him at all.
 
notanautomaton said:
I'm hoping that those people will have quieted down after the Huang Da fight, where we would have done much better with an Arm or Spine art.
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They haven't. See above.

I mean, I'll support you if you introduce that vote. Hell, I might introduce that vote. Though I would go Arms Spine Legs - I'm pretty sure SCS will require a third Legs to max out, while we can't go anywhere further with our current arts with one more heart alone.

Though that defensive earth art we saw was pretty nice. It made our enemies slower. Combined with making us faster, and that could have some nice symmetry.
 
TheLastOne said:
They haven't. See above.

I mean, I'll support you if you introduce that vote. Hell, I might introduce that vote. Though I would got Arms Spine Legs - I'm pretty sure SCS will require a third Legs to max out, while we can't go anywhere further with our current arts with one more heart alone.
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I just don't get how people think that we can survive long-term without any dedicated attack arts.

And I think we should go heart or lungs on the odds that Forgotten Vale Melody will require another of those. As a compromise how about we only grab Arms and Spine, and spend the other actions on increasing our Techniques? That way we don't have to worry about picking wrong.
 
notanautomaton said:
We didn't need to spend any Qi, the Damage Art's passives would have been enough.
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What the hell. No, it wouldn't have. Our debuff meant we did 3 times as much damage as we would have done otherwise. Damage without debuff means that while we might have done some more damage (doubtful, he used Qi to negate the 3 points of damage we did) it would not have allowed either Su Lin to hit him twice for lots of damage with her own arms arts, nor Li Suyin to hit him.

This was a classic fight where Arms meridians would have made things worse, not better. Same for golem.
TheLastOne said:
I mean, I'll support you if you introduce that vote. Hell, I might introduce that vote. Though I would go Arms Spine Legs - I'm pretty sure SCS will require a third Legs to max out, while we can't go anywhere further with our current arts with one more heart alone.

Though that defensive earth art we saw was pretty nice. It made our enemies slower. Combined with making us faster, and that could have some nice symmetry.
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I'm pretty sure SCS has something like 15+ Layers, but I might be wrong. I don't expect it to end before Indigo at the earliest.
 
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@TheLastOne It would indeed have some nice symmetry.
I personally don't mind an attacking art or a defense art, but a cognizant argument will have to be made. An argument that looks towards the future of where Ling Qi is going, what difficulties Ling Qi will face, and the best ways to defeat those challenges. Any argument based on the past won't really convince anyone because as is shown we have gone a significant distance without any attack arts have come out fairly fine. There will definitely come a point where attack arts will be mandatory to have in order for us to do damage, but there will be workarounds for that. Bound spirits, allies, various mental influencing effects, and other possibilities that won't involve directly attacking an individual.
 
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Arkeus said:
What the hell. No, it wouldn't have. Our debuff meant we did 3 times as much damage as we would have done otherwise. Damage without debuff means that while we might have done some more damage (doubtful, he used Qi to negate the 3 points of damage we did) it would not have allowed either Su Lin to hit him twice for lots of damage with her own arms arts, nor Li Suyin to hit him.

This was a classic fight where Arms meridians would have made things worse, not better. Same for golem.
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Yes it would have. Passives generally give bonuses of 1-2. A dedicated damage art would have given us 1-2 dice, at no extra cost. Therefore it would have been better to have an additional Arm technique than to not have an additional arm technique.

Thor's Twin said:
@TheLastOne It would indeed have some nice symmetry.
I personally don't mind an attacking art or a defense art, but it a cognizant argument will have to be made. An argument that looks towards the future of where Ling Qi is going, what difficulties Ling Qi will face, and the best ways to defeat those challenges. Any argument based on the past won't really convince anyone because as is shown we have gone a significant distance without any attack arts have come out fairly fine. There will definitely come a point where attack arts will be mandatory to have in order for us to do damage, but there will be workarounds for that. Bound spirits, allies, various mental influencing effects, and other possibilities that won't involve directly attacking an individual.
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An argument that doesn't look to the past is on unstable grounds, at best. We saw in the last fight that we can't just sit back and debuff for all time. We'll need to attack eventually (either because we were attacked on our own or because our allies have fallen) and when we do we'll need to make sure that we're not just a limp noodle flopping around. The people saying 'we don't need arm arts' are optimistic at best and deluded at worst. We were attacked with two friends, and we still needed to attack.
 
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