A Sword Without a Hilt: A Song of Ice and Fire/D&D 3.5 Crossover

[Duesal]

[X] Azel

@Azel, this might be a good time to give them Valyrian Steel as a further show of good will. Braga already has a Valyrian Steel Axe loaned to him which can be made a permanent gift. Maybe a Longsword for the Magnar to do with as he pleases as well?

Also, DP said it would help convince them if they realized that we were revitalizing the Night's Watch to its original purpose. Can we mention that as part of our war efforts?

 

[Massgamer]

[X] Azel

@Azel maybe add asking for information not mentioned in update? Other Free Folk groups (hopefully Mance's since his son is with him) and other things mentioned in last vote not answered?

 

[zxzx24]

The weirwood staff is also still... Mostly.

Something.

It's an epic grade chekovs gun that's for certain.

 

[Duesal]

The weirwood staff is also still... Mostly.

Something.

It's an epic grade chekovs gun that's for certain.

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Also, when they come south and settle on one of the uninhabited islands, we're growing them a Heart Tree of their choosing right off the bat.

Not to mention training their hopefuls as mages and such where we can.

 

[TotallyNotEvil]

s, one you'd heard before after hard fought victories

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Second person.

Even given the detached, protective menace that both of the apparent women radiated around their charge.

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It's not like he'd put Super Mummies in hats to take care of children or something

I literally cannot answer you without massive spoilers that I'm going to have discovered in story. Sorry

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The other question is, are they still essentially terminators that can tank RPGs with their faces and throw cars around?

Also, Technological Mindblank when

 

[Walliseatscheese]

That is very heroic stupid. He needs a good talking to about that.

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Yeah these guys just being stupid. There's no point dying if he's literally going to be helping the enemy by doing so. Heroically dying isn't good if your death doesn't weaken the enemy but literally makes them stronger.

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They're obviously far more useful as guides and teachers for everyone else down south. Just... just no to this plan of theirs.

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"We know the truth about the great enemy and are warriors seasoned in battle with it. So when it attacks in greatest forces that we can even hope to match, we will divide ourselves and sacrifice our most seasoned warriors so that the weaker ones travel alone to a place with people who are hostile to them.

Also we haven't thought about telling the rest of the world about the apocalypse because we are badass and they are not."

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Like DP has said,

To be fair it's more a case of the rest of the world barely existing to them. There's a line in the books about the Thenns considering the Wall the end of the world. They really had no idea how to get the word out in a way that would be believed.

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it's less of an issue of "Hurr Durr Warrior Pride" and more that they legitimately are unaware of their other options. Taking Styr aside to a private room and giving him a geography lesson and telling him straight up "These are my lands, and these are Thennlands in comparison so you have an idea of the scale. I'm forming a warhost to fight the cold and while I can train them to fight, I can train them in magic, the Thenn are the only ones who have truly fought the Enemy for so long, who can teach others about Winter. I'm willing to help you relocate all of your people and anything and everything you think would be of use to your people and give you lands to rule as your own underneath my own laws. I'm willing to help relocate all who are on this side of the Wall, for the dead only help the Enemy. What say you?"

Styr's plan basically amounts to "Leave a rearguard action to delay the Others as long as possible and hopefully destroy anything the Others would be able to repurpose for their own ends, everyone else heads South of the Thennlands and tries to work something out." If we can open his ears to other ways, he should be willing to listen.

I'm personally in favor of pulling him to a private room to talk this out rather than doing this all in a public format, but the whole "exploding mountain Dragon" thing probably would let us swing it.

 

[Azel]

It's not like he'd put Super Mummies in hats to take care of children or something

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Indeed. That would be silly, unless he had really no other choice.

Instead, we will put the Harbinger in charge of our wards once he is finished.

 

[Deliste]

For a minute there I thought he had this. @DragonParadox, something that could deflect multiple touch spells per round and had evasion + high saves would be difficult for us to deal with!

To be clear, it's an epic feat. But older Dragons can take those, can't they?

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Are you implying he's a Dragon?

Get out.

Mors Fighter 2/Barbarian 5
Braga: Barbarian 3/Ranger 5

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This is hilarious.

Mors: Trained as a lad by Master of Arms, goes on to be a berserker in his maturity.

Braga: A berserker as a lad that gains structure in his maturity.

 

[Duesal]

Like DP has said,



it's less of an issue of "Hurr Durr Warrior Pride" and more that they legitimately are unaware of their other options. Taking Styr aside to a private room and giving him a geography lesson and telling him straight up "These are my lands, and these are Thennlands in comparison so you have an idea of the scale. I'm forming a warhost to fight the cold and while I can train them to fight, I can train them in magic, the Thenn are the only ones who have truly fought the Enemy for so long, who can teach others about Winter. I'm willing to help you relocate all of your people and anything and everything you think would be of use to your people and give you lands to rule as your own underneath my own laws. I'm willing to help relocate all who are on this side of the Wall, for the dead only help the Enemy. What say you?"

Styr's plan basically amounts to "Leave a rearguard action to delay the Others as long as possible and hopefully destroy anything the Others would be able to repurpose for their own ends, everyone else heads South of the Thennlands and tries to work something out." If we can open his ears to other ways, he should be willing to listen.

I'm personally in favor of pulling him to a private room to talk this out rather than doing this all in a public format, but the whole "exploding mountain Dragon" thing probably would let us swing it.

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Nothing in my post indicated I thought it was due to their pride. At the end of the day their plan is a bad plan. It might make sense to them, but it's still a bad plan.

 

[Walliseatscheese]

Mors: Trained as a lad by Master of Arms, goes on to be a berserker in his maturity.

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The Bear Man has a lot to be angry about all told.

Braga: A berserker as a lad that gains structure in his maturity.

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The Man Hunter on the otherhand is basically living in a resurgence of his people, where lost marvels of long ago ages have been rediscovered.

Nothing in my post indicated I thought it was due to their pride. At the end of the day their plan is a bad plan. It might make sense to them, but it's still a bad plan.

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That is true, I just collected the posts commenting on the badness of the plan and reduced what I saw talking about of their primary motivation down into an instensely short and simple phrase that cuts out the complexity of the "Wildling v Summerlander" cultural conflict.

 

[brmj]

I don't think any amount of forting up is going to change the fact that the Others are going to sweep through them. Beyond the wall is a death trap and the more that die the more bodies they get

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If we reinforce the hell out of those wards, raise a Lys-scale heart tree to back them up, fortify everything to bullshit levels with our absurd engineering capabilities, and create a means of fast, large-scale travel to and from our realm for resupply and evacuation, this stops being a liability and starts being a dagger at the Other's backs, preventing them from turning there full power and attention southwards or punishing them if they try to. A way to threaten them and force them to divide their forces at relatively little real risk to ours. It would be a big investment to set it up adequately, but one that could be damn useful in the end.

 

[Goldfish]

[X] Azel

@Azel I feel that we should play on...not exactly their pride...but perhaps their sense of accomplishment(?) in surviving and even thriving to an extent this far north, so close to the Others' territory. What they have accomplished is truly impressive; managing to remain culturally cohesive while continuing to function as a society for 6,000 years in the face of such adversity and isolation can't be overlooked. But the time has come for them to leave their home, though should we prevail and defeat the Others, they could of course return one day in the future. Now, however, we need them. Not simply for their martial skills, which truthfully are not that amazing when compared to the Legion, but for their knowledge. We need them to train the Legion and our other allies in cold weather survival and combat, especially against foes like the Others, to whom the cold is a devastating weapon.

 

[Azel]

If we reinforce the hell out of those wards, raise a Lys-scale heart tree to back them up, fortify everything to bullshit levels with our absurd engineering capabilities, and create a means of fast, large-scale travel to and from our realm for resupply and evacuation, this stops being a liability and starts being a dagger at the Other's backs, preventing them from turning there full power and attention southwards or punishing them if they try to. A way to threaten them and force them to divide their forces at relatively little real risk to ours. It would be a big investment to set it up adequately, but one that could be damn useful in the end.

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The thing is, all of these resources could also be spent on the Wall instead.

My tentative plan for the War for Dawn is to fortify and arm the Wall with everything we've got, exploiting the existing defensive structure to force the White Walkers to spend a lot of strength on contesting it. Then, when we've bled them for every meter of ground as dearly as we could, we start the counter-attack.

But Thennhold is so far away and isolated that it's impossible to hold. Even with Gate resupply, we would still be stuck in a valley surrounded by mountains and there is nothing that would force the White Walkers to move to the Wall instead of gathering their full might in those mountains and wrecking Thennhold and all our investments there.

 

[Azel]

[X] Azel

@Azel I feel that we should play on...not exactly their pride...but perhaps their sense of accomplishment(?) in surviving and even thriving to an extent this far north, so close to the Others' territory. What they have accomplished is truly impressive; managing to remain culturally cohesive while continuing to function as a society for 6,000 years in the face of such adversity and isolation can't be overlooked. But the time has come for them to leave their home, though should we prevail and defeat the Others, they could of course return one day in the future. Now, however, we need them. Not simply for their martial skills, which truthfully are not that amazing when compared to the Legion, but for their knowledge. We need them to train the Legion and our other allies in cold weather survival and combat, especially against foes like the Others, to whom the cold is a devastating weapon.

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Added a line to that effect.

 

[Duesal]

The thing is, all of these resources could also be spent on the Wall instead.

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More or less this.

All of this lore?

From the fact that this 'Lokar' still has a name to be remembered by you suspect his death was good by the measure of his folk, but you do not press, asking instead: "What did they learn?"

"How to mend broken boundary stones, how to spell wells so they will not freeze even in the dead of winter, and how to find the two-skins the wargs with a spelled stone," the Magnar says proudly, and rightly so, for you had never heard of a way to find who might be a warg though doubtless Bloodraven could have told you if you had thought it worth his time to look for such a thing.

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The Night's Watch needs that. We need that.

Also, @Azel, your thoughts on gifting them one or two weapons of Valyrian Steel? We do actually have quite a few spares in the armory, and I feel it would be worth quite a lot in negotiations.

 

[T_of_A]

Great chapter Snowfire!

her pronunciation of Viserys' name was loaded with meaning,

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I disagree.
Indeed, the phrase "was full of meaning" doesn't actually convey any meaning at all. Is she doubting that the name is real? Impressed by him ? Doubting that the idea is really from Viserys? Scornful of his efforts? Suggesting that the name is plot-relevant in and of itself somehow ? Is she hate-filled, confused, dismissive, horny, impressed, amused ?

#PetPeeve

 

[Azel]

Also, @Azel, your thoughts on gifting them one or two weapons of Valyrian Steel? We do actually have quite a few spares in the armory, and I feel it would be worth quite a lot in negotiations.

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What kind of weapons?

 

[Duesal]

What kind of weapons?

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For one thing letting Braga keep the Valyrian Steel Axe we loaned him (and letting Mors Umber do the same for his axe while we're at it), then gifting Magnar either a Valyrian Steel Greatsword or a Valyrian Steel Longsword. He probably won't wield it himself because sacrifice spear, but he's got plenty of capable subordinates take up the blade for him.

 

[Goldfish]

What kind of weapons?

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The VS axe we loaned Braga. We should let him keep it as a reward for willingly facing the danger of the Others' cave.

It shows that we are generous, but not frivolous, willing to give a gift which means something rather than gold or meaningless praise.

 

[Azel]

-[X] Furthermore, let Braga and Mors keep the axes you loaned them and gift a VS Greatsword to Styr to do with as he pleases, as a sign that, no matter what the Thenn will choose, we will aid and support them as this is a war all men must fight together.

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@Duesal, done.

 

[Duesal]

@Duesal, done.

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Thank you.

Also @Azel, I think we should call attention to the following:

That would involve dragging undead though the lands of who knows how many hostile clans which would try to kill them for bringing such a thing along all in the hope that the Night's Watch (of which they have heard many bad things of an d basically nothing good) will be able to do... something about it (they have no clue about the kningdoms of the south or their politics).

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Would it help convince the Thenns to come with us if we inform them that we've been busy rebuilding the Night's Watch and they're now well aware of the Long Night, being supplied by us, and under instructions to allow all Free Folk to evacuate to our lands?

They might have a very dim view of the Night's Watch, but we're a different story.

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It might help yes

Good night guys, see you tomorrow with more from the Far North and the festival.

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A big reason the Thenns had their doomed plan was that even the Night's Watch had fallen from its original purpose. It would probably count for quite a lot if we not only told them what we've been doing to restore the Night's Watch to its original purpose, but perhaps even taking Magnar or some of his representatives to meet with Lord Commander Mormont.

You don't necessarily have to, I just thought it would be helpful.

 

[Azel]

Thank you.

Also @Azel, I think we should call attention to the following:


A big reason the Thenns had their doomed plan was that even the Night's Watch had fallen from its original purpose. It would probably count for quite a lot if we not only told them what we've been doing to restore the Night's Watch to its original purpose, but perhaps even taking Magnar or some of his representatives to meet with Lord Commander Mormont.

You don't necessarily have to, I just thought it would be helpful.

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I really don't know where and how to incorporate that into my vote without coming off as a chain of bragging.

 

[Sqweaktoy]

Great chapter Snowfire!


I disagree.
Indeed, the phrase "was full of meaning" doesn't actually convey any meaning at all. Is she doubting that the name is real? Impressed by him ? Doubting that the idea is really from Viserys? Scornful of his efforts? Suggesting that the name is plot-relevant in and of itself somehow ? Is she hate-filled, confused, dismissive, horny, impressed, amused ?

#PetPeeve

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I might be benefiting from my position as Snowfire's sounding board, but it made sense in context to me?
The rest of the piece make it clear that the 'meaning' inherent here is several fold. Both an acknowledgement that things wouldn't have progressed this far without Viserys and that the idea was already something she had been working towards before he hit the scene. When coupled with the satisfaction mentioned previously and the repeated expression that Harry better be able to deliver the promised miracle worker after all she did to line up the shot for him, there's also an edge of pressure to it a la 'Mr. Targaryen, who you vouched for.'

I'm not sure why that all needs to be spelled out right in that little break between dialogue, seems like it would overly affect the pacing of the conversation?

 

[Duesal]

I really don't know where and how to incorporate that into my vote without coming off as a chain of bragging.

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Perhaps just informing them while OOC noting it's not supposed to be bragging? This is stuff they need to know.

 

[Snowfire]

It's not like he'd put Super Mummies in hats to take care of children or something

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They're very much nonstandard. Most obviously in that the appearance they're using? That's not a Ribbon of Disguise. Also how they're actually being effective teachers and caretakers. It's metaphysical merging, like how Hellfire Ray fired literal DF Hellfire at the Fomor High Noble. Or why Dark Sister is now a Guardian Spirit.

The other question is, are they still essentially terminators that can tank RPGs with their faces and throw cars around?

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Why yes, Viserys takes the safety of children, especially those he's taken as wards, exceptionally seriously.

why the Outer Gates are as strong as they are

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Za? Little confused, actually, as to where this is coming from. Is it just the inability of Viserys to Plane Shift out, or something else?