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A Different Breed (Warhammer 29K)

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Captainwolf said:
I would skip standard squads, because I don't ever see why we would have more than 1 of each in a detachment, but other than that yeah might as well take all the options
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Standard squads might be one of the most powerful and effective options depending on what having officers leading squads actually does.

For example, Warmasters might make very effective squad commanders for shock infantry, so we'd want to take a squad of them to split across seven infantry units. Or Force Commanders might be similarly useful added to lead tank squadrons in an armoured detachment.

Until we try this out, we probably won't know.

I think it's worth taking the option and trying it out. Things like armoured or shock infantry detachments entirely in Ithilmar are expensive enough to probably be worth it. If you're spending 7000 EP worth of production on a detachment it's worth spending multiple turns worth of officer production on one as well.

With expensive detachments we could easily require multiple Foundry/Forge turns worth of production for their equipment, so requiring multiple 'Academy' turns worth of production for their officers is a fair comparative investment.
 
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Alratan said:
For example, Warmasters might make very effective squad commanders for shock infantry, so we'd want to take a squad of them to split across seven infantry units. Or Force Commanders might be similarly useful added to lead tank squadrons in an armoured detachment.
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But we can get squad leaders whose entire job is to do that, instead of commanders who have a focus split between leading squads and leading detachments.
Mechanis said:
You can add more and or better Leader Unit types later, yes... but that costs more AP the more types you already have. And competes with getting more advanced versions of your existing leader types. And, at least in the immediate sense, with other leadership options, like Squad Leaders, that you might want to invest in in the next few turns.
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I think we should go for standard squads of force commanders and warmasters, and single units for the warsingers and warseers.

Warseers should be individuals because we don't want to have the recruiting of command squads to require seer actions, as we need those for the curses.
so with the warseers, we'll be recruiting them on an ad hoc basis, i.e. When we have seers available.

Warsingers should be separate, because they take so much longer to train than the other officer types

[x] Plan: Numbers, Flexibility and redundancy.
-[x] Single Units
-- [x] Warsinger Captain
-- [x] Warseer Commander
-[x] Standard Squad
--[x] Force Commander
--[x] Warmaster

Approval votes:
[x] Plan Simple Solutions
[x] Plan: By Our Powers Combined
 
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Moratorium is up, so here is my plan. There is no reason to take standard squads, because having more than one of each leader in a detachment does nothing, and they aren't trained to be better at fighting than our normal soldiers, they are trained to be better at leading. Also, we can get dedicated squad leaders to command our individual squads.

[X] Plan Simple Solutions
-[X] Single Units
--[X] Force Commander
--[X] Warsinger Captain
--[X] Warmaster
--[X] Warseer Commander
-[X] Detachment Command Squad
--[X] Force Commander
--[X] Warsinger Captain
-[X] Warhost Command Squad
--[X] Force Commander
--[X] Warsinger Captain
--[X] Warmaster
--[X] Warseer Commander
 
I see no reason not to take all the options so we can experiment with them and learn what works best in the field. We're much too ignorant now to rule anything out;

[X] Plan All of the Above
- [X] Single Units
-- [X] [Single] Force Commander
-- [X] [Single] Warsinger Captain
-- [X] [Single] Warmaster
-- [X] [Single] Warseer Commander
- [X] Standard Squad
-- [X] [Standard] Force Commander
-- [X] [Standard] Warsinger Captain
-- [X] [Standard] Warmaster
-- [X] [Standard] Warseer Commander
- [X] Command Squad
-- [X] [Command] Force Commander
-- [X] [Command] Warsinger Captain
-- [X] [Command] Warmaster
-- [X] [Command] Warseer Commander

Captainwolf said:
Moratorium is up, so here is my plan. There is no reason to take standard squads, because having more than one of each leader in a detachment does nothing, and they aren't trained to be better at fighting than our normal soldiers, they are trained to be better at leading. Also, we can get dedicated squad leaders to command our individual squads.
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We have no reason to believe that having more than one officer in a detachment does nothing, nor that squad leaders are as good as more highly trained officers. Warmasters, for example might be able to grant Khaine's blessings to a squad at greater intensity than they can to a detachment. We just don't know.

I very strongly doubt we'd get the option for standard squads if it did literally nothing as you're suggesting.

You're just making a load of assumptions about things we have no information on.
 
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Unless I'm badly misreading this post:
Mechanis said:
The latter. You may, after all, wish to invest in other Rare Unit types that could be added to those squads before formally establishing them, after all.

To use an Imperium example, a Guard Command Squad doesn't just have a General in it, but a Commissar, perhaps two or three flavors of Psyker, a voxman, a standard bearer, probably a naval, Mechanicum, Ecclesiarchal and administratum liason, perhaps an assassin or two, and of course a pile of bodyguards even if each of the Important Personages only brings one or two.
You probably aren't going to get to quite that level of size and variaty for some time --- if ever --- but you will probably want to invest in a few other options besides just these four units.
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we aren't currently establishing what's in any particular Command Squad, just choosing which leaders we will have the option of putting in Command Squads when we get around to actually designing them. As such...
Prepost edit out Plan Anything Goes

[X] Plan All of the Above
 
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I'm not quite willing to assume there's no cost to the "maximum flexibility" option. So I'm dropping the really expensive commanders from Standard Squads and the cheap ones from Singletons.

[x] Plan: By Our Powers Combined
-[x][Single] Warsinger Captain
-[x][Single] Warseer Commander
-[x][Standard] Force Commander
-[x][Standard] Warmaster
-[x][Command] Force Commander
-[x][Command] Warsinger Captain
-[x][Command] Warmaster
-[x][Command] Warseer Commander
 
Candesce said:
I'm not quite willing to assume there's no cost to the "maximum flexibility" option. So I'm dropping the really expensive commanders from Standard Squads and the cheap ones from Singletons.

[x] Plan: By Our Powers Combined
-[x][Single] Warsinger Captain
-[x][Single] Warseer Commander
-[x][Standard] Force Commander
-[x][Standard] Warmaster
-[x][Command] Force Commander
-[x][Command] Warsinger Captain
-[x][Command] Warmaster
-[x][Command] Warseer Commander
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I would add force commander for the single, they have very basic powers and that makes great officers for squads
[x] Plan: By Our Powers Combined
 
Profilozof said:
I would add force commander for the single, they have very basic powers and that makes great officers for squads
[x] Plan: By Our Powers Combined
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we should unlock a squad leader option soon.
Mechanis said:
You can add more and or better Leader Unit types later, yes... but that costs more AP the more types you already have. And competes with getting more advanced versions of your existing leader types. And, at least in the immediate sense, with other leadership options, like Squad Leaders, that you might want to invest in in the next few turns.
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Yeah, I don't think I'm fully comprehending how this vote works and what it's doing. So I think I'm just going to opt out of this one and let other minds chew it over. Especially since I've had some health issues flare up last night and want to reduce my mental workload.
 
Alectai said:
Yeah, I don't think I'm fully comprehending how this vote works and what it's doing. So I think I'm just going to opt out of this one and let other minds chew it over. Especially since I've had some health issues flare up last night and want to reduce my mental workload.
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At least you're much better than me, I never understand anything when it comes to the weapon/vehicle building parts or those micromanagement ones. I just skim through it and hope the next update is something I can understand.
 
By our powers combined!
Tactical acumen
Meticulous study of warfare
Fervor for khaine
Psychic powers

They are Captain Vau-Vulkesh!

Needs to be a little more catchy...
 
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