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A Different Breed (Warhammer 29K)

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BigFungus26 said:
It is a very nice looking tank, I will admit, both in terms of it's aesthetic (like if someone took a 1950's/Cold-War era spy-plane chassis and put some anti-grav on it, to use a poor example) and it's crunch.

Lasguns are straight up useless against it thanks to the refractor field, lascannons get filtered through all 3 shields (Grav, Refractor, EDB) and anything that manages to finally hit the chassis after all that filtering will only end up hitting the armour.

Slap two Suncannons and a heavy needler on there and we've got our MBT with some absolutely delicious firepower for its size.

(On that note, I am still curious as to how much stronger our plasma weapons are since we decided to focus on its firepower, but if I have to guess, since Meltas can apparently compete with low-end plasma, our higher power Sunblasters are gonna be absolutely disgusting to use against vehicles and armour)

Either way though, any tank the Orks cook up probably won't fair well against plasma, and iirc, wasn't the Leman Russ Executioner (the one with the plasma cannon, I can't tell my Russes apart anymore) used for anti-tank roles?
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The Leman Russ Blast Template Dropper- I mean, Executioner, is more of an anti-everything unit really; especially if you spring for the optional plasma sponsions. Nothing says love like three blast templates every shooting phase ha. But yes, it's going to be a proper tank and would have tabletop stats that cause people to complain about it even if it took up half your CP to bring one ha.

The vehicles Orks optimistically call "tanks" at the moment tend to come in two flavors, really: slow, juggernought style things with way too much armor and things that have a literal rocket sticking out the back for more speed. Both, of course, tend to be either slathered in as many guns as will fit, or straining under the mass of the biggest, loudest and most impressive gun the tank ladz have the Teef for. Neither tend to fare especially well when fighting Eldar.
 
I love our Sunblasters and suncannons because they are Good against basically everything, Without shattering the bank. Sometimes Being widely applicable and good enough is much better then being great at a single task because it's not like you can always choose exactly what part of your army is going to make contact with there.

Just enough Splash to Clear out a horde of Mon'keigh cultist Chaff, Ork boys or Termigaunts yet still packing enough AP to give anything smaller then a superheavy a horrible day.

Mechanis said:
tabletop stats that cause people to complain about it even if it took up half your CP to bring one ha.
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Ah, I see we went to the T'au Hammerhead Railgun school of Game design.
 
CanYouMeme said:
The issue with this is that most of the galaxy - the ones that aren't Orks and Chaos so forth - is trying to be better. Especially here in 30k.

After an assload of people died from drug overdose, Vect and the other Dark Eldar looked at that and said, "Well if we can smell the bodies it means we're not doing enough drugs, go hit up some more!" And when they ran out of drugs, some bright spark said "Those people look like they have drugs in their bodies!" And they started abducting and torturing murdering everyone they could find so they could sniff the blood and feces in hopes it would get them high.

I can and absolutely will blame Vect and the rest of the DEldar for taking a bad situation and mking it worse because they wanted more drugs.
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In fairness, Vect was one of the people getting shat on by those remnants of the Empire, who then clawed his way into power and organised things to both get revenge and maintain his own power. Depending on how re-contact goes between Comorragh and those Eldar outside goes that could end up changing.
 
Suncannons are good, absolutely, but we have two cannons, and an imploder could be very effective against super heavily armored targets and at stopping Orks trying to swarm into our guns blindspot in their tracks. It's a much more versatile setup and not particularly expensive.
 
Karnax626 said:
In fairness, Vect was one of the people getting shat on by those remnants of the Empire, who then clawed his way into power and organised things to both get revenge and maintain his own power. Depending on how re-contact goes between Comorragh and those Eldar outside goes that could end up changing.
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I sure hope so. Him taking those remnants and making them what they became is one of the worst things to happen to the galaxy, ranking in the top 10 of what we know happened. He's the only one who meaningfully benefited from it, given how he kept assassinating everyone who might be a threat.
 
Am looking over the info posts to refresh myself. I see some interesting stuff in the Warhosts accordion about the equipment that was distributed. As an example,
Mechanis said:
The Militia Line detachments of this Warhost have traded their Wraithbone Trauma Plates for the vasty more capable Wraithweave Brigandine armor, massively improving their survivability and ability to withstand hostile environmental conditions, such as vacuum or poisonous atmospheres.

The Militia Heavy Detachment of this Warhost has exchanged the original Wraithbone Trauma Plates for far more effective Wraithweave Brigandine armor, improving their survivability by an order of magnitude.
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Really hope people stop arguing Wraithweave isn't good enough going forward.

On a minor note, in the Fleets table, under Fresh it lists us having 25 Assault Ketch and 3 Assault Ketch.
 
Randino Treviani said:
Suncannons are good, absolutely, but we have two cannons, and an imploder could be very effective against super heavily armored targets and at stopping Orks trying to swarm into our guns blindspot in their tracks. It's a much more versatile setup and not particularly expensive.
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It's not really that much more versatile. It might be better vs superheavies, but plasma has better range. Also orks aren't going to be able to get into gun blindspots, it's more like an aircraft in terms of speed compared to other races' tanks
 
I think for a MBT design intender to fight other tanks, pairing an imploder and an amplifier is the way to go.

For more multi-purpose designs, a pair of suncannons would be good. I can see us wanting both designs in our armoured detachments.
 
Getting back to the Druchii, I think there are three things we will have to leverage in our favor.

First and foremost, by the time they roll around, we'll probably have dealt with the Slaanesh aspect of the curse and completed our soul reforging. The option of regaining Psycher abilities and avoiding having there souls devoured upon death is going to be tempting to them, and Vau-Vulkesh is going to be the most capable of getting them it.

The second is Cegorach. The possibility of courting the favor of the last free Aeldari god who happens to have a webway key is going to appeal to them, and we've earned his favor thrice over. Just having the option to court the gods blessing will be a good point.

The last is of course, resources and industry. In a universe in which Aeldari federations cull the all but the worst Daemon and Ork infestations, the Druchii raiders aren't likely to find nearly so many easy targets, especially prior to their unification. A raider Oligarchy is going to be a lot less successful in this timeline than in Canon. It'll make it easier to convince them towards change, or trigger a revolution, in return for the support of a large coalition of craft worlds.
 
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Alratan said:
I think for a MBT design intender to fight other tanks, pairing an imploder and an amplifier is the way to go.

For more multi-purpose designs, a pair of suncannons would be good. I can see us wanting both designs in our armoured detachments.
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We could also put together a double Fusion Mortar or Point Singularity Projector design for a not-horrible light artillery piece. Probably the PSP design; it's direct fire and very expensive, which does a lot to justify putting it on a heavily armored tank chassis.

But that wouldn't be a basic tank, for which I'd say both "double suncannon" and "imploder/amplifier" are very solid.
 
Candesce said:
We could also put together a double Fusion Mortar or Point Singularity Projector design for a not-horrible light artillery piece. Probably the PSP design; it's direct fire and very expensive, which does a lot to justify putting it on a heavily armored tank chassis.

But that wouldn't be a basic tank, for which I'd say both "double suncannon" and "imploder/amplifier" are very solid.
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I think we have the potential points allotment that we could put a third vehicle weapon on a artillery piece using this chassis? Even have a enclosed infantry slot if we want to do things like have a seer as a spotter.

I sorta hope we get missile tech by the time we go for a artillery vehicle because having a missile battery as a secondary weapon would give a lot of options for either a double fusion mortar or double Point Singularity projector design.
 
Hmmmmmm let's keep in mind the ... Philosophical developments among the druchii.

Much of the pre-fall empire was taken in by the pleasure cults specifically because Asuryan pulled the gods back and made life so much less rewarding and meaningful to most eldar. The pleasure cults were a two pronged attack to replace that part of their lives with addictive behaviors, while creating a new god that would be able to get around or break through the edict.

Post fall the druchii, those who didn't just die or join Slaanesh willingly, are largely done with gods, they have been betrayed by them too many times. This is a very bad place for what is essentially a race of deva to be in. As such they continue the practices of the dominion because they're trying to keep using those behaviors to fill the hole left by the gods, while also appeasing Slaanesh enough to leave them alone a little bit longer. Any solution that's dependent upon divinities will likely be rejected. Even if Druchii want to have or be anything better than they become, the gods will have no place in their desire schema.
 
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Philosophical and ethical discussions about a Dark Eldar possible redemption are nice and all, but they ignore the most basic reality about them.

Dark Eldars are all drug addicts. Except that their drug is torturing people and that it doesn't cost them much, just some raids on inferior species which, coincidentally, also cause pain and fear and everything that pleases a Dark Eldar. Basically it's free sex, drugs and rock'n'roll all year round.

Now think about the lengths a human druggie goes to to get their drugs, then imagine what lengths a DE druggie would go to and think about all the manpower and heavy metal that they have to defend their right to stay stoned. Should anyone try to take away their drugs or try to make them go cold turkey, I don't doubt we would see the beginning of a Dark Eldar Crusade against the perpetrator.

Trying to poke the DEs in their addiction is just an extravagant way to commit suicide. If Vect or another comes to the Craftworlds to negotiate to get the goodies, why not? But any attempt to force them to go cold turkey should wait until the Craftworlds are capable of winning quickly and decisively against a Great Crusade dedicated entirely to their annihilation, because that's the kind of scale of conflict we are talking about and, since the DEs have a growing population, they will win the attrition game.

Otherwise, just develop the method, send a copy to the Harlequins and leave it to them to do their thing: that kind of discrete and wide-scale social engineering/trolling is right up their alley and, since they are ultra-stealthy, they can just disappear before the DEs drop the hammer. That's the difference beween having a war of genocide aimed at you or leaving Commorragh to tear itself apart in a civil war while not bothering the rest of the galaxy.
 
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Randino Treviani said:
Getting back to the Druchii, I think there are three things we will have to leverage in our favor.

First and foremost, by the time they roll around, we'll probably have dealt with the Slaanesh aspect of the curse and completed our soul reforging. The option of regaining Psycher abilities and avoiding having there souls devoured upon death is going to be tempting to them, and Vau-Vulkesh is going to be the most capable of getting them it.
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One to thing to remember is that it was apparently Vect that bans the Dark Eldar from using their psychic powers and his Kabal of the Black Heart that attempts to enforce this, with pretty good (given the circumstances) but not perfect success.

There's no metaphysical reason that a Dark Eldar can't use their powers. It's just that by M41 they've largely lost the knowledge of how to safely train to do so, as Vect stamped the practice out so there are no teachers. This isn't universal, there's at least one Haemunculi Kabal that still practices precognition, presumably because they've retained Pre-Fall knowledge of how to do so. There are also self-taught underground Dark Eldar seers who sell their services on the black market in defiance of Vect's ban.

And the reason he did that is that (because, I think, of the way Vect stitched together the modern Dark City from multiple Webway Realms) using psychic powers there risks causing a Disjunction and letting a daemonic invasion in. It's literally called a Disjunction, I think it's where the junctions between the many realms the modern Dark City is made of become disrupted and a gap in the patchwork opens up to let the inhabitants of the Warp in.

That doesn't appear to be the case in the rest of the Webway, including in other Webway realms, where we see psychic powers being used on multiple occasions with no concern being expressed by other Eldar who would know if they were risking similar phenomena.

Until Vect takes power in M35, the ban on using psychic powers in Commaroagh shouldn't exist and there's no central authority to enforce it even if they want it to, and, indeed, until M37 when Vect completes the assimilation of the major Webway Realms into the Dark City, it may not even be necessary, as until then the Webway Realms the Dark Eldar live in are probably stable enough, like Webway Realms controlled by other Eldar factions, to safely use psychic powers.
 
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Mechanis said:
Many. 30-50 centuries from now, give or take a few decades. You are presently heading into the very, very dawn of M30; so you still have a good long while before that's a serious issue---and you'll have a rather large issue with, perhaps, a little too much fondness for gold leaf and eagles being in consideration before that.
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Vau-Vulkesh's foreign policy strategy:

1) Pro-actively look for nascent factions with serious problems
2) Show up in a timely fashion and offer substantial help with their problems
3) They are befuddled but grateful at the completely unexpected but very welcome help with their problems
4) Make surprise friends, because nobody expects Aeldari to be the thoughtful friendly neighbor

Big E: "Oh shit, the Eldar are still around."
Vau-Vulkesh: "Oh cool, humanity isn't completely shattered. Wanna be allies? Those orks and daemons need smashing."
Big E: "What."
 
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Time Indeterminate | Interlude III | The Tower
  • Threadmarks


    • All is Dust​


    The Tower​

    Time Indeterminate
    The Warp​

    The Shadow of What May Be stalked the Sorcerer Who Was Not Yet through
    -a blazing desert-
    -a raging hurricane-​
    -a freezing tundra-​
    -a sweltering jungle-​

    Both were echos of what might be.
    Yet both from different futures.​

    The Sorcerer fled and the Shadow hunted, so it had been for-
    -a century-​
    -a Kalpa-​
    -a picosecond-​
    		-forever-

    Both would intervene, here and there, trying to nudge the Great Game one way or another, but for all the might they
    -did not--had always-
    -would yet-​
    -would never-​
    wield, in the True Now they had little influence, for neither yet lived in truth. Yet for all this, the power that both would wield meant there were few who would dare to interfere.


    As war raged between the Powers of the Warp,
    Corvus Corax(The Lord Crow of Shadows) stalked Ahzek Ahriman(The Last Loyal Son of Magnus),​
    And history rippled in their footsteps.​
    Stand By…​
    A/N: Not all history may come to pass,
    Yet its echos may walk the Warp regardless.​
     
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    • I will note that this really drives home how much of a badass Ahzek Ahriman is. It takes a lot to match a primarch and even if Corax isn't the most impressive example of that (being insane and not supported by one of the Ruinous Powers) it's still an accomplishment to be able to consistently evade a primarch specialized in tracking and capture.
     
    Hoo boy. So part of the problem is that things that "may be" can influence "what is" creating a retroactively self-fulfilling cycle. Wonder what other Primarch's echoes from the future-that-may-be we could encounter. Lion El Johnson? Jhagtai Khan?

    w34v3r said:
    Want to point out that this Ahriman is denoted as the Last Loyal son of Magnus. This rather implies he's not the Ahriman from canon.
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    Yeah, And Corvus is designated "The Lord Crow of Shadows". That doesn't sound like Best Feathery Boi.
     
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    Damn bro, imagine being so badass in 40K that your mere presence leaves an echo in the Warp that could become a problem for other timelines.

    Though if Echo-Corvus is here, WHO THE FUCK IS GUARDING ECHO-LORGAR'S HIDEY-HOLE?!
     
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