Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
The arguments supporting The Confusion of Battle are missing the point. Yes, it's very plausible. But what does it bring to the plot table? What stories does it open? Because so far it seems entirely like a trauma that closes options rather than opening them. Opposing Sigmar or the empire, OTOH, opens up a fun new range of semi-terrible ideas.

Compared to that, The Confusion of Battle just seems dull to me. It's a obstacle, not a character direction.
And I think you're missing the point that trauma is supposed to be negative, not another resource to be munchkined into new shinies. Opposing Sigmar or the Empire will almost certainly close off options too, for example: the possibility of repeating or even investigating the show of combined arms we made with Kasmir against the Singing King.

Besides, some people vote for story reasons, not optimization.
 
The arguments supporting The Confusion of Battle are missing the point. Yes, it's very plausible. But what does it bring to the plot table? What stories does it open? Because so far it seems entirely like a trauma that closes options rather than opening them. Opposing Sigmar or the empire, OTOH, opens up a fun new range of semi-terrible ideas.

Compared to that, The Confusion of Battle just seems dull to me. It's a obstacle, not a character direction.
Ironically, I would probably like the Trait more if Abel was still alive. After all, it isn't just a fear that Mathilde herself could die in battle, but that anyone can. Hence our spymistress would flutter about doing everything in her capacity to prevent her loved ones from heading into battle.

Only now, after the campaign, the only ones we have left are the ones who have no business being anywhere near combat.
Eh... it isn't so bad. Like look at Nagash - sure he went loopy... but he was also the greatest human mage ever. Ever!
Also, didn't he manage to turn into a god of Death, or do I misremember my End Times nonsense? That seems like a decent achievement for a competent man.
 
[X] Magic used recklessly has catastrophic effects; great care must be taken in it's handling.

[X] The Empire is a morass of self-interest, to the point of becoming a millstone around the neck of humanity.
 
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[X] Unity brings Strength, Discord brings Failure.
[X] The Empire is a morass of self-interest, to the point of becoming a millstone around the neck of humanity.
 
[X] The fog of war is a bitch, to all involved.
[X] The Empire is a morass of self-interest, to the point of becoming a millstone around the neck of humanity.
 
And I think you're missing the point that trauma is supposed to be negative, not another resource to be munchkined into new shinies. Opposing Sigmar or the Empire will almost certainly close off options too, for example: the possibility of repeating or even investigating the show of combined arms we made with Kasmir against the Singing King.

Besides, some people vote for story reasons, not optimization.
They way I read it, rancor is voting for story reasons exactly: Sigmar-blaming Mathilde is more interesting than craven/fatalistic/overengeneering Mathilde in their (and my own) opinion.
 
And I think you're missing the point that trauma is supposed to be negative, not another resource to be munchkined into new shinies. Opposing Sigmar or the Empire will almost certainly close off options too, for example: the possibility of repeating or even investigating the show of combined arms we made with Kasmir against the Singing King.

Besides, some people vote for story reasons, not optimization.
Optimization? In what way is pursuing a grudge against SIGMAR optimization? I want new conflict, not new shinys.
 
[X] It's not a great hero who carries the day, but a lot of small men working in concert.
[X] In the confusion of battle, even the greatest warrior can lose their life pointlessly.

Gotta say, I'm loving how balanced this quest is. Not full Grim derp all the time, but with actual consequences as well.
 
[X] The best battle is one where the enemy never gets a strike in.
[X] The Empire is a morass of self-interest, to the point of becoming a millstone around the neck of humanity.
 
I would point out Occam's Razor. Julia has shitty Stewardship and we assigned her on a moneymaking task. She might well have simply estimated the costs and returns wrongly.
Yeah, so maybe next time we can not do that and instead do something useful...


Can't decide on what to vote, but I think I've narrowed it down a little to the ones I prefer.

[ ] The best battle is one where the enemy never gets a strike in.​
Bonuses or narrative incentives for pre-emptive strikes, maybe an Intrigue bonus. Leads to Mathilde prioritising investigation and subtle action.
[ ] Magic is unreliable, gods are doubly so: always have a mundane solution.​
"Be prepared". It's a good motto to live by (and a better villain song). Unfortunate connotations for Mathilde's wizardry and relationship with Ranald, though.
[ ] The fog of war is a bitch, to all involved.​
Intel becomes more important to Mathilde. Maybe a bonus to developing @Alliterate's fog of war divination spell.
[ ] Expertise matters. And Stirland has precious little of it.​
Developing what native human capital we can and importing what else we need. Could be good for personal development, too.

And for damage:

[ ] The Colleges of Magic act in their own interest, rather than that of the Empire.​
Distrusting the Colleges' motives at the low end, perhaps leading to things like not publishing further magical discoveries, keeping more secrets a la Qhaysh Juice and the Liber Mortis. Could produce storylines about reforming the Colleges or even working against them.
[ ] Sylvanians will meekly accept any tyrant, to the point of complicity in their actions.​
Hatred: Sylvanians, I see you hiding there. If we can avoid Eastern Stirland, this is going to be the easiest by far to mitigate the effects of.
[ ] I, personally, failed to protect Abelhelm.​
Losing faith in herself. Very standard 'failed hero' narratives. Paths that are well-trodden, but can still be very emotional if written well.
[ ] Sigmar abandoned his most worthy follower in his hour of need.​
Hey Wilhelmina, looks like there's going to be another Anti-Sigmarite in town! Kasmir's not going to be happy, but he already seems to be in a bit of a Crisis of Faith of his own, so he may not even notice.
[ ] You can't trust people to have your back.​
Goodbye, Diplomacy score!
[ ] I will never meet a man as worthy as Abelhelm was.​
Good riddance, shipping opportunities!

And just for good measure, some I really don't want.

[ ] In the confusion of battle, even the greatest warrior can lose their life pointlessly.​
This will definitely lead to Mathilde avoiding fights, which is so not her, and potentially lose us the Brave trait. That's important when our main enemy (undead) pretty much all have detrimental effects on morale. And it's been a good trait to have in other situations, too.
[ ] Magic is a curse; Magisters and rogue mages alike will eventually die in it's handling.​
Mathilde is a wizard. Hating or fearing magic is just going to make it harder to get things done.
[ ] Gods will not help us.​
Sure, Sigmar's power failed, but it's not really Ranald's thing to heal anyway and our main problem up until now has been the people, not the gods. The main problem with this option is that it seems likely to lead to us losing Ranald's Blessing, which has saved our butt many times over -- a very obvious example of the belief not being true.
[ ] The Empire is a morass of self-interest, to the point of becoming a millstone around the neck of humanity.​
The Grey Order is the worst college to be a member of with this belief, since they're the most extreme in their requirements for loyalty to the Empire. Add to that Ranald's revolutionary tendencies, and this one leads Mathilde towards being declared rogue for betraying the state.
 
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[X] Unity brings Strength, Discord brings Failure.
[X] Sigmar abandoned his most worthy follower in his hour of need.
 
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[X] It's not a great hero who carries the day, but a lot of small men working in concert.
[X] In the confusion of battle, even the greatest warrior can lose their life pointlessly.
 
To clarify, I mean story reasons as in "for reasons that happened in the story", as opposed to "for reasons of what we can use it for in the future".
It's just... A dull conclusion to draw from what happened in story. It essentially amounts to "It is possible for anyone to roll a nat 1" (And as a Ranald follower that's an appropiate analogy). I mean sure, it is undeniably true and we saw it happen in the campaign, but at the same time I think we kinda saw other damages happen more often? Sigmar's faithful not only failed to sent any help outside of the one guy already present (and who had a history of obstructing us precisely due to his Sigmarite faith), Sigmar himself failed to heal the single most important person around. A person who still kept faith in him, none the less. At least Ranald managed to make a presence, even if he turned out useless in the end.

Just seems like a more natural outgrowth to me, if we're looking at the actual events that took place.

[ ] I will never meet a man as worthy as Abelhelm was.
Good riddance, shipping opportunities!
Oh you silly goose, not seeing the obvious loophole large enough to sail a battleship through.
 
I jus cannot comprehend why anyone would vote to undermine Mathilde's Brave trait. Its a MALUS, and in warhammer, the Rule of Cool exists. This will just make Mathilde more of a recluse and lose us the benifits of training. Why even train with a greatsword and gun if we're jus gonna make her a coward?
 
You're quite right. While Abelhelm came closest to winning the prize of Mathilde's heart, Julia was an option too. I don't think she got any votes, but she was there. Curses. It looks like I've got further to go before I can be free of the shipping menace.
Pfft, you won't ever be free. Even if the option was "There will never be anyone as worthy as him" (As it probably is in reality), it just means we have added incentives to learn how to bring people back from the dead!
 
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Please consider the previously mentioned arguments, avoiding battles will not make this quest more fun. We are not only a wizard and a protagonist, but also quite the swordsman.

EDIT: Also, some votes are obviously mentioned twice in the tally, don't worry about it, it does that.
Adhoc vote count started by JaceAoT on Mar 12, 2018 at 10:14 AM, finished with 86 posts and 47 votes.
 
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