Simply put, we make Libertalia an example. We want to be quick and agile. Surround the ENTIRE isle, use flyers to make sure that we have 100% coverage, then proceed to demand their surrender.
They refuse?
Force our way in, remove any of our people, then firebomb it to the ground. No survivors.
Then we can heavily imply that this would be our reaction to refusal to hand our people back and hover menacingly near some ports.
So we're diplomancig the south guys, sending in the spies, razing some pirates, and moving the peregine line south?
And all the while we throw ourselves into buildup and preparation in case diplomacy and intrigue fails?
Ah, and if they get pushy and keep so much as a single slave of our people or those of our allies no matter what diplomacy and intrigue we pull we prepare for war and start rallying the people to end them?
As a side note on this: they will also be leaning heavily on magic to make up for their limited pool of manpower, and so might do things in a different way than would be first assumed.
True. But I don't think it entirely changes the paradigm considering how their demonstrated magic, while useful isn't the sort to be able to sink warships in its own right.
Fire magic to boost incendiaries (which reminds me we can have naphtha siphons warships like the Byzies) illusion magic to aid maneuvers, and maybe wind magic
As for Maretonia- I'm getting a Mauritania vibe, but that's not necessarily or accurate. I do think we should somewhat skew things when we do send a diplomatic delegation like having a bodyguard of Inner Knights replete with Black Steel and a member of each race. We can send a delegation with enough of a militant slant to present strength without being belligerent enough to start a war.
Hey, I know everyone is all for kicking the asses of pirate slavers, but the whole Yak situation needs priority too. If a war happens there, it's going to affect us to a big degree because our country is right next to theirs.
Hey, I know everyone is all for kicking the asses of pirate slavers, but the whole Yak situation needs priority too. If a war happens there, it's going to affect us to a big degree because our country is right next to theirs.
honestly, I'll have to agree with you there. Tensions with the yaks are really important, since their situation would also affect us. It'll also take some time to get the navy side of things going, since I'm pretty sure we'll try diplomacy for that first. One diplo option toward the new guys on getting our and koryu's people back, one to see about keeping the yak powder keg from exploding. Plus we'll need some time to get some intrigue actions on the pirates done too. If they can unite peacefully and ally us, I'm sure we could use their people equipped with the orichalcum from that mountain to potentially help fight off magic threats. Could even lease some forges/mining tools toward em to get some profit off of it.
And speaking of the navy, we'll need to talk to koryu about getting his navy updated too. Cannon ships and all that. Unless he's already on it. Dude's pretty sharp, after all.
And of course, there's getting the engines into something workable. Steamboats ahoy!
Hey, I know everyone is all for kicking the asses of pirate slavers, but the whole Yak situation needs priority too. If a war happens there, it's going to affect us to a big degree because our country is right next to theirs.
They are going to fight each other if and only if a civil war starts. No side is going to attack us during that hypothetical war. Also the war is not going to happen next turn they are not at that point yet. The Yaks are not a priority if we had put actions last turn into looking into the yaks and helping the modernist then we could do something but right now they are not a possible priority.
@Questor
...Some-country will BURN
Not now, not tomorrow, but they will.
I agree with most SVers here, for now, we won't make any OVERT hostile moves, but slowly build our forces, influence.
Yes, diplomacy will be the 1st thing we use as a cover to get our spies in. We need information, because, around this time period, multiple warlords, unethical monsters, tyrants, etc. exist and control many lands (in a way they are the "only" powers in the world. ESPECIALLY in fantasy, magic-heavy realms).
But pirate "stronghold" will have to go. (though they might be "sponsored" buy that slaver country to do so ("deniability"), so will have to be careful here.)
But I wonder. With a name "Maretonia"
it might be pony controlled,
Or only males are slaves (I mean most equine hoards are matriarchal)
Either way, we have to play this medium-term. They go against what our Empire and our Allies values. This country is hostile no matter what they lie.
That and Crystal Ponies and soon others will go BALLISTIC if we let this CANCER exist for too long.
So looking at the update it's good to know that there's (probably) no actual ghosts at sea.
That being said, we cannot possibly ignore the Yak-situation. It seems that some sort of change for them is inevitable, I suspect they will form some sort of unified country, though some might just leave or die in the process.
It's in our best interest to have them unite I think as unification seems necessary at the coming tech levels.
It's definitely in our best interest to make sure it happens as peaceful as possible or at least as quickly and definitively as possible. We do not want a warring set of Clans made up of huge creatures on our border. It's bad for them and bad for our economy. I also don't feel like another possible influx of refugees at the moment. Our citizens have been amazing at adapting to a greatly shifting demographic, but we should not push them or our luck, they are still getting used to the Chrystal Ponies after all.
Titles: Emperor of Gryphus, King of Griffonia, Inheritor of the Imperial House of Gryphus, The Unifier, Great Winged Alpha, The Lightbringer
Description: Before your wife got her talons on you, you were a fairly typical example of the Griffon species. An unmistakably masculine build, a strong, prominent beak, feathers and fur that seem to be perpetually well-groomed, and a pair of piercing amber eyes hiding a fierce intelligence. Not anymore though. Oh, you still have all those qualities, they're just overshadowed by the massive amount of muscle you've put on since you started your wife's "enhanced training regimen". Your wings can lift dumbbells, and your legs are like tree-trunks supporting a barrel chest rippling with abdominal muscles. In short, you have the build of a person who has been lifting heavy objects his entire life.
Martial: 9+2+1+2=14
Diplomacy: 14+2+2=18
Stewardship: 13+2=15
Learning: 16+2=18
Intrigue: 11+2=13
Trait-Attractive: You are a very handsome fellow. +2 Diplomacy, better spousal relationship
Trait-Genius: Smart doesn't even begin to describe you. +2 all skills
Trait-Strong: Working out with your wife has done great things for your body. +2 Martial
Inventory:
Blade of the King: an ornate and deadly sword you had forged for yourself after being crowned King of Griffonia. +1 Martial
Royal Armor: Serving to protect you as well as display your royal status to onlookers, this armor is both durable and aesthetically pleasing.
Orichalcum Sword: A blade made of an extremely durable, magic resistant metal
Trait: Strong - Born stronger than most. (+2 Martial)
Trait: Experienced - Has been a mercenary for several years, ranging across the lands of the former Empire. Knows much about the world. (+1 All Stats)
Status: Teenager-Malus to all Stats (-5 to all Stats)
Status: Designated Heir. Will become player character in event of Parent's Deaths.
Trait: Strong-Born stronger than most. (+2 Martial)
Trait: Attractive-A cute kid, and eventually a handsome fellow. (+2 Diplomacy, better spousal relationship)
Trait: Genius-Smart doesn't begin to describe him. (+2 All Stats)
Trait: Game Master-Years of playing games of strategy and wits with members of the Imperial Court has honed his sense of strategy and taught him how to read others. (+1 Martial, +2 Diplomacy)
(Adopted) Daughter: Gwyndlyn Golden-Feather
Age: 11
Status: Child-No Stats
Status-Designated Regent: In the event that no heir is capable of taking the throne, or in the event the rightful ruler is otherwise unavailable, she will take control of the kingdom until the situation can be resolved.
Trait: Dragon-A fire breathing reptile. (+4 Martial)
-Army Upkeep: 400
-Navy Upkeep: 100
-Office of Disease Control: 10
-Ministry of Foreign Affairs: 10
-Peregrine Line: 100
Military
Imperial Army: Professional soldiers, paid and supplied by you. 500 soldier battalions cost 150 gold each to raise or replace. Additionally, Imperial Army soldiers have an upkeep cost of 150 gold per every ten thousand soldiers.
Imperial Army Morale: 80/100 (Strong)
Imperial Army Numbers: 26,764
-12,500 Warriors: Armed with a sword or hand-axe and shield, these Griffons make up the bulk of your army.
-6250 Polearms: For keeping your enemy at arms length or taking down opponents larger than a Griffon.
-6250 Archers: Griffons with bows and some arrows. Not much else to say.
-1500 Diamond Dogs: Armed with a variety of swords, maces, war axes, and other weapons suitable for close-quarters, Diamond Dogs are masters of subterranean combat, and are well suited to ambush tactics.
-264 Artillerists: Responsible for the transport, maintenance and operation of heavy weaponry, these Gryphons and Dogs are highly trained in their chosen field of ranged combat.
-4 Mobile Ballistae: Massively oversized mechanical bows that fire bolts big enough to pierce through tree trunks from vast distances.
-19 Cannons: Firing iron balls through the power of explosive black powder, these metal siege engines are one of the most powerful weapons in your arsenal.
-10 Flame Projectors: A product of Archimedes's "liquid fire", these static contraptions can shoot jets of flaming liquid vast distances, burning all in their path.
Knightly Orders (Self Maintained): In the old Empire, Knightly Orders were typically made up of Griffons of noble birth who joined a fraternal militant organization dedicated to martial excellence, honor, and a number of various edicts of moral strength. These great warriors dedicated themselves to the Emperor and the protection of the common Gryph. Tragically, few of these brave souls survived the reign of Discord. But a new breed of Knights now seeks to serve as your sword and shield, and will rally to your banner whenever you may need them.
The Knights Lion
1 Grandmaster Konrad Hardbeak, "The Kingslayer"
35 Knights of the Inner Circle
180 Imperial Knights
60 Squires
400 Griffons-at-Arms
Citadel: The Lion's Den, Griffonia
The Knights Talon
1 Grandmaster Colombroni Pigeonio
25 Knights of the Inner Circle
200 Imperial Knights
75 Squires
330 Griffons-at-Arms
Citadel: The Crow's Nest, Wingbardy
The Knights Panther
1 Grandmaster Adrian Dawnquill
30 Knights of the Inner Circle
200 Imperial Knights
50 Squires
250 Griffons-at-Arms
Citadel: The Black Fortress, Aquileia
Royal Navy: The vessels that guard your coastlines and patrol the oceans. Crewed by career sailors, they have an upkeep of five gold per ship, per year.
20 Cogs (Bolt-Throwers)
Auxiliaries: Auxiliary units are forces not part of a Knightly Order or the Royal Army and Navy that can be brought into battle alongside both of the former groups. They can be made up of allied nation units suborned to you, units drawn up from the militia, and mercenary outfits.
Politics
Nobility Opinion: 10/10 (All Hail the Glorious Emperor!).
General Public Opinion: 10/10 (All Hail the Glorious Emperor!).
Roll Bonuses
Improved Army Communications: +3 on certain Army Rolls
Naval Navigation Tools: +5 on certain Naval and Exploration Rolls
Gun-Cotton: +5 to all Cannon Rolls
Pre-Discord Map: +10 to next Exploration Roll
Scatter-Shot: Bonus to Certain Cannon Rolls
Blasting Jelly: +5 to Certain Explosive Rolls
Camouflage 101: +5 to Certain Intrigue/Army Rolls
Firebender Designed Flamethrowers: +5 to all Flamethrower/Liquid Fire Rolls
Imperial War Memorial: Army Morale may not fall below 20, Militia count as Regulars when defending Core Territory
???: A friendly and strangely casual Griffon female you met at your inaugural ball. Despite having a wonderful evening chatting with her, you never got her name.
Garibaldi Talonuelli: Formerly the Duke of Wingbardy, now the Grand Duke of Wingbardy, Talonuelli is a beloved public figure in his home province and an experienced administrator. After saving his city and people from Brochard's attempted invasion and negotiating his province's vassalage over a few drinks, you'd like to think you can count him among your friends.
Federico Montefeathertro: Duke of the (former) City-State of Urbirdo, and your Father-in Law. He might just be the friendliest of the former Feathersians, having agreed to back you and your kingdom without question or condition during the Brochard Crisis, and hiring a mercenary outfit as a belated wedding gift. You're reasonably certain he likes you, as much as In-Laws can like each other anyway.
Koryū Ryuō: The draconic Emperor of the Island Kingdom of Neighpon. Having agreed to assist you in the war against the Shadow King and making fast friends with your adoptive daughter, you consider him a decent fellow who you can trust to keep his word, and a valuable ally against any destructive forces the world can throw at you.
Minamoto Tadakatsu: Shogun of Neighpon. Born to peasant farmers, he's more than earned his place as the most powerful Samurai amongst the Qilin. After he lead the Neighponese contingent during the Invasion of the Crystal Empire and kindly instructed you in the myriad varieties and intricacies of tea on the campaign trail, you've come to respect the more-than-century-old leader.
Konrad Hardbeak, "The Kingslayer": Grandmaster of the Knights Lion and Hero of the Empire. Beheaded Brochard the pretender, crippled Sombra the shadow king twice over, and received the very first Imperial Medal of Honor. Despite it all, he is surprisingly humble, insisting in vain that he was, and is, merely doing his duty to the Empire, and to you. He is the very model of an Imperial Knight.
The issue with the Yaks is... what exactly do we do about it? Their issues are primarily cultural, and not really something we should mess with. I mean yeah, we showed them the benefits of civilization and are putting some (very light) diplomatic pressure on them, but that's pretty much just normal diplomatic relations between neighbors. We like the Yaks, and we'd really like to actually be able to deal with the Yaks instead of such and such chieftan/tribe/shaman/medicine woman/big man/etc. It doesn't help that they all live in a rather harsh environment under harsh conditions simply out of tradition and cultural inertia, all we did was show them another way. Which again, is just foreign relations.
The previous generation of Yaks want to put their faith in tradition and stay in power, the new generation of Yaks have aspirations of being an actual nation, with all that entails. The genie is out of the bottle on this one guys, the two groups literally cannot reconcile, as their goals are complete, polar opposites of each other. If we tried to aid the older generation we'd be stifling their development as a people, holding them back, and generally be acting like massive hypocrites, as we're pretty much the reason there's even a progressive faction in the first place. And if we try and aid the progressive faction we'd essentially be playing kingmaker, which would be a really shitty thing to do to our allies. Which isn't to say we won't wind up getting involved if things wind up spiraling out of control, I'm just trying not to count my chickens before they hatch.
Shit, we finally start wrapping up Sombra and the Crystal Empire and three more problems pop up.
For the Yaks, I think we should largely stay out of it, but use our influence to try and keep things peaceful. Send out word that if any particular clan tries to flat out conquer another, we'll try and help the defender. The individual clans can do what they want in regards to modernization, but we step in if anyone starts trying to unify by force. It ensures we don't get a powerful neighbor founded on war, while also keeping them independent and free to choose their path. Who knows, maybe it'll also encourage a more peaceful union between them, even if it takes a while before the clans all share a banner.
The pirates need to go. The mere existence of such an island is a problem, even if they weren't selling out citizens off as slaves. We can't be sure on any plan of action without a little intrigue first, but I think our best plan of action would be building up our navy for a few turns and setting up a mass blockade. I doubt they have a lot of farmland, so it won't be long until they're working on empty stomachs. In the event that their own guns outnumber our own, even after we've properly upgraded our navy, we'll just try and sow some distrust to keep them from unifying under a single fleet. I doubt they trust eachother to begin with, so it shouldn't be impossible. Even then though, they'll hardly ever agree to surrender if our terms are just sending them all to prison, let alone execution, so I say we bargain their freedom for the island, as much of their weaponry and loot as we can find, and an oath to never be pirates again. You know, give them all tattoos that mark them as having been on this island, then promise to kill any pirates we find with that mark outright. We can hardly leave them their ships of course, since they'd go right back to raiding otherwise, so we ought be nice and offer to return them to their various homelands ourselves. Who knows, maybe we'll meet a few more countries in the process. On top of being a fairly agreeable set of terms, considering the alternative of execution or imprisonment, I think they'll be pretty quick to agree once the food runs low. As for the slaves themselves, we give them the same deal, but instead of the marking we give them a nice chunk of the loot we've liberated so they can live comfy lives wherever they decide to go. If any happen to point us in the direction of new nations, or otherwise give us especially nice information, they'll get a nice bit extra and an offer at a nice title in the empire. You know, a county or duchy, or a spot on out Council if they'd like to keep helping us out. There's absolutely no pressure if they decline of course, but having members of foreign species so high up could give a lot of potential bonuses!
As for Maretonia, we don't know enough to really decide on anything yet. We'll have to do a lot of diplomacy and intrigue, but judging by them doing slavery, I think it's safe to assume that our relations won't be ideal. Personally, I say we deal with the pirates, and then establish relations while dropping them off. That way, we can start it off by showing them our kickass navy without overtly threatening them. Since they're so far away, we offer to have their leaders meet ours somewhere in the middle: How about the Crystal Empire, which we literally just finished freeing from a slaver who is now very dead? We have a nice talk, get to know eachother, then get to business: They clearly have connections with the pirates, so it wouldn't be that big a leap to assume that some of the ships and such we've just liberated from the pirates started off as theirs. Whether they were stolen or sold isn't our business, and the deal is the same either way: Return all foreign citizens to their respective homes, and they can have their boats back! Pretty agreeable terms, if I say so myself. Especially since we've got a fuckhuge navy and their leader is currently in the middle of a city that, statistically speaking, probably isn't a fan! It isn't the best start to relations, but neither is enslaving griffins, so fair's fair, right?
Overall, we should try to do things with minimal bloodshed, but maneuver ourselves so that if there is any, the blood is largely theirs. Keep things nice and calm that way. Of course, basically all of this is just based on the tidbits we have so far, so there could easily be better plans that become apparent soon, but this is my two cents for now.
The issue with the Yaks is... what exactly do we do about it? Their issues are primarily cultural, and not really something we should mess with. I mean yeah, we showed them the benefits of civilization and are putting some (very light) diplomatic pressure on them, but that's pretty much just normal diplomatic relations between neighbors. We like the Yaks, and we'd really like to actually be able to deal with the Yaks instead of such and such chieftan/tribe/shaman/medicine woman/big man/etc. It doesn't help that they all live in a rather harsh environment under harsh conditions simply out of tradition and cultural inertia, all we did was show them another way. Which again, is just foreign relations.
The previous generation of Yaks want to put their faith in tradition and stay in power, the new generation of Yaks have aspirations of being an actual nation, with all that entails. The genie is out of the bottle on this one guys, the two groups literally cannot reconcile, as their goals are complete, polar opposites of each other. If we tried to aid the older generation we'd be stifling their development as a people, holding them back, and generally be acting like massive hypocrites, as we're pretty much the reason there's even a progressive faction in the first place. And if we try and aid the progressive faction we'd essentially be playing kingmaker, which would be a really shitty thing to do to our allies. Which isn't to say we won't wind up getting involved if things wind up spiraling out of control, I'm just trying not to count my chickens before they hatch.
Its a really delicate situation. I'd like to think they'd not want war. Many of them have seen war, and given the response to large conflicts IRL, I'm pretty sure they don't want another one, except for the few that say it seems inevitable. Can't act as impartial party either, since even if we tried, I'm sure we'd lean modernist. Like, really, we'd need to actually look at Yak culture and see what their fears are, since those are the main issues. Currently, it seems the friction arises from latching on to tradition and making it seem like that part of the Yaks will be leaving as rapid advancement occurs. Traditions usually occur for a reason, and changing them or abandoning them is a scary thought. If the issue is that it feels like the old culture will be forgotten and replaced, perhaps writing down their traditions in books to pass on might help, or trying to understand why they did it in a certain way and adapt it to the modern understanding of the world.
But even then, they are subdivided into groups already. They don't cross over with one another, and they have fueds dating back a while that are hard to let go. Like, maybe theres a chance to transition to a republic in there, or have a 'united states of yakyakistan' if they were to have a vote to decide. But again that would lead to issues of certain places having more powers and voting blocks and so on and so forth. Or maybe go the oligarchy route, with the cheiftans repping each clan.
There'd have to be a breakdown of borders between clans to truly come together, and while the winter war proved to perhaps show theres not much different between em, old blood fueds are hard to break.
Its just a mess, all told... Really, all I can think of is to offer them our words of "please, we beg of you, as friends, don't go to war. War is bad." and try to offer alternatives.
might want to hold off long enough to get railroads down to the protectorate first. cause the logistics of fighting a war that far away from our core will be horrible. combo that with the yaks instability and i say we should focus on building up naval power and crushing pirates first.
edit: also considering their borders , barring some insane geographic border, Maretonia had to deal with Sombra like we did. which bodes ill.
I see 1 guaranteed and 2 possible consequences from a Yak civil war.
1. Our trade income will take a hit but considering it's our second lowest source of income it's not that crucial.
2. Possible bandit raids from across the Yak border. While we do have good relations with all the current clans war especially a prolonged one has a way of making people desperate.
3. This one's a bit of a toss up but there's a chance that whoever wins will be less than friendly towards us and non-Yaks in general. They might become Isolationist at best or Xenophobic at worst but the opposite could also happen, like I said it's a toss up.
I mean, if we can find a way to end their slavery without starting a war, that would be cool, but tolerating it just won't work, and wouldn't be in Character.
We dont know anything about them yet. The could be like America pre civil war, one faction for Slavery another against. What we should do is look for that kinda of situation (if it exists) and stoke the flames, maybe even setting up a Railroad to help free slaves.
People keep talking about needing to invade Maretania.
Do people not realize we only need to invade Libertania (to knock out a haven of scum and villainy) and then do one thing that will cause all port cities in their little corner scream in agony?
Blockade their ports.
ALL OF THEM.
No trade, no fishing, not even a rowboat will be allowed to escape.
The slave haven dies thats just going to happen regardless, what were saying is to avoid bloodshed with the actual nation at all cost, but we must have a line somewhere.
That line doesn't have to be purely "WE SEE YOU AS BAD SO WERE GOING TO CONQUER YOU" kinda sets a bad precedent, we should try Diplo and Intrigue first.
For the Yaks I advise we try to find the most peaceful modernists that aren't for abandoning all tradition, just what stands in the way of them having better lives and support them as we can. Try to support a lack of violence among our neighbors and hope for a better future for them.
Those pirates are weird. Why in the name of God Emperor Koryuu would they only take cargo and personnel, leaving perfectly good ships behind to drift? You can sell those things! Those merchantmen are probably worth more than the wares they carry!
There has to be a reason, but I'm drawing a blank here.
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