Current events and tensions have made it so that anything targeting shipping on the Skull River is automatically attributable to Marienburg unless proven otherwise, because that's one of the two supply pipelines for the canal construction.
Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest
- Thread starter Boney
- Start date
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Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
Current events and tensions have made it so that anything targeting shipping on the Skull River is automatically attributable to Marienburg unless proven otherwise, because that's one of the two supply pipelines for the canal construction.
- Location
- being near locations is my passion.
The use of 'If'
The lack of captisation on the word 'mages'
The use of 'Runesmith' as opposed to 'Runelord'
...
Did I get it right?
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Regarding the spell:
Honestly, there's a silver lining to this: It gives Mathilde time to do other things. Now the cloud of "spell can not be held active all the time" is a pretty bad one, but... eh.
That said, if anyone asks us to teach or try to codify it in the future; I'd strongly argue for throwing an AP at it first rather than teaching as-is; most Battl Magic casters do not hve Mathilde's staff to make this easier on them, after all.
Regarding the intrigu- oh look! What was that!? I think it was a distraction, excuse me while I go investigate this vital matter!
I think there is a decent chance at Skaven, they are after all the primary source of Warpstone gunpowder. The question is 'is that enough to make a call?'.
SuperSonicSound
Shadowmancer of the Shadow Cabal
Well the default assumption is that Marienburg attacked (due to current tensions), the evidence we have shows it wasn't marienburg but was reached mostly through magical means, something that wouldn't be commonly known about.
@BoneyM
Do we have to go with a conclusive statement?
I'd like to go with something like "It's a frame job, but it looks like the skaven did the frame job."
- Location
- Before the Ninth Gate
Note that it's dubious that the correct answer matters. What can Mathilde get away with that best benefits order is another pertinent question. Our best hope is this is skaven. The worst case scenario is this is Empire.
Also note that if Marienburg wanted, it would do this all via catspaws, so signs seem to point to criminal mercenaries from Reiksland having stuff to do with this. Who hired them is probably Marienburg, but we have no evidence as of yet.
I would rule out Skaven though. Even if they were trying to do a frame job, they wouldn't have gotten the barrel or shot from there, as there's no more skaven undercity in Reikland.
Also note that if Marienburg wanted, it would do this all via catspaws, so signs seem to point to criminal mercenaries from Reiksland having stuff to do with this. Who hired them is probably Marienburg, but we have no evidence as of yet.
I would rule out Skaven though. Even if they were trying to do a frame job, they wouldn't have gotten the barrel or shot from there, as there's no more skaven undercity in Reikland.
One of the options is to say it's not conclusive.
Hochlander quest must be quite the interesting read. He consistently gets up to interesting things and meets interesting people.
As for the vote I'm leaning towards.
[ ] It's good enough for now
The spell is workable which is good enough I think, we can potentially work on it during the trip but most likely we'll just have to make do.
[] The evidence is inconclusive
The Skaven could easily sourced this material and have all the required knowledge and motive.
Marienburg could have potentially done it, but if they did so it was impressively done for no obvious gain.
A framejob would presumably have resulted in some more obvious evidence pointing to someone in particular. (Although as a general tension raiser it makes sense, especially since the investigation does kind of point at Marienburg in a sloppy kind of way)
My report would be that it's likely the Skaven who was behind the attack, but we don't have any hard proof to guarantee it. I wouldn't want to make a definitive statement though because new evidence could turn up. I think the major thing that pushes me to think Skaven is the recent disease outbreak. Both the disease outbreak and the complex bomb both point to Skaven.
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- Location
- Brazil
I know the Good Enough option is tempting, but it needing to be at dusk or dawn means that, say, we can't beat a hasty retreat through what would be great terrain to pass through and avoid pursuers outside those specific hours.
It serves its purpose for strategical movement, but the very powerful tactical uses it has are severely diminished. For example, we won't be able to let the hundreds of monster cavalry we have to flank people at will, and flanking heavy cavalry is nearly as good at killing things as blowing them up with BM.
So I say we bite the bullet and try for it. Double overwork isn't nice, but it isn't the end of the world like Triple is.
Worst case, we still have this version of the spell.
But a better one could seriously alter how we wage warfare on a scale from skirmish to army through freely repositioning heavy assets, which might also be known as a CREED!
It serves its purpose for strategical movement, but the very powerful tactical uses it has are severely diminished. For example, we won't be able to let the hundreds of monster cavalry we have to flank people at will, and flanking heavy cavalry is nearly as good at killing things as blowing them up with BM.
So I say we bite the bullet and try for it. Double overwork isn't nice, but it isn't the end of the world like Triple is.
Worst case, we still have this version of the spell.
But a better one could seriously alter how we wage warfare on a scale from skirmish to army through freely repositioning heavy assets, which might also be known as a CREED!
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Alectai
Speaks Words of Wisdom... On occasion
Yeah, literally the only piece of evidence we've found that disproves Marienberg's involvement (Though only to a point of pushing the likelyhood of their involvement to the far edge of the margins), is one that couldn't be detected by anyone with a less sophisticated Windsight than Mathilde herself.
All the other pieces used strongly suggest Imperial Source, which by extension of the current tensions red-flags Marienberg.
But yeah, the availability of Skaven Blackpowder and the costs of being caught combined with the fact that "You don't have any experience with this shit"...
It's probably not Marienberg, because that's not just flirting with war, that's flirting with war that they don't get to call on their defensive alliance to bail them out of.
"Who Benefits?"
The answer in this case is "Anyone who benefits from potentially seeing the Karaz Ankor and Ulthuan lock horns again". Marienberg doesn't benefit because they're ground zero. The Skaven benefit as it gets everyone focused topside again while they're reorganizing after the Civil War--and have the ability to have done it. The Druchii benefit and would have the ability to carry this out, though not necessarily the ability to acquire the Skaven blackpowder used in it.
All the other pieces used strongly suggest Imperial Source, which by extension of the current tensions red-flags Marienberg.
But yeah, the availability of Skaven Blackpowder and the costs of being caught combined with the fact that "You don't have any experience with this shit"...
It's probably not Marienberg, because that's not just flirting with war, that's flirting with war that they don't get to call on their defensive alliance to bail them out of.
"Who Benefits?"
The answer in this case is "Anyone who benefits from potentially seeing the Karaz Ankor and Ulthuan lock horns again". Marienberg doesn't benefit because they're ground zero. The Skaven benefit as it gets everyone focused topside again while they're reorganizing after the Civil War--and have the ability to have done it. The Druchii benefit and would have the ability to carry this out, though not necessarily the ability to acquire the Skaven blackpowder used in it.
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SakSak
Unbound
- Location
- The Cold Wastes of the North
I am thinking that
[ ] It's good enough for now
since I do not want to ehad into the Chaos Wastes with an overwork action under our belt, to fine-tune an already working spell.
As for the investigation..... I refuse to believe even Marienburg would be stupid enough to knowingly get involved with Skaven on a level required for this operation. Individual actors within there, maybe, but not the city-state as an official whole.
So either someone in Marienburg is driving us towards a conflict, because they believe in lower-case chaos being a ladder they can use to climb, or someone outside of Marienburg wants the fight for their own reasons (and frankly, war between Marienburg, the Empire, and the Dwarves, is a massive distraction)
So I'd say its a framejob. Who is doing the framing is very much up in the air, but to me it seems that someone who is not the total ruling council of Marienburg is intentionally driving tensions up as much as they can.
[ ] It's good enough for now
since I do not want to ehad into the Chaos Wastes with an overwork action under our belt, to fine-tune an already working spell.
As for the investigation..... I refuse to believe even Marienburg would be stupid enough to knowingly get involved with Skaven on a level required for this operation. Individual actors within there, maybe, but not the city-state as an official whole.
So either someone in Marienburg is driving us towards a conflict, because they believe in lower-case chaos being a ladder they can use to climb, or someone outside of Marienburg wants the fight for their own reasons (and frankly, war between Marienburg, the Empire, and the Dwarves, is a massive distraction)
So I'd say its a framejob. Who is doing the framing is very much up in the air, but to me it seems that someone who is not the total ruling council of Marienburg is intentionally driving tensions up as much as they can.
[ ] Push on and try to improve the spell
Use overwork to spend another action to try to create a better delivery mechanism for the spell.
The spell is good but it could be better and better could make the difference between the Expedition failing and it succeeding.
It could be Marienburg framing the Skaven. It could be Skaven framing Marienburg. It could be vampires or necromancers framing everyone.
Use overwork to spend another action to try to create a better delivery mechanism for the spell.
The spell is good but it could be better and better could make the difference between the Expedition failing and it succeeding.
It could be Marienburg framing the Skaven. It could be Skaven framing Marienburg. It could be vampires or necromancers framing everyone.
Ekzentric Lohner
I miss Wildstar...
It seems more likely to be Skaven framing Marienburg than to be Marienburg framing Skaven, but we just can't say so conclusively.
It's unlikely for an Empire party to pull this off without official aid, which is definitely not something that could happen because the allience with the Dawi is literally holy and Mathilde certainly isn't ignoring the possibility of someone being deep enough in realpolitik to ignore that because of her divided loyalties, no sir.
It's unlikely for an Empire party to pull this off without official aid, which is definitely not something that could happen because the allience with the Dawi is literally holy and Mathilde certainly isn't ignoring the possibility of someone being deep enough in realpolitik to ignore that because of her divided loyalties, no sir.
Omegahugger
Inattentive Idiot
One important part of this update is this:
solidified dhar makes Skaven weaponry much more reliable, which is either a great endorsement of Dhar or a truly damning condemnation of all Skaven kind.
I suggest we do further testing to figure out which is the case.
Here, we here have the word of an expert concluding that the addition of
I suggest we do further testing to figure out which is the case.
No, the rest of the turn is set in stone.
- Location
- Germany
Ah, okay, if Marienburg is automatically suspect that it is most likely a frame job.
However I don't really see much evidence for Skaven involvement. The Warp powder may just have come from unscrupulos or desperate people going through the remains of the Skaven undercity in Ubersreik. The evidence is not conclusive enough for an accusation, but I suspect that someone in the Empire is trying to lure the Dwarfs into open war with Marienburg, so that the Empire can annex it.
However I don't really see much evidence for Skaven involvement. The Warp powder may just have come from unscrupulos or desperate people going through the remains of the Skaven undercity in Ubersreik. The evidence is not conclusive enough for an accusation, but I suspect that someone in the Empire is trying to lure the Dwarfs into open war with Marienburg, so that the Empire can annex it.
- Location
- Brazil
It won't take effect until we come back, so it won't hinder us during the expedition itself.
- Location
- New Brunswick, NJ
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
Alectai
Speaks Words of Wisdom... On occasion
Dark Elves have the motive, another Karaz Ankor vs Ulthuan throwdown is very good for them. They can also pose as Elves working on Marienberg's behalf too to further muddy the waters. The only stretch in this case would be the acquisition of Skaven blackpowder because it falls into the Dark Elf pride hole, but if they have trade connections with the Skaven they could simply acquire it themselves.
Like, if we're asked "Can we prove it to Dwarfen satisfaction", we'd have to say "Unfortunately, no". If the answer is "What do you think", the answer would be "I think it was a false flag attempted to provoke the Karaz Ankor into lashing out at Marienberg to activate their defensive alliance with Ulthuan".
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Omegahugger
Inattentive Idiot
Part of me kinda suspects this is a frame job by Skaven blaming other Skaven.
Because really, Skaven are the only faction who in any way benefits from other Skaven getting blamed,
Because really, Skaven are the only faction who in any way benefits from other Skaven getting blamed,
Yes, this is for the second overwork.
- Location
- Before the Ninth Gate
I would also say that unless one is pro lying to the dwarves to either get a grudge or nope a grudge, the only honest answer is not conclusive. We might think that A is more likely than B, but we don't know this beyond a reasonable doubt (given there's
a reasonable chance for a frame job in multiple directuons). Declaring a war should require beyond a reasonable doubt.
a reasonable chance for a frame job in multiple directuons). Declaring a war should require beyond a reasonable doubt.