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Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest

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ninjafish said:
[X] FIRST LINE: Caldera
[X] SECOND LINE: Withdraw
[X] THIRD LINE: Eastern Valley

Withdraw is by far the superior option and i don't know what is possessing people to attempt the futile and bloody task of trying to hold the mountains.
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Aside from this being an inflammatory post, I think the real problem is that we're going to end up in a bloody fight whatever we do. The only question you have to ask is whether you consider a bunch of traps as being able to deal more damage than the massive artillery, gyrocopter, and runelord advantage we have.
 
Robotninja said:
Hopefully Mors being destroyed will help Belegar feel better about realpolitik. If the Dwarves adapted somewhat, they could use Skaven treachery to their advantage. If it is in a given clans best interest to screw over another clan in a way that helps the Dwarves, they will almost always do so. So the Dwarves just need to get good at creating such incentives. With a hundred years of seasoning, Belegar would be an excellent candidate for high king.
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The problem is not that he feels bad about realpolitik: he has seen its efficiency and deeply believes that the reconquest of K8P would have been impossible without it. The issue is that realpolitik is incompatible with traditional dwarf values, and that according to realpolitik there's no reason to conquer K8P at all: the Dwarves don't need space in their current state. It's only traditional dwarf values that makes the reconquest valuable - but he has rejected them. There's no easy way out of that conundrum.
 
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Pempelune said:
But I do agree with your conclusion, the entire Waaaagh could probably fit in the Eye's dead zones. That's a pretty big issue, because the dead zones is probably where they will want to be (as it's where they can assault Karagril and the Citadel).
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This is very questionable to me. Think about it - if orcs were happy to stream piecemeal into prepared artillery ground, they wouldn't be nearly as big a threat as they are.

What I strongly suspect will happen is that the orcs will stream in, we'll start bombarding the ones that enter our artillery zone as they enter, and then they'll pull back and amass outside of our artillery's reach for a mass attack.

If we're very lucky then they'll wait until almost all of them are in K8P before launching said attack, and we'll ZOT them all at once. More likely they'll wait until "only" a third to a half of them are available before charging to overcome our artillery, so we'll only be able to yeet that smaller fraction of the force into the shadow realm.

The idea of them happily clumping up where there's constant artillery raining down on them when they could just pull the meeting point back a bit and be safe from bombardment is kind of silly - and not in the way orcs are usually silly.
 
Ericwinter said:
Aside from this being an inflammatory post, I think the real problem is that we're going to end up in a bloody fight whatever we do. The only question you have to ask is whether you consider a bunch of traps as being able to deal more damage than the massive artillery, gyrocopter, and runelord advantage we have.
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We cant really use the gyrocopters or runelords and such in the mountains now can we?

But fair
 
ChronOblivion said:
Also, the Drazh Underway is currently ahead of our Last Line.
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Yeah that was my point, we really don't want that to happen because our opponents then go from what survives to enter, to what survived to enter plus an entirely unknown amount of very enthusiastic orcs.

If we're making the last line the East Valley I think Hold has far better uses than otherwise because it delays the linking of Waaagh Birdmuncha and the Karak Drazh Underway for as long as possible, which mean the Underway orcs suffer worse losses.
 
Redshirt Army said:
This is very questionable to me. Think about it - if orcs were happy to stream piecemeal into prepared artillery ground, they wouldn't be nearly as big a threat as they are.

What I strongly suspect will happen is that the orcs will stream in, we'll start bombarding the ones that enter our artillery zone as they enter, and then they'll pull back and amass outside of our artillery's reach for a mass attack.

If we're very lucky then they'll wait until almost all of them are in K8P before launching said attack, and we'll ZOT them all at once. More likely they'll wait until "only" a third to a half of them are available before charging to overcome our artillery, so we'll only be able to yeet that smaller fraction of the force into the shadow realm.

The idea of them happily clumping up where there's constant artillery raining down on them when they could just pull the meeting point back a bit and be safe from bombardment is kind of silly - and not in the way orcs are usually silly.
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That's the sort of thing that will depend on how the dice rolls go.
 
@BoneyM

Do we consider it plausible to adapt our matrix to inanimate objects if we do a research project?

Is enchanting an object to have a single use effect easier than a reusable item?
 
13th Fleet said:
That's the sort of thing that will depend on how the dice rolls go.
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Of course. But the zone between "safe from our mountain because it's in the citadel's shadow" and "far enough away from artillery to be safe" is going to be very narrow if it exists at all, and crucially, the orcs don't know about the mountain to know they need to thread that needle.

Odds are that they'll charge at Karagril, the place they see as theirs and home to those ratties they want to take revenge on, instead of fruitlessly rushing at the sheer cliff that is the approach to the Citadel, but the potshots we take at them may cause them to switch their primary target to the Citadel.

Either way, whichever they charge at, they'll be exposed to artillery on the approach. Being quite wise in the ways of applied brutality, they'll very quickly grasp that rushing in single file isn't going to cut it, so they'll park outside of the artillery and wind up for a knockout punch.

It's hypothetically possible that some amount of them will poke at the other mountains while this is happening, although it's not that likely due to the lack of an obvious fight, with Zilfin being the primary contender on account of some of them potentially wanting to tussle with a dragon.

It seems unlikely to me that these piecemeal efforts will make any significant progress on mining open the entrances to those mountains if they occur at all - if by some stroke of luck they do manage to pry Zilfin (or Yar, or Mhonar) open before enough of them accumulate for the rush on Karagril or the Citadel, it should be obvious to Mathilde due to the theatre level movements swiveling towards that peak, so we'll just fire the Eye early and thus buy time to re-seal the mountain.

Otherwise, if things go as I'd expect them to, we should wait to fire the Eye right for when the first mass attack on Zilfin or the Citadel launches that we don't expect to be easily turned away by the artillery.

If we're very, very unlucky, this should still buy enough time for ~25% or so of the enemy force to be in the killzone, and has decent chances of decapitating their leadership. Effectiveness goes up from there on better rolls.
 
BungieONI said:
Yes, the scouting horns we made on the march to K8P were one use and very easy.
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Yep. Sharing the citation because of who I am as a person:
BoneyM said:
Normally, enchanting is a long and drawn-out process; the reason for this is that magic really doesn't like to be trapped in one place doing one thing indefinitely. (Talking about magic as if it had desires rather than just a nature is useful shorthand, but whether it is actually true is the source of a great deal of debate.) Trapping it temporarily to do something once, on the other hand, is magnitudes easier - and magnitudes more when the desired effect is the sort of petty magic apprentices begin their education with.
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I kinda doubt we will get the warboss, he has a wagon to hide in, and since he is in charge of half a million orcs he is going to be pretty tough.
 
Captainwolf said:
I kinda doubt we will get the warboss, he has a wagon to hide in, and since he is in charge of half a million orcs he is going to be pretty tough.
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I doubt it's self-propelled. If we take out his entire horde and leave him in the middle of the Caldera, he can either eat artillery until he's dead or try to run.
 
Hmmm, it would be good or bad luck if the warboss ends up being one of the first to enter the Caldera?

I mean, if he dies the Waagh disperses... into the mountains.
 
Tomcost said:
Hmmm, it would be good or bad luck if the warboss ends up being one of the first to enter the Caldera?

I mean, if he dies the Waagh disperses... into the mountains.
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Orcs do have a limited chain of command. While there'll be instability, it's possible there's one or two of them running around big enough that they won't get many questions if they say they're in charge now.

Like the battle for Nar, I think, where a really good warboss rose up, and when he died he got a replacement, even if that replacement wasn't as good.
 
Mopman43 said:
I doubt it's self-propelled. If we take out his entire horde and leave him in the middle of the Caldera, he can either eat artillery until he's dead or try to run.
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Well, Snotling Pump Wagons are, to my knowledge, self-propelled. Or rather, propelled by Snotlings frantically working the pumps and cranks that are mashed together from whatever rubbish could be found, but it mostly works anyway because Waaagh.

On the other hand, Pump Wagons aren't exactly known for their uniformity, so it's quite possible that his seat will be exposed to the sun.
 
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