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Compare to an action spent in raising Diplo by one or two to, say, Advanced Asassination.
That's not really a fair comparison, since advanced skills are a good bit harder to upgrade than basic ones. I still maintain that we should at *least* pick up practical diplomacy at some point. If nothing else its name outright describes it as a fallback, a way to not be completely offguard in diplomacy, because while we may not be able to be fancy and political, we can at least have a well developed set of guidelines for interacting with people in power, to try and avoid making too many powerful enemies as we continue to increase our visibility and exposure to imperial/college/etc politics.
 
That's not really a fair comparison, since advanced skills are a good bit harder to upgrade than basic ones. I still maintain that we should at *least* pick up practical diplomacy at some point. If nothing else its name outright describes it as a fallback, a way to not be completely offguard in diplomacy, because while we may not be able to be fancy and political, we can at least have a well developed set of guidelines for interacting with people in power, to try and avoid making too many powerful enemies as we continue to increase our visibility and exposure to imperial/college/etc politics.
Ah, but breaking things down into a few generic scenarios and how she should respond to them falls squarely within Mathilde's current skillset.

Kind of like Edda, except Mathilde is more flexible, and can always play the Wizard card.

I won't say no to free Diplo gains, but training a stat we almost never use, and have in fact found ways of getting around, is at the bottom of the to-do pile, and it's a big freaking pile.
 
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If nothing else, when we go visit the the Elves we won't have the weight of our college rep, dwarf rep, political position or great deed backing us up - getting on with our (famously touchy) hosts will be all our own interpersonal skills.
 
Ah, but breaking things down into a few generic scenarios and how she should respond to them falls squarely within Mathilde's current skillset.

Kind of like Edda, except Mathilde is more flexible, and can always play the Wizard card.
When she has prep time, and the advocacy for diplo classes revolves around situations where she doesn't have said prep time. And "breaking things down into a few generic scenarios" sounds a lot like Practical Diplomacy to me.
 
When she has prep time, and the advocacy for diplo classes revolves around situations where she doesn't have said prep time. And "breaking things down into a few generic scenarios" sounds a lot like Practical Diplomacy to me.
Then we don't need it, as that's what we do already.
If nothing else, when we go visit the the Elves we won't have the weight of our college rep, dwarf rep, political position or great deed backing us up - getting on with our (famously touchy) hosts will be all our own interpersonal skills.
Silently kill a lot of druchii, and all's well.

Nagarythe diplomacy in nutshell.
 
Thanks. Mostly I'm just trying to figure out what book topics we might gain benefit from. Obvious candidates:
  • Skaven (making use of our 2 dwarf favour stipend to max this bonus out)
  • Anatomy (Imperial Esoteric just costs money and helps Max translate)
  • Chaos Mutants & Beastmen (to give us some reference material for the "AV on living things" experiment). Our library currently doesn't cover these at all -- I'd be fine just picking up Imperial Extensive in each.
  • Maybe Physics, for states of matter research for the AV transformations? It came up in the narrative last time, though we didn't roll for it. Might be useful, but I could leave it out.
I don't think further sources on Ranald/Familiars are useful; when we set up the shrine, it was an unmodified piety roll, and I imagine that teaching our Good Boy to talk can make use of our Esoteric Canines. We're not gonna start an enchanting project next turn, and we already have +7 Arthropods on the We.

Anything else I'm missing? Any objections to included topics? Anyone? Bueller? @TotallyNotEvil?
I think that another candidate that you are missing is Dragons, because IIRC it had a 40% chance of waking up during the last war turn... So I don´t think he is going to stay asleep for long...

And since these books give a bonus for everything can get +12 both to diplomacy, stealth or combat with the Ice Dragon
 
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Silently kill a lot of druchii, and all's well.

Nagarythe diplomacy in nutshell.
The Nagarythe folk didn't vary their tone or express any sort of body language.

Like, that's not really that off-putting, given our go-to interpretation of the spell to become so terrifying that people die from fear is just to actually become that scary, rather than putting up an illusion or anything, but it's not indicative of how we'd be received in the other Elven Kingdoms.
 
In the end, Mathilde is good enough at diplomacy to not botch things. Whenever we need things to succeed, we can prepare for it, and make our Diplo not relevant.

If we are going to Ulthuan, buy some elven books and get a handle on how they tick, not that they are super alien to begin with.

I really can't see a sufficiently relevant situation where basic preparation for the most likely scenarios, and a hell of a poker face, and the skill to play the part of "the wizard" very well indeed, isn't enough for our dipomatic needs.

Not when the cost of making things surer is, well, everything else, and it isn't exactly hard to play to our existing strengths.
 
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How about we put down the Glasses of MinMax +5, and accept the possibility that Mathilde can still blossom to a less-awkward Super-Wizard/Warrior/Dwarf/Share-Holder/Ranald-Cleric/Assassin?

Besides, this is all theoretical. Any attempts to improve Diplomacy will be way down the priority list anyway and in the distant future, but you seem determined to snuff it in the crib right now.
 
The Nagarythe folk didn't vary their tone or express any sort of body language.

Like, that's not really that off-putting, given our go-to interpretation of the spell to become so terrifying that people die from fear is just to actually become that scary, rather than putting up an illusion or anything, but it's not indicative of how we'd be received in the other Elven Kingdoms.
Sure, and for that ten-turns-in-the-future-minimum expedition, we can brush up on elf lore, and learn the procedures so we don't fuck up, and how they think so we can leverage our intrigue.

Meanwhile, increasing Diplo sits at the bottom of the pile for very good reasons.
 
I don't really think these would be very relevant.
We have a research option for "take this deeply magical thing and put it on a living being to see what happens." Getting some library material about existing kinds of living-beings-exposed-to-raw-magic-and-transformed-thereby seems wise.
We could use book so on Powerstones and Enchanting.
I agree longterm, but I don't think anyone is floating a plan where we take either Powerstone class or Enchanting class next turn.
I think that another candidate that you are missing is Dragons, because IIRC it had a 40% chance of waking up during the last war turn... So I don´t think he is going to stay asleep for long...
This is a good point. We don't want to break the bank, but a bit of dragonlore is probably a good idea.
 
How about we put down the Glasses of MinMax +5, and accept the possibility that Mathilde can still blossom to a less-awkward Super-Wizard/Warrior/Dwarf/Share-Holder/Ranald-Cleric/Assassin?
How about you tone the condescension way the fuck down?
Besides, this is all theoretical. Any attempts to improve Diplomacy will be way down the priority list anyway and in the distant future, but you seem determined to snuff it in the crib right now
You seem to be incapable of reading the posts where I say "diplomacy is at the bottom of the list for the foreseeable future, and it's honestly not a problem because of this and that".

Instead of calling people filthy min-maxers, maybe you should actually read what's being said, eh?

Getting better at anything is obviously not bad. But this particular weakness is fairly trivial, for a multitude of reasons, and of minimum priority.

It's not an issue right now, and it's not likely to become an issue pretty much ever, as we can easily work around it and use one of our strengths instead.
 
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How about you tone the condescension way the fuck down?

Yeah, sorry. That was a bit too much. Thank you for pointing that out.

But if you're going to be this passionate about building Mathilde into this super-killy character, I'd like to mix a little role-play here and there. And that involves playing sub-optimally sometimes.

EDIT: To make this clearer, I am apologizing.
 
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You seem to have skipped over the "when she has prep time". Thus Practical Diplomacy should allow for it when we don't.
Are you expecting to go to Ulthuan without prep time?

Scenarios that are possible don't equal scenarios that are likely.

Mathilde being on a high stakes diplomatic duel without prep time is one of the former, and very much not one of the later.
 
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Yeah, sorry. That was a bit too much. Thank you for pointing that out.

But if you're going to be this passionate about building Mathilde into this super-killy character, I'd like to mix a little role-play here and there. And that involves playing sub-optimally sometimes.

EDIT: To make this clearer, I am apologizing.
At least to me, trying to get Diplomacy because it is useful sounds more min/maxy than keeping to our strenghts.
In character, Mathilde is not a diplomat and is kind of dorky, she gets around social interaction by preparing, it is who she is.
 
Ah, but breaking things down into a few generic scenarios and how she should respond to them falls squarely within Mathilde's current skillset.

Kind of like Edda, except Mathilde is more flexible, and can always play the Wizard card.

I won't say no to free Diplo gains, but training a stat we almost never use, and have in fact found ways of getting around, is at the bottom of the to-do pile, and it's a big freaking pile.
...I'm really not sure how 'Mathilde is like the character that literally found a major part of her job impossible and tried to quite because of it, only slightly less bad because she keeps finding ways to put off dealing with the problem situations' is supposed to be an argument *against* mathilde needing diplomacy training, to be honest? o_O

Like, no, its not a complete game changer. Yes, we mostly avoid it, because we mostly interact with people who either are already our friends from good diplo rolls in the past, are intimidated enough by our status that they won't fight us on things, or are people we only really interact in ways that our personal accomplishments matter. Yes, its not generally going to be about life or death in the immediate sense.

But. If we want to continue to get into imperial politics, either actively or just in a 'we are becoming too important a piece on the game board to not be involved'? If we want to become a lord magister and have to deal with the political side of the Colleges instead of 'just' the academic? If we want to start that branch college that keeps getting mentioned every few hundred pages? If we want to continue being someone that Belegar or any future employers can safely send as a representative to other polities? If, as others have mentioned, we want to go on a war fieldtrip to a very divergent cultural group that is notably prickly about outsiders, in search of contacts and learning opportunities? Then diplomacy 1. becomes more and more important, and 2. becomes harder and harder to get around by shying away from it and relying on books for personal interactions.

Long term, i personally want (at least) to pursue practical diplomacy, imperial politics (might fall under 'altdorf'?), maybe psychology (which should have intrigue benefits as well), and of course finish off the advanced dwarf trait just by way of spending time at K8P like Boney has said is viable. That seems like it would cover the basics and the most important of our contacts (dwarves twice over, imperial politics, and we already have stirland and college diplo) and give a good ~4 diplo points for us. But like i said, thats long term. Short term i personally would favour practical diplo classes over most other self improvement actions, as well as several research actions. We have a ridiculous array of strengths, we should shore up our biggest weakness next, imo.
 
This is a good point. We don't want to break the bank, but a bit of dragonlore is probably a good idea.
I would suggest to use most if not all the budget that Belbro gave us for this turn into Dragonlore... And even spend some more to get the +12...

We are going to need it eventually, and by the looks of it it is going to be soon so better spend it now than lamenting when we have to deal with an Emperor Dragon...
 
Are you expecting to go to Ulthuan without prep time?
I'm expecting her to go to Ulthuan and then end up in situations she didn't know were going to happen while she was there.

Hence it certainly seems worthwhile to plan on putting some of that prep-time before going to use on preparing for diplomatic situations (as represented by training a diplomacy related skill)
 
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