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Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest

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Jreengus said:
So I'm leaning toward grief but can anyone explain what potential downsides would be from people thinking Mathilde was sleeping with Ableheim? They can hardly claim he gave her unwarranted promotions because she was already as highly ranked as possible before meeting him, they can't claim anything she achieved afterwards was due to him because he died. I don't think the empire would have the same taboo about relations between an employer and their employees as we do. So aside from being some mildly salacious decades old gossip would it really impact Mathilde negatively?
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It's not really a stretch to think that a sizeable group of wizard would see it as 'sleeping with the enemy'.

The silver hammer and the colleges may work together, but they don't like each other. The banning of the colleges was not that long ago, and there is always a flare up of tensions or a rouge Witch hunter (or someone claiming to be one) that would still try to burn on sight.
 
There is also potential tarnishing of Abalheims memory among lot of people.
Possibly including his daughter.

I doubt there will be huge consequences of people think Mathilde was sleeping with Abelheim, but it is not true and there is no real point to the potential scandal when we have other explanations available to us.
 
Jreengus said:
So I'm leaning toward grief but can anyone explain what potential downsides would be from people thinking Mathilde was sleeping with Ableheim? They can hardly claim he gave her unwarranted promotions because she was already as highly ranked as possible before meeting him, they can't claim anything she achieved afterwards was due to him because he died. I don't think the empire would have the same taboo about relations between an employer and their employees as we do. So aside from being some mildly salacious decades old gossip would it really impact Mathilde negatively?
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I mean, Abel did give her a knighthood. That looks kinda sus from the perspective of Abel and Mathy being in a relationship. Kinda feel like it'd also impact some of Mathilde's social relationships? I'm thinking of Roswita here specifically, though there could be others. Though... I suppose this begs the question of who, exactly, would these "people" be? Starke, certainly. The rest of the Grey LMs, possibly, if they cared to learn it. Magisters... maybe? I don't really see it going further than that, aside from maybe rumors running rife with the apprentices, possibly affecting Eike since Mathy is known to be associated with her in some capacity, but beyond that? Unless we really piss off Starke I don't see this escaping the College, and I don't think the chance of that is especially high. For one thing, Algard seems to run a tight ship, and with the debacle of the Lights still playing out I doubt he'd want two of his LMs getting into a spat over decades old deeds.
 
I would (Usualy) advice telling the truth.

Which means telling her theres voices in her head making vote at critical points of her life..



Yeah. Lets lie.
 
Hm. I am corrently torn between these two:
[JK] Omeganuke: I was too busy reading my newly-acquired copy of the original Liber Mortis to do my job properly
[JK] Slynnwenpiety: i tried to convert the Watch to Ranald because we have an understanding, wherein I help him mug the other gods for pocket change and he gives me divine artifacts and familiars."
 
I think grief and Skaven are the most appropriate.

Grief, to me, seems to fit most closely with Mathilde's internal monologues, her decisions, and the thread tone at that time. I would label this as most true, and is my preferred option.
Furthermore, I think this is by far the most likely to reassure Starke that we are not going to repeat anything like this. Our actions at the time were not reasoned and measured. "You react … badly." Remember? We failed a self-control roll right before reacting. There was clearly intense grief. Starke would probably understand(and accept) us having had a "trial of faith" right after Abelhelm died.

Skaven is a good description, and not untrue, because the thread was very worried about Skaven, even though Mathilde personally did not know about them yet. Yes, it was metagaming, but it is also actually what happened.
 
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Jyn Ryvia said:
Would gather simpathy, but will also open the door for questioning out suitability for our rank because tramma don't just go away.
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While correct about trauma, lets keep this in perspective.

Starke himself said he didn't particularly care about something that happened 10 years ago and in the 10 years since there hasn't been a repeat of this incident.
Also if Boney is going to do indepth library science research I doubt psychology is going to be treated with less seriousness and unfortunately our modern understandings of Trauma are relatively recent, PTSD wasn't even a known condition until the mass Shellshock traumas of WWI. This medieval society is unlikely to match our understanding.
Meanwhile the Gray College keeps Melkoth as a LM despite the fact that he needs a Perpetual to remind him not to do magic tricks in a Witch Hunter and lets not mention the quadruple agent.

Trauma doesn't go away but medieval society may not recognise that, and even by a modern understanding it seems that Mathilde has processed it in the decade since. And the she is far from the least eccentric LM the Gray College keeps.
 
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I think I prefer a version of faith that's worded so she doesn't explicitly says she's a faithful of Ranald. Just say something like "I thought faith in the Protector would be appropriate for people who's job should be to protect others". Anybody who looks can easily find out she's a faithful of Ranald. She built two public shrines. Going wink wink nudge nudge on this would be no different, so long as she doesn't say it explicitly.
silentorphan said:
...you don't get to complain about this!
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Especially because she was absolutly delighted by her promotion ceremony. It was everything she wanted.
 
I'm leaning trauma or piety. Trauma feels like the safest option "I was a journeywoman in charge of one of the most important battles in recent history, of course it temporarily messed me up, but it didn't stop me from reclaiming two karaks", whilst there's something amusing to just... Straight up acknowledging we're one of Ranald's favourite servants. No lies, no falsehoods, just truthfully admiring we're a worshiper of the God of deception. "Grey wizards are supposed to be unconventional" indeed.
 
[JK] Sigmar sucks, and anybody who worships him is either unlucky or deluded.

But seriously, leaning Trauma here. It's one of the most accurate to the truth, and lies based on truth are hardest to disprove. Any negative implications on Mathilde's character from the act are likely to be small, due to both how long it's been since then and how much Mathilde's accomplished.
 
Boney said:
"My own credentials are in counterespionage, counter-daemonology, and Article 13 enforcement. I have relevant experience in the purging of malign energies and in encounters with Waystones corrupted for fell purposes, two of which were restored and one necessitated destruction. I also have access to many relevant accounts of events involving Waystones in the Luminarian Archives, the vaults of the Librarium Secularum, and the sacristies of the Order of the Silver Hammer."
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Useful knowledge.
Although the conversation as a whole makes me think she is never going to permit Mathilde to be her friend.

What Alric wants most of all is for his Order to finally outgrow him
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Citation needed.

He nods slowly as he considers that. "Thank you," he says again. "And I will be sticking with you. If nothing else - and in truth you've provided a lot of 'else' - then because Tor Lithanel is a great place to hunker down and wait for this conflict to be over."
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Awful lot of meanings packing into that small paragraph.

Despite his animosity towards Alric he was very much considered part of Alric's faction. And to a significant degree still is.

We should get around to writing about the beam-cannon arm soon. Get Egrimm and Mathilde's names on the same paper.

"Wizards," he sighs.
You nod in agreement. "Sometimes I think they're just making it up as they go along."
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Ha!

You suppose this was inevitable, you tell yourself after running through the first dozen disastrous scenarios.
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Mathilde: Panicked Wizard noises.

the Wurtbad Watch
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Ah. Yes, that little… fumble.

Saying Piety would be best for Ranald, who is trying to become more respectable, but bad for Mathilde.
Saying Skaven is the best for Mathilde if it works but could backfire.
Just leaving is a bad idea.
The rest… pretty inconsequential.
 
Having reread the update, it appears Starke is on our side. Someone has been slandering one of his wizards—one of his peers—and he wants the ammunition to fire back and say "suck it, that's just how my people roll".

Going dow the grief route, I feels, weakens this, as it opens us up to additional slander. Piety is probably similar, but easier for him to hide, because everyone expects Grey's to be Ranaldians anyway. Skaven is just straight up lying, and whilst we can retcon that into a sort of truth, I don't think we should do that here.

But trauma is fine, it's a very understandable reaction and it hasn't stopped us doing any part of our—hell, immediately afterwards we ran off to a warzone, so no one can really criticise us on that basis very easily.
 
Jyn Ryvia said:
Mathy being in a relationship with a witch Hunter, e.g the people that want Wizards banned and burned as a policy, is not a good look for a wizard.
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No intelligent Magister would think that. Which includes most of them and probably all LMs.

And there's WoG backing me up here. Some of the earliest even I think.

The only reason to preempt rumors of this kind is ultimately benign personal embarrassment.
pucflek said:
or, more pertinently, something to cast shadow on Roswita's relations with the various churches as a daughter of Count that consorted with wizards.
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I don't see it. Pretty much all EC families have most likely much worse rumors about their ancestors floating around. And Roswita fired us as literally her first act in office, thereby washing her hands off of any such "undue relations" with wizardry or otherwise. You know, up to the point where Mathilde marched into her home with a literal Dwarf honor guard, by Sigmar.
On top of all that Abelheim currently has hero or hero-adjacent status in Stirland, while Mathilde is big enough for people to sell trinkets in her imagine for protection.
So no, I don't see this causing any non-negligible issues.
Valmond said:
Possibly including his daughter.
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His daughter can bloody well ask if she thinks we were that important to her late father.
BurnNote said:
She built two public shrines.
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What two public shrines? I only see a shrine to no god in particular and definitely no hidden compartments and a reputable tavern giving veterans of the Karak reconquest some well earned entertainment, legal under Dawi law, that happens to display imagery inspired by the house pet of the renowned Oswald Oswaldson.:V
 
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pucflek said:
Of all the potential fallouts, this one seems like the least likely one from that rumour.

I expect more in way of slandering Mathilde's reputation with implications of being the social climber of the worst kind (which is rather unlikely) or, more pertinently, something to cast shadow on Roswita's relations with the various churches as a daughter of Count that consorted with wizards. I think the potential blowback has far more capacity to create problems for someone she likes than her herself.



Described it above, i think but to make it a point by point list of rumours that might sour something somewhere

1) Rumours of Mathilde ingratiating herself in nonrespectable ways
2) Rumours of Mathilde bewitching the Count
3) Talks of the "relationship" between late Count and his Court Wizard being used to sour relations between Roswita and the Witch hunters/Sigmarite church in general

None of it seems relevant unless she decides to interact with nobility of the Empire except the last one, which would be making some problems for Roswita, but nothing too serious if i am being honest.

I am still entirely in favour of Grief.
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Actually with the amount of wizard that already are or were in Sylvania it's probably not to big of a blow to Roswitas standing.
She also was not anywhere near us or abelheim whole this was happening and the first thing she pretty much did when coming back was throwing us out.
It shouldn't be a problem.
 
Rafin said:
I don't see it. Pretty much all EC families have most likely much worse rumors about their ancestors floating around. And Roswita fired us as literally her first act in office, thereby washing her hands off of any such "undue relations" with wizardry or otherwise. You know, up to the point where Mathilde marched into her home with a literal Dwarf honor guard, by Sigmar.
On top of all that Abelheim currently has hero or hero-adjacent status in Stirland, while Mathilde is big enough for people to sell trinkets in her imagine for protection.
So no, I don't see this causing any non-negligible issues.
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I did clarify in another post that i don't think the potential issues are gonna be some big hurdle, but i definitely believe that there are people within Church of Sigmar or some of the Witch Hunter orders that view Wizards as unsavoury and detest the possibility/implication of one of them having undue influence on Roswita (who is currently on very friendly terms with us) and previously Abelhelm. Sigmarites because they want Roswita in their bag and Witch Hunters because they had her and are, to a point, losing their influence on her.

Its certainly something that could be used as possible platform for detractors to try and undermine her in certain specific circles. I think that its unlikely to go there but i think discounting it outright is unwise.
 
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