Remove ads

Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest

Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
Voting will open in 9 hours, 20 minutes
Reader mode
Karugus said:
It's kinda hard to argue Ranald is more suited to driving out Vampiric infiltration than Sigmar though... given Sigmar fighting Nagash is literally part of the religious canon and an explanation for some of the vampires' vulnerabilitie.s
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Fair point. Tearing down altars to Sigmar and putting things up to Ranald doesn't help the situation.
 
How about all of the above? Abelheims death was a Skaven assassination so in our grief and trauma we re tooled in preparation for entering the war below. :V:V:V Surely nothing can go wrong trying that.
The difficult part is getting the whole thing out while leaving, Mathilde had better talk fast.
 
[x] Write in: (Challenge him) There are other ways of ensuring that your underworld is immune to vampire, necromancer, and skaven incursions.

None are as self regulating or as useful to a spy mistress and to my Elector.
 
Last edited:
Karugus said:
To keep playing the devil's advocate on this one, proving a negative is usually really hard. Especially when the subject clearly knows the content now. We're one of the best experts on Skaven in the Empire, if not arguably the best. It is really difficult to say 'I can prove that Weber did not know about the Skaven during the year of 2477'- especially when that's something like a decade ago now.

Off the top of my head I think Johan's the only one who could maybe sink that story, and Johan is a) a good friend of ours, and b) pretty savvy on this sort of thing for a gold wizard, so I don't think the risk is that large.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
My response is that they do not need to prove it fully but only produce reasonable doubt. Anyone looking into this further will know just as well that it would be next to impossible to prove without a doubt our story is false, but if they are able to provide enough evidence that we might be lying that will still hurt our reputation. And that's not even considering if the counterespionage grey magister has some method we do not know about to tell if we are lying.

Why risk it for what seems to be some minor embarrassment at having made the wrong call a decade ago?

Plus I very much do not like the idea of us flat out lying to our superiors when we may be able to get away with us for the sole purpose of making ourselves look better.
 
Ericwinter said:
…I almost wish the Fifth Article of Magic was actually relevant for something like this, if only for the Lols. :V
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

[ ] Plead the Fifth
You introduced the worship of Ranald as a first step towards making the entire Wurtbad Watch into your Apprentices.

Andres said:
Wasn't it Only Gork? (Not memeing here.)
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

It was an altar and ritual of Only Gork that started it all, but the part that'd be a mess if it got out is that Mathilde became an avatar of Only Mork when she started muckin' about with it.
 
Grief. It's true and is the least damaging to Mathilde. She was a decade less experienced, out of her depth, and in close contact with someone that treated her with respect and care. An attraction forming isn't really all that strange.
 
What are the downsides of the Porter knowing our faith? How far will that information go beyond Starke's desk? Given that we occasionally just kind of... spewing god-power in every direction, how likely is it's already known?
 
I don't have time to make a full blown post, but I would like to point out that Mathilde has already chastised herself over "not being a very good Ranaldite" because Liljiana found out about it so easily. I don't think Mathilde minds telling people close to her like Panoramia or making a cheeky reference while doing a religous service to Ranald like the gambling celebration in Karag Nar, but outright telling anyone who asks that she's a Ranaldite to cover herself isn't the greatest reason to reveal it.

Part of being a Ranaldite is that you shouldn't scream outloud that you are one, and I don't think it's a particularly good idea. It also allows people to maintain plausible deniability if we don't officially say that we're a Ranaldite. It's not a crime to be a Ranaldite, but it hurts someone's reputation, and maintaining plausible deniability can allow people who would otherwise be hurt reputation wise through association (Heidi being involved with a Ranaldite? What a scandal!) to not be affected.

It's fine for everyone to know that Mathilde is a Ranaldite as long as they can't prove it without a shadow of a doubt. Mathilde outright saying she's a Ranaldite kind of breaks that shield.
 
Karugus said:
It's kinda hard to argue Ranald is more suited to driving out Vampiric infiltration than Sigmar though... given Sigmar fighting Nagash is literally part of the religious canon and an explanation for some of the vampires' vulnerabilitie.s
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I think we could make a pretty decent argument here: Who has contributed the most to ridding Eastern Stirland of its vampire problem, Sigmar or Ranald?

Of course, framing it like that kinda turns the entire argument into "Grief but I'm still not done processing it"
 
A possibility has been raised to me. If we vote [ ] Grief then the Grey Order may be bamboozled into thinking that Mathilde was in love with Abelhelm. And the idea of them thinking that while Mathilde doesn't know they think that is absolutely hilarious. So I put the question to you all, what possible write-in could we do that is IC for Mathilde but is most likely to make the Grey Order think that she was hopelessly in love with Abelhelm? Remember, here shoveling grist into the rumour mill IS the point.
 
It's also worth noting that Mathilde also sponsored a Ranaldite temple in the Karak. And has generally failed to interact much with any of the other faiths. That cat is basically out of the bag.
 
Well that's a blast from the past.

Codex said:
Part of being a Ranaldite is that you shouldn't scream outloud that you are one, and I don't think it's a particularly good idea. It also allows people to maintain plausible deniability if we don't officially say that we're a Ranaldite. It's not a crime to be a Ranaldite, but it hurts someone's reputation, and maintaining plausible deniability can allow people who would otherwise be hurt reputation wise through association (Heidi being involved with a Ranaldite? What a scandal!) to not be affected.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

I don't get the plausible deniability thing in Mathilde's context. Thorgrim Grudgebearer actually wrote a letter on how Mathilde could be a dwarf soul stolen by Ranald and basically left the situation for the Conclave to investigate further.

Mathilde getting involved with Ranald in some manner isn't exactly a closely held secret and Grey Wizards are already closely associated with Ranald anyways.
 
Omegahugger said:
I think we could make a pretty decent argument here: Who has contributed the most to ridding Eastern Stirland of its vampire problem, Sigmar or Ranald?

Of course, framing it like that kinda turns the entire argument into "Grief but I'm still not done processing it"
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Technically, if you count Roswita as Sigmar, then Sigmar. She's done far more work to clear Sylvania out than Mathilde has by this point, due to years of tedious and lengthy work.
 
Worshipping Ranald probably isn't a problem amongst the orders. I actually think hate for the Sigmarite faith is a lot more common in the orders than they would like to admit because of the whole burn the witches thing.
 
I'll admit, I'm a little partial to all of the first three options. They're all true, in my eyes, especially as Mathilde's intentions there and then were pretty muddled. Such muddled intent was noted at the time to be much of why it failed, after all.

If only there was some way to combine them.~

(Honestly, even the "Skaven" option has some truth to it, IIRC. Just not IC or for that decision specifically. I vague recall them coming up in context of decisions on how to build out the Stirland Watch on the part of some players. What with the victory of both the Thief as leader and the Ratcatchers for incorporation.)
 
I'm thinking either Trauma or Piety.
Our Ranaldian faith is not a huge secret, so even if it could cause issues later, it should not be major ones.
Trauma makes things understandable if not really all that smart in hindsight.
 
Codex said:
Technically, if you count Roswita as Sigmar, then Sigmar. She's done far more work to clear Sylvania out than Mathilde has by this point, due to years of tedious and lengthy work.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
... Oh yeah, she counts, doesn't she.

Not even just technically, she's a Sigmarite like her father was and unlike him has shown no signs of lapsing. Even if you credit Ranald with uprooting the Lamhian conspiracy, she's still enough to tip the scales towards Sigmar.

*silently adds "Made me look like a fool by using competent followers" to his list of grudges against Sigmar*
 
Codex said:
Technically, if you count Roswita as Sigmar, then Sigmar. She's done far more work to clear Sylvania out than Mathilde has by this point, due to years of tedious and lengthy work.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Nah, Mathilde was instrumental to Abel's initial push as a Journeywoman and then stabilised Roswita's reign as a Magister.

Roswita was only able to clear things once the most thorny threats were already dealt with.
 
Zero Gravitas said:
Nah, Mathilde was instrumental to Abel's initial push as a Journeywoman and then stabilised Roswita's reign as a Magister.

Roswita was only able to clear things once the most thorny threats were already dealt with.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
And Mathilde only managed to do lot of it because of other people.
X could only succeed because of Y, who only suceeded because of Z, who only could accomplish this because of...
Is an endless chain not worth following.
Roswita deserves credit for her accomplishments.
 
Last edited:
Reader mode
You must login or register to reply here.
Voting will open in 9 hours, 20 minutes
Remove ads
Back
Top