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Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest

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Guys we know what happens when Ranald directly interacts with the divine energies of other gods, he cannot help us with this, not directly at least, not to mention that he might have a conflict of interest regarding divinity.

We will never go as far with Faith as we would with Truth, and this is the kind of Truth that can change everything.

It might actually be the most interesting plot thread I've seen in a long time, i just want to see what we can get, imagine the rush of stealing even one more signature.
 
[x] Faith

I think i would be more interested in truth if we could focus on it, but in reality we aren't going to touch it while there is a 100 other actions that we still have to do with the waystone project and other, less dangerous projects.

I just honestly think we will never get around to it.
 
Jreengus said:
Ranald isn't really Mathilde's god, he is her friend who happens to be a god. If he is the kind of asshole friend who would secretly test her like that she may be better off without him.
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But he didn't setup the test; she did by stumbling across forbidden lore. If he's watching, he's done the equivalent of arriving unnoticed and keeping quiet to see if his friend is actually his friend. Is his friend going to just keep the envelope of money with his name on it? Or is she going to pull out her phone and call him right away?
 
Jyn Ryvia said:
[x] Faith

I think i would be more interested in truth if we could focus on it, but in reality we aren't going to touch it while there is a 100 other actions that we still have to do with the waystone project and other, less dangerous projects.

I just honestly think we will never get around to it.
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We have been consistently using vitae the last few turns, you think the intersection of vitae, divine mysteries and Grand Theft Artifact (well more like Artifact Snap) won't be popular?
 
Ph34r_n0_3V1L said:
But he didn't setup the test; she did by stumbling across forbidden lore. If he's watching, he's done the equivalent of arriving unnoticed and keeping quiet to see if his friend is actually his friend. Is his friend going to just keep the envelope of money with his name on it? Or is she going to pull out her phone and call him right away?
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I think you really need to step back and consider who you are describing... the incarnation of deception larceny and risk taking. You think that being wants us to play it safe and be honest?
 
Well, color me pleased about this outcome.

I'm still catching up on discussion (y'all maniacs added over 20 pages to the thread in six hours, Jesus Christ Ranald!), but I have work in half an hour (I'm employed again now, by the way!) and think I have my vote.

[X] Faith

Let me begin by saying: I don't give a shit about the wrath of the gods. I don't think they have a right to their secrets. Steal fire from heaven. As such, I won't be upset if Truth wins.

But I give a lot of shits about Ranald, personally. The dude has had our back over and over. We only have the Aethyric Vitae because Ranald was looking out for us -- the fucking snake kept failing its rolls to manifest, the one time it was about to manifest Ranald's Blessing sent a cat to protect us, and then it rolled a 50 and got trapped in a superposition of life and death. And yes, that's a blurring of the lines between the fiction of the story and the meta knowledge of the quest in which dice rolls govern reality, but, like, Mathilde's fortune has been really good, and she has to have noticed that in fiction. With his help, we stole Queekish from the skaven. With his help, we dismantled Alkharad's operation in a single night of prowling. With his help, we survived four rounds of direct combat against an empowered champion of the Chaos God of direct combat.

I am 100% fine with tempting the wrath of every god from Aach to Wulfor (this rhetorical flourish would be better if there were gods beginning with X, Y, or Z, but I work with what I've got). But I don't want to do something Ranald would find a violation of his person. I want to work in partnership with him and not at cross (ha) purposes -- and I know the partnership that Faith would involve isn't a research partnership, but I'm sure he can think of something interesting to do with it.
 
So, had a bit of time to think about this.

First, random thought: if we stored Shallyan Divine Fingerprint/Essence, would we effectively have a Tear of Shallya? Would Essence of Morr kill Vampires?

Second, regarding our choice: prudent is off the table for me. Mathilde is just too curious for that to sit squarely with me, and to be honest, so am I.

Faith...the thing is, I can't see a scenario where Ranald isn't already ok with this. I really don't think he failed to notice us playing with the coin. He's shown willing before to smack us over the head if we are going after something he genuinely wants to say no to. And more than that, he's a god of thieves, conmen, gamblers and rebels. Deceiving the gods in insanely risky maneuvers to steal pieces of the essences of the divine? This literally hits all four of Ranald's buttons.

I think what's going on is that this is genuinely an insanely risky thing to pursue, and Ranald doesn't want to put his finger on the scale when we decide. If we take that risk, he wants us to do it for ourselves, and not to please him.

I think I'd we took faith, I think he'd be like, "yo, I can't be mad at you, cause you're showing how much you love me. But I'm a little disappointed you didn't let it all ride. It's okay, you weren't ready."

So, much as it surprises me, I guess I'm leaning Truth. We're just going to have to hit new heights of paranoid caution.
 
DragonParadox said:
I think you really need to step back and consider who you are describing... the incarnation of deception larceny and risk taking. You think that being wants us to play it safe and be honest?
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it's a commandment of his to not do the sneaky stuff to other members of the cult that you would do to other people.

Ranlad don't like his kids shitting in their(his) own backyard.
 
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COULD be a test of "Can you keep quiet on this?"
If yes, then proceed, until you start poking the wrong thing again and need a rap on the knuckles.
If no, then well, you've already told Ranald, even though he was purposely not watching, so nah, you can't.
 
Jyn Ryvia said:
it's a commandment of his to not do the sneaky stuff to other members of the cult that you would do to other people.

Ranlad don't like his kids shutting in their(his) own backyard.
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Which is why we are not going to do anything with this crystal, but we are also going to give him plausible deniability by not forcing our heist on him... where he would have to play the Man.
 
Jyn Ryvia said:
it's a commandment of his to not do the sneaky stuff to other members of the cult that you would do to other people.

Ranlad don't like his kids shutting in their(his) own backyard.
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We're in the clear on that then. Steal fire from the other gods. The mean ones.

Truth while staying pious just means not using the essences of allied deities.
We can go mug Gork and Mork again...
 
Has boney mentioned that sacrificing the crystal to Ranald is continuing the research, but with him? because from the update i really don't get the feeling it would be and people are treating it is.

It reads like sacrificing the crystal is accepting that the mysteries of gods are beyond us and we should never try to understand them.
 
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DragonParadox said:
I think you really need to step back and consider who you are describing... the incarnation of deception larceny and risk taking. You think that being wants us to play it safe and be honest?
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With him? Yes. We can see it within his church; loyal to each other, but free to mess with everyone else. If that wasn't the tone, Mathilde would never have relied on them for espionage. It's because he's also the Protector; no one's going to turn their back on someone to protect them from the dark if they fear a knife in the back.
 
Ph34r_n0_3V1L said:
With him? Yes. We can see it within his church; loyal to each other, but free to mess with everyone else. If that wasn't the tone, Mathilde would never have relied on them for espionage. It's because he's also the Protector; no one's going to turn their back on someone to protect them from the dark if they fear a knife in the back.
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I am not going to get into a discussion on the sincerity and centrality of the protector, but I will note that the GM said that a 'plausible deniability' relationship with Renald seems possible to Mathilde and I think that is more reasonable than the god of lies and risk taking demanding less risks and more truth
 
das_slash said:
We will never go as far with Faith as we would with Truth, and this is the kind of Truth that can change everything.
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I don't think it's a matter of "How far can you go?" but a matter of different paths and different ways to walk them and different things.
DragonParadox said:
I think you really need to step back and consider who you are describing... the incarnation of deception larceny and risk taking. You think that being wants us to play it safe and be honest?
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Man, you know exactly what they mean and they're talking about. =/

They're proceeding from the argument that it is reasonable to believe or expect that one of the explanations for why Ranald might not have shown his awareness of this event, despite Mathilde suspecting that he ought to be aware... is that this might be a test of faith or character. Your responses to that earnest point from people... is basically just memeing and going "Ah, but you think a god of lies wouldn't lie about things? Shame on you. :V"

That's just as reasonable a conclusion for people to reach or to consider, as is your own stance of "Aha, perhaps it's plausible deniability?"

And also... Yeah? Like, Ranald isn't just some "personification of lies and stealth and cheatiness", he's the Ranald who has as one of his tenets "There is no honour among thieves, yet trust in your brothers and sisters, for there is honour among Ranaldans."

So... yes, Ranald might use a test of character to see if somebody holds to the tenet of "There is honor among Ranaldans". There's no need to rib people who make that argument and joke at their expense for believing that, because it's true.
 
[X] Faith

'Let's not potentially piss off the entire continent' being my operative thinking in this instance.
 
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