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"Or... Johann might be willing to volunteer. He's a big believer in self-improvement and already has golden arms. Though the magical interface seems like it would be a problem, Hysh meeting Chamon."
Surely not he must have learnt his lesson by now.
After all you know what they say about hind...
[ ] [ARM] Johann
Attempt to attach the prosthetic arm to Johann, with his full and enthusiastic consent.
...sight is 20/20. :O
With that worry set aside, you go through the other possible reasons and end up with two likely candidates: that he does not want the rest of his Guild learning of the meeting, or that he wants to negotiate an extreme degree of control over the project and seeks to put you off your guard.
Perhaps he wants Kragg involved?
Nevermind slightly less possible than the assassin.
Maybe the assassin wants us and Kragg in the same place to kill the both of us?
 
It's not impossible, but it seems extremely unlikely for Dwarves to have just forgotten how to unseal the hold of their ancestors when they've been living in the same incredibly well-defended place since the year they sealed it.
Wasn't there something incredibly cursed about middle mountains from dwarf perspective? Is it possible its just rumour Middle Mountains dwarves spread to look less bad?
 
Murder? What murder? Thorek is asking for us to exert our political influence in the Empire to pressure the Karaz Ghumzul descendants to give us the secrets to entering their holds that they haven't been to in 3000 years. This is definitely going to irritate them, but unless things go horribly wrong, no murder at all should be happening.

Unrest is a thing. Murder is another.


''"Two," he says frankly. "First, the descendants of ancient Dawi treason live fat, happy lives within Middenheim. There are many wrongs that must be punished before their own inherited sins are a priority for the Karaz Ankor, but they still hold the keys to Karaz Ghumzul. I need allies in the Empire to bring pressure to bear on them so they will surrender those keys, so that I might harvest a beginning of repayment from its ruins."''

Given the way dwarves tned to think about things I assumed this repayment was of the murdery variety? My brain might just be pulling a big dumb on me.
 
Well shit.

Gotta go for both IMO. I think Thorek is the best dwarf for the job of shaking up the runelords, so unless someone has some good arguments against I'm leaning his way for sure.
 
''"Two," he says frankly. "First, the descendants of ancient Dawi treason live fat, happy lives within Middenheim. There are many wrongs that must be punished before their own inherited sins are a priority for the Karaz Ankor, but they still hold the keys to Karaz Ghumzul. I need allies in the Empire to bring pressure to bear on them so they will surrender those keys, so that I might harvest a beginning of repayment from its ruins."''

Given the way dwarves tned to think about things I assumed this repayment was of the murdery variety? My brain might just be pulling a big dumb on me.
Thorek wants their stuff, most pertinently any runework that may have been left behind, either in the form of tools/weapons or structural stuff. Of course, if he finds that something's squatting there now I'm sure there'll be some murder involved as well.
 
''"Two," he says frankly. "First, the descendants of ancient Dawi treason live fat, happy lives within Middenheim. There are many wrongs that must be punished before their own inherited sins are a priority for the Karaz Ankor, but they still hold the keys to Karaz Ghumzul. I need allies in the Empire to bring pressure to bear on them so they will surrender those keys, so that I might harvest a beginning of repayment from its ruins."''

Given the way dwarves tned to think about things I assumed this repayment was of the murdery variety? My brain might just be pulling a big dumb on me.
The only Grudges for which the repayment is unnilateral death are usually levelled against Skaven and Orks.
 
''"Two," he says frankly. "First, the descendants of ancient Dawi treason live fat, happy lives within Middenheim. There are many wrongs that must be punished before their own inherited sins are a priority for the Karaz Ankor, but they still hold the keys to Karaz Ghumzul. I need allies in the Empire to bring pressure to bear on them so they will surrender those keys, so that I might harvest a beginning of repayment from its ruins."''

Given the way dwarves tned to think about things I assumed this repayment was of the murdery variety? My brain might just be pulling a big dumb on me.
This was expounded on before in regards to Grudges:
You describe the Book of Grudges, and cite several examples - not from the Dammaz Kron, which describes only the most terrible of wrongs done to the Dwarven race, but from the local Books of Grudges maintained in each of the hold, which records every unsettled score. One in particular seems particularly relevant: an unsettled debt between Zhufbar and the Asoborn tribe, where tribesman made a delivery of a cartload of wild grains in exchange for three good axes, only for it to be later discovered that the grains were mouldy and cut with sawdust. After the destruction of Castle Drakenhof, several Grudges against the Vampires were struck out as settled, but so too were several accumulated Grudges against the rulers and population of Stirland - and then, when it was judged that the Grudges struck out were almost but not quite sufficient, they kept going back until they found a Grudge of just the right severity, and only then were the sins of the long-dead Asoborns forgiven.

Judging by the horrified stares you get, the message has been successfully communicated. What you didn't tell them was that the sins of those Asoborns would likely never be pursued, or at least not until the more important Grudges against greenskins, Skaven, Chaos Gods, Chaos Dwarves, Ogres and Elves were settled first. A little terror would be good for them.
The Dwarfs have plenty of grudges on the ancestors of man, just as they do with the ancestors of Ghumzul. They just don't get to it until all the more serious grudges are cleared. Death isn't teh only way to repay grudges either, there are a dozen ways of making recompense that don't involve murder. It's only when you refuse to negotiate or you've proven yourself utterly incapable of negotiation (Greenskins, Skaven) that they jump to killing.
 
I would really want Mathilde and Thorek to sit down with Kragg to discuss the entire thing before raining hell down on the Runemasters.
 
[X] [THOREK] Both

Thorek is the best and last chance of reform in the Runesmiths' guild. Let's give him the best chance he can have

[X] [ARM] Disassemble

Johan getting the arm will benefit Johann, it will make him more lethal, but there are many ways to make one magister more lethal. Knowledge however can be reproduced, it can be transmitted, it can help many and for more than war. I am willing to take that chance.
 
[X] [THOREK] Both

Seems to just make sense on many levels, we want him on board so boosting his position is helpful for us by resulting in a partner with more pull, also seems more likely giving him a stronger position might help prevent his initiative from bogging down into a costly quagmire. Finally what he's asking us to report is basically what we already believed (and even spoke about to the rest of the leadership when we were still at Dum).

[X] [ARM] Disassemble

Johann option is cooler, but hopefully this will result in enough additional data to be worth the loss of an active laser arm.
 
Putting aside the morality question, that's the sort of gambit that costs nothing if it goes perfectly but costs everything if it doesn't. When the cost for doing things straightforwardly isn't so high, it doesn't make sense to risk imploding the reputations of everyone involved just to avoid paying it.

Yeah, that option being a crazy gambit is what I figured - just wanted to raise the option of crazy gambits due to our history in engaging in them (and also because the reform the Runesmith option feels like an equally risky gambit).

Kragg has got a lot of influence on the guild, even though he has no interest in it.

That's why I feel that Kragg's opinion on this is very significant.

I don't mind Mathilde standing up to a random Living Ancestor or even a bunch of them - particularly not with another Living Ancestor Thorek in her corner.

However Kragg is as far away from the average Runelords as they are from journeydwarfs and is four times as old as the minimum Living Ancestor age. He dwarfs (heh) even Mathilde's accomplishments - and quite probably even Mathilde and Thorek combined so it'd be really painful to go against him.



[x] [ARM] Johann
[x] [THOREK] Karaz Ghumzul
[X] [THOREK] Both

I'm really torn between playing it safe with Karaz Ghumzul and being ambitious and going for Both.
 
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