Starfleet Design Bureau

anyway @Sayle , potential set of options for phasers that don't require completely redoing how they work, to be appended to relevant weapons votes:

[-] High Performance EPS Grid [COST HERE]
By constructing the entire electro-plasma system from the same ultra-high-performance condiut as is typically used to connect the warp core to the nacelles, total allowable max load on the grid can be increased by several orders of magnitude, allowing a ship to freely fire modern phasers. Unfortunately, this conduit, and the neccessary high pressure EPS taps, are very expensive to manufacture in the required quantity, rapidly becoming prohibitively expensive as vessel size (and, therefore, the total size of the EPS grid) increases.

Adds 0.5 cost per 10,000 Tons of ship mass (before nacelles). Obviously, this one is your preference for a small ship- and 80 kton vessel, for example, would add a whopping 4 extra cost for one. on the other hand, it is absolutely prohibitively expensive on large ships- a 200 kton vessel would be shelling out one hundred cost for a similarly reinforced EPS grid!
Which, obviously, easily explains why we don't do that.

[-] Dedicated Power Runs [Phaser Bank Cost 4 → 6]
On the other hand, one could instead run a fully segregated power feed directly between the ship's warp core and each phaser bank. This would complicate the interface at the core itself significantly, and require the manufacture of extra EPS conduits above those normally required by a vessel, functionally increasing the cost of each phaser bank by fifty percent.

Obviously, the middle road option; a small ship (that even carries enough phasers to care about the ability to shoot lots of them) would probably find it more cost effective to just reinforce the entire grid as above, but a larger vessel, particularly if it was going to mount a relatively low number of phaser banks but still desires to fire the lot at once, absolutely will generally prefer this option unless mounting a truely ludicrous number of banks.

[-] Local Reactor [No extra Cost, Phaser Bank space consumption increased]
Alternatively, each phaser bank could be connected directly to a modestly sized fusion generator for power. This would add negligible cost to the vessel given the wide availability and longstanding maturity of fusion reactor technology, but would require additional space in the hull for the reactor itself, effectively tripling the size of each phaser bank.

Your "I have space to burn, let's get our discoball on" option. Obviously favors big lads with loads of volume to burn and ships that don't care overmuch about internal space, and disfavors small ships or things with floorspace concerns.

[-] Use Standard EPS Grid [No Cost]
of course, you can simply use a standard issue unmodified electro-plasma system built to the standard configuration that has been in use since the Sagarmatha class starship, even if this does restrict a ship to only being able to power two phaser banks at any one time, incurring no extra costs in space or manufacturing.

The "two phaser banks is fine for this ship, we don't need to add cost overhead in any way" option. which may well be desirable more often than it might seem.


There. Two Phaser limit alemorated, multiple methods of doing so with different limitations available for people to argue over, built in explaintions for why not one of the three was previously standard issue, and no new mechanics required. Easy peasy lemon squeezy.
 
One thing I will note is that Starfleet is very bad at actually sticking to class theme names.

Galaxy class had anything from Enterprise, to Allegheny, etc.

Constitution is even worse, everything from Constellation to Potemkin.

I'm actually struggling to find somewhere that Starfleet stuck to a theme as well as we generally have heh.
 
Connies had names that were extremely resonant to the viewers in the 1960s, being warships from many foreign (and enemy!) navies. This is, however, something that has lost salience to more recent audiences, and more importantly makes basically no sense from the context of the 2260s Federation. TOS just kind of didn't really care that much at the time though, Rondenberry was writing an allegory and he wanted it to be blunt.

Constitution itself, as a name, also came very late, for TOS the Enterprise was "Starship"-class.
 
Connies had names that were extremely resonant to the viewers in the 1960s, being warships from many foreign (and enemy!) navies. This is, however, something that has lost salience to more recent audiences, and more importantly makes basically no sense from the context of the 2260s Federation. TOS just kind of didn't really care that much at the time though, Rondenberry was writing an allegory and he wanted it to be blunt.

Constitution itself, as a name, also came very late, for TOS the Enterprise was "Starship"-class.
Yeah but I mean more that even later on, as in TNG+ ship classes generally didn't then follow the naming conventions set by the class name. Defiant had a Sao Paulo, Sovereign had a bunch of non monarchy related names, etc.
 
I've tried to keep out of this hot topic so far, but it's showing a lot of frustration on both sides, so I'm going to claim the middle ground in an attempt to difuse the tensions.
I can understand the POV of the Connie "Trueists", if this was a Star Wars quest and we were the Corillian Yards designing the YT-1300 - I'd be stedfast in insisting that it "HAD" to be the same. I'd be willing to accept it being a bit larger, perhaps swap out a few components. But if it didn't look like the Millenium Falcon at the end I would be very upset. So please accept that I'm not just blowing off your concerns here guys.

What we need to remember is that both our and the OTL Connies were a product of their enviroment- technological, social and threats. What I consider the biggest deviation can be traced back to the new warp core design. OTL Starfleet stayed with the Horizontal design which they could refit to the Legacy fleet, allowing it to remain front line capable for several more decades while Starfleet slowly built up a fleet of new design ships that would be able to take the eventual Vertical core design. The result of this was that the Klingons viewed than as a strong opponent for several more decades and weren't willing to commit to open war during that time. This meant that the OTL Connie wasn't a critical lynchpin and the design could allow for a less combat focused design.
We on the other hand, had an "oooohhh, SHINY!!" reaction to the vertical core and faster speeds and went for it, possibly without fully considering that it would take us decades to build up enough new design ships that we could stop relying on the Legacy fleet. This has resulted in the Klingons looking at us and realising that we're still using our old designs and that we are slower and weaker than them. With this critical weakness the Klingons believe that the imbalance of power has tilted far enough in their favour that they're willing to switch from Cold War to a Hot one. Under these circumstances, our ship must be a pure warship design in order to meet the oncoming threat, despite our wishes otherwise.

Until such time as the Federation has enough new design fleets that we are no longer stuck relying on the Legacy fleet, we are exposed and weak to the Klingon threat and our ship designs must reflect that. The Klingons are not a Peer power, they are currently a SUPERIOR threat and we have to recognise that. If we want to be able to go back to creating all those nice scientific explorers we love, we first have to survive long enough to get there.
 
[-] High Performance EPS Grid [COST HERE]
By constructing the entire electro-plasma system from the same ultra-high-performance condiut as is typically used to connect the warp core to the nacelles, total allowable max load on the grid can be increased by several orders of magnitude, allowing a ship to freely fire modern phasers. Unfortunately, this conduit, and the neccessary high pressure EPS taps, are very expensive to manufacture in the required quantity, rapidly becoming prohibitively expensive as vessel size (and, therefore, the total size of the EPS grid) increases.

Adds 0.5 cost per 10,000 Tons of ship mass (before nacelles). Obviously, this one is your preference for a small ship- and 80 kton vessel, for example, would add a whopping 4 extra cost for one. on the other hand, it is absolutely prohibitively expensive on large ships- a 200 kton vessel would be shelling out one hundred cost for a similarly reinforced EPS grid!
Which, obviously, easily explains why we don't do that.
You have your maths here wrong; at 0.5 per 10,000 tons, a 200 kton ship would have a cost of 10, not 100.
 
I mocked up how we could do a vertical core in a Delta hull design:


View: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1eDc2JXYTpf3chqsFtK9pf3Wv5ts5Kgya/view?usp=sharing

It's a 5 deck Delta, with decks 1 and 2 being 1/2 the size of the deck below.
Deck 5 has forward facing phaser turrets on the outer rim, main engineering and the plasma conduits of to the nacelles (could be tucked under the delta alongside the blister?).
Decks 6-9 (the blister) looks like the bottom 1/2 of a normal engineering hull has been welded on underneath
Deck 6 has 2 x rapid fire torpedo launchers
Main deflector is recessed into decks 7-9
A/M storage in decks 8-9
Finally with a vertical core, we can finally have a core eject mechanism.
Use 2 x mk 3 impulse engines, Covariant shields and call it the Defiant class. We now have a very fast, maneurvable frigate/destroyer we can pump out in large numbers
 
Last edited:
If we're going to make a defense-focused station, I'd be very tempted to give it a strong secondary in science.

Build something that we can drop on top of interesting anomalies or other subjects of study that we can be confident won't need constant babying to still be there long enough for the science to be done, rather than getting jumped by pirates or becoming casualties in border incursions.
 
I mocked up how we could do a vertical core in a Delta hull design:


View: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1eDc2JXYTpf3chqsFtK9pf3Wv5ts5Kgya/view?usp=sharing

Its a 5 deck Delta, with decks 1 and 2 being 1/2 the size of the deck below.
Deck 5 has forward facing phaser turrets on the outer rim, main engineering and the plasma conduits of to the nacelles (could be tucked under the delta alongside the blister?).
Decks 6-9 (the blister) looks like the bottom 1/2 of a normal engineering hull has been welded on underneath
Deck 6 has 2 x rapid fire torpedo launchers
Main deflector is recessed into decks 7-9
A/M storage in decks 8-9
Finally with a vertical core, we can finally have a core eject mechanism.
Use 2 x mk 3 impulse engines, Covariant shields and call it the Defiant class. We now have a very fast, maneurvable frigate/destroyer we can pump out in large numbers

Yeah, I was thinking something similar.

We take a Delta and undersling a Small Secondary hull below it for the Warp Core and the Navigational Deflector, I was going to write up an Omake about it and call it 'Project Gladius', because it borrows from the Sabre while being earlier.
 
If we're going to make a defense-focused station, I'd be very tempted to give it a strong secondary in science.

Build something that we can drop on top of interesting anomalies or other subjects of study that we can be confident won't need constant babying to still be there long enough for the science to be done, rather than getting jumped by pirates or becoming casualties in border incursions.
So Regula One but she'd actually be able to resist the Reliant (well, prime timeline Reliant, our Miranda will probably take a wolfpack of regular ones to kill) coming to take her research?

Edit:
Obviously take it with a grain of salt, since these are all DITL speculation (though generally also rather inkeeping with the majority of fan estimates), but some comparative sizes.
 
Last edited:
It's a boring theme (including when US Navy uses it), but it does conveniently come with 50 names.
Honestly I'd say the worst class name wise is the Parliament class. Named Parliament, only two examples we see are of Canadian cities that do not have the Canadian Parliament in them, I'd expect for Canada to be represented by USS Parliament Hill (since the actual buildings have the rather indistinct West/Centre/East Block names) and at least a USS Palace of Westminster/Westminster (Mother of Parliaments and all that).
 
Yeah the whole "here's how to make multi-phaser fire feasible" kind of misses the point that I don't want there to be multi-phaser fire because then you stop building ships with the same rules that Starfleet uses to build ships. The Excelsior's saucer phasers, for example, are perfectly spaced for 45 degree firing arcs with one bank covering each.

I'm happy with a system that creates a power scale between smaller and larger ships, rather than the only difference being how easy it is for them to engage ships surrounding them.
 
Last edited:
Back
Top