Orc Quest; or, A Critical Examination of Agency Through in Interactive Fiction (Warcraft)
- Thread starter FractiousDay
- Start date
- Fantasy
I did but others didn't as much so it didn't happen.
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Yeah, as I originally thought, Gilneas is more urgent. I change my vote and amend my previous comments.
[X] Plan: priorities
-[X] Mercenaries- Gilneas
-[X] Mercenaries- Kul Tiras
-[X]Train the Drake
-[X]Rescue the Revantusk + aid the Warsong
-[X]Integrate the New Clan
Two kingdoms are busy falling to the Scourge, Werewolves, or Datrohan (and we don't know what's worse). Let us not go gallivanting with the Dwarves who will not even give us their good shinies anyway. We'll get the Dragonmaw later.
I just realized that we are not only in a race against Rend to collect Orcs and sundry.
We are also in a race with Datrohan, for the fate of the Orcs, but also of the Alliance and the whole continent.
Because if we collect all of our cute Orc chips and then promptly get massacred by the entire continent reunited under the Burning Legion-aligned Alliance, that's still a gross failure.
Besides, we should help Grok'mash to be less of a tool. Everybody who is smart runs circles around him (the Black Dragons, Gregor, Datrohan). We should talk more with the lady from the Shattered Hand.
[X] Plan: priorities
-[X] Mercenaries- Gilneas
-[X] Mercenaries- Kul Tiras
-[X]Train the Drake
-[X]Rescue the Revantusk + aid the Warsong
-[X]Integrate the New Clan
Two kingdoms are busy falling to the Scourge, Werewolves, or Datrohan (and we don't know what's worse). Let us not go gallivanting with the Dwarves who will not even give us their good shinies anyway. We'll get the Dragonmaw later.
I just realized that we are not only in a race against Rend to collect Orcs and sundry.
We are also in a race with Datrohan, for the fate of the Orcs, but also of the Alliance and the whole continent.
Because if we collect all of our cute Orc chips and then promptly get massacred by the entire continent reunited under the Burning Legion-aligned Alliance, that's still a gross failure.
Besides, we should help Grok'mash to be less of a tool. Everybody who is smart runs circles around him (the Black Dragons, Gregor, Datrohan). We should talk more with the lady from the Shattered Hand.
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- Location
- United Kingdom
Would welcome suggestions for how to do this, given Grok's position. As previously, it's not necessarily that he doesn't know he's been manipulated, he knows that people want stuff from him, and unfortunately for him they're selling him that stuff in clever ways. For example, all of Dathrohan's manipulation, that of Varimathras, that of Thrall and Feldad. Grok has always been suspicious of them and he knows they're playing him, but he benefits too. The problem is he doesn't know the stuff behind the scenes that's actually more difficult.
For example, it's pretty apparent to Grok that:
1. The Burning Blade is clearly full of demon worshippers, not just renegades but there's actually a large proportion of people who still support the Legion
2. They're focused around the non-Orgrimmar area, eg in Desolace
3. the BB clearly have links to Legion aligned actors like Argus Wake and Varimathras
4. Feldad is also clearly having difficulty balancing all of this
5. Feldad is increasingly isolated from the Horde leadership, and potentially falling into the Legion aligned camp
Grok knows all this, he's aware of the implications. He might be wanting to ignore it a bit because he just doesn't want to think about his clan being traitors. Again, he can't really 'do' anything about this. What would be the solution? Just to attack Desolace? Something like that?
Comparably, there's 2 plots he doesn't know about for example, which have been going on for a couple of arcs. He can't figure these out because he doesn't have access to the specific information.
As an example of other plots, to properly understand what the Blacks are doing, he'd need to hvae a credible idea of what the Black Dragonflight is, who runs it, what their aims are, what the internal politics and systems of alliance and relations are. He doesn't have access to that info. No one does really, no one outside teh Black Flight itself. Some people might piece it together like senior dragons like Krasus, informed people like Thaurissan, or maybe a few people might have an idea in the Blackrock Clan, but otherwise there's not much he can do really. It seems quite reasonable to Grok that Neferian is using his agents to better secure his Flight and their affairs, but beyond that it's very difficult to actually 'do' anything about that once he knows about it.
Same with Dathrohan. For a start, Grok has sensed that there's 'something behind Dathrohan's eyes' and that Dathrohan can be magically translate his words, but Grok assumes that's just a paladin thing because he's previously seen Tirion do it. No one has actually seen Dathrohan do any Light based magic because Dathrohan is very very careful not to expose himself like that. Very few people can detect a Nathrezeim, they're infiltrators and spies, they've very good at what they do. You're not going to get some 18 year old guy to be able to detect them.
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More actions because he can't respond to manipulations faster.........
I kid. What you need is actually characters that would be one of his closest advisors or something like a personal confessor for him.
What then this leads to is Grok then becomes more aware and can react accordingly. Like with Danrothan he knows thanks to Tirion he's pilfering necromancy secrets from scholomance to have light undead soldiers or something like that. It isn't blackmail information but information all the same when it comes to negotiating with Danrothan where he sees his rising pawn in a different light.
Same with Onyxia where he discovers already the black dragonflight to be divided but he doesn't know to what extent.
You actually need to give him the information to react accordingly either with a character or some event happens where he discovers like Danrothan or Onyxia's secret journal of being naughty or more generally proof they're up to no good. Maybe another dragonflight scouts him out.
- Pronouns
- He/Him
We need to actively go looking for Onyxia/Datrohan/Feldad's diary to find out these things. And other diaries to find out more.
Originally my character idea - that lost that vote - was to give our Orc some investigation capabilities, like Adam Jensen from the Deus Ex series, or even a stealth-based Garrett from Thief. Because I wanted to find information. Blind action is ultimately not enough.
Grok'mash right now is so much of a samurai that he can defeat about anyone in a duel... and lose the war, as all the plots get unleashed around him and the great pillars of the world fall.
- Location
- Texas
[X] Plan: Aggressive Diplomacy
-[X] Mission to Stormwind
-[X] Rescue the Revantusk
--[X] Mercenaries
--[X] Queen Prestor's Call for Aid
--[X] Warsong Clan's Call for Kinship
--[X] King Magni's Pact
I'd like to do a diplomatic blitz focusing on Stormwind, and getting a good relationship with our mutual neighbor is sensible. Also, if we're going to help the Revantusk, I figure we might as well bleed with the Warsong to continue building up our own Horde and sublimate the other Warchief in the Eastern Kingdoms.
Regarding the other clans, I don't really care about expanding Grok's personal clan so long as they are functional. I am sympathetic to wanting to help Kul'Tiras or Gilneas, but strategically I would prefer to deal with Dal'Rend's Horde first. I am also ready to be crucified for not thinking we have time to spend 1/4 of our action economy on socializing with a Drake right now.
-[X] Mission to Stormwind
-[X] Rescue the Revantusk
--[X] Mercenaries
--[X] Queen Prestor's Call for Aid
--[X] Warsong Clan's Call for Kinship
--[X] King Magni's Pact
I'd like to do a diplomatic blitz focusing on Stormwind, and getting a good relationship with our mutual neighbor is sensible. Also, if we're going to help the Revantusk, I figure we might as well bleed with the Warsong to continue building up our own Horde and sublimate the other Warchief in the Eastern Kingdoms.
Regarding the other clans, I don't really care about expanding Grok's personal clan so long as they are functional. I am sympathetic to wanting to help Kul'Tiras or Gilneas, but strategically I would prefer to deal with Dal'Rend's Horde first. I am also ready to be crucified for not thinking we have time to spend 1/4 of our action economy on socializing with a Drake right now.
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I wasn't being literal. More like an example.
It was more like in the case of if Tirion thinks Danrothan is suspicous and so needs Grok's help to see what Danrothan is up to.
- Location
- St. Petersburg
Why would Grok care about Dathoran getting Gilneas, or Lordaeron wholesale?
I would assume Grok would take offence if someone stated their policy to keep the orcs scattered and fragmented, too busy bickering over territorial disputes to raise their heads and consider anything bigger. Not that their diplomats would say that to his face. Why, then, would he object to the centralization of power behind the only force capable of holding back the Scourge? His personal distrust for Dathoran is hardly an excuse. It strikes me as hypocritical (which has a meaning close to dishonorable, especially after the diatribe he gave to Drum Fel) to deny your ally that which you are doing yourself.
The problem is that Dathoran acts in the interests of the Burning Legion, but Grok can't know that. So what would be his reason for keeping Gilneas out of Dathoran's reach, and not being happy that humies are resolving humie problems without having orcs die for it?
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- Location
- St. Petersburg
This is a fresh take. Mission to Stormwind is very much on my to do list, and there can be argument to doing it sooner rather than later.
But isn't taking a mission from Queen Prestor a bit too bold? What does it look like if we go bother Dal'Rend's Horde on behalf of our human liege? I can't figure out a way to spin it as a positive in the eyes of any other orc.
- Location
- United Kingdom
This would be one where I'm willing to take a combined write in, subject to review. For example, these actions represent about a month of time each given 4 per turn and turns are about a season long. It might be appropriate to spend a month rapidly degrading the Vilebranch presence to take the heat off the Warsong for example, but you couldn't fight more than like 1 battle against them if you were also spending time evacuating and escorting the Revantusk.
Same for Stormwind and the Blackrock action. Sure you could visit Stormwind but you'd get much less socialising and diplomacy time etc.
depending on what you mean here, groks clan is not functional at all. He has no council of elders for exmaple, and his magic support is pretty patchwork, those are the sorts of things a 'functioning' clan would have
Don't think it would really be a problem. If it was him going against his own clan sure, but they're not his clan or even his wider community. There was internecine warfare between orcish clans on Draenor, it wouldn't be that remarkable. It might be more remarkable that he's working for a human and that could be easily spun by Rend to discredit Grok somewhat though
But from groks internal perspective, not a big deal really
- Location
- Texas
Would we be able to break off detachments after seeing to the situation personally? Example, we show up, get the Revantusk evacuated, fight a single decisive battle against the Vilebranch, then leave an officer with some troops to support the Warsong directly while we leave for other business?
Edit: If we did combine the Revantusk/Warsong expedition as well as the Stormwind/Blackrock Expedition, that would actually leave us open to intervene in Gilneas and Kul'Tiras as well, which is certainly a thought.
Edit 2: I've thought about it some more, and I still want to focus hard on the Local area and the South. I'd also like to thank FractiousDay for the Reminder that we still haven't sought Magical Aid.
[] Plan: Aggressive Diplomacy V2
-[] Orc Wrangling 2
-[] Seek Magical Aid
-[] Evacuate Revantusk/Reinforce the Warsong
You will support both the Hammerfell Clan's allies as well as those of the Warsong Clan. As the Revantusk are evacuated, you will seek decisive battle with the Vilebranch before leaving a detachment under Vark's command to assist the Warsong for the next few months.
-[] Mercenaries
--[] King Magni's Pact
-[] Mission to Stormwind/Against the Blackrock:
It is past time you met the Queen of Stormwind and demonstrated closer to home the strength of arms your people are famous for. You will pass through the Realm of Ironforge first, waging war against King Magni's foes before leading your Army to Stormwind with great pageantry, as this is as much a military expedition as it is a diplomatic one. Once you have satisfied both honor and curiousity, you will march against the Blackrock in the East.
Would this be a valid?
Edit: If we did combine the Revantusk/Warsong expedition as well as the Stormwind/Blackrock Expedition, that would actually leave us open to intervene in Gilneas and Kul'Tiras as well, which is certainly a thought.
Edit 2: I've thought about it some more, and I still want to focus hard on the Local area and the South. I'd also like to thank FractiousDay for the Reminder that we still haven't sought Magical Aid.
[] Plan: Aggressive Diplomacy V2
-[] Orc Wrangling 2
-[] Seek Magical Aid
-[] Evacuate Revantusk/Reinforce the Warsong
You will support both the Hammerfell Clan's allies as well as those of the Warsong Clan. As the Revantusk are evacuated, you will seek decisive battle with the Vilebranch before leaving a detachment under Vark's command to assist the Warsong for the next few months.
-[] Mercenaries
--[] King Magni's Pact
-[] Mission to Stormwind/Against the Blackrock:
It is past time you met the Queen of Stormwind and demonstrated closer to home the strength of arms your people are famous for. You will pass through the Realm of Ironforge first, waging war against King Magni's foes before leading your Army to Stormwind with great pageantry, as this is as much a military expedition as it is a diplomatic one. Once you have satisfied both honor and curiousity, you will march against the Blackrock in the East.
Would this be a valid?
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- Location
- United Kingdom
In some cases this would be alright, but there's issues with it. Firstly, I'd like to avoid there being random detatchments of people all over the place. Secondly, Grok is an extremtly charismatic leader, that is to say he leads by charisma not by heirachy or legal authority, as such he'd not really be able to deploy people far away without his oversight.
I'm not massively against. If you gave the Warsong the opportunity to make an honourable victory against the Vilebranch the Warsong would just come back with you. They're not that attatched to the land etc so in that specific instance you might not need to leave such a detachment.
So you've got a series of random groups from the various people you've absorbed, and thus have a pretty motley collection of shaman and warlocks, as well as a few others like mages from the Alterac army. However, power levels, training, equipment, doctine and many other things differ significantly.
At the moment you've got several actions which would go toward molding these forces into a single one. These are the New Clan, Blademaster and Breaker actions, which relate to the civilian population, military elite and magic users respectively.
This is fine, and in this case Vark is probably the best person as his ogres can just eat the trolls if they need to.
This however is more problematic. So, for example, lets say the Dragonmaw refuse to give battle, or retreat in good order. Grok can't just leave Haomarush behind as who's running Alterac then, and more to the point, the Dwarves wouldn't be happy with a load of Fel Orcs hanging about in their lands. They wouldn't necessarily mind Grok have a Fel Orc attendant (Sesk), but they'd draw the line at a lot of Demonsword orcs. What would probably happen would be that Grok would bring a mixed force with a core of his closest warriors in order to get his lot into shape etc.
But yea more problematic for the various issues there. There's a point at which combining actions leads to greater inefficiency. If the objective is to make friends with the Dwarves then a decisive campaign against the Dragonmaw, adn a subsequently couple of weeks in Ironforge so Grok can be honoured is a more effective way of doing it than rushing from action to action not making any connections.
- Location
- barking
- Location
- United Kingdom
mercs and growth leading currently, but more votes welcome etc.
Not in a rush to close it so take your time.
Also, we're reaching a point where Grok has to work out what he actually wants from his little Horde. He's being pushed into the position of being a Warchief contender, and has the potential to bring down both Thrall and Rend. He doesn't necessarily 'want' this, but he certainly wouldn't mind it. While that's further off, one thing that's definitely the case would be that he's now a Chief. The problem is he can't take up such a mantle without permission from his father, who he can't contact properly yet.
I'd like some discussion on this to get the views of the thread. What are people aiming for? Should Grok be trying to full absorb the Demonsword and Hammerfall Orcs into the Burning Blade? Would he rather keep them separate? There's various advantages of both.
- Location
- St. Petersburg
I think you could offer us some choices, an idea of what is on the table. In broad strokes, what are the possible priorities we can pursue that are actually different?
Everyone wants more and better orcs, but what are the opposing principles we need to choose from? What are the upsides and downsides of adhering or not adhering to said principles?
For example, the Burning Blade has been an amalgamation of numerous clans around the core of demon-
There is no reason to assume it won't keep working forever, until you point it out. Like, say, numbers. Integrating a clan larger than ourselves would be like trying to assimilate China. It's more likely that the resulting clan would end up looking like them. But does the Burning Blade even have a strong identity to begin with, besides its attributes that we are trying to revive, such as Blademaster traditions?
Would you be willing to consider the modified Revantusk action as specified above by the GM?
I can get behind your plan if so. I still prefer dwarves over Gilneas, but I am not passing Kul Tiras.
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I would say a form of legitimacy. Warchief without being called one is possible unless Feldad likes it.
Keep them separate if only to ensure different traditions spread out unless they're willing to be absorbed.
Something like this
Tribe
A tribe is an alliance of at least four clans. In order to form a tribe, you need to meet the following conditions: Succeed in performing The Making of the Storm Tribe heroquest, asking Orlanth for his tribe-making blessing. Have a kingly reputation, which you can get by showing generosity to...
- Location
- St. Petersburg
Demonsword should likely be separate, though we could simplify the acceptance to our clan of their willing and worthy. They have a strong sense of identity that is too closely tied with Fel for us to accept them wholesale. I believe vetting them would be important, and they can be good future Blademaster fuel.
I got the impression that Hammerfall... is not really a clan? It's just a collection of people who found no place in other clans. Malcontents, cripples, etc. I am not particularly thrilled by what kind of traditions we'd be looking at if we take their most motivated and able-bodied as we have already done once. I'd say integrate them as a non-combatant part of our clan.
I got the impression that Hammerfall... is not really a clan? It's just a collection of people who found no place in other clans. Malcontents, cripples, etc. I am not particularly thrilled by what kind of traditions we'd be looking at if we take their most motivated and able-bodied as we have already done once. I'd say integrate them as a non-combatant part of our clan.
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[ ] Seek Magical Aid
One thing you're quite clear about is the lack of magical support in your warband, and the wider Alteraci military. Seek aid from the Kirin Tor, as well as attempting to form a cohort of Shaman within your Orcish warband.
[ ] Demongate
Jubei'thos' clan had formerly been guarding a Demongate, a lesser version of the Dark Portal, intended to aid in the summoning of lesser demons. The Traitor Prince, Arthas, had used the gate to received instructions from Burning Legion during their campaign on Azeroth. You've heard from Haomarush that the location of the Demongate is higher in the mountains, a place of great danger due to the rampant demons around the gate. While you don't intend to summon any demons, it might be well to use the gate to contact your father with greater reliability of communication perhaps.
Can these two be combined? Though I suppose this depends if Grok is ok letting the Kirin Tor know of the demon gate which I see nothing wrong with if only to keep the place guarded.
One thing you're quite clear about is the lack of magical support in your warband, and the wider Alteraci military. Seek aid from the Kirin Tor, as well as attempting to form a cohort of Shaman within your Orcish warband.
[ ] Demongate
Jubei'thos' clan had formerly been guarding a Demongate, a lesser version of the Dark Portal, intended to aid in the summoning of lesser demons. The Traitor Prince, Arthas, had used the gate to received instructions from Burning Legion during their campaign on Azeroth. You've heard from Haomarush that the location of the Demongate is higher in the mountains, a place of great danger due to the rampant demons around the gate. While you don't intend to summon any demons, it might be well to use the gate to contact your father with greater reliability of communication perhaps.
Can these two be combined? Though I suppose this depends if Grok is ok letting the Kirin Tor know of the demon gate which I see nothing wrong with if only to keep the place guarded.
- Location
- barking
I think grok needs to establish as safe of a place for the orks as possible so they can thrive without attacking its neighbours thralls horde has the warsong clan fighting the night elves and rends horde is fighting both the dark iron (wonder what happened to their deal) and stormwind with the dragonmaw fighting the dwarves and without the need rend horde has for aging up kids and without the whatever bullshit kargaths horde has (and speaking of wonder how both hordes view the fel horde mess once the portal opens). as for absorbing the minor clans we have under our banner I think abosrbing the hammerfall orcs not sure on what to do with demonsword clan
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- Location
- Texas
Personally I am against absorbing the different clans if only for sentimental reasons. I like the different cultures and feel we'd be losing even more of the cultural legacy of the Orcs by doing so.