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NorseQuest (A Norse Xianxia)

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I think my previous commentary has been clear on this but, for the record, I too am 100% fine with this update. It's not exactly what we wanted to happen, but it did accomplish our core objective despite us stepping on a bit of a landmine, and with the extra social actions, the only 'gamey' bit that would've been a problem (turn ends, we can't talk to people in the scene any more) has ben counteracted more than sufficiently.

This was fine. I would've preferred it to go a bit differently, but we made our choices and these are the consequences and, as consequences go, they both make complete in-story sense and are just not that big a problem. Verisimilitude isn't broken and we weren't screwed over, so I have no real complaints.
 
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DeadmanwalkingXI said:
Flavor, probably, non-fighter stuff I definitely want to teach her in the long run but given Drifa's ambitions to be a warrior, I thought it was better to start her off with combat stuff.
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Essentially my idea is to tell her a story from our raid.
Gets her Attention and Interest, considering her passion to become like us in that regard.
Start the story with the felag preparing and us telling the poem, continue with the fight with the Squire on and how the felagi were so motivated by the poem that they didn't even flinch at one of them having his throat ripped out.
She will probably love that as a cool story and it makes poetry look cool to her.
Get her a mix of the obvious combat stuff and useful support skills.

Also, do we know if she has weapon skills? And preferences?
Might want to put them in too and get her a good training weapon next time we have a free action slot for the crafting.
 
Toboe said:
Also, do we know if she has weapon skills? And preferences?
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The Training action specifies Tricks rather than skills. We can try telling the story and add the Poetry Skill-Trick to the lineup, though.

Like, as an NPC her growth is a bit abstracted compared to ours and I imagine her skill growth rate is predetermined to at least some degree...it looks like what we can do is help her learn specific Tricks and/or more of them.

EDIT: And added story time and the Poetry Skill-Trick to the list. Also added 1d6 to Training Drifa rather than the Forgefire/Standstill combo (which was always a real longshot). I'd move the die to more research if we come up with any, but it's better helping Drifa than being spent on quite that long a shot.

Toboe said:
Might want to put them in too and get her a good training weapon next time we have a free action slot for the crafting.
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We could make her a weapon, yes, though I'd be inclined to make Abjorn a good backup weapon first. And/or our retainers.
 
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Imperial Fister said:
I know that this was a bet of a let down update, so I figured that I might as well soften the blow a little bit. I don't particularly want to pull fucky wucky stuff like this, but it's the bed I've made for myself, so it's the bed I'm laying in. (One of the major reasons I decided to run this Quest at all was to break a particularly bad habit of mine, that of being scared to have consequences happen... thank you a lot, first dnd experience I had)

But hey, the final kill is still on the table!
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Having given my thoughts through the update a bit,

I'd say it's more like I was expecting a tense back and forth bit, and instead a literal meteor landed in the courtroom, and the case had to be adjourned as a result.
 
Wait, the plan includes making a Forgefire alloy, right?

Ah, it does. Just saw Deadman's post. Sorry.
 
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Bass11 said:
Also are we going to mention Horra's son flesh puppet? When talking to the headsman and Logi?
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I mean...they saw it, and know more about Drysalt than we do, so they know about that better than we do, I think. We could ask about it, but honestly that distracts from the main point, which is for us to give them information and thus motivate them to act.

Constenanto said:
Wait, the plan includes making a Forgefire alloy, right?

Ah, it does. Just saw Deadman's post. Sorry.
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No worries. I've missed equally obvious stuff before so it's worth checking.
 
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Very interesting update, there be more going on than we knew or suspected.

The only thing that looks odd is the immediate partial outlawing for an act of violence during the Thing. Someone who knows/suspects a full outlawing is coming his way during a Thing could draw steel and take the partial outlawing, saving his holdings and family from a worse fate and giving himself a fighting chance. Seems very exploitable (if costly), and I'm struggling to find a good reason within the internal logic of the legal system, especially since it removes the offender from the proceedings and legal system entirely.

After all, any purpose it serves would be served as well by the pronouncing of that verdict together with the verdict on the main claim being brought. If a claimant would eg be after recompense for damages done (or breach of contract or w/e), he would be rightfully pissed if a defendant got immediately smacked with a partial outlawing and thus would no longer be a valid legal subject. Yes, he could likely bring a new claim against the outlaw's next of kin and possessors of his estate, but the most important witness for that second trial is now gone with the wind and outside of the legal system. Killing him isn't likely to satisfy if all you're after is money, as the outlaw is now a penniless fugitive.
 
Siual said:
he only thing that looks odd is the immediate partial outlawing for an act of violence during the Thing. Someone who knows/suspects a full outlawing is coming his way during a Thing could draw steel and take the partial outlawing, saving his holdings and family from a worse fate and giving himself a fighting chance. Seems very exploitable (if costly), and I'm struggling to find a good reason within the internal logic of the legal system, especially since it removes the offender from the proceedings and legal system entirely.
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They could've given him a full outlawing for the attack, and likely would've if they thought he was gaming the system like that. They just didn't in this case, I suspect due to him clearly being distraught rather than calculating.

Also, for the record, his family would inherit his holding normally even with a full outlawing, so the partial one is better for him but not for his family. And from that point, they'd actually have a harder time fighting against monetary claims than they would with his presence, I think. So it's a wildly risky strategy with very small upsides in general. It technically worked to his advantage this time, but it wouldn't always by any means.
 
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DeadmanwalkingXI said:
his family would inherit his holding normally even with a full outlawing, so the partial one is better for him but not for his family
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DeadmanwalkingXI said:
Not inherently, no. You can wind up having fines laid or assets seized but that's a separate judgment, not part of the outlawing, from what I read. Like Greebocalypse says, the main differences are that full outlawing is forever and there are no places of safety.
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That doesn't seem to be true though. A full outlawing is major punishment for the outlaw's family and heirs too, as the outlaw's entire patrimonium is now gone.

Imperial Fister said:
Lesser Outlawing banishes the individual for three years and strips them of most of the law's protections. However, their property is not confiscated so they can, upon the three years passing, return to society. There are certain proceedings that a lesser outlaw has to follow in order to retain some of their immunities, if they don't then they are deemed full outlaws.

Full Outlawing banishes the individual, strips them of the law's protections, and confiscates their property. Anyone who helps a full outlaw can face outlawing themselves. Anyone can come and kill them with impunity.
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Siual said:
That doesn't seem to be true though. A full outlawing is major punishment for the outlaw's family and heirs too, as the outlaw's entire patrimonium is now gone.
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I think it confiscates it in the sense of 'they will never ever get it back', not 'their heirs don't get it'. At least, that's what seems to have been true historically, and would make sense with Imperial Fister's comment.
 
Say have we tried making (or discussed making) some sort of artifact training aid for Hamar? Or actually just one in general?

I'm not exactly the beast in wordplay but is such a thing even possible?

Also have we tried to invest Odr into our training dice? Would the resulting +1 successes and 1 negated failure (that what investing Odr dos right?) make using more then 1 training dice more efficient?
 
uri said:
Say have we tried making (or discussed making) some sort of artifact training aid for Hamar? Or actually just one in general?

I'm not exactly the beast in wordplay but is such a thing even possible?
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No idea. And absolutely no idea how to word it. If anyone comes up with a good wording to speed training, I'd be happy to put it in the plan. Maybe not this turn, but next turn definitely.

uri said:
Also have we tried to invest Odr into our training dice? Would the resulting +1 successes and 1 negated failure (that what investing Odr dos right?) make using more then 1 training dice more efficient?
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It's actually 1 negated failure or 1 Success, so it's basically just +1 success in most ways. That said, while we haven't actually tried, it'd probably work on Training...but spending 1 Odr for 1 success on Training is, uh, not a great exchange rate usually. Like, I'd imagine it would work but we probably aren't gonna do it much.

It basically allows us to just spend Odr as Training Dice (with slightly different limitations on where to spend them) but given some of the other things Odr can be spent on, that's not its best use unless we're in a real rush for something highly specific.
 
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DeadmanwalkingXI said:
I think it confiscates it in the sense of 'they will never ever get it back', not 'their heirs don't get it'. At least, that's what seems to be true historically, and would make sense with Imperial Fister's comment.
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Aha, confiscate is a bit confusing then, as it literally means "to go to the fisc/treasury", and was what happened under Roman law outlawry. I've had a look at the thesis on outlawry in Iceland and it seems to check out that it here takes the form of civil death, and inheritance proceeds as normal.
 
uri said:
Say have we tried making (or discussed making) some sort of artifact training aid for Hamar? Or actually just one in general?

I'm not exactly the beast in wordplay but is such a thing even possible?

Also have we tried to invest Odr into our training dice? Would the resulting +1 successes and 1 negated failure (that what investing Odr dos right?) make using more then 1 training dice more efficient?
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For training aids: We know that "teaching via poetry" trick is possible (just haven't pushed for that being trained yet due to *gestures at Horra situation*), that might be about creating training aids in the form of poem riddles & memory aids.
 
uri said:
I'm not exactly the beast in wordplay but is such a thing even possible?
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DeadmanwalkingXI said:
No idea. And absolutely no idea how to word it. If anyone comes up with a good wording to speed training, I'd be happy to put it in the plan. Maybe not this turn, but next turn definitely.
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Following Wuxia logic it would probably be something like Goku's shackles.
DeadmanwalkingXI said:
It's actually 1 negated failure or 1 Success, so it's basically just +1 success in most ways. That said, while we haven't actually tried, it'd probably work on Training...but spending 1 Odr for 1 success on Training is, uh, not a great exchange rate. Like, I'd imagine it would work but we probably aren't gonna do it much.
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It would be extremely powerful if it was possible. We could work pretty fast on focusing singular stats like Hamr or Hugr. A power that grows with the Orthsirr we gain.

I don't think it's possible at any rate.
 
I mean.

The flipside is that if he got a Full Outlawing, he'd just be fucking off out of the valley ASAP. A Partial One means he might stick around to keep access to his Sekrit Sanctum to make final preparations, which he shouldn't be aware that we've already broken into.
 
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