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Eh, if we're generating it passively, I think it's worth spending a mote to see if we can put it into a stat and another to power a point of Hone or something. Worth knowing before we end up in a fight.

Maybe next turn, we'll have a better idea of what our income will look like then, and we'll have an idea of what a Cultivator Plant can do for us.

We'll also have a good sized quantity of Odr--enough that we can risk using some to see how it applies to our normal magic.
 
Can Halla tell if that berry on the Hearthroot/Hearthberry plant is ripe yet?

We could write in 'feed the Hearthplant as much Odr as it wants this turn, up to 3'. Or up to 6 (total of 9) to test the theory of 9 Odr.
 
So yeah, I think that's our research itinerary this turn.

1 to eat the berry and see what happens
1 for Bible Study
1 to investigate the Mysterious Tree Grove--maybe see if they've got some seeds or pinecones or whatever we can transfer to our Field?

I think the third probably still involves an Explore action? I could be wrong, though. I was also thinking that our attempt to inform others probably counts as Research, but I could be wrong there as well...

@Imperial Fister what kind of actions would it be to investigate the mysterious grove or try and talk to more people about cultivation? Are those Research, Social and Explore respectively, or what?

Personally, I don't really want dying of normal-ass pneumonia to be something you have to worry about. Magical Gluelung Pneumonia? Sure!

Likewise with something like poison ivy. Kinda seems a bit silly to have you be this monumental badass cultivator lady only to be brought low by freaking off-season clams.

Sure...but making it cost 2 Capacity to defend against those things makes it a lot harder to realistically have characters who can do that. Not so much for us, but for everyone without an Owl Fylgja definitely. Like, having an Trick to beat mundane poison and disease seems totally reasonable, but needing two makes it really hard for anyone to actually have those slotted.

I was also saying right now there's basically no incentive to ever raise them above Rough (since they basically only come up out of combat, and Refined just makes things cheaper) which seems wrong, and that combining them but saying you need Refined to do both options would solve both that (since there's now incentive to raise its level) and the 'how does anyone have the Capacity for this' issue.
 
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I think the third probably still involves an Explore action? I could be wrong, though. I was also thinking that our attempt to inform others probably counts as Research, but I could be wrong there as well...

We already found the grove, Explore only seems to trigger when you're wandering around without a specific goal in mind or leaving your property.

Anyway, we definitely want to start grinding Hugr now, since we've hit our Cap limit anyway.
 
Sure...but making it cost 2 Capacity to defend against those things makes it a lot harder to realistically have characters who can do that. Not so much for us, but for everyone without an Owl Fylgja definitely. Like, having an Trick to beat mundane poison and disease seems totally reasonable. I was just saying right now there's basically no incentive to ever raise them above Rough (since they basically only come up out of combat, and Refined just makes things cheaper) which seems wrong, and that combining them but saying you need Refined to do both options would solve both that (since there's now incentive to raise its level) and the 'how does anyone have the Capacity for this' issue.
Alrighty, works for me.

Also, I'm thinking about making Wordplay upgrade your Capacity every rank up rather than every other
@Imperial Fister what kind of actions would it be to investigate the mysterious grove or try and talk to more people about cultivation? Are those Research, Social and Explore respectively, or what?
Research for investigate. Social for talking.

Can Halla tell if that berry on the Hearthroot/Hearthberry plant is ripe yet?
It is
 
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Alright, in that case, plan time:

[X] Saga Establishment

[X] Plan Stalking Horra

-[X] (Crafting) Try to make something
--[X] Forged Iron Wood Axe (+7 Successes from Tools/Workshop)
-[X] (Personal) Spend time with...
--[X] Aki, Abjorn, Stigr, and Stigmar
--[X] Try telling some of our allies as much as we can about the steps not to die in our cultivation quest and see what they have to say, or if they can even hear what we're saying
---[X] Strongly suggest they not actually try it as it's a very good way to die
---[X] Be careful not to tell them the imagery precisely
-[X] (Visit) Go visit...
--[X] Horrby, Horra's Farm
---[X] Rather than visiting normally, you instead stealthily approach and try to scout it out.
---[X] Send our Fylgja using Dressed in Rags and its natural stealth skills to avoid notice
---[X] Attempt to follow Horra's tracks (using our tracking skills) to any secluded locations he goes to looking for where he works his magics. Specifically, we're avoiding actually following him within his actual line of sight so as not to get caught.

Training:
-[X] (Rolled)
--[X] Train Kindle-Spinner 2d6 (1d6) (+1 Success from Born of Fire)
--[X] Train Firebomb-Strike 2d6 (1d6) (+1 Success from Born of Fire)
--[X] Train Ember-Winged Cloak 2d6 (1d6) (+1 Success from Born of Fire)
--[X] Train Campfire 2d6 (1d6) (+1 Success from Born of Fire)
--[X] Train Beaconlight 2d6 (1d6) (+1 Success from Born of Fire)
-[X] (Research)
--[X] Go investigate our new grove of weird magic trees 1d6
--[X] Try feeding more odr (up to 6) to the bush gradually and see what happens, stopping if it seems 'full', then see what we can do with the Hearthroot's berry (probably by eating it, but we'd at least look if there were other options) 1d6
--[X] Do more bible reading with Jerasmus 1d6
-[X] (Blackhand's Training) Try to develop old/train new hugareida tricks
--[X] Train Halting Vortex 1d6
-[X] (Training) Tricks
--[X] Train Goal-Tell 1d6
--[X] Train Cool-Off 1d6
--[X] Train Skewer-Flick 1d6
--[X] Train 'Sax' Weaponcraft Skill-Trick 1d6
--[X] Train 'Mail' Armorcraft Skill-Trick 1d6
--[X] Train 'Tracking' Wildcraft Skill-Trick 1d6
-[X] (Training) Hamr (62 successes to rank up)
--[X] Train Hamr itself 1d6
--[X] Train Chop 1d6
--[X] Train Cut 1d6
-[X] (Training) Hugr (28 successes to rank up)
--[X] Train Hugr itself 1d6
--[X] Train Armorcraft 1d6 (+1 Success from Sten)
--[X] Train Composure 1d6
--[X] Train Housecraft 1d6 (+1 Success from Sten)
--[X] Train Scouting 1d6
--[X] Train Silver-Tongue 1d6
--[X] Train Weaponcraft 1d6 (+1 Success from Sten)
--[X] Train Wildcraft 1d6 (+1 Success from Sten)
--[X] Train Wordplay 1d6
-[X] (Training) Fylgja (11 success to rank up)
--[X] Train Fylgja Itself 1d6

Orthstirr:
-[X] (Orthstirr Usage)
--[X] 6 Hamr
---[X] 4 Chop, 4 Defend, 4 Dodge, 4 Glima, 3 Bash, 3 Pierce, 3 Throw, 3 Cut, 3 Labor, 3 Overland (34 total)
--[X] 6 Hugr
---[X] 3 Barb-Tongue, 3 Composure, 5 Housecraft, 3 Management, 4 Scouting, 3 Silver-Tongue, 3 Strategy, 3 Tactics, 4 Wordplay, 5 Wildcraft (36 total)
--[X] 4 Fylgja
---[X] 3 Command
--[X] 1 First Impression
--[X] 189 free for tricks

Fylgja:
-[X] (Fylgja Capacity)
--[X] Remove Shield, Boulder, and Tools.
--[X] Add Halting Vortex
--[X] Add Kindle Spinner
--[X] Add Ember-Wing Cloak

Okay, so for actions, we should finish off replacing all our regularly used tools, and the plan was to stalk Horra, so let's do that (with our Fylgja, giving it our best defensive Trick and something for offense in an emergency). The third action is, as discussed, trying to bring our inner circle on board with what's going on...inasmuch as we can. I'm still suspicious the perception filter will stop this.

For Training Dice we're still sadly stuck on raising a lot of things slowly, but we hit a lot of breakpoints this turn and will thus free up a bunch of dice for next time (Scouting, Wildcraft, Tracking, and Cut all hit their next benchmark and need not be increased further for some time, so next turn we'll be putting at least 4d6-5d6 on something we want to increase faster). In the short term, while we want to improve our anti-disease Campfire Trick and pick up the anti-poison one, neither are useful against someone like Horra until they level much higher, so we need to wait a little there.

For management, this assumes we can harvest and just start over with the fields, which is the only way I can see getting more crops out of them. I'll change it if that doesn't work. Management rules suspended for the moment.
 
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For management, this assumes we can harvest and just start over with the fields, which is the only way I can see getting more crops out of them. I'll change it if that doesn't work.

Add Ember-Wing Cloak to our Fylgja, being able to fuck off in a hurry is of critical importance.

Also, do we need to put Track in our Fylgja for it to be able to use it on our behalf @Imperial Fister ?
 
Alrighty, works for me.

Sweet. We'll definitely be raising that in the future then.

Also, I'm thinking about making Wordplay upgrade your Capacity every rank up rather than every other

I mean, that'd obviously be great for us. The question really comes down to how much Capacity you want your average 20 year old Norseman, and your average 30 year old badass to have. Right now, the first guy has around a 5-8 (Hugr 4-6, Wordplay 2-4), and the second guy maybe more like 9-12 (Hugr 7-9, Wordplay 4-6). Up it to every rank and the first guy has more like 6-10, and the second guy has 11-15.

Another option to increase the total available Capacity and avoid making Wordplay too good would be to have another skill add every two ranks rather than making wordplay add per rank (maybe Management? That definitely involves memorization).

Those second numbers look more workable to me, but if you want them to be highly constrained in their Muna/Hugareida usage you probably want to go with the first.

Research for investigate. Social for talking.

It is

Cool. Taken into account.

For the time being, management mechanics have been put on hold

Deleted.

Add Ember-Wing Cloak to our Fylgja, being able to fuck off in a hurry is of critical importance.

It can already fly, so I was thinking that wouldn't help (it can also vanish into the spirit world as soon as it breaks line of sight).

@Imperial Fister would EWC actually be useful for our fylgja, or is it rendered unnecessary by natural flight?
 
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The limiting factor might be having enough training dice to actually rank up all the tricks. Most Norsemen probably have 12d6 training dice thereabouts.
 
Anyway, we definitely want to start grinding Hugr now, since we've hit our Cap limit anyway.

This is why we're grinding Wordplay, which we're actually getting close to raising. Grinding Hugr doesn't really help us here because as soon as we get it, we want to alloy for Forgefire and we'll want at least two Tricks for that. So Hugr pays for itself more than expands our capacity in practical terms.

We can also put some of our less combative Tricks in our Fylgja temporarily while waiting for Wordplay to level. In particular the anti-poison/disease trick could easily go in our Fylgja once it's not busy scouting the enemy.

The limiting factor might be having enough training dice to actually rank up all the tricks. Most Norsemen probably have 12d6 training dice thereabouts.

I think maybe a tad more that that...but certainly less than we do, yes. What specifically are you saying this is the limited factor on?

If you mean Capacity being filled, I honestly think that's gonna be mostly filled with Muna for most Norsemen, which do not require Training Dice, with only a couple of Hugareida tricks at most on a 20 year old, and only two or three Hugareida and a handful of Hugareida Tricks even on the 30 year old.
 
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I think maybe a tad more that that...but certainly less than we do, yes. What specifically are you saying this is the limited factor on?
Well, most tricks cost a ton of Orthsirr and most Norsemen are like, 30 to 40 Orthsirr. Having a lot of tricks isn't really helpful if you can't pay for them. And if your training dice are limited, well, and you have to spend them on farming or hamr or hamr (this specific weapon), etc.. Simply having more trick capacity isn't useful.
 
Glad to see we're true cultivators now, and that we have more info to chew on. A question I've been mulling over is whether The Enemy is just an enemy to the Norse paradigm, or whether they are "Everybody's" Enemy. A purely academic question at the moment, but a meaningful distinction.
 
Well, most tricks cost a ton of Orthsirr and most Norsemen are like, 30 to 40 Orthsirr. Having a lot of tricks isn't really helpful if you can't pay for them. And if your training dice are limited, well, and you have to spend them on farming or hamr or hamr (this specific weapon), etc.. Simply having more trick capacity isn't useful.

As I edited in above, Capacity also stores Muna. I don't think most Norsemen are gonna come anywhere near filling it with Hugareida Tricks, but we have 4 Muna that have nothing to do with Hugareida, and while we're above average there, I expect most Norsemen have at least that many Muna by 20 (we know first kill Muna are nearly ubiquitous, for example).

We do also know for a fact that the average 20 year old Norseman has 8-15 Tricks, though some of those are likely non-combat, so they can't be too strapped for training on those. Most of them won't be Hugareida-related, but they must have some ability to train a fair number of things.
 
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Well, most tricks cost a ton of Orthsirr and most Norsemen are like, 30 to 40 Orthsirr. Having a lot of tricks isn't really helpful if you can't pay for them. And if your training dice are limited, well, and you have to spend them on farming or hamr or hamr (this specific weapon), etc.. Simply having more trick capacity isn't useful.


Assuming they raised successfully, wouldn't most adult Norsemen have a lot more than that?
 
Assuming they raised successfully, wouldn't most adult Norsemen have a lot more than that?

40-60 is standard for a 20 year old by the benchmarks. Bear in mind that 20 is when most Norsemen actually go raiding for the first time, so that's a pre-raid number. 20-30 is standard for a 16 year old so I think the assumption for orthstirr gains in childhood is around 5-8 per year starting at the age of 12 or so, with basically none before that. That matches up with Halla's starting point pretty well, though she escalated quickly.
 
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Did we get the (what I think is) 21 Orthsirr from our Prestige & Feats? Though we have so much Orthsirr it doesn't really matter..
 
Did we get the (what I think is) 21 Orthsirr from our Prestige & Feats? Though we have so much Orthsirr it doesn't really matter..

We did, yes. It wasn't noted in the post but the math is correct for us having gotten it.

The limiting factor might be having enough training dice to actually rank up all the tricks. Most Norsemen probably have 12d6 training dice thereabouts.

Going back to this for a moment I decided to figure out how many Training Dice actually are typical for a Norseman.

In terms of base stats, looking at it, the average 16 year old is built with, like, 120-150 successes or something like that. Assuming they start training at 10, over 6 years they have 36 turns, and would need only 4d or 5d a turn to achieve that. Maybe a little more if they're being inefficient or start later (I'd say 6d to 7d if they start at 12). So call it 5d or 6d average at this age (3d of it likely from training of one sort or another).

To get from there to the default 20 year old is another 350 to 400 successes on top of that in only 4 years, so that's clearly when their training dice start really kicking in and we're talking more like 15d-17d though I suspect that, like Steinarr's 6d he was giving us until recently, this is a potent but temporary 'survive a raid' course of study and 5d to 6d of that vanishes once they go on a raid and come back. The other additional dice over their pre-16 year old selves is probably from sparring bonuses and maybe a bit of Hamingja.

So, post raid, they likely lose 5d-6d, but I suspect there's a slight Hamingja gain as well, making 12d probably about right for random adult Norseman #37 after his first raid. He probably has Hamingja, like, 4-5, and two or three people he spars/trains with for +6d-7d total. That number likely escalates somewhat if he goes on more successful raids.
 
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Oh hey! I noticed our Aki relationship just jumped to 10!

He's finally our Ride or Die Friend!

[X] Saga Establishment

[X] Plan Stalking Horra

Anyway, I wonder how many Dice Halla's spitting out to her training partners now that she has Teaching. Any chance you can ballpark that for us @Imperial Fister ?
 
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What kind of fire hugareida would your classic fire aura/fire shield/PBAOEDOT effect be? Your "I set yourself on fire but it burns you, not me"? I was thinking that as Campfire was defensive, it might be there, but it seems Campfire is much friendlier.
 
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