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NorseQuest (A Norse Xianxia)

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Alectai said:
3v1 when the One apparently is Elder Ironbrother tier is worth slamming the Panic Button. The guy almost one-shot us rememer.
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Bluntly, I don't think this is true, although I think you may have posted this before IF confirmed that we could definitely have won. Like, I don't want this to become "Skippy harangues the thread again for being insufficiently bold and not playing in the mindset of a Norse warrior", but since you ask...

..fighting three on one isn't a reason to start looking for panic buttons, it's a challenge. The kind of thing that a great warrior is excited by, feels their blood pumping hot in their veins, and rises to meet. That's the mindset of a hero like Blackhand, and that's the standard we're being judged by here. Also for what it's worth, we wouldn't have had to fight three on one because Axe Man was clearly winding up to strike first, giving us an opening to do a Contested Movement, and Spear Guy was backing away because we'd broken his spear. This was spelled out to us to us in the tactics section of the last update.

But I think the main thing here is more, uh... how we react to situations like this, I guess? If you look at situations like this and start from the assumption that we're doomed. doomed, DOOMED, then you're always going to be able to find evidence which confirms that. If you look at situations like this instead from something more like a growth mindset, seeing it as a challenge we can overcome, then you aren't tying your own shoelaces together at the start of a run before going "look, there's just no way we can do it".
 
Skippy said:
..fighting three on one isn't a reason to start despairing, it's a challenge. The kind of thing that a great warrior is excited by, feels their blood pumping hot in their veins, and rises to meet. That's the mindset of a hero like Blackhand, and that's the standard we're being judged by here. Also for what it's worth, we wouldn't have had to fight three on one because Axe Man was clearly winding up to strike first, giving us an opening to do a Contested Movement, and Spear Guy was backing away because we'd broken his spear. This was spelled out to us to us in the tactics section of the last update.
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I obviously can't speak for Alectai, but the record, I at least didn't think it was a certain loss, I thought we'd have to spend multiple rounds whittling them down and TSS would let us blow a giant gap in the lines and look pretty awesome, which is why Alectai's idea to use TSS persuaded me. And none of that was wrong per se.

And using Contested Movement on Axe Guy would've left us wide open for the Champion, which would've been...dicey. I think we basically would've needed to rely on Slowing Slog to tank hits from anyone but the Champion to win, while spending our actions on defending from the Champion (who we had zero read on), and finishing off the other two. Then could've moved on to the one-on-one.

So basically, I think you're entirely right we could've won, but you're overestimating how easy it would've been. From a purely tactical perspective I think TSS was a reasonable call here. Not the only reasonable call, but one of them.

Drieder said:
What action did the Odrengskapr come from?
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From context and IF's commentary, using TSS at all...it makes opponents helpless and unable to fight back in a way that is apparently not Dreng-like. Not nid, but not good. I think there was reason to believe that wasn't the case given that literally trapping people in place while you kill them with IAT is not Odrengskapr and similar things, but there is a distinction to be made there (IAT can be escaped...TSS can't, at least not readily), though it's a pretty fine one to my own sensibilities. Apparently not to the Norse, though.
 
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Anyway here' a plan:

[X] Plan Chooser of the Slain
-[X] Now the battle is over and the rout has started, take to the skies using our Ember-Winged Cloak. Sound our Boar-Headed Horn to celebrate our victory, enliven our allies and dishearten our fleeing foes.
-[X] Where there are allies who look like they're on the brink of death, fly down and heal them.
-[X] Pursue the rout using our greatly superior mobility and visibility, swooping down on the fleeing raiders like an eagle, killing men with Kindle-Spinners and Firebomb Strikes as they flounder in the river.
-[X] If any men lay down their weapons and ask for mercy, they can be taken prisoner, but otherwise we shall be as terrible and pitiless as a ravening wolf. We need to kill as many of the enemy as possible to prevent word getting back to the ships and to make this victory count.
 
Skippy said:
Anyway here' a plan:
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That seems reasonable. Between fights we'll plausibly recover Aspects but will not inherently recover Orthstirr, so we should probably stoke another Aspect in there to get our Orthstirr up. We're down just about one Aspect's worth of Orthstirr. We may not recover two Aspects between fights, but we'd feel silly going into a fight down over 300 Orthstirr if we could but didn't take advantage of the opportunity.

[X] Plan Chooser of the Slain
 
DeadmanwalkingXI said:
I obviously can't speak for Alectai, but the record, I at least didn't think it was a certain loss, I thought we'd have to spend multiple rounds whittling them down and TSS would let us blow a giant gap in the lines and look pretty awesome, which is why Alectai's idea to use TSS persuaded me. And none of that was wrong per se.

And using Contested Movement on Axe Guy would've left us wide open for the Champion, which would've been...dicey. I think we basically would've needed to rely on Slowing Slog to tank hits from anyone but the Champion to win, while spending our actions on defending from the Champion (who we had zero read on), and finishing off the other two. Then could've moved on to the one-on-one.

So basically, I think you're entirely right we could've won, but you're overestimating how easy it would've been. From a purely tactical perspective I think TSS was a reasonable call here. Not the only reasonable call, but one of them.
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This is sort of what I was saying, though?

My argument was that it would not have been easy, but we could absolutely have done it, and the challenge would be a good reason to try. In my view, we should seek out battles that are a bit dicey from time to time, because that's what a warrior does, and true challenges are what provide the insights and experiences we need to become stronger.

Anyway, I don't want to keep going on about this? It's in the past and we helped win the battle, ultimately one Odrengskapr isn't the end of the world. Also, I will say right now that I was also convinced to go for TSS because I thought that we might lose more orthstirr from a longer battle, so I'm not claiming to have been like, a Cassandra here. It was an understandable decision given the circumstances when we made it, and I'm not trying to have a go at anyone.

DeadmanwalkingXI said:
From context and IF's commentary, using TSS at all...it makes opponents helpless and unable to fight back in a way that is apparently not Dreng-like. Not nid, but not good. I think there was reason to believe that wasn't the case given that literally trapping people in place while you kill them with IAT is not Odrengskapr and similar things, but there is a distinction to be made there (IAT can be escaped...TSS can't, at least not readily), though it's a pretty fine one to my own sensibilities. Apparently not to the Norse, though.
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I don't think this is the case if we used TSS as a finale in a duel with someone of roughly equal strength to us, which as a Finale, is how it is intended to be used.

I think it was specifically an issue because in this instance, us using it was a bit like shooting fish in a barrel due to the strength disparity. It may also not have helped that we hit spear guy and axe man rather than just the Champion.
 
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Skippy said:
Anyway, I don't want to keep going on about this? It's in the past and we helped win the battle, ultimately one Odrengskapr isn't the end of the world.
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Yeah, fair, happy to drop it. Just noting my own reasons for eventually agreeing with the TSS idea.

Skippy said:
I don't think this is the case if we used TSS as a finale in a duel with someone of roughly equal strength to us, which as a Finale, is how it is intended to be used.

I think it was specifically an issue because in this instance, us using it was a bit like shooting fish in a barrel due to the strength disparity. It may also not have helped that we hit spear guy and axe man rather than just the Champion.
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I dunno if I agree. It sounded, in context, like this would be more of a general thing...whenever we use it, it's basically an execution, and it's expensive enough we're not gonna use it in a fight we've already won, so it's always gonna be kind of a cheap shot. I'd be happy to be proved wrong, though.
 
War is war. We took shame to make a challenge into a check mark of enemies dead. No shame that can't be bourn here that we won't make up for in time.

In the time we finished them and the fight we can help slay more raiders
 
Shame about the shame (heh) but like I'm surprised it took us this long to get one LOL. I get why Halla ain't fine with it, but we are protecting our loved ones here. Besides, just means we needa get more honor to offset it :D

Time to send these folks packing!

[X] Plan Chooser of the Slain

seems like a fine plan, perhaps a turn early? idk.
 
I'm really interested in some of Hakka's interactions going forward now that she's earned a point of Odrengskapr. In particular when she's teaching Drifa and her kids about being a Dreng. There's more lived experience to back up her teaching and advice. It might even allow her to open up a bit more with her friends and family. I'm sure Stennair and Sten have done things that they aren't proud of in pursuit of vengeance.

I'm also really curious about how she could talk to Abjorn about this. They clearly love each other deeply but I'm under the impression that he puts her on a pedestal. I think the majority of his munna are related to her. A bit of shared vulnerability would maybe wipe away some unrealistic sheen and be more open with each other.
 
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