Unless we've somehow stumbled into the Maw without realising it, there should be no possible way for the Mother to affect us, and this will remain so as long as Centerpoint Station, that other station and the Son and Daughter live.
There are some ways I could see it happening. Probably the least likely but the most interesting I've thought of is that by tapping into conceptual shatterpoint abilities we've linked with our possible future selves, one of those futures is us getting possessed/eaten by Abeloth and she's eldritch enough to follow a string of potentiality back in time to slightly affect our current day self so that she can try to set up a Terminator-style time loop and use us to free her and get possessed so she can affect our past self so that we free her and get possessed and so on.

Suberoa: Listen, Lady Ciaran. I was fine with you building that massive medical research complex that flattened some historic districts. I was fine with you converting that abandoned sector into a giant distillery. I was fine with you putting up the giant statue of yourself in the central spaceport. But I can't let you build a giant palace here, it's against regulations for you to have a bigger residence than the Prime Minister.

Ciaran: Since when!?

Suberoa: Since I signed off on it five minutes ago.
And that was the moment Ciaran decided to run for office.
 
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There are some ways I could see it happening. Probably the least likely but the most interesting I've thought of is that by tapping into conceptual shatterpoint abilities we've linked with our possible future selves, one of those futures is us getting possessed/eaten by Abeloth and she's eldritch enough to follow a string of potentiality back in time to slightly affect our current day self so that she can try to set up a Terminator-style time loop and use us to free her and get possessed so she can affect our past self so that we free her and get possessed and so on.


And that was the moment Ciaran decided to run for office.
or just build him a realy big house.
 
There are some ways I could see it happening. Probably the least likely but the most interesting I've thought of is that by tapping into conceptual shatterpoint abilities we've linked with our possible future selves, one of those futures is us getting possessed/eaten by Abeloth and she's eldritch enough to follow a string of potentiality back in time to slightly affect our current day self so that she can try to set up a Terminator-style time loop and use us to free her and get possessed so she can affect our past self so that we free her and get possessed and so on.
I honestly would have thought that Gramps might have done a few runs through the Maw back in his smuggler days, and if we were in his ship at the time …
 
Haha :rofl:! Ciaran almost died, but IMVHO worth it!!
Saw their reactions? That was not normal "immortal" reaction, that was pretty much mortal reaction to something they're INCREDIBLY afraid to touch.

And let's be honest, That person, she "died" because of love, and her families reaction. I bet even now despite all her anger, pain and sadness her true goal stems from love: love of her family, love to keep them safe, love to live with them.
+
Shatterpoint anyone? This power is practically power over fate/destiny, both a key to free Mother, or block the exit. Of course any strong shatterpoint users would be "in her radar", especially if she (limited)access to dream realm.

Though now something interesting is about to happen {+ really want some Force philosophy with all 3 [S, D, F]}
 
I think this is like the third time we've used the title "Family Matters". It's just so always relevant.

"I've...done what is right. Or what is wrong, depending on your point of view,

Obi-wan: Huh, I might have to use that in the future.

Anakin: Well from my point of view...

Guess we know where they get it from.
 
Yeah, the dark side is self interest, but that doesn't mean you have to be interested in being evil.

Selfishness-selflessness and creation-destruction are separate axes. And neither of them necessarily map onto good-evil.

We simply happen to enjoy benefiting in ways that also benefit others.

Like, "yeah I'm selfish but that doesn't mean I have to be a raging psycho asshole about it."
 
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I'm of the opinion that it is actually Mortis itself speaking to us. Just a thought that keeps coming to me.
 
Sure she's escaped before, but that's only by affecting somebody Force Sensitive in the Maw, and the Son and Daughter have got on that pretty damn quick, which would indicate that they have some way of knowing quite quickly if she's actually escaped or doing some dastardly shit.

If she can affect force sensitives outside the Maw, then honestly, we should be worrying less about ourselves and more about any of the much more powerful, much more important force users scattered across the galaxy.. or even Palpatine himself being possessed by her.

"According to the Killik Thuruht hive, Abeloth managed to escape her prison whenever the Current of The Force was altered and the flow of time changed. Each time she escaped, the Son and the Daughter would return to the Killiks and defeat Abeloth, locking her back in her prison."

While normally her force abilities are restricted to the Maw, it's clear that she has been able to escape before, and it's highly likely that the Father and his children upgraded the seal every time. It's possible that the Maw being able to restrict her powers is a recent development.

This is all assuming that Abeloth hasn't already awoken and had someone else free her.

After all, what have we done, but change the flow of time?
 
Except the Dark Side is known for turning people into raging psycho assholes. In TOR, for example, if you're playing Sith, the Light Side is pragmatism and the Dark Side is atrocious psychopathy.

And if you play Jedi, that one with the Jedi-Plague, Starting in Chapter 2 and going into 3, the Darkside option is pragmatism and the Light Side is Blind Faith that things will work out.
 
Except the Dark Side is known for turning people into raging psycho assholes. In TOR, for example, if you're playing Sith, the Light Side is pragmatism and the Dark Side is atrocious psychopathy.
And the light side can turn you into a blind naive idiot, or worse an emo utilitarian.

Neither side works on its own its why Kreia in the update was warning us about the potential consequences of killing the Son, but not the Daughter and why it was constantly being pointed out that the Daughter's actions are not as good as she would like them to appear.
 
Neither side works on its own its why Kreia in the update was warning us about the potential consequences of killing the Son, but not the Daughter and why it was constantly being pointed out that the Daughter's actions are not as good as she would like them to appear.
Unreliable narrator and bias could well have been in play. Kreia is hardly some inexhaustible font of wisdom. She has her faults.
 
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And the light side can turn you into a blind naive idiot, or worse an emo utilitarian.

Neither side works on its own its why Kreia in the update was warning us about the potential consequences of killing the Son, but not the Daughter and why it was constantly being pointed out that the Daughter's actions are not as good as she would like them to appear.

I dont belive that the hidden voice is Kreia, but another being (thats not mother) or even the force itself.
 
Unreliable narrator and bias could well have been in play. Kreia is hardly some inexhaustible font of wisdom.
No, but she is honest (brutally so) so going by evidence she's telling this as accurately as she knows which give her status as a force phantasm I think she knows more than we do and even then look at the episode in which the Ones featured.

When the Daughter is killed the Force instantly goes crazy, the Light Side doesn't work, its only when the Son is killed and the Father dies that the balance of the three is restored to normal allowing for both light and dark to work.

Killing the Son alone would destabilise things towards the Light as the Dark would have no representative, which would be really bad, after all I can't make a light without having darkness to make a contrast.

Another point and as loath as I am to do this I am going to have to use Lucas.

Remember how Anakin was supposed to bring balance to the force, well he did. In his own bad way Lucas was able to get that bit through, where the Jedi thought balance would be destroying the Sith vice versa Anakin did fulfil the prophecy, killing the overgrown and corrupt Jedi order, and then destroying the rampaging Sith.

It does kinda imply that just like the Son and Daughter both sides are out of control.

I dont belive that the hidden voice is Kreia, but another being (thats not mother) or even the force itself.
Wiggles hands, there seems to be two voices one that speaks normally
"Do not be deceived. She desires victory far more than she appears to."
And another that does this

And possibly a third like this

so long as you possess it you and you alone can decide this realm's fate

Admit ably I'm basing this off little things like of capital letters, length of sentence and content ect.

Currently my theories are that either it is the force doing another triad thing, or its three different beings, one of which might be Kreia (the one that uses capital letters)
 
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Unreliable narrator and bias could well have been in play. Kreia is hardly some inexhaustible font of wisdom. She has her faults.
True, but the concept "greater good" or whatever she operates on is also an extreme. By that I mean Light side can also turn into "Well-intended Templar" something that's more of a tyrant or "evil" in it's own.


I dont belive that the hidden voice is Kreia, but another being (thats not mother) or even the force itself.
3rd party, is definitely at play, but judging by the way she/he/it spoke, that someone/thing is to extend very familiar with Ciaran...
 
Another point and as loath as I am to do this I am going to have to use Lucas.

Remember how Anakin was supposed to bring balance to the force, well he did. In his own bad way Lucas was able to get that bit through, where the Jedi thought balance would be destroying the Sith vice versa Anakin did fulfil the prophecy, killing the overgrown and corrupt Jedi order, and then destroying the rampaging Sith.
Official canon is that he brought balance to the force by wiping out the Sith, leaving only Jedi in the galaxy. It was not by killing all the Ones. You have to consider that maybe "balance in the Force" does not necessarily mean making both equally powerful.
 
Neither side works on its own its why Kreia in the update was warning us about the potential consequences of killing the Son, but not the Daughter and why it was constantly being pointed out that the Daughter's actions are not as good as she would like them to appear.

That the Son and Daughter both have to live to avoid destabilizing the Force says absolutely nothing about the morality of the actions of the Jedi or Sith. Honestly, nothing in this arc says much of anything about the Jedi or Sith, excepting the ones that are on Mortis at the moment. The ternary division of the Force tends to provoke this discussion about whether Balance is better than Light alone - a discussion with no real conclusion, because sources vary wildly on this, and people's interpretation of those sources varies more wildly still - but we shouldn't project the Jedi's issues onto the Daughter, nor vice versa.

All that aside, looking forward to the conclusion of this arc - it's been good, but I'm looking to get back to discussions about Force techniques, counter-Palpatine diplomacy, and making all of the money rather than about whether the Jedi are evil.
 
To write more random thoughts down Lucas for all that he's terrible at making movies his ideas ain't too bad, and so I want to comment on his naming choice specifically calling the sides of the force Light and Dark.

Now obviously we know what these two are Light Jedi Dark Sith ect. simple easy ect., but this has a lot more complexity then just light and dark.

If Lucas intended for the Light to just be good and the Dark just bad then he made a really poor choice in naming them and while for all I know there is a language out there where light and good are the same thing, Light has never = good it has synonyms of Bright, Rich, Luminous ect. and generally makes us think of good things as it should we are naturally day time creatures we do stuff during the day and can see in it, but at the same time the light is blinding, especially if we look straight at a bright light source.

On the Other Hand Dark has never = evil either it has synonyms of Black, Cloudy and Dim. None of these are good things in fact most of them are not good at all, and thus makes people think of bad things which again makes sense, we're not nocturnal creatures we sleep during the night, we can't see in the dark its scary there are things out there and I don't like it. However, it also is one of my favourite times because its the time when I sleep and do all that nice stuff (and other things I won't talk about). Its still scary and I don't like it much.

In short if he was trying to make the Light and the Dark inherently and explicitly evil he did a poor job.

Official canon is that he brought balance to the force by wiping out the Sith, leaving only Jedi in the galaxy. It was not by killing all the Ones. You have to consider that maybe "balance in the Force" does not necessarily mean making both equally powerful.
No I interpreted it to mean wiping both out so that something new could arise from the ashes of the old, which is what he did, the Jedi he created and the First Order having very few similarities I can see with the Jedi and Sith of the Republic era.

Seriously how can light alone be balanced, wiping out the darkness would mean there would be no light at all.

Also where is this stated?

That the Son and Daughter both have to live to avoid destabilizing the Force says absolutely nothing about the morality of the actions of the Jedi or Sith. Honestly, nothing in this arc says much of anything about the Jedi or Sith, excepting the ones that are on Mortis at the moment. The ternary division of the Force tends to provoke this discussion about whether Balance is better than Light alone - a discussion with no real conclusion, because sources vary wildly on this, and people's interpretation of those sources varies more wildly still - but we shouldn't project the Jedi's issues onto the Daughter, nor vice versa.
And if I was commenting on that then that'd be great, but I'm not (for the most part) I'm trying to examine the interactions between the light and the dark and give my own conclusion (activate sarcasm mode: which is totally the right one guys, and anyone who says other wise is an idiot Sarcasm mode deactivated)

That said ye are correct, though if I think of things I may just pop em here any for people to mull over.

And yes lookin forward to getting back to shooting that creepy pedo in the face :).
 
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Could someone post with invisitext marked? On mobile, so...
https://forums.sufficientvelocity.c...s-ck2-style-quest.33222/page-327#post-8493861

Seriously how can light alone be balanced, wiping out the darkness would mean there would be no light at all.
Didn't mean light alone, just heavily in favour of light. It's like how gold weighs more than rock, so the only way to achieve balance between the two is to ensure there's more of the latter than the former. As for the Force, majority Light so that everything's peaceful, minority dark so there's still non-Light emotions but not so much that war and stuff happens. Just an idea I had.
 
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