We have a pretty decent amount of pull with Bai, especially now that we are starting to pay off by being able to help her with her challenges, but that doesn't mean that her largesse is infinite. I suspect that she isn't going to be so willing to provide resources and aid if that assistance ends up devoted to boosting someone from a different faction, that isn't tied to her at all. Bai would have to be wondering what exactly she gets out of spending limited resources on Fan Yu, and I doubt 'Ling Qi wants all the social links' is going to be a sufficient answer.
Forge of Destiny(Xianxia Quest)
- Thread starter yrsillar
- Start date
- Original Fantasy
We have a pretty decent amount of pull with Bai, especially now that we are starting to pay off by being able to help her with her challenges, but that doesn't mean that her largesse is infinite. I suspect that she isn't going to be so willing to provide resources and aid if that assistance ends up devoted to boosting someone from a different faction, that isn't tied to her at all. Bai would have to be wondering what exactly she gets out of spending limited resources on Fan Yu, and I doubt 'Ling Qi wants all the social links' is going to be a sufficient answer.
I think that, overall, I'd prefer our story to take a dramatic turn where there's a big falling out rather than this slow decay of a friendship.
What your vote tried to do was what Ling Qi managed to do near the beginning: go to both Su and Zhou's classes and only use up one timeslot. Now there's an argument to be made that Li Suyin's bond can be maintained through training because we're the one doing her a favor, while Han Jian's cannot because he's doing us a favor so it's far less meaningful to him, but the argent vent would have been meaningful.
Forget the argent vent though, those of you frothing at the fingertips to reply about that: as far as I am concerned, the Argent Vent is Su, Li, Bai, and ours (and Huang's).
I think that if we recover our relationship with Han Jian, Ling Qi's new status will have to depend on her outrageous luck. That, like Gu Xiulan noticed, Ling Qi tends to be at the center of things, to find the opportunities others don't, and manage to do things in an unorthodox way that nonetheless achieves results.
What we need to do is remind him that a lot of our worth is tied into our different way of thinking and that this way of thinking is beneficial to him.
Alternately, we go to him about boy troubles.
I imagine the topic will go something like:
Ling Qi: Han... um, Brother Han! I have something I'd like to discuss with you in private.
Fan Yu: (frowns)
Han Fang: (shrugs)
Gu Xiulan: (FROWNS MIGHTILY WITH A VEIN POPPING NEAR HER FOREHEAD) WHA-
Han Jian (sighs, and shushes Gu): Ah, I see. It's about... Sister Bai, isn't it? Anything you want to say you can say in front of them. We're all friends here.
Ling Qi: Okay. But it's not about Meizhen. It's about... (mumblemumblewhisper) a boy-
Gu Xiulan: (CONTINUES FROWNING MIGHTILY though with more of a thoughtful, menacingly interrogative bent)
Han Jian (confused): And you want to talk to me because...?
Ling Qi: Well, um, I, uh, well, you know how Gan Guangli basically saved my life from Kang Zihao the other week, yeah? I was wondering if I should cook something for him-
Gu Xiulan: (HER EXPRESSION SHIFTS TO PURE GLEE. SHE SQUEALS SO LOUD THAT BIRDS FALL DEAD FROM THE TREES. Fan Yu is forced to clap his hands over his ears) OMG FINALLY!
Han Jian: Wait, what.
Ling Qi: I mean, I think I should, but I thought, what if that is considered like, something weird for nobles and-
Gu Xiulan: Stop right there, sister. I gotchu. We're going shopping. Jian, Fang, Yu, you're coming with.
Fan Yu (Fainted at this point)
Fang: (Nods)
Han Jian: Wait, what?
Gu Xiulan: To carry our bags, what else?
Han Jian: Xiulan, we've discussed this-
Gu Xiulan: And what we've discussed is stupid! You have the chance to witness a roadside weed blossom into an orchid today and you dare say no??? Preposterous! This is more important than politics.
Ling Qi: (already being dragged away) This is why I wanted to talk about this in private.
Gu Xiulan: (making happy noises)
Han Jian: (prods Fan Yu's insensate body. sighs.) I think your father was just outmaneuvered by a teenage girl with a crush.
Gu Xiulan (already some distance away): HURRY UP YOU SLACKERS. THIS IS WHY YOUR CULTIVATION NEVER GETS ANYWHERE. YOU LACK CONVICTION! THE CONVICTION TO GET SHIT DONE ON TIME LET'S GO LET'S GO LET'S GO!
/the next month is spent putting out the fires from this shopping expedition as everyone and Huang Da decides to ambush us
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Grosstoad
Birdbrain - Dick - Rules-Lawyer - Creeper
Huh... That line about Inner Province, though...
Doesn't that invalidate Han Jian? The Golden Fields is a border territory, right?
Inner Provinces are nobles like Huang Da, Kang Zihao, and perhaps Meizhen, right?
I forgot if Emerald Seas is an Inner Province... And then Cai Ren Xiang is the High Noble.
I do think you have a point, we have gone too long and spent too much time arguing over the vent. It just isn't going to happen. Alongside that though I no longer think we have the kind of big gesture needed to keep Han's entire faction happy with us, so I think it is just about time to write off most of that group. Be friends with Gu on the side, don't try and be more than allies of convenience with the rest of them.
Sure that might mean Gu drifts away or can't trust us as much, but at least we won't have to worry about devoting time to the entire batch, and worrying about keeping enough of them happy at any given moment that things don't break apart. If Gu isn't willing to be friends with us outside of her social group then that would suck, because she is definitely more interesting than the healer and wild girl, but at least we would know if she was someone we could rely on over the long term.
Short of Han ordering Gu not to be friends with us I honestly don't think she will completely bail. We wander around getting in fights with her when the rest of her coterie won't, we spend time doing girly things with her when the rest of them literally can't, and we are a future asset that her family might be able to leverage. I think the worst case scenario is that we don't get to roll with the entire team in a potential future combat situation, and instead we just get involved in Gu related issues.
Ultimately I think we should let the group relationship decay, but keep spending around the same amount of time with Gu and see what happens. The absolute worst case scenario is we pare down our social links to an amount manageable with our cultivation rate, and that isn't a nightmare scenario imo. I really doubt it happens though, especially if we instead devote the periodic time slots that we use trying to keep Han from giving up on us on Gu instead.
Arkeus
Crazy cat guy
- Location
- France
Meizhen/Huang Da and most likely Xuan are inner province. Emerald Seas is a border province at the south, like Golden Field is to the East. I think Han Jian was inspired by High Noble chargen but didn't have the exact backgrounds. I guess it's also possible it's Xuan, but by now Huang made is pretty clear he was Ji Rong's significant enemy.
I guess he could both be High Noble and significant enemy?
Have not played LoL for some time and when going back i found this out.
As a animated visual aid I think they work pretty good for inspiration.
If we stick with knives/daggers we could go exotics and with wind and shadow control we could make a mean precision influencing assassin/mage hybrid, so long as we don't go against a tank that has no vulnerable spots.
As a animated visual aid I think they work pretty good for inspiration.
If we stick with knives/daggers we could go exotics and with wind and shadow control we could make a mean precision influencing assassin/mage hybrid, so long as we don't go against a tank that has no vulnerable spots.
The thing with Xiulan that's necessary to remember is that she's marrying a guy that she doesn't actually care about (so far as Ling Qi can tell). She's a political player, apparently all nobles are. We're an interesting side-project, but despite what my THE DUFF omake and the exaggerated scene above might communicate about my understanding of her, I do think that she puts the political over the personal. If Han Jian decides that we're not going to be part of their social circle...
She's not going to disobey too strenuously because that's not how the game is played. When the game is played, you need to start weighing your pros and cons and so far all we have been to her is 'that girl who's interesting, but also super frustrating because she's completely unwilling to just... socialize!' and more a timesink than an active benefit.
- Location
- Fabulously Rainbow Ireland
Yes Formations OP, Formations VERY OP. Good thing we've begun studying them now.
Well for example just because their provinces might not be close allies back in the outside world doesn't mean they can't say.......form a temporary mutual defense pact to work together against outside aggressors. Unless their families hear about it and object I'm don't think there would be that much opposition to it if it gets them a heavy hitter like Meizhen on their side as a leg up against the other combat monsters...........aside from Fan Yu of course.
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Grosstoad
Birdbrain - Dick - Rules-Lawyer - Creeper
Huang Da as the High Noble...
The Negaverse quest is very, very odd...
"What the fuck, islarry?! 'Your hands are beautiful.'"
"What? I told you he has 'Attitude' problems."
"Okay, okay, we can still work with this."
And then the Vent happened.
" . . . We got chumped by three peasants."
"DAMN THAT NAT 1 ON PERSUASION!"
- Location
- USA
You know, I kinda want to hang out with more new people.
there are all those interesting characters which we are avoiding to play damage control with like, 3 people.
We never actually tried to really socialize with Su Ling. There is still that mute guy in jian's group.
There is the dude we wanted to cook for as thanks for saving us.
there are all those interesting characters which we are avoiding to play damage control with like, 3 people.
We never actually tried to really socialize with Su Ling. There is still that mute guy in jian's group.
There is the dude we wanted to cook for as thanks for saving us.
I think if Han decides he is going to order Xiulan that we aren't to be part of their social circle then you are absolutely right. If she is flat out told that we are off limits then we are off limits. I just don't think that is what is happening to this relationship. I expect things to just get more and more frayed until we aren't part of the group at all anymore, and it is down to individual relationships.
Han has nothing to gain by deliberately spiking the relationship and making enemies, he isn't so stupid that he doesn't know that. On top of that Xiulan has become aware of just how rapidly we are progressing, and I don't think she was joking at all about how valuable we could be to her family. I expect that if we just stop showing up at group training and only interact with her from that group then she will keep her toes in the water of the relationship at least, in hope of a future payoff.
I have no doubt that Han and co would like having a heavy hitter on their side, my point is that it doesn't benefit Bai at all. She already has the support she needs, namely her familiar and her friend that can clear fodder for her and is coming along nicely. What does she really gain from allying with Han and his group that she doesn't already have?
Actually, that's a good question. She was sent to the sect as a concession of her family to help ameliorate ties with the other provinces. What does that mean, exactly? Is she supposed to become friends with other big name families? Is she supposed to serve as a sort of whipping boy, a way for other families to take out their anger on her family? Is she supposed to be a hostage, sent to assure their family's good behavior? A combination of the above?
We don't really know. I think it probably would have been very useful to have Han Jian's view on the politics of the situation, we're not getting a very complete picture only talking to Bai Meizhen.
Arkeus
Crazy cat guy
- Location
- France
This amuses me because I'm seeing them both having variations on the Zephyr's breath higher tier technique: one with Heart/Head meridian focus, one with Heart/spine.
That's not how the game is played, though.
I mean, if she 'knows how the game is played', this means she'll know that Han Jian won't disapprove of Ling Qi being part of her social circle. Because that's how the game is played. You know people who know people, and Gu Xiulan being Ling Qi's friend means that Han Jian can have the benefit of having Ling Qi's help without needing to actually commit if things go wrong.
It's win/win for Han Jian, and the same for Gu Xiulan.
I think Han Jian's not high enough on the pecking order to actually know what's really going on, there.
My Guess? All of the above. It's a show of trust to the Empress, as well as a "sacrifice", but it's also to try and get new allies.
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- Location
- Fabulously Rainbow Ireland
More safety from her enemies and the opportunistic scavengers like Kang Zihao and his ilk? She just got a big wake up call with how she was almost overwhelmed by that ambush and Ling Qi nearly getting killed by that pretty boy and all because of the bad reputation her family has resulting in her social isolation. Meizhen is powerful but she can't just one/two woman (and one snek) her way through everything (not unless we massively increase our power soon somehow)
I think we should capitalise on that to nudge her into trying to make alliances or her own faction or at least earn some goodwill to mitigate any more sneaky backstab attempts.
That last bit is working really well so long as her roommate doesn't flake out.
- Location
- Singapore
A Bow Harp? Maybe this? Death's Opus - Official Path of Exile Wiki
I been thinking about how clans would work with how long cultivaters could live, and I bet that a lot of the old clans are really huge. Taking Han Jian for example he could be in the direct line for being a heir by being the oldest child, but his great great great great great great grandfather could easily still be the head of the clan so it might not mean that much. I bet that encourages the younger cultivaters to do their best to stand out because with all the possible competition they have to get resources from their clan. After all even if a clan is rich resources are expensive and it would be best served helping one good talent rather then ten average talents. That makes me think that Bai Meizhen's family probably isn't that upset that they had to send their children to different sects after all conflict does help a lot. And the strong ones that are worth investing in will prosper and the ones who couldn't make the cut can just be ignored.
Have you given thought to an actual bow as a weapon, and a bunch of bells woven into our hair that play music as an accessory slot? I honestly think it would be far more effective overall, even if it does take up an accessory slot that would otherwise be free. Half asking our weapons is probably a bad call in general once we have the cash to get a good one.
- Location
- Singapore
I can't help but feel that bells in hair is kinda half-assed though, because it probably can't compare to a harp in terms of range of sounds/tunes. Also, we might have to learn how to move without making them jingle if we don't want to compromise our stealth.
Arkeus
Crazy cat guy
- Location
- France
For all that Death's Opus is fricking great, I suspect we'd end up with Death's Harp instead.
Yeah, I think the point is to have a musical weapon, a back-up long range weapon, and a back up back up short range weapon.
Flute/Bow/Throwing knives work great there, especially as Throwing knives are easy to use both in mid range and melee, and they can be quickly switch to flute and vice versa.
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Kai Merah
Hound Hearted Hedonist
- Location
- Somewhere in the corners of my imagination
Hokay. Next week, I'm guessing we should just keep the share vent option totally off the table since so many people have problems with it. Let's see, most urgent things we need to do next week...
1) Han Jian SL: Talk to him on a personal level, see where we stand, see if there's anything we can do to help
2) Get archive techniques. People have been pushing for that a while, and if we get the archive techniques, we can loan the pass to Han Jian if necessary after that.
3) Meditating at the vent with Suyin and Su Ling to finish off that Argent cultivation
Things I'd like to do, but less urgent...
1) Spend a non-combat, non-training turn with Suyin to make sure she's okay before she breaks into Yellow
2) Show our appreciation to Gan Guangli. He saved our life, we really should get around to at least showing our appreciation to him. Also, possible in to Cai
Also, now that I think about it, I'm wondering if perhaps we're growing distant from Han Jian for one of the same reasons Han Jian is growing more distant from us. We're closest to Meizhen and Suyin I think, mainly because we know what they want from us. We help them, from a cultivation perspective for Suyin, from a social perspective for Meizhen. They need us, they'd be sad if we were gone.
But Han Jian? From the beginning, we've never really figured out why he was willing to help us out. He's not socially isolated like Meizhen, he definitely doesn't need our cultivation help like Suyin. He doesn't seem to need us for anything, besides being a helpful teammate/ally, and we already are that. But beyond that? Being friends with him seems to cause him tension more than anything else. And despite all the time we've spent with him, he remains rather distant. We still don't know why he chose to be nice to us that first day. We don't know what he needs us for, and because we don't know, we feel less obligated to him than we do towards Suyin and Meizhen, even though he's arguably helped us more than Suyin at least.
Similarly, as others have said on this thread, he may be growing more distant from us, because we don't appear to need him anymore. And he's never appeared to need or really want us, beyond just being nice to us. He appeared to want us just as a helpful teammate, so we've been repeatedly taking teammate group training actions, but we're just not that close to him socially. Maybe that's why we've been reluctant to spent action on the Han Jian SL, to the point it got this bad. I really hope that next week, we at least get to clear the air with him, and assess if a friendship can still be saved. Regardless of how he feels about us, or we about him, I feel we still owe him for giving us a leg up, those first few weeks in the sect. Ideally, I'd also like it if he not only didn't regret befriending us, but is happy to have done so, despite the tensions brought about by our rate of progress. Honestly, I want to be his friend, not just his dependent or his ally.
1) Han Jian SL: Talk to him on a personal level, see where we stand, see if there's anything we can do to help
2) Get archive techniques. People have been pushing for that a while, and if we get the archive techniques, we can loan the pass to Han Jian if necessary after that.
3) Meditating at the vent with Suyin and Su Ling to finish off that Argent cultivation
Things I'd like to do, but less urgent...
1) Spend a non-combat, non-training turn with Suyin to make sure she's okay before she breaks into Yellow
2) Show our appreciation to Gan Guangli. He saved our life, we really should get around to at least showing our appreciation to him. Also, possible in to Cai
Also, now that I think about it, I'm wondering if perhaps we're growing distant from Han Jian for one of the same reasons Han Jian is growing more distant from us. We're closest to Meizhen and Suyin I think, mainly because we know what they want from us. We help them, from a cultivation perspective for Suyin, from a social perspective for Meizhen. They need us, they'd be sad if we were gone.
But Han Jian? From the beginning, we've never really figured out why he was willing to help us out. He's not socially isolated like Meizhen, he definitely doesn't need our cultivation help like Suyin. He doesn't seem to need us for anything, besides being a helpful teammate/ally, and we already are that. But beyond that? Being friends with him seems to cause him tension more than anything else. And despite all the time we've spent with him, he remains rather distant. We still don't know why he chose to be nice to us that first day. We don't know what he needs us for, and because we don't know, we feel less obligated to him than we do towards Suyin and Meizhen, even though he's arguably helped us more than Suyin at least.
Similarly, as others have said on this thread, he may be growing more distant from us, because we don't appear to need him anymore. And he's never appeared to need or really want us, beyond just being nice to us. He appeared to want us just as a helpful teammate, so we've been repeatedly taking teammate group training actions, but we're just not that close to him socially. Maybe that's why we've been reluctant to spent action on the Han Jian SL, to the point it got this bad. I really hope that next week, we at least get to clear the air with him, and assess if a friendship can still be saved. Regardless of how he feels about us, or we about him, I feel we still owe him for giving us a leg up, those first few weeks in the sect. Ideally, I'd also like it if he not only didn't regret befriending us, but is happy to have done so, despite the tensions brought about by our rate of progress. Honestly, I want to be his friend, not just his dependent or his ally.
Returning to the posts a couple pages back due to just catching up about not having to tell about the Vent when we can instead speak about the tokens; I don't think we should tell Han Jian and his group about the tokens, largely because I don't think they actually got them.
We were specifically singled out by Elder Jiao due to what happened with the moon spirit, he mentioned that in the future he would be willing to personally tutor us, and he just happens to be the formations teacher. Thus him leaving the tokens (remember at that point we're still in the "dream world") as a test of whether we have the prerequisite formations knowledge, in addition to us taking advantage of the moon spirits gift and learning the techniques on the jade slip, to us being ready to begin learning from him makes a certain amount of sense.
There should be a reason we haven't heard about the tokens from any of the other 30 students who passed, or in the weeks following that given the powerful pills within them were. If they had them someone would have commented on them, or aimed to try and acquire the others if people didn't know the value inside of them. To me it just makes sense that it's a personal test of Jiao's.
We were specifically singled out by Elder Jiao due to what happened with the moon spirit, he mentioned that in the future he would be willing to personally tutor us, and he just happens to be the formations teacher. Thus him leaving the tokens (remember at that point we're still in the "dream world") as a test of whether we have the prerequisite formations knowledge, in addition to us taking advantage of the moon spirits gift and learning the techniques on the jade slip, to us being ready to begin learning from him makes a certain amount of sense.
There should be a reason we haven't heard about the tokens from any of the other 30 students who passed, or in the weeks following that given the powerful pills within them were. If they had them someone would have commented on them, or aimed to try and acquire the others if people didn't know the value inside of them. To me it just makes sense that it's a personal test of Jiao's.
That is a really easy subvote though. Ask if he/she still have the tokens and if he/she does, offer to unlock the starlight one if they haven't already.
And TBH, whether Ling Qi doesn't know about something is pretty indicative of nothing. She had no idea that people were interested in Ji Rong for instance. Ling Qi can barely be bothered to spend time in the common areas - she's always been at home, training, or at the vent in the mountains - so unless she personally stumbles upon a fight or someone more connected tells her, she has no idea what the rumor mill is churning about.
And TBH, whether Ling Qi doesn't know about something is pretty indicative of nothing. She had no idea that people were interested in Ji Rong for instance. Ling Qi can barely be bothered to spend time in the common areas - she's always been at home, training, or at the vent in the mountains - so unless she personally stumbles upon a fight or someone more connected tells her, she has no idea what the rumor mill is churning about.
Arkeus
Crazy cat guy
- Location
- France
I'm really hoping for one of the token to give a pill that gives either an extra art action or extra meridian action. That would give us an effective extra action for our Sable Pill weak at the end of yellow.
We know they got them, after all we got the tokens from, amongst other things, beating up disciples. The question is whether they still have them.
But basically, Ling Qi misses things. Given how those token seems rather hard to activate, I'd say most disciples missed what they do and were either bought 'en masse' as part of another deal, or have been confiscated after lost fights.
I'd say it's the opposite: Us not knowing why he befriended us is why we keep feeling more obligated toward him than we do toward the other people who have helped us.
Also, at this point I'm not sure anyone is arguing to be his dependent, it's either about being a close friend, a friend, or his ally, though there is a lot of 'ally' faction trying to say it's either ally or nothing at this point, and 'close friend' faction saying it's either close friend or nothing, with no give between them.
Given the circumstances, I doubt the slow decay would ever really drop below training partner. The fundamental issues remain that we will mutually benefit from being on friendly relations without actually being friends.
In such cases, I'm getting the read that Meizhen in the sect is mainly to show that her family is part of the Empire, rather than it's own nationstate, with it's own cultivation techniques and motives. Countries get very deeply nervous when a powerful internal group does not partake of the Empire's services, and remains staunchly independent.