Omake sequel you say?
Forge of Destiny(Xianxia Quest)
- Thread starter yrsillar
- Start date
- Original Fantasy
Kai Merah
Hound Hearted Hedonist
- Location
- Somewhere in the corners of my imagination
I picked Cai route because Meizhen. But now I'm actually on Cai route, I feel like... Cai actually needs us. She needs us as her vassal much more than Jiao needs an apprentice, Xing needs a pseudo-daughter, or Tai needs a fiance. It's a nice feeling to be needed. And I enjoy exceeding her expectations. I suppose it's a thing that started when we were merely allied with her, and showed most prominently during the Renshu base-wreck and the Liling goose chase, but yeah. I like the fact that we bolster Cai every time we do well, and Cai seems to really appreciate and be impressed by it. I feel like it would have been much harder to impress Jiao, and also, our successes wouldn't bolster him to the same degree as our successes bolster Cai. The stakes are higher than if our patron was an established Elder, compared to the yet untried Ducal heir.
I would have liked the Sect but I'm happy voting for the Cai Route and am getting what I want, deep end politics while we street rat it up until CRX becomes a real girl.
Oh god, it's not Kung Fu High School. With Ling Qi it's Kung Fu High School Musical.
You generally don't fall in with somebody you refer to as a worm if you still are enjoying the patronage of a high noble.
Oh god, it's not Kung Fu High School. With Ling Qi it's Kung Fu High School Musical.
You generally don't fall in with somebody you refer to as a worm if you still are enjoying the patronage of a high noble.
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I agree that the larger scope of the story is great, and while I also would have liked to keep to a more limited scope, I'm still ambivalent on that front.
But this is the part I disagree with:
In my personal experience it's great to feel wanted. To feel needed, on the other hand, it depends but it can be frustrating and emotionally exhausting.
Basically it boils down to the fact that to me*, being someone's primary source of emotional support while she navigates a toxic and abusive relationship with her mother is not exactly my idea of a good time. And since Cai Renxiang is a fictional character, there's no guilt involved in not being there.
*I would have thought that's true of everyone, but I've seen posts in this thread where people said that's what they're looking forward to most.
Kai Merah
Hound Hearted Hedonist
- Location
- Somewhere in the corners of my imagination
It is what I'm most looking forward to. Ling Qi is fictional too, and I really like the narrative of two lonely girls helping each other grow. Also, I just really like how Ling Qi's successes have tangible benefit for and from CRX. We're making a real difference in our friend's life by succeeding in the tasks she gives us. I very much like that.
We did something similar for Best Snek, and I keep doing so for both.
NaanContributor
Provider of delicious flatbread, and nothing else.
- Location
- Hawaii
I try to imagine what the tournament arc would be like right now if we were doing the Sect Route instead of the Cai Route. And I can only think of things that would be missing from the narrative, without much else in their place.
Because the Sect "Route" in the scope of this first year in the Outer Sect isn't quite a route itself per say, so much as us refusing all the other routes. Because our potential apprenticeship under Jiao was never going to be more than an ephemeral possibility until after we'd already proven ourselves by getting into Inner. Heck, if it weren't for Xin, Jiao couldn't even hint at a real offer to Ling Qi due to political restrictions, so I doubt he'd be able to give us any more plausibly deniable assistance than he already has (or would want to, since he's a troll who believes that a tough challenge is better for our development and more entertaining).
So a Ling Qi who rejected Renxiang's offer in the hopes of cashing the apprenticeship check that Xin wrote, would basically be stumbling through all the big wig politics and networking going on around her without any connections, backing, or knowledge to guide her other than what she'd have on her own and maybe whatever help Meizhen could get away with giving her.
*Shudder*
Because the Sect "Route" in the scope of this first year in the Outer Sect isn't quite a route itself per say, so much as us refusing all the other routes. Because our potential apprenticeship under Jiao was never going to be more than an ephemeral possibility until after we'd already proven ourselves by getting into Inner. Heck, if it weren't for Xin, Jiao couldn't even hint at a real offer to Ling Qi due to political restrictions, so I doubt he'd be able to give us any more plausibly deniable assistance than he already has (or would want to, since he's a troll who believes that a tough challenge is better for our development and more entertaining).
So a Ling Qi who rejected Renxiang's offer in the hopes of cashing the apprenticeship check that Xin wrote, would basically be stumbling through all the big wig politics and networking going on around her without any connections, backing, or knowledge to guide her other than what she'd have on her own and maybe whatever help Meizhen could get away with giving her.
*Shudder*
Kai Merah
Hound Hearted Hedonist
- Location
- Somewhere in the corners of my imagination
Haha, I did mention my initial reason for choosing CRX route was Meizhen. Meizhen suggested CRX was the best way they could stay in touch and preserve their friendship after all. I like doing things to help our friends.
al103
Grumpy Russian Bear (SV edition)
- Location
- Russia, Krasnoyarsk
No, without proper basis you get administrator that can rig election and plans to squeeze-dry-and-run (or squeeze-dry - do-it-even-more-to-placate-superiors - lie-to superiors).
Especially because it will be somebody with backing of our authority - they can't just un-elect him. And it probably would be pretty hard to send petition too.
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- Location
- Florida
Clearly we need a wet bint to throw a sword at someone. That's obviously a good basis for a system of government.
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I mean, it worked pretty damn well, they just went with the old feudal method of inheritance.
Should've had the watery tart throw another sword rather than keep using that system. Would've cut through a lot of problems.
One of the things with quests that can be really disappointing is how when people latch onto a NPC they can obsessively subordinate the PC's interests in favour of that NPC, and the quest becomes all about getting positive feedback about that relationship, neglecting all the other aspects of the PC that actually make them a well rounded and interesting character as part of an immersive setting. The PC needs to be more than a supporting character in some one else's narrative.
This is a xianxia setting as well. You always needs to be looking out for number one.
This is a xianxia setting as well. You always needs to be looking out for number one.
BungieONI
Seven gremlins in a trench coat
- Location
- Lickwidget
- Pronouns
- She/Her
This is invalid because that is how bad xianxia settings work and this setting is categorically not a bad one. Plus you might also want to look at the various "you are a servant" quests on SV/SB for different takes on subordination to a character.
A good story can survive even in a subordinate position for the Main Character, even a quest.
- Location
- scrabbling
Alratan used the word subordinate but not in the sense of a formal position of service. "Obsessive subordination [of interests]" is very different from "being subordinate"—what Alratan is alluding to is the type of thing that would have happened, for an extreme example, if Ling Qi did end up taking the Bai 'route.' In that hypothetical, Ling Qi exists primarily as a method for the thread to please Meizhen, no matter how unhealthy or unfavorable a situation that places on Ling Qi herself.
Or at least, that's the impression I got. I'm not Alratan, after all.
notanautomaton
I've got 99 quests, I've finished one
Well, there is Krakoa, but we don't talk about him.
Hell, there are quests starring literal slaves who spend their time scheming on how to deal with the fallout of their social betters fucking around so that they can go off and do their own thing.
Some of them are even popular!
BungieONI
Seven gremlins in a trench coat
- Location
- Lickwidget
- Pronouns
- She/Her
If that's what they meant then I'll comment that a good quest writer and/or story should be able to adapt to the point where such a thing is still engaging. It is an unhealthy relationship, but in the proper contexts those can sometimes be an interesting read. They certainly don't evoke good feelings, since they're not supposed to, but in genre's like psych horror or pure psychological they can be useful.
Aside from that tangent though, my objection to their statement was essentially refuting the implication I saw of "The Cai Route is bad because we have to obsessively subordinate our interests to Renxiang" which I saw based on context of the surrounding posts and topic.
E: It was probably a poor refutation because I couldn't properly articulate the thing I was refuting until now, but nothing I can do about that now.
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- Location
- the netherlands
I agree.
- Location
- Florida
The last argument about the Cai Route being bad was how CRX was a bad liege that doesn't help us enough and is pretty distant. Now that Yrs is having Ling Qi provide emotional support and signs point to interacting more closely, suddenly it's horrible because LQ is now a slave to CRX's every whim.
Which is it anti-CRX people? I'd be laughing right now if it wasn't so depressing.
Which is it anti-CRX people? I'd be laughing right now if it wasn't so depressing.
Different anti-CRX people are allowed to have different objections.
That's a pretty absurd straw-man. Wanting the character to retain independent agency and agenda does not in any way equate to them having no social contacts.
In many ways, becoming an instrument to advance the Cai's interests compromises Lu Qing's ability to be social much more, as social connections will be judged through the lens of utility for someone else.
And that's the opposite of subordinating the main character's interests, as a slave should in general be strongly opposed to their owener's interests and focused on subverting them for their own benefit.
It's not being in a formally subordinate role that's the problem, it's making the main character a cypher that exists to enable another character.
Look at how the recent analysis has been strongly focused on how to advance the Cai's interests and gain them face rather than on how to advance Lu Qing's interests. These are by no means completely aligned. For example, there's not been much commentary on how to exploit the fact that being the only retainer to make it into the Inner Sect is a position of significant advantage.
This is a feudal and hence transactional relationship.
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- Location
- Florida
You're right, I shouldn't have negligently bunched them up. It just feels like there's always something different for some of them to complain about. And it's like, I get it, you don't like the current direction of the quest due to that single vote. But it's getting really exhausting having the same discussion with something new as the focal point to complain about.Different anti-CRX people are allowed to have different objections.
We're on the Cai route, we're stuck with it, and I'd really appreciate it if people would get over it instead of hashing out contradictory complaints every few days.
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NaanContributor
Provider of delicious flatbread, and nothing else.
- Location
- Hawaii
The reason that everyone is discussing how to better further the interests of Cai's faction is because we're a member of Cai's faction. That's what it means to be a part of a team, where each member's achievements furthers everyone's shared goals, while failures reflect poorly on the group in turn.
Being CRX's only retainer in the Inner Sect because of Gan's loss is still a bad thing for Ling Qi as well as Renxiang, because that means we have one less sworn ally accompanying us through whatever challenges we have to face there. Having Renxiang, Gan, or any other allies lose face might make Ling Qi look better in comparison from an objective standpoint, but the concept of face can't be objective since association is such a key part of it.
And because, more importantly, the more valuable we make ourselves the more we provide reason for the Cai to invest in us - and that's the best way we have to get high end resources and opportunities (other than moon quests).
The main challenge we have is balancing our responsibilities with our cultivation time - and that's something I think we're going to press Renxiang to maybe take a page or two out of our book on.
The main challenge we have is balancing our responsibilities with our cultivation time - and that's something I think we're going to press Renxiang to maybe take a page or two out of our book on.