Forge of Destiny(Xianxia Quest)

It matters a great deal whether she cares for Ling Qi or she cares for Ling Qi's power and talent and skills. I'm not positively inclined towards her (or her route...still moderately salty that yrsillar favored her so heavily accidentally or not), so I lean towards the latter, but at the moment it's not actually clear which is true.
Depending on how much of what we and everyone else see of her is an act, caring for someone's power and skill and how they can be useful to her may be as close as she's capable of getting to caring about that person. Her having serious mental/emotional problems is not unlikely from what we know of her background, and it's one of the ways to take Six's comment about an unfinished doll not understanding.
 
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The whole point is that it's not about a purely cold mercantile exchange.

One situation was when we were in a position of weakness and had nothing to bargain with and we were still helped while the other we were the stronger party and we STILL bargained for a resource and provided services for that resource.

Han Jian didn't owe us a damn thing and still helped us out.
I want Han Jian, but this is making a disservice of Heizui here. We went to him and bullied use of his house. I think getting a minimum of politeness and respect to him is important given what an asshole we have been there.

Neither Han Jian nor Heizui owed us a damn thing, and one helped us out (like half our friends did), while the other we were an asshole too. I think both are things that could be interesting. Logically, They are probably the more 'important' minor votes, as in the ones with the bigger social impact for us.
Adding in plan vote
[X] An Eye to the future

Formations won't improve enough to be actually useful in tournament in 2 actions - baring a complete rework of how formations function (aka going narrative on them next year). For reference, Ossuary Horror currently has base dice of 27 and rolls in the low 30s since it can use techs (it's from the era where yrsiller expected dice to be in the 30s). Our defense and offense are shaping up in the high 40s and peaking low 50s. Do we think we can get 10 dice on them with 2 actions? Let's not spend 21 YSS on something that can't hit shit and get a head start on what we need to be doing in the next year.

I could support a serious archive action, problem being what? And then meridian space (drop FSA?). Maybe FSA+ finally? But that also has/will fall behind on dice since we are no longer focusing on supporting it with our loadout.
It's an unlearned formation, so all we do would be getting it usable.... so yeah, it won't help in the tournament. Hell, it could arguably make us weaker if we want to try using it and lose combat turn for it by beginning with a bad intro.
 
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Depending on how much of what we and everyone else see of her is an act, caring for someone's power and skill and how they can be useful to her may be as close as she's capable of getting to caring about that person. Her having serious mental/emotional problems is not unlikely from what we know of her background, and it's one of the ways to take Six's comment about an unfinished doll not understanding.
You can understand what causes someone to act a certain way all you want, but in the end that only rarely excuses it. The seriously impaired are definitionally less able and it takes a lot of extra effort on the part of those around them to make up for their often-too-often lacks. I'll repeat myself: it matters a great deal whether she cares for Ling Qi or for what Ling Qi can give her. One of those options is not a friend, and is still not a friend no matter how far the other is from CRX's grasp.
 
Depending on how much of what we and everyone else see of her is an act, caring for someone's power and skill and how they can be useful to her may be as close as she's capable of getting to caring about that person. Her having serious mental/emotional problems is not unlikely from what we know of her background, and it's one of the ways to take Six's comment about an unfinished doll not understanding.

It's not actually a secret that Shenhua is a terrible, terrible person, who did horrible things in the interest of creating her perfect heir.

That doesn't mean that Renxiang is a lost cause, just that actually toeing that line to help her become something Good and Great rather than a doll that can only do what its maker permitted is going to require a hell of a lot of time and effort--as is doing so in a way that Shenhua won't decide is a lost cause and just start fresh. More effort than the flighty Dreaming Moon and their emanations can really muster, so they just default to giving the stink eye.

Part of why I wanted to go this route was to actually try to do this. Because holy hell, Renxiang needs friends badly, even if she doesn't know what that is outside of an academic understanding. I'd feel guilty as hell to leave her to her own devices--and Guangli alone can't help carry all that weight.

That aside though, I'm starting to get the idea of what happened with the Weilu--we already know that they're really popular among the Moon and Sun spirits--especially the Dreaming Moon--and we know that they were cast down in the first place because they basically ignored Ogodei's invasion. I'm starting to get the feeling that what happened to the Weilu is precisely what happens when an Ancient Clan truly becomes more spirit then man--they become detached from the world at large, and hit a sort of echo chamber of themselves--and the themes they favored were ones of rampant life and revelry. In short, they collapsed due to their own hedonism, and didn't even notice the sky caving in until it was too late.

But their vassals were used to the relatively light touch, which led to corruption and a general undercurrent of hedonism--so Shenhua taking charge was like dropping a god damn depth charge into a bathtub. No wonder she basically secured her throne on an ocean of blood, and the only surviving Weilu Conservatives were far enough on the fringes that they didn't drink all the kool-aid--though the Meng clan deciding to give up what was apparently cordial relations with the Bai Clan in favor of Sun Shao might be a desperate attempt to get the fuck out before Shenhua chokes them out for being troublemakers who aren't willing to leave their personal feelings at home when it comes to politicking.
 
[X] An Eye to the future

I like the talisman design here and it's more practical to aim for a few more benefits from polishing our strengths a final time than to divert into formations. We never gave them more than secondary attention (if even that) and their quality reflects it. At this point they're not worth it... even if I wish it were otherwise. They are, after all, really cool.
 
We can expect to get ASA 4 with the single action. Is that better for the tournament than the formations? It's much cheaper. And will be useful for every single fight.
 
I want Han Jian, but this is making a disservice of Heizui here. We went to him and bullied use of his house. I think getting a minimum of politeness and respect to him is important given what an asshole we have been there.

Neither Han Jian nor Heizui owed us a damn thing, and one helped us out (like half our friends did), while the other we were an asshole too. I think both are things that could be interesting. Logically, They are probably the more 'important' minor votes, as in the ones with the bigger social impact for us.

How were we an asshole? We bargained with him and provided tribute after we proved our strength by exhausting him in a duel without laying a finger on him. We were told that's how you deal with dragons, either as a superior or an underling. If disciple's weren't allowed in his grove they wouldn't give out sect jobs to STEAL from it, and Heizui wouldn't even entertain an option to allow anyone to cultivate there. We have fulfilled our parts of the bargain, been polite to him and reprimanded our spirit from speaking disrespectfully to Heizui. If anything Heizui shooting snarky comments on matters he has nothing to do with is disrespectful.

You're treating Heizui as if he were human. He's not. He's a dragon, and they play by different rules. Treating him as we would a human is probably LESS respectful. The arrogant teen gets coddled enough from mumsy.
 
That aside though, I'm starting to get the idea of what happened with the Weilu--we already know that they're really popular among the Moon and Sun spirits--especially the Dreaming Moon--and we know that they were cast down in the first place because they basically ignored Ogodei's invasion. I'm starting to get the feeling that what happened to the Weilu is precisely what happens when an Ancient Clan truly becomes more spirit then man--they become detached from the world at large, and hit a sort of echo chamber of themselves--and the themes they favored were ones of rampant life and revelry. In short, they collapsed due to their own hedonism, and didn't even notice the sky caving in until it was too late.

But their vassals were used to the relatively light touch, which led to corruption and a general undercurrent of hedonism--so Shenhua taking charge was like dropping a god damn depth charge into a bathtub. No wonder she basically secured her throne on an ocean of blood, and the only surviving Weilu Conservatives were far enough on the fringes that they didn't drink all the kool-aid--though the Meng clan deciding to give up what was apparently cordial relations with the Bai Clan in favor of Sun Shao might be a desperate attempt to get the fuck out before Shenhua chokes them out for being troublemakers who aren't willing to leave their personal feelings at home when it comes to politicking.
Weilus were the founding family that fell first. E.G, maybe ten thousand years ago. The capital was much later rebuilt by the Xi clan (new duke clan), and then much later on the Hui? Basically, Emerald Sea had had quite a few ducal clans as none managed to get as entranched in the province as the Weilu did.

But yeah, Ogodei mess was with Hui? clan and so on.
How were we an asshole? We bargained with him and provided tribute after we proved our strength by exhausting him in a duel without laying a finger on him. We were told that's how you deal with dragons, either as a superior or an underling. If disciple's weren't allowed in his grove they wouldn't give out sect jobs to STEAL from it, and Heizui wouldn't even entertain an option to allow anyone to cultivate there. We have fulfilled our parts of the bargain, been polite to him and reprimanded our spirit from speaking disrespectfully to Heizui. If anything Heizui shooting snarky comments on matters he has nothing to do with is disrespectful.

You're treating Heizui as if he were human. He's not. He's a dragon, and they play by different rules. Treating him as we would a human is probably LESS respectful. The arrogant teen gets coddled enough from mumsy.
We bargained with him by making sure there couldn't be no for an answer.

Him being a dragon has nothing to do with us going into his house and saying "here, let me live here". Bargaining only works if the price is on the table, and there was no price there. It would be like, say, Sun Liling came to our house, beat up Meizhen, then gave us 1RSS and told us she now lives in the house with us.

There is also no hint whatsoever he currently gets cuddled from mommy.
 
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It's an unlearned formation, so all we do would be getting it usable.... so yeah, it won't help in the tournament. Hell, it could arguably make us weaker if we want to try using it and lose combat turn for it by beginning with a bad intro.
Arkeus I know it is competing with your plan, but this is just a really dumb claim. Having the horror ready to give ling qi and Zhengui both 2 temporary health boxes any time ours get chewed through will not make us weaker. Up to 12 health boxes between Zhengui and ling qi, and possibly more if we end up making worms somehow is a really good use of two actions. It will certainly do more for us than being a bit further along the spiritual and epc lines.
 
[X] You need to unwind, take a morning and spend it on the slopes with Zhengui and Hanyi, a little childish fun can be nice from time to time

[X] Gu Xiulan has done all she could to prepare herself and train, coax her out of the training field for one more night on the town

[X] Heizui has, for all his ill temper, been a decent host. Thank him for the time you've spent in the Vale
 
Huh, well, shows what I know.

Still, what the hell leads people to be called "Weilu Conservatives" literally ten White generations after they were wiped out in that case? They shouldn't even qualify as a footnote in history at this point if that's the case.
 
Arkeus I know it is competing with your plan, but this is just a really dumb claim. Having the horror ready to give ling qi and Zhengui both 2 temporary health boxes any time ours get chewed through will not make us weaker. Up to 12 health boxes between Zhengui and ling qi, and possibly more if we end up making worms somehow is a really good use of two actions. It will certainly do more for us than being a bit further along the spiritual and epc lines.
It will arguably make us weaker if it takes a combat action to put the horror in, which it should. Basically, we might be trading a full combat action to use DWV maybe twice for healthboxes (because the horror will likely go down before we lose 4 healthbox). This is a very bad combat trade off.

It is also in a weird narrative place where you are arguing we should be using the Horror for the heart component of a spine/heart art, when it's supposed to be about a spine tech.
 
Six is a good source of social advice but it needs to be taken in context of what they are: A intangible muse moon fairy without a ton of experience dealing with waking humans. Remember, they didn't understand why one of us or Meizhen didn't just flip genders or that there is a difference between kinds of love humans can feel. If anybody knows what the hell CRX's real deal is, it's not gonna be Six.
 
But yeah, Ogodei mess was with Hui? clan and so on.
Yeah, it was the Hui:
"Once the Ahui clan conquered the Forest of Murk and bound their leader bound its guardian spirit, spiders became a popular spirit companion in the Emerald Seas," Li Suyin replied matter of factly. "Since they were an offshoot and pillar of the ruling Hui clan, it only makes sense for others to have copied them."

Ling Qi blinked, glancing at her friend. She hadn't actually been expected an answer. "...What happened to them then?" Since clearly they weren't keeping the spiders under control anymore.

Li Suyin didn't respond at first, peering into the mist ahead as she fidgeted with her sleeves. She was a little on edge about the coming binding it seemed. "They were destroyed during the invasion of the Cloud Tribes, along with many others. "The Hui clan never properly recovered from the loss of so many loyal vassals, and combined with the imperial condemnation of their failure to properly coordinate their armies..."
 
[X] An Eye to the future

I like the talisman design here and it's more practical to aim for a few more benefits from polishing our strengths a final time than to divert into formations. We never gave them more than secondary attention (if even that) and their quality reflects it. At this point they're not worth it... even if I wish it were otherwise. They are, after all, really cool.
Polishing what strengths? Aside from the talisman differences (where I think that more dice for Zhengui is more valuable than more Qi reduction, but that's a matter of opinion), the only difference between Eye to the future and Stalking Horror is training EPC and Spiritual instead of the formation stuff.

And since neither of those are going to complete a stage and give any kind of improvement for the tournament, I don't really see the point in doing them right now? I mean, even if people think the Ossuary Horror isn't up to par against peers, it's still more than nothing at all. And aren't it's current stats from before yrsillar tweaked some of the dice pools (I remember the mechanics gurus talking about how good it was when it was introduced), so updating it might rebalance it into being viable?

We can expect to get ASA 4 with the single action.
Considering the fact that it'll probably require multiple new meridians that we can't predict to equip it at that level, I sincerely doubt that.
 
The meridians needed are already accounted for in the plan. Lung and arm. We also have a spare arm if needed.
No, those are only the meridians needed for the first level of ASA. We don't know what other meridians are required for your claimed fourth level. Sure it might just need one more Arm meridian, which would be really convenient, but we have no idea if that's the case.
 
The meridians needed are already accounted for in the plan. Lung and arm. We also have a spare arm if needed.
ASA4 will almost certainly need another meridian opened beyond the first two. There's also not much point opening arm meridians when we can just unequip the currently useless FSA.
Adhoc vote count started by Erebeal on May 28, 2018 at 3:57 AM, finished with 61915 posts and 97 votes.
 
No, those are only the meridians needed for the first level of ASA. We don't know what other meridians are required for your claimed fourth level. Sure it might just need one more Arm meridian, which would be really convenient, but we have no idea if that's the case.
ASA4 will almost certainly need another meridian opened beyond the first two. There's also not much point opening arm meridians when we can just unequip the currently useless FSA.
While I do agree getting a Lung meridian alone is better (and we can't reliably open a second meridian without white room anyway) so @Killer_Whale probably only should have lung with white room, FSA only got a third meridian at FSA5. While it's possible ASA4 might need one, I wouldn't say 'almost certainly'.

Polishing what strengths? Aside from the talisman differences (where I think that more dice for Zhengui is more valuable than more Qi reduction, but that's a matter of opinion), the only difference between Eye to the future and Stalking Horror is training EPC and Spiritual instead of the formation stuff.

And since neither of those are going to complete a stage and give any kind of improvement for the tournament, I don't really see the point in doing them right now? I mean, even if people think the Ossuary Horror isn't up to par against peers, it's still more than nothing at all. And aren't it's current stats from before yrsillar tweaked some of the dice pools (I remember the mechanics gurus talking about how good it was when it was introduced), so updating it might rebalance it into being viable?
Well, going for spiritual/epc might give us a Qi, but yeah, not much immediate power.

OTOH, the horror is very unlikely to give us any too, and is likely to give us false incentive to use it in the tournament when it's a 'weaker' combat option. If assembling/getting it ready it takes a combat action, It would be like choosing to use the current Rumbling Squall rather than Ten Ring Defence in our early combat set up, except in this cast it would be a full action for 'free' DWV rather than full action for Thousand Rings Unbreakable.
 
I care less about using the horror in combat and more in getting more formation practice because I still have the dream of making a BLG
 
If assembling/getting it ready it takes a combat action, It would be like choosing to use the current Rumbling Squall rather than Ten Ring Defence in our early combat set up, except in this cast it would be a full action for 'free' DWV rather than full action for Thousand Rings Unbreakable.
Why wouldn't we be able to assemble it before the match starts?
 
Why wouldn't we be able to assemble it before the match starts?
Why would we? I don't think we can go on the stage with our buff already up, so why would we be able to go on the stage with our formations already up? We probably can either have them fly to us during the fight and then assemble them or take them out of our ring and then assemble (or be assembled in the ring? unsure) but those scenarios also need us to use a full action in combat.

We have always seen formations take turns in combat, and I don't see why 'formation prep' is something we can ask a timeout for to the ref but not anything else.
 
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