Forge of Destiny(Xianxia Quest)

Without anti divination art it would be really hard do missions,
Ling Qi has thought of anti-divination measures as formations, not Arts.

Putting it that way, Work on formations with Li Suyin, working on a project with your friend will be fun, seems more appealing, if we can specify an anti-detection formation. Having a specific formation to work towards was also noted as important for improving formations at all.
 
If we're doing Fu Xiang's favour we need to discuss how much to do for him.

Honestly I don't want to do much for Fu Xiang beyond the bare minimum here for a few reasons. First, the potential consequences would be heavy and making it 6 rolls (stealth + larceny) has a much greater chance of things going wrong.

We would lose access to the market for the year and be reliant on Fu Xiang or another person to go and get our pills for us. On top of putting us further in Fu Xiang's power (somewhere I really don't want us to be) it would undoubtedly make things much more difficult for getting items other than pills. We would not be able to browse the market for new talismans, having to rely on that person to look for what we'd want, and meaning we'd probably have to miss out on less obvious things, have to reveal a lot of our actual arts and equipment set up and be at the mercy of their schedule.

It will undoubtedly make ordering a custom talisman much, much more difficult even with help. For example we are the only high powered flute user we know of in the outer sect. If we wanted to upgrade our flute there is every chance that the crafter would recognise that it was a request from someone on the banned list and either refuse outright or slap on a huge 'doing business with a shady character' surcharge that Ling Qi would have no choice but to pay.

Secondly, the effects it could have oun our relationships and our potential future. As mentioned in the narrative there is the potential fallout with Suyin, but there are other potential issues as well. For example our relationship with the Cai faction. Whilst we know that Cai has no problems with using tools such as blackmail to solve her problems a lot of her legitimacy comes from looking like the good guy and from punishing those who distub her order. If we're caught it will cause us a lot of problems on that front because Cai will have to choose between enforcing her order and pubically having us be part of her faction and she's likely to go for publically punishing us (as she can't afford to fail the control the outer sect test her mother has set).

Su Ling might be an issue if she thinks we were doing it to give her and Suyin an advantage because of her feelings on finding her own path.

So overall I feel he's asking a massive amount in return for his aid.

That said if we do do this favour we might want to link it to a formations archinve action to see if Ling Qi can do something like make the paintball formations that Elder Jiao had us use in our training. It would ruin the efforts of the people to be sabotaged whilst being easier to claim as a simple prank if we're caught. Given Ling Qi is known for infiltrating bases and making off with things and has not been publically linked (afaik) with the pranking spree it might also serve to throw off suspicions over simply nicking the stuff.

Huh, there was an outbreak of pranking a while back, if we can leverage that...
 
Ling Qi has thought of anti-divination measures as formations, not Arts.

Putting it that way, Work on formations with Li Suyin, working on a project with your friend will be fun, seems more appealing, if we can specify an anti-detection formation. Having a specific formation to work towards was also noted as important for improving formations at all.
I think we'd probably need to do the archive dive to get a new formation major to get one that protects us against anti-detection. I think this is for getting the vault warriors finished.
 
I think we'd probably need to do the archive dive to get a new formation major to get one that protects us against anti-detection. I think this is for getting the vault warriors finished.
Which, incidentally, I'm planning on having in my plan.

I think that this week would be a good week to get a new formation against anti-scrying, and adding to that a minor to figure out escape measures would have synergy in that we can see what a basic anti-scrying formation looks like and see what differences the markets are selling.

I also think that we can get two meridians done next week without any problems.
 
Maybe with Meizhen if her art actually causes the wolves to flinch and lose turns, maybe.

It's far more likely that she will just get mobbed down by 15 wolves at the same time after they bring down her defenses by mobbing.
I'll give you calcs later, but even alone Ling Qi can probably do it. With Xiulan being mobbed down by 20 wolves won't happen for either of us. @Erebeal did extensive simulations there.
Show me the calculation that shows that Ling Qi will get 100 successes in 2 free actions. Also show me how the hell will Ling Qi actually use 2 high sun pills. The time to use one of them was at the previous vote, it's likely that Ling is only going to open more than 2 meridians before the breakthrough
Incoming week is week 35 with highsun (2 meridians), and then we do another highsun week 36 (1 meridian). We need those for FZ5, AC3, TRF4.
Here is our dice when using highsun:
Talent 6 + Stone 30 + Pills 24 + EPC 12 + Vent 8 + Larceny 5 + Highsun 3= 88 dice +2 successes.
Getting 176 dice +4 successes means getting an average of 102 successes.
 
I'll give you calcs later, but even alone Ling Qi can probably do it. With Xiulan being mobbed down by 20 wolves won't happen for either of us. @Erebeal did extensive simulations there.

Incoming week is week 35 with highsun (2 meridians), and then we do another highsun week 36 (1 meridian). We need those for FZ5, AC3, TRF4.
Here is our dice when using highsun:
Talent 6 + Stone 30 + Pills 24 + EPC 12 + Vent 8 + Larceny 5 + Highsun 3= 88 dice +2 successes.
Getting 176 dice +4 successes means getting an average of 102 successes.

1) Ling's attack is anemic as we have seen during the scuffle with Sun. She will absolutely get bogged down and attacked or leave her sole partner to suffer that fate. And she is still mobbed down by 20 peer opponents.

EDIT: Like straight up, you need to chew through each wolf qi reserves before directly harming them while 19 other doggoes swarm you.

2) How the hell do you get 24 bonus pill dice? Also, as far as I know Ling needs to roll 5 or less to succeed so her average would be 88 if your math is right.
 
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Considering Qi!Mom's reaction to Ling Qi mentioning that her best friend is Bai Meizhen, I have to wonder how she will react to the next letter. "Hi, mom I got Cai Renxiang to teach me Bureaucracy and put in a good word with the MoL."

Speaking of her reaction to Meizhen... really her wording there "No other clan dares use that spelling." She seems to have had some political training beside her literacy, math and arts.
 
I'll give you calcs later, but even alone Ling Qi can probably do it. With Xiulan being mobbed down by 20 wolves won't happen for either of us. @Erebeal did extensive simulations there.
Whatever simulations @Erebeal allegedly did, I don't think I believe them. Maybe, maybe, it works out if the wolves do nothing but attack directly. But what happens if they have support arts, or combined-attack arts like FZ/AC? It seems the height of arrogance to assume that a Wolf Pack, which is designed to take down enemies as a team, won't have any support capabilities.
 
1) Ling's attack is anemic as we have seen during the scuffle with Sun. She will absolutely get bogged down and attacked or leave her sole partner to suffer that fate. And she is still mobbed down by 20 peer opponents.

EDIT: Like straight up, you need to chew through each wolf qi reserves before attacking them directly harming them while 19 other doggoes swarm you.

2) How the hell do you get 24 bonus pill dice? Also, as far as I know Ling needs to roll 5 or less to succeed so her average would be 88 if your math is right.

You are forgetting the rerolls on 1.
You are also forgetting unblockable damage and the passive damage/turn from the song.

It would also not be amiss to be more polite, especially since you do not seem to have done your research too well.
 
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1) Ling's attack is anemic as we have seen during the scuffle with Sun. She will absolutely get bogged down and attacked or leave her sole partner to suffer that fate. And she is still mobbed down by 20 peer opponents.

EDIT: Like straight up, you need to chew through each wolf qi reserves before attacking them directly harming them while 19 other doggoes swarm you.
Ling Qi's attack is not a problem, though she could do it alone via judicious use of harassing/stealth/etc, Xiulan is the big attacker here. Our defences are good enough that we'll only get hurt by the 13th wolves or so in constant attacks, and that's if we play things badly. HRA is really powerful for tanking if need be.

Considering there is only 20 or so wolves, they can't manage to hurt either of us.

2) How the hell do you get 24 bonus pill dice? Also, as far as I know Ling needs to roll 5 or less to succeed so her average would be 88 if your math is right.
We have a lot of pill dice if we go all out (White art + Bear'smarrow/blood + steady/sturdy), and we get rerolls on 1's. I suggest you use PrimalShadow's excellent anydice code for this.
 
I would prefer a plan with dragon and the ma sisters. Doing the favors for stealth boni would also be cool. As I have already forgotten what arts we need and if we are good on meridians and qi I will leave the actual plan making to people who know what they are doing.
 
I would prefer a plan with dragon and the ma sisters. Doing the favors for stealth boni would also be cool. As I have already forgotten what arts we need and if we are good on meridians and qi I will leave the actual plan making to people who know what they are doing.

Since we just did a sisters action we can wait a week, I think.
Agree on the dragon, though.

I also want to have the favor out of the way and done with.
 
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I want more bonding with Su Ling. The Ma sisters are also better that I thought. Plus, if we introduce them to Su Ling, we can show her how awesome it'd be being Ling Qi's minion!
 
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Whatever simulations @Erebeal allegedly did, I don't think I believe them. Maybe, maybe, it works out if the wolves do nothing but attack directly. But what happens if they have support arts, or combined-attack arts like FZ/AC? It seems the height of arrogance to assume that a Wolf Pack, which is designed to take down enemies as a team, won't have any support capabilities.
The big thing is that it doesn't really matter if a wolf pack has support capabilities when the supporter is not able to apply them.

Keeping in mind the majority of those wolves are mid-yellow with corresponding dicepool, if there is a supporter there it won't be able to resist Despair of the lost, rendering him useless. If the supporter if the boss it's even easier, there. When you add in Xiulan's own ridiculous damage abilities, and the possible supporting abilities won't last long.

We also have the range and speed advantage, here. After scouting ahead to see what they are arranged as, we can easily prepare to strike from 300m out with Xiulan, then activate our mist when they are 80m away while backing away. Even if they can double-run at 60m/turn (making them much faster than the normal yellow enemies) we can still both go 30m/turn backward, giving us three full turns before they can actually engage us in melee once they are within the mist.

That leaves us time to successfully fully use FVM+Elegy + Despair, and even maybe AtW too. When they reach us, half the pack wouldn't be alive anymore thank to Xiulan, and HRA is powerful enough to more or less immunise us from their attacks.
 
I would personally prefer to wait on the favour until after we break through to Green. The bonus auto's will likely be very valuable for a flawless success.
 
I really don't think we should do dragon this week. We are on track to be ready to break through week 37, but we don't have a lot of leeway with this. We very possibly don't have any actions to spare. We MIGHT, if we roll very well and nothing comes up. But we can't count on it. And there is absolutely nothing about the dragon action that's on a time limit. Whereas getting to Green/Bronze as fast as possible is incredibly important.
 
Would also prefer to leave Fu Xiang favor until after we hit Green.

First, Green autos will help ensure success rate is higher. And yes, it is fairly high already in certain situations but we only need to fail one check before it's a bad result for us.

Second, if we succeed, it's better to do it a bit later when they're further along. As it is, note that Fu Xiang said they've "started" work. The sooner we do it, the longer the cultivators in question have to salvage their work and redo it in time for the end of the year tournament. I suspect, like most of you, we only want to do this once rather than multiple times over the latter course of the year.

Third, if we fail, that's less time depending on Fu Xiang to buy our pills for us (and won't impact the vassal offer). It'll also mean less time impact on our ability to request custom talismans and so on.
 
I really like doing the wolf mission this week; waiting a bit on Fu Xiang's favor makes sense as others have said, and getting the points for another tutor week 36 (if needed) would also help make sure we are ready for breakthrough week 37.

I would be much happier to do the wolf mission with Meizhen, however. For one thing we need stealth successes from the mission, and Xiulan isn't the stealthiest. Meizhen is liable to be much better at stealth; certainly Cui is a lot better than Xiulan. Not only would this hopefully result in multiple stealth rolls, but hopefully we can cut down their numbers before we get in a big confrontation. Secondly, of course, she's just much better once we get into the big confrontation, especially with Cui at her side.
 
The big thing is that it doesn't really matter if a wolf pack has support capabilities when the supporter is not able to apply them.

Keeping in mind the majority of those wolves are mid-yellow with corresponding dicepool, if there is a supporter there it won't be able to resist Despair of the lost, rendering him useless. If the supporter if the boss it's even easier, there. When you add in Xiulan's own ridiculous damage abilities, and the possible supporting abilities won't last long.
Why the hell would there be only one supporter?

I'm thinking more like a quarter-to-half of the wolves know support arts, or ALL of them know a team fighting technique of some sort. We've seen how Argent Current scales when multiple people are using it. While I don't expect the Wolves to have an Argent-quality art, I do expect them to have a similar style of art somewhere, and with 20 attackers it can absolutely wreak us.
 
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Hmm. People make good points on the Fu Xiang mission; waiting until we are in Green makes sense here.

However, if we are doing that, do people have suggestions for what we are doing regarding stealth, if anything?
For the record, I refuse to entertain an idea where we go up against nearly TWENTY yellow opponents, and with a Green for support as well.
 
I expect wolves have something that increases the multiple attackers bonus, not counting any support arts or hunting tactics.

In any case, I'd want to take more than one friend along with us on the eventual wolf job. Maybe Xiulan and foxy could bond over their shared habit of lighting things on fire? Or Meizhen, she could use another friend.
 
To clarify my simulations: they were an exploration of how well we could handle getting attacked by a large group of mid-yellow beasts. In this light, I assumed the wolves had 15 dice (~ what we and Kang's dog had at thunderdome redux), and gave them a couple of bonus damage on their attack.

Under these assumptions, we can take 10 attacks easily, but getting hit by 20 at once would wipe out about half our health and qi.

This does not, of course, account for possible other bonuses. They may be able to do more damage than this. These results should be used treated as loosely indicative of what kind of things we can handle, and not as a literal prediction of the strength of the wolves.

Anyway, the big thing that really helps is that, as @Arkeus noted, that we can open from long range and thus have the wolves as unable to attack us for several turns. If we were, for instance, simply to open from max range of FVM (~70m ish), then they would have to spend the first turn just running at us. They would be debuffed, and Xiulan could blow them up. In the second turn, Elegy comes out, and most of them other than the Alpha should be stunned. Xiulan blows them up some more. If we're kiting at the same time, then we should now be a full round away from most of them again. This gives us a good number of turns to get all our debuffs down, and for Xiulan to bring the numbers down to something manageable.

At this point, we drop the flute, and switch to shooting since they're unlikely to last more than 4 turns.

Keep in mind that once our debuffs are up, the wolves should basically have no defensive dice. Xiulan will probably be hitting her maximum damage on most of them, and should be able to blow them up pretty fast.
 
If we were, for instance, simply to open from max range of FVM (~70m ish), then they would have to spend the first turn just running at us. They would be debuffed, and Xiulan could blow them up. In the second turn, Elegy comes out, and most of them other than the Alpha should be stunned. Xiulan blows them up some more. If we're kiting at the same time, then we should now be a full round away from most of them again. This gives us a good number of turns to get all our debuffs down, and for Xiulan to bring the numbers down to something manageable.

At this point, we drop the flute, and switch to shooting since they're unlikely to last more than 4 turns.

Keep in mind that once our debuffs are up, the wolves should basically have no defensive dice. Xiulan will probably be hitting her maximum damage on most of them, and should be able to blow them up pretty fast.
What happens if they start buffing each other? They can do that regardless of the range to us.
 
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